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 OrgoneConclusion
Pharoah & Balanced
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 29,385
Loc: Luxor
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 The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer 
#9243296 - 11/14/08 09:27 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Note: Haven't had one of these enlightening discussions in months. 
S: Strives to have an internally consistent viewpoint.
B: Consistency is not very important.
S: Enjoys having his ideas challenged/questioned as it is a way to further knowledge.
B: Hates having his ideas challenged as they are writ in stone and should never be questioned as he already knows the important stuff.
S: Doesn't give a damn what you believe in until it affects him.
B: Has an overpowering urge to get you to accept his dogma and will not rest until you do.
S: Likes broccoli.
B: Hates broccoli.
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This is your drain on brugs.
Edited by OrgoneConclusion (11/14/08 10:08 AM)
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 Nexion
Seeker
Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 647
Last seen: 1 month, 4 days
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 Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#9243331 - 11/14/08 09:35 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
S: Likes broccoli.
B: Hates broccoli.
Key point! 
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WhiskeyClone
Not here
Registered: 06/25/01
Posts: 16,474
Loc: Longitudinal Center of Ca...
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#9243375 - 11/14/08 09:46 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
S: Strives to have an internally consistent viewpoint.
B: Consistency is not very important.
S: Enjoys having his ideas challenged/questioned as it is a way to further knowledge.
B: Hates having his ideas challenged as they are writ in stone and should never be questioned as he already knows the important stuff.
S: Doesn't give a damn what you believe in until it affects him.
B: Has an overpowering urge to get you to accept his dogma and will not rest until you do.
S: Likes broccoli.
B: Hates broccoli.
I don't agree with any of this. Skeptics can be just as dogmatic and stubborn as religious zealots. They don't necessarily like having their ideas challenged, and a lot of them hate broccoli. Most 'skeptics' are believers, IMO. They have the same burning urge to come to rest on a belief, just perhaps without as much wishful thinking. The dichotomy should be between believers and agnostics.
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Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man. For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire. Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.
~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"
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Redrawing
Psychonaut
Registered: 04/03/08
Posts: 526
Last seen: 1 year, 7 months
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#9243398 - 11/14/08 09:50 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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This is a gross and inaccurate generalization. Really, none of these hold true in any regard.
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I'm an insect who dreamt he was a man and loved it, but now that dream is over and the insect is awake
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deCypher
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 52,515
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#9243430 - 11/14/08 09:56 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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I agree with your post, as it technically stands, but I feel a lot is left unsaid.
Being a skeptic is better when formulating one's principles than being a believer, purely because no belief should be accepted unquestioningly. Distrust everything and anyone; only agree to something if it's been logically verified or if you've experienced it yourself.
At the same time, living one's life is impossible as a die-hard skeptic; only when you have accepted a few beliefs as your foundation can you pragmatically accomplish anything. I presume you believe that you exist. I also presume you believe that you're breathing air right now, that you're typing on a computer right now, and that other people exist.
And you tried to lump yourself into the skeptic category... for shame. 
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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
  
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 67,609
Loc: underbelly
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Nexion]
#9243442 - 11/14/08 09:58 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Nexion said:
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
S: Likes broccoli.
B: Hates broccoli.
Key point!
Broccoli makes you really logical. Yum!
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 67,609
Loc: underbelly
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Redrawing]
#9243448 - 11/14/08 09:58 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Redrawing said:
This is a gross and inaccurate generalization. Really, none of these hold true in any regard.
Stick around and see for yourself.
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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OrgoneConclusion
Pharoah & Balanced
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 29,385
Loc: Luxor
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Redrawing]
#9243452 - 11/14/08 09:59 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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I am going to guess that you and WC hate broccoli.
Quote:
Really, none of these hold true in any regard.
Oh, really? Who is more likely to get banned even when following the rules: a fundamentalist on a skeptic message board or a skeptic on a fundamentalist message board?
How many skeptics have accosted you in the airport or knocked on your door with a dogmatic pamphlet?
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This is your drain on brugs.
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deCypher
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 52,515
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#9243465 - 11/14/08 10:01 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
How many skeptics have accosted you in the airport or knocked on your door with a dogmatic pamphlet?
How many anti-believer, pro-skeptic rants from OC have visually assaulted my eyeballs upon entering P&S?
Well, at least you're evening out the score.
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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 67,609
Loc: underbelly
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: deCypher]
#9243492 - 11/14/08 10:05 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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He's trying to save you dude. Show some appreciation.
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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Recondicom
Power of four
Registered: 05/03/07
Posts: 226
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#9243505 - 11/14/08 10:08 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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B: Love and Faith are both passions. They release known/unknown chemicals in the brain.
S: They need
B: Super inflated.
S: They blow.
B: Actions are subject to extremes (realistic moral or the “rules”). The enforcing releases more chemicals.
S: It is a maybe or a probably not.
B: We are it.
S: Probably not. I can show you proof.
Note: S is not to be confused with Socrates. “ I know that I know nothing” When I was a young man I went to the oracle at Delphi… and now… @3$556&* Hey… what were Socrates last words?
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Wave.
'And for this reason repentance (metanoia) is an elevating means. For he who feels impatience with the circunstances in which he finds himself, devises means of escape.
Now the chief thing in purification is the will. For then both deeds and words lend a helping hand. But, when the will is absent, the whole purificatory discipline of initiation is...'
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 67,609
Loc: underbelly
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Recondicom]
#9243519 - 11/14/08 10:11 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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They release known/unknown chemicals in the brain.
Now how would you know they release "unknown" chemicals in the brain unless you are a true believer?
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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OrgoneConclusion
Pharoah & Balanced
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 29,385
Loc: Luxor
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Recondicom]
#9243537 - 11/14/08 10:13 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
I know nothing! No-thing!
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This is your drain on brugs.
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Recondicom
Power of four
Registered: 05/03/07
Posts: 226
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Icelander]
#9243552 - 11/14/08 10:18 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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I would answer with the X-files. But...It is classified.
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Wave.
'And for this reason repentance (metanoia) is an elevating means. For he who feels impatience with the circunstances in which he finds himself, devises means of escape.
Now the chief thing in purification is the will. For then both deeds and words lend a helping hand. But, when the will is absent, the whole purificatory discipline of initiation is...'
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 67,609
Loc: underbelly
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Recondicom]
#9243573 - 11/14/08 10:23 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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"The truth is out there". Go deep.
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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OrgoneConclusion
Pharoah & Balanced
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 29,385
Loc: Luxor
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Icelander]
#9243589 - 11/14/08 10:25 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Marianas Trench? Already been to Roswell...
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This is your drain on brugs.
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The Chronic
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 11,041
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Icelander]
#9243729 - 11/14/08 10:50 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
Quote:
Nexion said:
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
S: Likes broccoli.
B: Hates broccoli.
Key point!
Broccoli makes you really logical. Yum!
I eat a big bowl of brocoli everyday, theres that theory out the window...
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 67,609
Loc: underbelly
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
#9243732 - 11/14/08 10:51 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Try Marilyn Chambers.
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 67,609
Loc: underbelly
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: The Chronic]
#9243740 - 11/14/08 10:52 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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I eat a big bowl of brocoli everyday, theres that theory out the window...
It has to be organically grown..
--------------------
“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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The Chronic
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 11,041
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Re: The Main Differences between Skeptic and Believer [Re: Icelander]
#9243776 - 11/14/08 10:58 AM (3 years, 6 months ago) |
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Sorry to be so pedantic but i only eat organic veg, apart from the pickles in my bacon double cheeseburger
I think being skeptical is good if you really still have the urge to discover truth, but if you dismiss everything as mystical new age nonsense then your just as ignorant as people who blindly believe in it, your still stuck in a mind state thats rigid & unopen to new knowledge, we are always learning so open minded scepticism is good, but closed minded scepticism is the most ignorant imo
The fact is that new knowledge comes in from the unknown, so if your not willing to explore the unknown then your being ignorant
"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind"
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