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Taharka
The Root of the Problem
Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 686
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: starkist]
#8289042 - 04/15/08 09:32 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Do you really want to cut up/boil and consume disgustingly bitter T. grandiflorus flesh for the off-chance you might trip? The activity of many Trichocereus are rumored, but only peruvianus, bridgesii, and pachanoi are established. I've also read reports from cuzcoensis and macrogonus. Most cacti contain alkaloids, but nothing to get excited about. If T. grandiflorus had something significant to offer, I'm sure we'd know about it by now.
That said, bioassay is still the best way forward in this field.
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Fnord
TWISTER FORMONEY, TWISTERFOR BLOOD!
Registered: 02/05/08
Posts: 243
Loc: maine
Last seen: 14 years, 10 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: starkist]
#8289051 - 04/15/08 09:33 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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If your looking for more info on grandis google grandiflorus and fnord the top one is usefull, im still awaiting shulgins info on teh validity of his tests.
-------------------- Blessed are they that run around in circles, for they shall be known as wheels.
Edited by Fnord (04/15/08 09:34 PM)
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plainswalker
Plant Shepherd
Registered: 03/29/07
Posts: 765
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: starkist]
#8289075 - 04/15/08 09:37 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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As far as I know the cactus does not contain any of the big M. It could be psychoactive, although probably not any more psychoactive than a can of Mountain Dew.
-------------------- tradelist
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Fnord
TWISTER FORMONEY, TWISTERFOR BLOOD!
Registered: 02/05/08
Posts: 243
Loc: maine
Last seen: 14 years, 10 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: plainswalker]
#8289143 - 04/15/08 09:46 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
"Though T. grandiflorus is not known as a traditional hallucinogen, this short columnar species has gained interest due to Shulgin's unpublished chemical analysis that indicated the presence of N,N-dimethyltryptamine (DMT), the powerful hallucinogenic drug contained in numerous plants known for their hallucinogenic use throughout South America.
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Upon the reanalysis of T. grandiflorus Shulgin was unable to confirm the presence of DMT and had some concerns to whether or not the same plant material was used for the confirmation. Shulgin's belief was that he used the red-flowering variety originally and the yellow-flowering variety afterwords, but there had also been concern about the use of contaminated laboratory equipment.
Quote:
Quote:Contemporary human bio-assay has strongly suggested the presence of mescaline, at least in the white-flowered variety.
Quote:Several flower colors exist, including white, yellow, and red. The white-flowered species is nocturnal-blooming and is known as Trichocereus grandiflrus, while the red-flowered day-bloomer is better known as Helianthocereus grandiflorus. Both are in their own distinct taxa, but are closely related. A yellow-flowered day-blooming variety is also known to exist, but it may simply be an "affinity" species that may not in fact be T. grandiflorus. The red- and white- flowering T. lobiviodes "grandiflrus" appear to be synonymous with H. grandiflorus and T. grandiflorus respectively. Claritive identification of the variations and their proper taxon classification is necessary.
Quote:Often this species is referred to as Lobivia, but it is best known as Echinopsis Hauscha. Of the very few Helianthocereus and Lobvia species tested for alkaloids, none have been found to contain mescaline."
Quote:I was curious to see if there were any effects from this particular species.I am happy to report that this plant is quite active indeed.I consumed 8 oz. of raw blended cactus and within 15 minutes there were stimulating effects.After about 2 hours into the journey it became more visual . Likened to a trichocereus panachoi trip.However the onset was slightly more delayed. About 1/2 hour in my estimation.Usually with panachoi the effects seem more full blown at 90 minutes. The visual quality was about 75 % of that I have experienced previously.However the colors were more pronounced then the visual patterns.The were more vivid to say the least...the color spectrum was more varied and pronounced.This plant is however more stimulating then any trichocereus panachoi I have consumed in the past in my opinion. the effects lasted about 12 to 13 hours.I would say the stronger portion of the trip was about 9 hours though There were even some residual effects after three hours sleep. However I like to report there is a nice afterglow indeed.I have consumed trichocereus panachoi 35 times.I have consumed trichocereus spanchianus 3 times. This is a very mild hallucinogen..trichocereus spachianus.That is my opinion however. All in all I would reccommend this species for consumption . However it was slightly more nauseating then any cactus I previously ingested. Not too bad though. It just seemed a bit longer then usually what I'm used too. I never realized there were so many others interested in sacred plants these days.Was I ever wrong about that.I'm glad I joined.
Quote:Did you ever try the powder that you were speaking of before about a month ago?I've planted a new crop of trichocereus grandifloras and I'm pleased to say that I have 10 new pups from 35 seeds so far.I've decided that this plant does contain quite a bit of histamine in it's tissue. How ever this was conquered with one 30 mg sudfed anti histamine tablet. Thus making the experience much more pleasurable. I developed an allergy to the species after 3 journeys. I sought a way of controlling the effects of the histamine. This idea actually came to me during a salvia divinorum journey.Anyhow I like to hear back from you if possible velvet siren from the land down under about your experience with the T huasca powder.
Quote:yeah the guy who sent it to me i asked about dosage and he says around 2 - 3 grams dried material is a place to start but he didnt really know either, so i took 1 gram to start with there was a slight stimulation but apart form that nothing and that could of been placebo it wasnt very strong. so when the time is right i will go with 3 grams and see how that goes i never knew about the histamine effects of this cactus thanks for the heads up on that one. will make sure i got some antihistimine around if needed. good to hear you are growing this one and htat you have had 3 journeys with it. i am interested in this cactus, some people have been working with san pedro combined with hordenine which is the active ingredient in huascha as far as i know and they are saying it resembles the experience of bridgesii, this i foudn interesting but its from memory so will have to double check what they said exactly. anyway its a lovely cactus i would be interested ot hear of what lady salvia showed you about how to deal with the histamine effects.
Quote:
Several flower colors exist, including white, yellow, and red. The white-flowered species is nocturnal-blooming and is known as Trichocereus grandiflrus, while the red-flowered day-bloomer is better known as Helianthocereus grandiflorus. Both are in their own distinct taxa, but are closely related. A yellow-flowered day-blooming variety is also known to exist, but it may simply be an "affinity" species that may not in fact be T. grandiflorus. The red- and white- flowering T. lobiviodes "grandiflrus" appear to be synonymous with H. grandiflorus and T. grandiflorus respectively. Claritive identification of the variations and their proper taxon classification is necessary.
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From Ms smith Quote:MDMA has never been found in nature up to this point and I highly suspect there is something amiss in this. I'll see if I can get a clearer picture from Sasha. I haven't talked to him in years, but if it will help clarify something...
He told me once that he found Gramine in the T. grandiflorus, but I'm bit sure if that has been confirmed by him.
This is the info i have found so far that im willing to publish, more will come someday soon. i have tried about 10-15grams on an empty stomach was tried by me as a test dose,no effects that couldn't be differentiated as non-placebo were felt.
-------------------- Blessed are they that run around in circles, for they shall be known as wheels.
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starkist
Stranger
Registered: 04/13/08
Posts: 208
Last seen: 15 years, 7 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: Fnord]
#8289169 - 04/15/08 09:50 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Everyone one is saying that grandiflorus is short. the ones i found are rather tall.
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Fnord
TWISTER FORMONEY, TWISTERFOR BLOOD!
Registered: 02/05/08
Posts: 243
Loc: maine
Last seen: 14 years, 10 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: starkist]
#8289427 - 04/15/08 10:42 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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How tall are they? Are we allowed to link to other forums? i can show you pics of some grandis.
-------------------- Blessed are they that run around in circles, for they shall be known as wheels.
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shroomingjew
Banjankri
Registered: 10/01/07
Posts: 86
Loc: Californ-ya
Last seen: 13 years, 9 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: starkist]
#8289444 - 04/15/08 10:45 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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is that in malibu?
-------------------- nigga please
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sturmer88
Shroomer
Registered: 09/26/07
Posts: 582
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: starkist]
#8289445 - 04/15/08 10:45 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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I thought DMT containing plants if you were gonna injest orally needed in MAOI inhibitor? Only if you smoked them you could get an effect without one.
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Fnord
TWISTER FORMONEY, TWISTERFOR BLOOD!
Registered: 02/05/08
Posts: 243
Loc: maine
Last seen: 14 years, 10 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: sturmer88]
#8289481 - 04/15/08 10:54 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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MHRB is active oraly without an MAOI,im not sure about others. But even though shulgin confirmed this plant has DMT/whatever at one point i WOULD NOT belive his statment untill further testing, some people doubt the acuracy of his testing and if he used contaminated equipment. im waiting for info from a few diffrenent sources regarding this.
-------------------- Blessed are they that run around in circles, for they shall be known as wheels.
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starkist
Stranger
Registered: 04/13/08
Posts: 208
Last seen: 15 years, 7 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: shroomingjew]
#8289591 - 04/15/08 11:28 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
shroomingjew said: is that in malibu?
about 30 miles or so south on the coast.
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Fnord
TWISTER FORMONEY, TWISTERFOR BLOOD!
Registered: 02/05/08
Posts: 243
Loc: maine
Last seen: 14 years, 10 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: starkist]
#8289619 - 04/15/08 11:35 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Are links to other forums allowed?
-------------------- Blessed are they that run around in circles, for they shall be known as wheels.
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royer
±±±±±±±±±±
Registered: 05/15/06
Posts: 4,801
Loc: anywhere but here
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: Fnord]
#8290410 - 04/16/08 05:23 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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the big one is a cereus
-------------------- ================================================= if you have any questions please feel free to pm me , thx :-)
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Taharka
The Root of the Problem
Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 686
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: sturmer88]
#8290491 - 04/16/08 06:36 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
sturmer88 said: I thought DMT containing plants if you were gonna injest orally needed in MAOI inhibitor? Only if you smoked them you could get an effect without one.
I woulnd't call the grandiflorus in question a DMT-containing plant just because analysis revealed the presence of DMT. Most plants and animals supposedly contain trace amounts of DMT.
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Fnord
TWISTER FORMONEY, TWISTERFOR BLOOD!
Registered: 02/05/08
Posts: 243
Loc: maine
Last seen: 14 years, 10 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: Taharka]
#8290535 - 04/16/08 07:05 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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As i pointed out,i and others questions if shulgin used proper care when analyising this cacti and its very likly he made a mistake by anouncing at mindstates convention that it contained DMT and MDMA like substances.
Further testing is needed.
-------------------- Blessed are they that run around in circles, for they shall be known as wheels.
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casgoodie
weedwright
Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 770
Loc: terra
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: starkist]
#8291563 - 04/16/08 01:18 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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looks like a Cereus peruvianus and a Trichocereus spahcianus
-------------------- TRAPPED IN LINGUISTIC CONCEPTS
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ApacheShaman
Stranger
Registered: 06/27/06
Posts: 1,346
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: starkist]
#8292033 - 04/16/08 04:09 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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its a cereus peruvianus (SP?)
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,417
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: Taharka]
#8292186 - 04/16/08 04:47 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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shulgin probably didnt throughly clean his equipment. i have seen pics of his lab and he doesnt seem like the most organized person.
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sturmer88
Shroomer
Registered: 09/26/07
Posts: 582
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: Taharka]
#8292380 - 04/16/08 05:26 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Taharka said:
Quote:
sturmer88 said: I thought DMT containing plants if you were gonna injest orally needed in MAOI inhibitor? Only if you smoked them you could get an effect without one.
I woulnd't call the grandiflorus in question a DMT-containing plant just because analysis revealed the presence of DMT. Most plants and animals supposedly contain trace amounts of DMT.
I was commenting on DMT containing plants in general. I don't know anything about grandiflorus and I don't think I'd try it even if I did. If the test was correct sounds like a bunch of trouble for nothing. I would think if you wanted a DMT experience your best bet would be an Ayahuasca mixture.
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ShroomDoom
Friend of the Medicine
Registered: 06/07/04
Posts: 4,435
Loc: A Psychedelic State
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: starkist]
#8295487 - 04/17/08 09:46 AM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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i am 100% sure that is not a trichocerus pachanoi. looks like a cereus.
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Ozjuicemonkey
Stranger
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 2
Last seen: 15 years, 10 months
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Re: Did i just find the biggest score of active cactus ever? [Re: starkist]
#8309166 - 04/20/08 10:52 PM (15 years, 11 months ago) |
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geezus people
im not buying cacti off you!
there is no way in hell thats a pedro i strongly recommend yopu go look at some pedro pics and train your eyes
thats clearly a cereus of a species cluster normally called Cereus peruvianus around here which is an invalid name it may be one of a number of allied species
edible fruit. one form is cultivated in the levant under the name of Kubo
the Trichocereus spachianus in the first photo (left) it look too tall and well wrong for a huascha/grandiflorus is more interesting a brew of that may have stimulting properties or its an ok grafting stock
wait till it flowers if it coloured its a huascha/grand type if its nocturnal and white its a spachianus type
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