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Offlinexshadowmage666x
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household suicide
    #8473853 - 06/02/08 07:26 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Pulled this from digg.com


Japan is facing an alarming new trend: Websites that explain simple ways to commit suicide with household chemicals have led to several deaths and emergency room nightmares.

By mixing toilet cleaner with pesticide, anyone can make a cloud of deadly hydrogen sulfide gas. If the concentration is too low, it won't work, so at least one set of instructions includes a web app that can calculate the perfect amount of each ingredient.

Hydrogen sulfide can stick to the metal ions which sit at the core of many important enzymes in our bodies. In small amounts, it can put animals into a state of suspended animation.


That trick may work because H2S simultaneously suffocates the critters and halts the natural dying process: It gums up the proteins that would ordinarily go haywire and destroy their cells when they are deprived of oxygen.

Unfortunately, in large doses, inhaling the gas is a one-way ticket to eternity.


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"It is the prayer of my innermost being to realize my supreme identity in the liberated play of consciousness, the Vast Expanse. Now is the moment, Here is the place of Liberation. " -alex grey


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OfflineAiko Aiko
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Re: household suicide [Re: xshadowmage666x]
    #8473871 - 06/02/08 07:40 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

weird


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*When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace. ~Jimi Hendrix

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InvisibleFerris
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Re: household suicide [Re: Aiko Aiko]
    #8473880 - 06/02/08 07:43 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

It's not like suicide is new to Japanese culture. I respect a society that lets its weaker members weed itself out and don't think this should be looked down upon.

A good old fashioned sword should always be a primarily considered option however. Where's the honor in using gas?


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: household suicide [Re: Ferris]
    #8473905 - 06/02/08 07:57 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

H2S is pretty far from a humane death and it stinks into the high heavens so that people may flee the scene half-poisoned.

Quote:

A good old fashioned sword should always be a primarily considered option however.




Seppuku suicide was always followed up by a kill by someone standing by. Plunging the sword into ones body rarely was lethal swiftly, leading to an agonized death.

Quote:

Where's the honor in using gas?




Wheres the honor in any kind of suicide or murder?


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InvisibleFerris
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Re: household suicide [Re: Asante]
    #8473926 - 06/02/08 08:15 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

By weeding out the weak, you are improving your society. I know its morbid, and that Western culture can't relate, but it's a solid argument.


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Offlinezouden
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Re: household suicide [Re: Ferris]
    #8473934 - 06/02/08 08:20 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Who decides that they are weak?


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I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see


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InvisibleFerris
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Re: household suicide [Re: zouden]
    #8473938 - 06/02/08 08:24 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Well, either the individual decides from themselves, or they get the impression from the friends/families/co-workers that they have somehow shamed them. I wouldn't profess to understand the system, but it's worked for hundreds of years. It's not that difficult, cmon.


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Offlinezouden
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Re: household suicide [Re: Ferris]
    #8473944 - 06/02/08 08:29 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

If you have "somehow shamed" your friends or relatives it doesn't mean you are "weak" and should kill yourself. Hardly anyone would make it through adolescence, and this forum would be almost empty.
Quote:

it's worked for hundreds of years



I wouldn't call that working.


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see


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InvisibleFerris
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Re: household suicide [Re: zouden]
    #8473954 - 06/02/08 08:38 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Look, I didn't make that post so you could throw a hissy fit about the immorality of suicide or whatever.  Obviously, people don't just commit suicide on a whim because someone frowned at them.  It's only when someone feels an over-riding sense of extreme shame (say, I don't know, if you were caught commiting a felony).

I'm by far no expert on Japanese culture; I'll leave that to the anime nerds.  But I'm just trying to relate that western views on suicide reflect hundreds of years of Chistian guilt, and that it CAN be within a populations interest to weed out the weak.  I'm not proposing we start implementing some godamn race purifying system.  I'm just saying that I think suicide is a right, and could actually serve the greater good of society, especially in this overpopulated world with very little danger to those of us unfortunate to be damaged goods from the start.

FYI, I'm a fine peice of human meat if I do say so myself :wink:


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InvisibleBridgeburner
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Re: household suicide [Re: Ferris]
    #8474121 - 06/02/08 10:26 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

suicide is cool. huffing gas is cool too.


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Offlinexeallos
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Re: household suicide [Re: Bridgeburner]
    #8474178 - 06/02/08 10:59 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

It's only when someone feels an over-riding sense of extreme shame... I'm just trying to relate that western views on suicide reflect hundreds of years of Chistian guilt




Wtf?

Everyone I know made the decision to kill themselves due to their perception of a lack of a future or direct control over it.

Similar framing is used in quality of life decisions with regards to terminal care and life support.

It really doesn't have shit to do with religion or some supposed instinct to remove your presumably inadequate genes from the breeding pool of the Motherland... although I give you points for such a pointlessly psychotic theory.

This all reminds me of the killyourself.com story...


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Offlinelukey2411
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Re: household suicide [Re: xeallos]
    #8474195 - 06/02/08 11:13 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

The true weak links in society are the rapists, murderers...etc. Exactly the people who don't give a fuck about the 'greater good of society'.

So in the end you end up with capital punishment. Nice one, you tit.

I'm glad "western culture can't relate", I'd prefer to have an empathetic, egalitarian society that has it's problems but at least tries to help the "weak" ones out and not "weed" them out. Society isn't a machine or a hard disk that needs to be de-fragmented. I hope you're only voicing these opinions to start some debate on the topic.


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InvisibleBridgeburner
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Re: household suicide [Re: xeallos]
    #8474196 - 06/02/08 11:13 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

xeallos said:
Quote:

It's only when someone feels an over-riding sense of extreme shame... I'm just trying to relate that western views on suicide reflect hundreds of years of Chistian guilt




Wtf?

Everyone I know made the decision to kill themselves due to their perception of a lack of a future or direct control over it.

Similar framing is used in quality of life decisions with regards to terminal care and life support.

It really doesn't have shit to do with religion or some supposed instinct to remove your presumably inadequate genes from the breeding pool of the Motherland... although I give you points for such a pointlessly psychotic theory.

This all reminds me of the killyourself.com story...




the western society IS conditioned by christian feeling of guilt: guilt of not achieving the standards the society has set for him/her. the dude you quoted is pretty much right.


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InvisibleFerris
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Re: household suicide [Re: lukey2411]
    #8474256 - 06/02/08 11:43 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

lukey2411 said:
I'm glad "western culture can't relate", I'd prefer to have an empathetic, egalitarian society that has it's problems but at least tries to help the "weak" ones out and not "weed" them out. Society isn't a machine or a hard disk that needs to be de-fragmented.




I agree with you Lukey. I explicitly stated that I didn't beleive we should actively try to inact any policy remotely like that. I just stated that suicide is a personal choice and if a person decides to do so with the intent of the greater good, I think that person has made a morally justified choice.

Xeallos decided to take my statement out of context to make the opposite argument, and I beleive he is a victim of the conditioning I reffered to before. Suicide causes no direct harm to others, except possibly emotional harm to friends and family members, and therefore I have a hard time finding immorality in the action outside Christianity's inane notions of heaven and hell. In the Japanese society in particular, suicide is looked at as acceptable in certain situations, so even the contingency of the immorality of emotional harm is partially nullified.

Yes Lukey, the point of my bringing this up is just for a harmless debate, although it's inevitable that in a discussion like this, there's going to be some complications.


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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: household suicide [Re: Ferris]
    #8474332 - 06/02/08 12:15 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Ferris said:
Well, either the individual decides from themselves, or they get the impression from the friends/families/co-workers that they have somehow shamed them. I wouldn't profess to understand the system, but it's worked for hundreds of years. It's not that difficult, cmon.




QFT. It obviously worked well for the Japanese, and western culture doesn't really understand it at all, but I respect the tradition and agree it helps to weed some of the weaker links out.


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Offlinelukey2411
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Re: household suicide [Re: Ferris]
    #8474335 - 06/02/08 12:17 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

"no direct harm to others"
Unless you are the unlucky bugger who has a falling body land on them!

Understood and respected. :thumbup:


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Offlinexeallos
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Re: household suicide [Re: xeallos]
    #8474402 - 06/02/08 12:44 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Xeallos decided to take my statement out of context to make the opposite argument, and I beleive he is a victim of the conditioning I reffered to before.



Obviously you aren't interested in having a rational conversation on the subject, my apologies for replying to your initial insanity with even a modicum of sincerity.

My only conditioning in the context of suicide has come from the wonderful sight of two of my friends corpses laying motionless with their brains spilled out, one with a revolver and one with a shotgun. Not quite as cute as your GED level psychological framing and vocabulary though, that's for sure.


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: household suicide [Re: Ferris]
    #8474414 - 06/02/08 12:49 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

By weeding out the weak, you are improving your society.





And the weak ofcourse are you?

Oh right, I get it: other people must be weeded out to make way for people like yourself.


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Offlineheartofalion
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Re: household suicide [Re: Asante]
    #8474431 - 06/02/08 12:54 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

I have to agree with our buddy, suicide is a right. If someone feels they should no longer be alive what right do we have to tell them they should.....What he is saying is suicide isnt frowned upon in japan the way it is here in the US. If you ever attempt suicide and fail in the US its a major stain on your reputation. It sounds like in japan its not looked down upon and the choice is left to the individual. I personally would rather not live in a society where i am forced to live even against my will.


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Edited by heartofalion (06/02/08 12:57 PM)


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Offlinelukey2411
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Re: household suicide [Re: xeallos]
    #8474433 - 06/02/08 12:54 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

It's always a bad idea to assume that everyone who doesn't agree with you have been brainwashed.


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