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Offlinevintage_gonzo
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Registered: 04/08/06
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Decent Article on Real LSD
    #6371540 - 12/14/06 07:28 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

It is a long read but I found it interesting. Talks about the progression of the LSD movement from the pure Sandoz acid to the "street acid" we are all familliar with and its effects on the spiritual aspect of the trip. What I found fascinating was at the very end of the article where it said "....if you are an acidhead, chances are you've never taken LSD." Really? It got me thinking was what ive taken, even though a very intense trip, just the tip of the iceberg? How rare is "pure" LSD-25? Is the fluffy chrystal LSD-25 or is that even impure? Anyways enjoy, I felt it was a good read.

http://www.bruceeisner.com/writings/2004/08/lsd_purity_from.html


LSD Purity -- From High Times 1977
LSD Purity - Cleanliness is next to godliness
From High Times, January 1977


By Bruce Eisner


In the late 1940s, psychologists began experimenting with LSD as a "psychotomimetic" drug - one that causes the taker temporarily to mime the condition of psychosis. Some experimental subjects, however, and eventually some modern mystics like Aldous Huxley, Allen Ginsberg, and Alan Watts discovered in LSD a shortcut to the ecstasy and egolessness of nirvana. LSD was recognized as the switch that turned on the clear light of the void.


Today's acid trip, however, is far more likely to resemble a live TV broadcast in runny color from the from seat of a roller coaster or a scene from The Exorcist. The decline in psychedelic quality over the years, which resembles the degeneration of Christianity and Russian Communism, has been a consequence of greed and opportunism on the part of manufactures and distributors. They offer to substitute immediate sensory gratifications for the original spiritual ideals. But the history of underground chemistry is also one of ingenuity and courage though influenced by haste and amateurishness. Its is the story of how LSD-25, the most powerful and spiritual molecule known to humanity became a "street drug."

Originally all LSD was made by Sandoz Pharmaceutical company, which had developed the chemical and hoped to market it commercially. It came in glass ampules filled with blue liquid, or small tablets in bottles with pharmaceutical labels specifying strength.

With underground LSD use came underground manufacture. The first recorded underground laboratory was set up by Bernard Roseman in 1962. Roseman, who now lives in seclusion in Oregon, was later arrested for allegedly attempting to smuggle 62,000 doses of LSD. In his LSD and the Age of the Mind, he has this account of the first manufacture of LSD of less than pharmaceutical quality:

I have already invested a year - on and off - and all the money I could save on this project, and I was at the point of admitting defeat. At this time, I was naturally reading everything I could lay my hands upon about ergot alkaloids. I stumbled upon a few articles that at first seemed quite unrelated to LSD, but they were logical and worth a try; because by comparison the process was exceedingly simple, compared to Hoffmann's monumental preparation.

I obtained new starting material and worked it up to the point I was sure was correct, where I had d-lysergic acid monohydrate, quite useless by itself but the prerequisite for making LSD-25 by any system. The rest of my ordered materials arrived and I was ready to proceed. After so many repeated failures, I couldn't accept the possibility that this few-day procedure would work.

I went ahead nevertheless, though pessimistically, so that my seemingly apparent failure would not bother me too much. I worked with extreme care, protecting anything from heat and light. At the last step, when I was recrystallizing the few grams I had obtained, I was filtering the crystals off by vacuum and using ether. When all the ether evaporated , the substance started to absorb moisture from the atmosphere and was turning black before my eyes. All my work was gone: I stood there shocked unable to move for a moment. My hands instinctively grabbed an alcohol bottle and I pored it over the black decomposed material hoping to salvage something. I separated it with water and disheartedly took the black mess home. All night I tossed and turned and dreamt horrible, unrelated dreams.

At the first crack of dawn, I jumped out of bed, grabbed the flask from the refrigerator, poured a teaspoonful and drank it down. I went back to bed and turned on Wagner's Parsifal. Minutes passed by and nothing seemed to happen. I had psychologically prepared myself for failure, so I just closed my eyes and lay back an listened to the wonderful sounds of Wagner. In my concentration, I failed to notice that the music was getting slowly louder and instead of just my ears hearing, all my senses seemed to encompass the sound., and instead of hearing the music - I was the music!

Beautiful, soft colors emerged and exploded as climates of tone were achieved. An immediate understanding of the composer's intentions was revealed to me; I was being taken on a heavenly excursion into the world of pure sound and emotion. All at once, I sprang up with joy. I was in the state of LSD - my own LSD which I had made. I was deliriously happy and proud of my success.

LSD is a translucent crystal; this was a black mess. Thus, the first underground LSD was also the first impure batch, and its distribution may, somewhere, have incurred the first unfavorable consumer reaction.

By 1965, use had increased sharply. Most acid at this time came in sugar cubes dropped with liquid Sandoz or some type of underground LSD. What percentage of the material was Sandoz is left to future determination. Augustus Stanley Owsley III, unable to obtain any pharmaceutical LSD, began to manufacture his own - first in Los Angeles in '65, then in nearby Point Richmond in '66.

Owsley's fellow alchemist, Tim Scully, admitted to me that the 1965 batch was impure, but claims that Owsley and he perfected a purification process in 1966. Many who used both Sandoz and Owsley - the latter came in tablets of purple (Purple Haze) and white (White Lightning) of 270 micrograms - say that Owsley acid was less mystical and had more stimulant side reactions than the Sandoz product.

Timothy Leary, who realized that impurities were a threat to the spreading psychedelic revolution, uttered prophetic words of warning at a Senate committee hearing in 1966, in exchange with Teddy Kennedy:

Senator Kennedy of Massachusetts: "What is it in the quality that you are frightened about?"

Dr. Leary: "We do not want amateur or black-market sale or distribution of LSD."

Senator Kennedy: "Why not?"

Dr. Leary: "Or the barbiturates or liquor. When you buy a bottle of liquor-"

Senator Kennedy: "This is not responsive. As to LSD, why do you not want it?"

Dr. Leary: "On possession?"

Senator Kennedy: "Why do you not want the indiscriminate manufacture and distribution? Is it because it is dangerous?"

Dr. Leary: "Because you do not know what you are getting..."

Despite Leary's warning, LSD was made illegal on October 16, 1966.


Owsley acid was the first large-scale commercialization of LSD. There were other smaller LSD laboratories before Owsley, and there were scores of laboratories that put out LSD at the same time that Owsley did. Some were making LSD of a purer form; the majority made it much worse.

After Owsley was arrested in 1967 at his tabbing facility at Orinda, California, his protege Scully set up a laboratory with Nicholas Sand, another alchemist long involved in the psychedelic scene. They manufactured a quantity of ALD-52 - a cousin to LSD, which they called Sunshine - in large crumbly orange tablets of 270 micrograms or so.

In the spring of 1969, Ron Stark, then a chemist with a European LSD factory and now a fugitive, allegedly began supplying underground acid to the Brotherhood of Eternal Love. Since the Brotherhood was also, by this time, distributing ALD-52, and since both drugs were tabbed into identical pills (except for a few early blue tablets of ALD-52), many people didn't realize that there was more than one kind of Sunshine. Many counterfeit versions soon appeared on the market, most of which were impure, according to Scully.

Sand and Scully ceased manufacturing, but Stark went on to produce over 10 kilograms (over 35 million doses in crystal form) of what became the famous Orange Sunshine - the last of which actually appeared in large red and green tablets called "Christmas Acid."

With the Sunshine boom came increased reports of side effects. In addition to stimulant reactions and symptoms akin to those of strychnine poisoning being reported, there seemed to be something missing in the spiritual dimensions of this new underground acid. Michael Hollinshead, who gave Leary his first taste of acid in 1960, later wrote in The Man Who Turned on the World:

There was now (1968) little good acid around, and what there was - the so-called "street acid" - came mainly from California. There was something wrong with the synthesis; it was not pure. And you were never sure what it was exactly that you were taking, so I only dropped it on those rare occasions when someone gave me "Sandoz" or "crystal" acid...

My evaluation had nothing to do with the notion that a wholly synthetic drug produced a wholly synthetic experience - the intellectual response - but was based on direct, first-hand experience (about 30 trips with street acid in all). And in each session I felt that there was something it lacked - it was too "electric," too "speedy" and too "mind-shattering." The earlier clarity of "insight" which I had obtained via the Sandoz acid was replaced by confusion, brokenness, words and worlds thrown into absolute dismemberment, or even absolute chaos, though, I must add, often coupled with a feeling that I can only describe as "sublime inflation," a super abundance of emotive energy, but it could not signify more a passionate flame and less the life-giving sun.

At Woodstock, Hugh Romney (a/k/a "Wavy Gravy") of the Hog Farm announced to the crowd, "There's no such thing as bad acid, just acid that's made wrong." In 1969, LSD began to appear in microdots, and in 1971, on gelatin sheets of various shapes - dubbed "windowpane." The strength of individual doses swiftly decreased, and so did the purity of the average street dose.

In a correspondence with City magazine in July 1975, Timothy Leary wrote: "After 1966, my lectures and writings were mainly concerned with a general theory of psychological and political relativity and made little mention of lysergic acid, which in truth, had been driven completely off the scene by Owsley speed, orange amphetamine, and the more commercially and socially acceptable cocaine-heroin trade."

In Timothy Leary at Folsom Prison, a filmed dialog made for television but never broadcast, he amplifies: "I don't particularly recommend you take LSD. First of all, 99 percent of what they say about it isn't true." Ken Kesey also had occasion to reflect back on the acid scene in his recent book Garage Sale: "I can't really recommend acid, because acid has become an almost meaningless chemical. I mean, the first acid I took was Sandoz, given me by the federal government in a series of experiments (what now, Uncle? Don't give me that anti-American drug field bullshit: you turned me on ...!) and it was beautiful.

"With perhaps the exception of Owsley's work, every bootleg batch I've tried from then on down has been interesting, enlightening, agonizing, bizarre, etc., but never anything as pure."

Many other early trippers, including Alan Harrington (author of Psychopaths), Dr. Stanley Krippner (former head of Brooklyn's Maimonides Hospital Dream Lab) and Adam Smith (author of Powers of Mind in addition to his Wall Street best sellers), have also noted the decline in psychedelic use and linked it with the purity crisis.

An LSD experience is a complex interaction of five influential factors: set, setting, guide (fellow tripper), purity, and dosage level.

Set refers to the psychological makeup of the LSD tripper, both long term (genetic inheritance and childhood conditioning) and short term (expectations about the LSD experience and how the person feels that morning).

Setting refers to the environment of the trip - indoors or outdoors, "informal suburban house," "formal hospital room," or "windy beach at sunrise."

Set, setting and guide form the fabric of the trip. But before these influences can come into play, alteration in consciousness must occur. Thus, the nature of the biochemical used, its purity and its dosage level are most central in determining the course the session will take.

In its pure form, LSD (d-lysergic acid diethyl amide) is an odorless, colorless, and either tart-tasting (if in the tartrate form) or tasteless crystal substance. The major pharmaceutical company manufacturing pure LSD, for research purposes, is the Spofa United Pharmaceutical Works in Prague, Czechoslovakia, although it has been manufactured by many others. Besides Sandoz Pharmaceutical Company in Switzerland, there was the Eli Lilly & Company with the patent for the Garbrecht process (the most efficient process for the manufacture of LSD), and Farmitillia of Milan, Italy, which perfected the deep-vat cultivation of ergot, a mold that grows on rye, among other places, and serves as a source for lysergic acid monohydrate, the main precursor of LSD. In addition, a number of U.S. pharmaceutical firms make small amount of LSD for testing purposes.

Today, underground acid comes in many forms; in tablets of varying sizes and colors, in capsules (most popular from 1966 to 1968), as gelatin windowpane (a lamentable hardship to vegetarians, who do not eat cow hooves from which the gelatin is derived), plastic film, blotter paper, liquid vials, and many other forms - just about anything on which a liquid can be dripped has been used. Since LSD is a crystal and the average dose is so small as to be just barely visible, it is usually dissolved in a solvent such as ethyl alcohol and then dropped on some medium buffered with some inert substance. Only if a buffering substance is inert will it not affect the course of action of the biochemical mind-changer.

The most common explanation regarding impurities seems to be adulteration with some other biochemical mind-changer such as speed (amphetamine) or strychnine additives. Yet, as most testing programs and drug information organizations are fond of repeating, there is rarely speed or strychnine in street acid. The most common additive is PCP (phencyclidine, or Serylan, an animal tranquilizer that causes hallucinogenic delirium reactions), which is also present when street acid is mislabeled "mescaline" or "psilocybin." Synthetic mescaline and psilocybin (usually psilocyn) disappeared from the streets a bit after pure LSD did (around 1969), and the only genuine forms of these drugs on the streets now are the organic staples of mushrooms or buttons of peyote. (Note: The acid-PCP combination is sometimes used on store-bought mushrooms, so caution is advised.)

Because of the imprecise nature of the street-drug market, a number of street drug-testing programs were established in the 1970s. These drug organizations have repeatedly labeled most street samples of underground acid as "LSD." For example, the Straight Dope Newsletter, a compilation of information from U. S. testing organizations, reported on a total of 209 samples turned in to the various organizations during the period from March 1973 thru July 1973, of which 183 samples were "LSD."

PharmChem of Palo Alto, California, the most noted of the various street drug testing groups, reported in 1973: "Of 405 samples said to be LSD, 91.6 percent were as alleged, 3.4 percent had no drug at all, 3 percent were actually DOM, PCP and others, and 2 percent had DOM, PCP and methamphetamine in addition to LSD."

Contrast these two reports to a survey abstracted in LSD - A Total Study (edited by D. V. Siva Sankar): "Marshman and Gibbons tested 519 samples of street drugs for which the vendor's claimed composition was available. Of the samples alleged to be LSD, 44 percent contained LSD with two or more contaminants or even were mixtures of intermediate chemicals resulting from the failed attempts to synthesize LSD."

There is something wrong, something impure about today's "street acid." One possible theo[EXEC:Url '/docs/purity.shtml' not found or insecure]ry for the degeneration of LSD manufacture is given by Hollingshead in The Man Who Turned on the World:

I think the problem for the underground chemists manufacturing clandestine acid was a shortage of ergot, without which the synthesis of d-LSD-25 is impossible. Until 1965, supplies of ergot could be bought with little difficulty from three or four European chemical companies; but pressure from Washington put a stop to this, doubtlessly hopeful that this would lead to an end of clandestine LSD. In one sense, the Federal authorities were right. The underground ceased turning out d-LSD-25; instead, they discovered a wholly synthetic substance akin to d-LSD-25....Sure the new stuff "worked" in the sense that any new mind-altering chemical "works" to produce subjective effects within the body, but it didn't seem to produce in those who used it any particular noticeable elevation in either head or heart; at least it was - and probably is - an unpopular view amongst the "congnoscenti" who claim that some of the street acid is capable of producing positive subjective effects of a "long-lasting nature," though they readily admit a lot of the stuff sold as "pure acid" is actually methamphetamine (a potent form of amphetamine first developed by the U.S. Army) or a stripped-down ergotamine compound by modern molecular chemistry.

A more likely reason for the different effects of street acid and LSD is that by-product impurities contaminate the product at various points in manufacture. LSD can be made from lysergic acid derived from either morning-glory seeds or ergot, or from compounds made from ergot - including ergotamine tartrate, a pharmaceutical drug used in treating migraine headaches. LSD can also be synthesized totally from organic chemicals. No matter what process is used, if it is carried forth correctly, the resultant molecule is LSD.

Before LSD was made illegal, the materials for its manufacture could be purchased from a number of chemical companies in the United States and Europe. Most Owsley acid was manufactured from lysergic acid monohydrate obtained from Sandoz before lysergic acid was proscribed. But after 1966, properly prepared precursors were not easily obtainable.

The manufacturing of he necessary precursors is a long process, and a great many new occasions for impurities can arise. During the preparation of the main precursor - lysergic acid monohydrate - various ergot alkaloids and cycloalkamides of lysergic acid will contaminate the final product if not later removed by proper chromatographic procedures. Which contaminants do appear depends on whether the starting material was ergot, ergotamine tartate or morning-glory seeds. And once these proper precursors have been synthesized into LSD, various isomers and lumi-LSD (LSD saturated with water) may contaminate the final product if not removed by proper chromatographic procedures.

Thus, chromatography, the highly refined procedure that the organic chemist uses to isolate specific chemicals, is the key process by which impurities may or may not be removed from he eventual LSD crystal. A passage from Psychedelic Chemistry, by Michael Valentine Smith:

There is a great deal of superstition regarding purification of psychedelics. Actually, any impurities which may be present as a result of synthetic procedures will almost certainly be without any effect on the trip. If there are 200 micrograms of impurities present... and few compounds will produce a significant effect until a hundred to a thousand times this amount has been ingested. Even mescaline, which has a rather specific psychedelic effect, requires about a thousand times this amount.

Most of the books on the market that give details on the LSD process - for example, Psychedelic Guide to the Preparation of the Eucharist, by Robert Brown, Basic Drug Manufacturing and The Book of Acid, by Adam Gottlieb, as well as Michael Valentine Smith's book - fail to describe the efficient chromatographic procedures, like zone-melting chromatography, necessary for the manufacture of pure LSD. Timothy Scully told me that both he and Owsley believed the tolerable limits of impurities to be on tenth of a percentage point (requiring 99.9% purity) - far from the 50 percent figure of Michael Valentine Smith! Until careful studies are done, the true figures for tolerable impurities will remain unknown.

How do these impurities change the optimum course of action of LSD and the experience it creates? One of the theories is that, because d-LSD-25 is like a key (its outer electron shell has a specific shape), it fits into a number of tiny locks called "receptor sites." These are located somewhere in the brain - nobody is sure where, but one theory suggests that they might be in the brain stem. It is known, however, that these receptor sites interact only with extremely specific molecular configurations.

The various ergot compounds, cycloalkamides of LSD and lumi-LSD plug into the same receptor sites as LSD does. But these compounds evidently don't turn the lock in the smooth, clean manner of LSD. Many of these compounds have effects similar to symptoms of ergot poisoning - the St. Anthony's Fire of he Middle Ages. These symptoms include inflamed joints, headaches, nausea, and hot and cold flashes.

Isomers of LSD are another possible contaminant and indeed are reported present by the drug analysis groups. There are four possible isomers of LSD, but only the d-lysergic acid diethyl amide form is active. The other rotation forms - l-lysergic acid diethyl amide, d and l iso-lysergic acid diethyl amide (contrary to recent reports!) - are inactive. they have no pharmacological role, except possibly as a catalyst for some latent effect of LSD, or to block the action of LSD at the receptor site.

If a contaminated batch of diethyl amine is used in the manufacturing process, or if the chemist purposely decides to make them, LSD homologues might be present in the final crystal. Molecules similar to LSD in structure but with some addition, subtraction or rearrangement of action, homologues plug into the same keyhole that LSD does.

Some of these homologues have profound effects that vary in course of action and potency. For example, the strongest of he homologues, ALD-52, has 91 percent the potency of LSD and is said to have a slightly different effect upon the mind (there is some dispute about this).

However, as Albert Hoffmann puts it in "Drugs Affecting the Central Nervous System": LSD has the highest and most specific effect and may therefore be considered as the genuine prototype of psychotomimetic compounds."

Thus, all impurities found in LSD are like imperfect keys. Such substances as ergot alkaloids, cycloalkamides and other lysergic acid derivatives, and LSD homologues and lumi-LSD are drugs that might open the door par way. But only pure LSD opens the doors of perception all the way.

In addition to manufactured impurities, impurities can also arise from decomposition of LSD. Dr. Albert Hoffmann points out in his paper "The Chemistry of LSD": "The free base as well as the tartrate of d-lysergic acid diethyl amide, like all lysergic acid derivatives, is very sensitive to light and oxidizing agents. All preparations must be stored carefully, protected from light and from oxygen of the air, to prevent them from being destroyed within a short time."

Even if, by some chance, an underground batch were made pure, it would turn to bunk in time, especially if put in conventional underground packaging (blotter or windowpane) that does not protect it from light or air. Pharmaceutical LSD is stored in vacuum vials in nitrogen gas. A pure, viable form of black-market LSD should find its way to the consumer in a tablet coated with pure, inert buffering material or in a vacuum vial, but this expensive packaging is certainly not reconcilable with dealing for profit.

Why is it that most of he underground LSD in the United States is made wrong? There are several other possible explanations. One chemist, for instance, told me that it was "because all the pros ar out of the field." That is to say, most underground chemists, whether motivated by altruism or greed, are incompetent to manufacture pharmaceutical-grade chemicals.

Moreover, they often lack the money to buy the complicated equipment necessary to produce pharmaceutical-grade materials or to test their final product properly.

Paranoia, too, can lead to faulty manufacture. A chemist often doesn't have the time to do a full scale procedure, or will take shortcuts to limit possible exposure to bursts.

It would help if street-drug analysis groups perfected their methods of analysis. Many such groups do not have samples of the impurities that can exist in street acid, and are therefore unable to identify them.. In addition, their testing techniques are not up to the exacting task of determining the nature of their samples. Most rely on thin-layer chromatography, which can show only that LSD exists in a sample,, but not all of he other impurities lurking there.

In a private correspondence, Dr Alexander T. Shulgin, a professor of toxicology at the University of California at Berkeley commented:

In the usual analysis of LSD (such as done at PharmChem Foundation) one chromatographs an extract of the suspected drug, observes the resulting separation under UV light, and then sprays the plate with some color-generating agent such as paradimethylaminobenzaldehyde (PDAB). If there are impurities present that fluoresce (such as lysergic acid or iso-LSD) and that have mobility in the chromatographic separation, they will be seen. If impurities are present that have the intact indole-2-hydrogen atom, they will give blue to purple colors with PDAB. Both tests require, of course, that there are amounts present sufficient to be seen. But if the impurity does not fluoresce (as is known to occur with lumi-LSD or any of the photoaddition products) or will not react with PDAB (as would be found with 2-substituted impurities such as 2-oxo-ergots), then they (the impurities) would remain invisible. It is completely possible that an LSD sample could be grossly contaminated with impurities and, if they did not give any response to one of these two tests, it is highly likely that their presence would never even be suspected.

Again, it would be helpful if street-drug analysis groups started looking for by-product impurities and established criteria for psychedelic chemical purity. They must stop labeling their impure samples "LSD", a habit that suggests purity and thereby creates much confusing in the public mind and among drug writers. Instead they must clearly distinguish between street acid and pure, pharmaceutical LSD. And if they cannot afford the equipment to test LSD (mass spectrometers and electron microscopes), then they should let the public know about their true capacities. For that matter, none of the commercially sold drug-testing kits is capable of determining purity.

Many early LSD users later gave up on acid and tried other methods of consciousness-expansion as available LSD became impure. They thought that LSD did not work any more, or blamed their heads, not realizing it was a change in the nature of the actual chemical. Thus, the increasing number of impurities led many people to repress the mystical experiences they had had, and retreat to a comfortable, "cool" conformity. Or they turned to Eastern gurus and Jesus movements.

I suspect that impurities give people body trips (euphoria) rather than the pure mind trips of LSD (ecstasy). People turned to other euphoria-producing drugs (pot is on of these) because street acid fell into the realm of dishonest dealing games and lost the spiritual qualities of LSD. Just the fact that LSD did not work any more led people into attempts to escape from the all-too-static reality via coke, pot, tranquilizers, alcohol and smack.

As experiences changed, the emphasis among the makers and distributors of LSD changed. In the beginning, the main motivation was spiritual - to turn people on. Much LSD was given for free, and dealing was just an amateur pastime. As LSD became another in a long list of body drugs, avarice polluted the spiritual stream.

The real responsibility for all this lies not with the underground, or even the public, victims of brainwashing with beer and TV, but with the government. Today, a small elite of government-sanctioned scientists controls LSD in the United States. Despite the good their limited research does, their exclusive and narrow-sighted use of these drugs seems sad in the face of the much greater good that psychedelics could do if more widely used. Many suggestions for more rational use include making LSD a prescription drug, creating LSD centers or making LSD a patent medicine.

The psychedelic movement, which has been in eclipse for ten years, will remain dormant until people can get LSD of known strength and purity. Until then, if you are an acidhead, chances are you've never taken LSD.

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OfflineLedHead
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: vintage_gonzo] * 1
    #6371551 - 12/14/06 07:30 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

this has been proven to be false over and over. read any one of the treads about acid "purity" levels, basically the more impure it is the weaker a said ammount of crystal is. if its 94 percent pure than dissolving to make it 100 mics a hit would be 94 mics a hit. im sure someone could explain it better but yeah thats untrue so sorry, us acidheads have definately been doing real deal lsd


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Offlinevintage_gonzo
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: LedHead]
    #6371556 - 12/14/06 07:32 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

where has it been proven false? do you have any links

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OfflineLedHead
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: vintage_gonzo]
    #6371566 - 12/14/06 07:34 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

its around the forums do searches on acid purity


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Offlinekosmic_charlie
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: vintage_gonzo]
    #6371636 - 12/14/06 07:49 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

if you are an acidhead, chances are you've never taken LSD.




That is a completely bogus and outdated article.  There is still very pure LSD being made such as needlepoint.  Also, a few micrograms of impurities isn't going to affect any person cosuming that with a few hundred mics of LSD.  And he goes so far as to say it's not even LSD!?  :rolleyes:

I think the leading theory is that impurities only have pronounced effects on the user in very large doses of LSD (like a visible amount of crystal).  The speedy, body buzz feeling mentioned in the article can be attributed to the LSD and also is probably dependent very much on set and setting.


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OfflineChemiker
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: vintage_gonzo]
    #6372615 - 12/15/06 12:59 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Balls. Samples of street "acid" have been known to contain LSD. Eisner has no clue what he's talking about.

I've seen a lot of babblings about LSD impurities and their synergistic effects, but nothing remotely convincing or backed up by anything objective. I suspect that the majority of impurities are simply inactive and have no effect, so the only "effect" an impurity would have would be to effectively reduce the dosage. Without double-blind placebo controlled studies, I don't see how anyone can possibly claim to definitively know what impurities cause what effects. Reports like this are totally bogus.

Also, wtf is "needlepoint"?

Quote:

vintage_gonzo said:
"....if you are an acidhead, chances are you've never taken LSD."



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Offlinelsd25icu812
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: Chemiker]
    #6372645 - 12/15/06 01:24 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

i think this is a great article.... I'm not going to get into the argument but i agree very strongly. very very subtle effects. but it makes a difference in the spiritual experience. i strongly believe this and don't care to argue about it but i just thought id give my opinion. Every highly acclaimed chemist ..... Hoffman...owsley(white lighting) ... nick sand(orange sun shine).... they all preached and still preach purity very very strongly. but anyway, thats what i think. i have eaten low quality at high doses, and i have eaten very high quality. THERE IS A DIFFERENCE. talk to someone who has eaten amber crystal and then eaten fluff. see if they agree.


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OfflineLimerick
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: vintage_gonzo]
    #6372825 - 12/15/06 05:18 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Really good article. I already knew most of this. i've tripped with my dad with some very weak acid like they describe, and he said it was quite different from the stuff he was trying back in the 60s (one of them being Orange Sunshine).

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OfflineExplosiveMango
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: Limerick]
    #6372940 - 12/15/06 07:37 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Most acid is real, I don't know what this guy is thinking.


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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: ExplosiveMango]
    #6373005 - 12/15/06 08:09 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

After reading the article:

This guy does not sound like a user.

The drugs acid is supposed to be tainted with will not produce effects in blotter quantities.

LSD is NOT "the most spiritually significant molecule" according to popular opinion, that would be DMT.

I have read an article entailing some acid gurus taking 'street acid' side by side with sandoz stuff who were unable to tell the difference.

How old was this article again?


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OfflineNizzyJones
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: Chemiker]
    #6373124 - 12/15/06 08:45 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Needlepoint is extreamly high-purity LSD crystal.

Check this out:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/1287892/page/0/fpart/1/vc/1

Edit: Whoops, wrong link. *fixed*


--------------------
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Edited by NizzyJones (12/15/06 08:48 AM)

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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: ExplosiveMango]
    #6373709 - 12/15/06 11:17 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

ExplosiveMango said:
After reading the article:

This guy does not sound like a user.

The drugs acid is supposed to be tainted with will not produce effects in blotter quantities.

LSD is NOT "the most spiritually significant molecule" according to popular opinion, that would be DMT.

I have read an article entailing some acid gurus taking 'street acid' side by side with sandoz stuff who were unable to tell the difference.

How old was this article again?




Word...he's full of shit IMO. I've had plenty of L that was so fucking clean, I highly doubt Sandozs and Owsleys was much, if any purer, and I'm damn sure no one could really tell the difference. The stuff was as clean as it gets. I know plenty of old heads who took L back in the 60s, and they say needlepoint and fluff is just as clean. I also remember Chinacat saying that LSD is the same as it's always been. There was impure stuff back in the day too. Saying that the acid since anytime isn't really LSD is fucking bullshit, total bullshit.


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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: Dark_Star]
    #6374417 - 12/15/06 02:53 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Well, Koala Koolio posted a good article on this subject.

Personally, i find the information in this article very persuasive.

http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/lsd/lsd_article2.shtml

It basically disproves the myth that a majority of "street acid" isn't actually LSD.


--------------------
"To do right is to know what you want. Now when you are dissatisfied with yourself it's because you are after something you don't really want. What objects are you proposing to yourself? Are they the objects you really value? If they are not, you are cheating yourself. I don't meant that if you chose to pursue the objects you most value, you will attain them; of course not. Your experience will tell you that. But success in getting after much labor what you really don't care for is the bitterest and most ridiculous failure." -George Santayana

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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD (UPDATE By MJ- 7-20-2007) [Re: kosmic_charlie]
    #7200944 - 07/20/07 01:41 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

If you really want to read good articles on LSD then read Jay Stevens, "Storming Heaven" or read "Acid Dreams" by Martin A. Lee and Bruce Shlain. Or read some of the writings of Michael Hollingshead who turned on most of high society, music groups and hollywood to LSD.

Or Tim Learys two books, "High Priest" and Flashbacks. Those are the true tales of LSD and its trip from 1938 to the present.

Or Albert Hofmann's, "LSD My Propblem Child."



I posted this following article once. The first issue of Seattle Monthly (1967) has a 29 page feature article on LSD in the U district of Seattle when every shop from 40th and University Way to 55th and University way was either a coffee house or a head shop. I bought this magazine in 1986 for $29.00. IT is worth a lot more now and imagine, a real magazine featuring an article on LSD that is 29 pages, plus the images make more.

I was partners with the original owner of Dr. Feelgoods and later a partner with the new owner who also had Real Concepts chemical supplies and model rocket kits up on 50th and University Way, the building is still there i except it is called Concepts. Somoeone took the word Real from the title of the store. For a while it was a record shop. Now I have no Idea what is there.

We had a basement laboratory in the Basement of Feelgoods/Beauty and the Books which by 1978 was half bookstore and half head shop. (we manufactured X when it was legal and 2cb (Bromo).

This Article in the magazine on LSD is a classic example by the author who went to the U district and bought a hit of acid and then described his experience as he patrolled the streets of the U. That Magazine is still called Seattle Monthly but has no drug articles since. At the time, it had more pages than the articles in Life, Look and Holiday Mags, which also reported on Leary, The human Be-In in the Haight and other drugs which were becoming mainstream.

However,. due to other work, I am not going to post the 29 pages and the illustrations because I do not have time.

And to further study ergot and its history, I have in my possession a book now being sold on Ebay for $400.00.

It is the 1908 issue of the Chicago American (AMA) Medical Associations Societies annual yearbook by Welcome and Burroughs Drug Company which also lists cocaine hydrochloride for 25-50 cents a gram, morphine sulfate for 20 cents a gram. IT is 229 pages but the first the majority of pages provide one of the most complete histories of ergot and dates from about 1500 B.C. from Babylon to 1908 in Chicago. Just prior to Albert Hofmann's beginning studies of obstetric medicines in the ergot family. I will try sometime to scan and post this for everyone here. But it is 229 pages and copyright free to the public.

Here is the cover of this book and one listing from a site selling a copy on Ebay.

Quote:

Wellcome, Henry S.. FROM ERGOT TO ERNUTIN: AN HISTORICAL SKETCH. Lecture Memoranda, American Medical Association, Chicago, 1908. London, Burroughs Wellcome & Co.: 1908. Some wear to spine and corners, else VG. A small AMA regional publication for Chicago. Rare treatise on these hallucinagenic seeds and derivatives (a primitive form of LSD). $400.00




An intro and a query of if anyone knows about this compound please contact us statement from the editor and publisher of the book.

The forward:
Half the index tot he contents of this 229 page booklet

An image of St Anthony from the book (There are many photos, maps and products included in this book. Including a beautiful painting of the Icebreaker Discovery on its maiden voyage to the Antarctica carrying Burroughs Welcome medicinal hospital supplies for the expedition to the South Pole.


And here are the page 11 and 12 of the start of this history of Ergot.
Betweeen 1908 when this above book was published, very little research was conducted on ergot until Hofmann went to work at Sandoz. In 1917, Professor Stoll had been working on the ergot coompounds and by the early 1930s, was approached by Albert Hofmann, one of Sholl's associates and asked to work on something else.

Here are Albert's own words regarding his introduction at Sandoz labs to Ergot related studies which Sholl worked on in 1917, almost ten years after the AMA 1908 book was published/ and then another 13-years before Hofmann began his research on the Lysergic Acid phases of his studies.

Quote:


Looking for a new field of research, I asked Professor Stoll to let me continue the investigations on the alkaloids of ergot, which he had begun in 1917 and which had led directly to the isolation of ergotamine in 1918. Ergotamine, discovered by Stoll, was the first ergot alkaloid obtained in pure chemical form. Although ergotamine quickly took a significant place in therapeutics (under the trade name Gynergen) as a hemostatic remedy in obstetrics and as a medicament in the treatment of migraine, chemical research on ergot in the Sandoz laboratories was abandoned after the isolation of ergotamine and the determination of its empirical formula. Meanwhile, at the beginning of the thirties, English and American laboratories had begun to determine the chemical structure of ergot alkaloids. They had also discovered a new, water-soluble ergot alkaloid, which could likewise be isolated from the mother liquor of ergotamine production. So I thought it was high time that Sandoz resumed chemical research on ergot alkaloids, unless we wanted to risk losing our leading role in a field of medicinal research, which was already becoming so important.
Professor Stoll granted my request, with some misgivings: "I must warn you of the difficulties you face in working with ergot alkaloids. These are-exceedingly sensitive, easily decomposed substances, less stable than any of the compounds you have investigated in the cardiac glycoside field. But you are welcome to try."




This research begin in the 1930s when Hofmann was finally given permission to study the ergot compounds at Sandoz.


AS I have noted here on numerous occasions I have a fantastic expensive library of drug related data which goes back a few thousand years in research.

I also have all of Wasson's books, except for the hardbound ripped-off copy of his Soma autographed to me.
That includes the two vol;umes by Tina and Gordon on Mushrooms Russia and History, and the Heim Wasson two volumes on the hallucinmogenic Champignons of Mexique.


I hope this is good reading for those who complained about author Bruce Eisner's above posted article.

mj

Edited by mjshroomer (07/22/07 04:01 PM)

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Offlineskroomadoom
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD (UPDATE By MJ- 7-20-2007) [Re: mjshroomer]
    #7201735 - 07/20/07 09:22 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

This is total BS. Everyone likes to pretend that acid and drugs in general were somehow "better" back in the '60s although this is blatently not the case. My favorite is when people try to claim the marijuana from back then was better -- LOL. Not even close. Hydroponics, removing males from the crop, etc, weren't even invented back then.

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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD (UPDATE By MJ- 7-20-2007) [Re: skroomadoom]
    #7201750 - 07/20/07 09:27 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

haha, removing males, they might have figgered that one out WAY back in the 60s


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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD (UPDATE By MJ- 7-20-2007) [Re: skroomadoom]
    #7201925 - 07/20/07 10:23 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

I personally like Mexican pot compared to the thieving rip off price of homegrown budd. Anyone who tries to sell an ounce for $300 to $500 dollars to a friend is a thief.

It had nothing to do with better pot. IT was social. $40 dollars a kilo and $7 to $10 dollars an ounce (40 joints to an ounce) and everyone shared and smoked joints all day and listened to good music and in the Haight-Ashbjury there were free greatful dead, Jefferson Airplane, Santana, Stepinwolf, Big Brother, Quicksilver Messenger Service and even Hendrix concerts free in Golden Gate Park and acid (usually .50 cents a dose 1966-1969 was freely given away to everyone at those park concerts and also at the 8 SF clubs everynight in San Francisco which had $2.00 concerts.

And pot was circulated free as the acid was.

Today, these grows of pot where I read of people getting busted for growing 12,000 plants or 50 to 500 pounds of mushrooms then they fucking deserve to go to prison. That is pure greed.

Today, pot is a one bong hit and then off to eat $20.00 worth of food to come down. There is nothing social about that. And people charging $20 dollars a gram, they are the last people in the world I would give my money to because they are scum of the earth. I would never calll anyone my friend who would asked me to pay that kind of a price for pot.

In the sixties and seventies, pot was about friendship. Not about overcharging your neighbor or alleged friend at exorbitant prices for marijuana.

I personally hope they never legalize it. Which of course they won't due to the UN Charter every country in the world signed. BUt I feel like pot is like a tree or the grass on the ground. It should not be legal or illegal. There should be no law for or against it to begin with.

Government controlls you by allowing you the right to gather and protest to protest and get petitions to change laws and then the Feds tell you your state laws and votes don't mean shit because it is still illegal by Federal law so they raid the pot clubs for the medical pot.

Yes pot and acid and drugs and music and the people who did them were cool, nice with beautiful thoughts and friendship throughout that period in history. Todays music sucks as does high grade marijuana.

By the way, the very people who wrote those hydroponic pot books are personal friends of mine. AS are most of the authors of many of the pot growing books sold on the market, and I am a co editor on Mark Merlin's original history of Hemp, "Man and Marijuana, now co authored with Rob Clarke of the "Marijuana Botany" fame. The book was Merlin's Thesis for his masters degree in Geography at the U of Hawaii in Manoa and was published in 1971. He wrote the first book published on Hemp since the original James Lane Allen's (An actual relative of mine) who wrote, "The Reign of law: A tale of the Kentucky hemp Farmers, in 1900.

Those pot growers who wrote those books do not grow today due to the harsh penalties but they do live in Seattle, where many mushroom authors also live. I have known them since the early 1970s.

Here is an image of the cover and title page of this first edition of this original book on hemp. Also from my library.

mj

One more thing.

Acid was fifty cents a fucking hit. Today most is from $3 to $7 dollars or more and it is mostly shit, although if i want some i know where to get any drug in the world with little ease.

I have now done acid since 1964, thats 53 years. I know what good acid is.

Edited by mjshroomer (07/22/07 04:02 PM)

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OfflineThe Wizard
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: vintage_gonzo]
    #7202036 - 07/20/07 10:55 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Much of what goes around today as L might actually be either a phenethylamine (DOB, DOM, DOI, DOC, Bromo-Dragonfly, etc.) or less likely a tryptamine (5MEOAMT, ETH-LAD, PRO-LAD, AL-LAD).

The fact cid nowadays often has a bitter aftertaste, takes a few hours to come up, is speedy, has effects often lasting almost 24 hours and physical side effects such as cramps and nausea all point to it being other less desireable substances...

Why would chemists resort to making these dirty compounds rather than real L? Well, it's simple, they're much cheaper and easier for an amateur to produce.

Then again, perhaps most of the stuff nowadays is actual L, just made sloppily so it has toxic byproducts in it. Who knows? Shrugs.

Let's just hope angel dust and meth are no longer appearing on

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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: The Wizard]
    #7202139 - 07/20/07 11:26 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

see, this is why I believe in plant manipulation. Think of getting a plant to produce only lysergic acid. Wait, there is one, right? A plant that produces lysergic acid without the amide, it's called sleepy grass. Now why wouldn't people just use that to make lsd. Way less steps in the process. People have become so obsessed with chemistry, they've forgotten the age old process of converting plant subtances in the plant or out of the plant into the drug they want. Drugs have been around for years, why did people forget that? I mean, you could be messing with the amino acid dna sequence, or the established enzymes with different bonding organic molecules, and coming up with all types of dmts and lsas and phenethylfuckyouups and cures to nerve cell damage and master antioxidant producing plants. I mean, so much has been done now with lab chemistry. Have people forgotten plant chemistry manipulation as well? So many people now have forgotten how many different organic molecules there are in a plant and how easily you can at least fluctuate the ones there in different quanitities, it's a wide world of discovery, you know? PEACE


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: imachavel]
    #7202170 - 07/20/07 11:38 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Hi imachavel,

There are students botanists and future pharmacologists who come from Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Oxford, MIT, John Hopkins, Stanford Medical who get grants to go to Central and South American countries to bring back new plants to research in the manufacture of new chemicals for pharmaceutical firms. Many such firms support plant to medicine reserch. Shultres did this. He discovered 24,000 plants new to science, But his students who took his classes after he returned to Harvard, further carried out such research with grants from pharmaceutical corps. fo this. Then Wade Savis who wrote the Schultes biography, One River, his students also do the same. So there is a lot of plant manipulation and plant medicines being made on a daily basis.

mj

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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: mjshroomer]
    #7202452 - 07/20/07 12:59 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

did schultz do any research on woodrose or rivea corymbosa? AND, where can I find this information, online if possible?


--------------------
:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: imachavel]
    #7202641 - 07/20/07 01:50 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

http://www.botany.org/plantsciencebulletin/psb-1972-18-4.php

Check the United Nations Bulletin on Narcotics for a three part series by Richard Evans Schultes. He may have collected seeds with Reko in Mexico int he later 1930s. I just lost text over this stupid google tool bar when I went to look something up

http://www.botany.org/plantsciencebulletin/psb-1972-18-4.php

mj

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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: imachavel]
    #7202654 - 07/20/07 01:52 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

The street acid I get where I live is all on printer paper and usually slightly (but not immediately or overpoweringly) bitter. The potency varies a lot and is completely unpredictable given it all looks the same, but I can attest I've always gotten acid. Comes up in an hour? Check. Lasts 8-10 hours after that? Check. Warping, geometric, often fractal visuals? Check. Jefferson Airplane, The Doors, and Grateful Dead sound like auditory sex? Check. Shocking experiences where I become the very room in which I'm sitting? Check. I'm pretty certain it's LSD.

I feel like there's a tendency for seasoned acid-users to be snooty... sure, the LSD you get nowadays is nowhere near as good as it could be, but it's LSD all the same. This contaminant thing is blown way out of proportion, how many chemicals other than LSD (and RCs, which are to my experience nowhere near as common as people seem to think they are) even have a pharmacological effect at levels present in a tiny piece of paper?


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Edited by Tchan909 (07/20/07 01:54 PM)

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: mjshroomer]
    #7202657 - 07/20/07 01:53 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Also in the Plants of the gods with A. Hofmann and possibly some Harvard Botanical Museum Leaflets. or the Psychedelic Reader or the Psychedelic Review.

I have an article in aa volume of the yearbook for ethnomedicine and the study of consciouness and Albeert Hofmann also has an article in that issue 1 of the journal form Germany. Not sure where my copy is at.

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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: mjshroomer]
    #7203015 - 07/20/07 03:25 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

mjshroomer, you seem very knowledgeable and I was wondering what you opinion on Carlos Casteneda(sp?) and his books on Don Juan is.

I would have PMed you this, but you arent accepting them.


Sorry to get off topic, I just had to urge to ask this.


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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #7203165 - 07/20/07 04:10 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Tchan909 said:
The street acid I get where I live is all on printer paper and usually slightly (but not immediately or overpoweringly) bitter. The potency varies a lot and is completely unpredictable given it all looks the same, but I can attest I've always gotten acid. Comes up in an hour? Check. Lasts 8-10 hours after that? Check. Warping, geometric, often fractal visuals? Check. Jefferson Airplane, The Doors, and Grateful Dead sound like auditory sex? Check. Shocking experiences where I become the very room in which I'm sitting? Check. I'm pretty certain it's LSD.

I feel like there's a tendency for seasoned acid-users to be snooty... sure, the LSD you get nowadays is nowhere near as good as it could be, but it's LSD all the same. This contaminant thing is blown way out of proportion, how many chemicals other than LSD (and RCs, which are to my experience nowhere near as common as people seem to think they are) even have a pharmacological effect at levels present in a tiny piece of paper?





EXACTLY man...

i think that all these people from the 60's and 70's are just like that guy who is a massive fan of some band and then when everyone starts liking that band, they get all pissy and claim that the band sucks now and that they were a true fan before the band got big...or something to that effect if you get what i am trying to say...

PLUS, if i am looking for spirituality in a trip i am going with mushrooms for sure..


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: morphius2661]
    #7203442 - 07/20/07 05:36 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Carlos was a con man and a deceiver. While his works are impeccable tales of sorcery and magic, his botanical data is not there. I really do not want to get into to it.

Wasson wrote four essays on the first Castaneda four books, all published in Journal of Economic Botany.

Wasson also challenged Castaneda but He never responded.

Here is his death notice from the Seattle times and then four references to DeMille, the number one authority on Castaneda and his tales and lies.


Ref for DeMille's books.

Quote:

SOME CASTANEDA REFERENCES REGARDING HIS HOAX

De Mille, Richard. 1976. Castaneda's Journey. Capra Press. Santa Barbara, Ca.

------. Carlos Castaneda-Fact or Fiction. High Times. vol. 20:44-49, 84-96. April.

------. The Shaman of Academie: Carlos Castaneda. Horizon vol. 22(4):64-70.

------. The Don Juan Papers: Further Castaneda Controversies. Ross-Erikson. Santa Barbara, Ca.




the first and last ref are the best of the two books. Plus they cover the mail confrontations between Wasson and Castaneda.

mj

Edited by mjshroomer (07/22/07 04:03 PM)

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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: mjshroomer]
    #7203482 - 07/20/07 05:49 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

good post man...even though it is off topic, i was very pleased to have read this...

i have not read any of his stuff yet, but i am sure i will get around to him someday


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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: mjshroomer]
    #7203832 - 07/20/07 07:26 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks man! :thumbup:

Some of his stuff seems a little far fetched. It's still an enjoyable read, and I already have up to Journey to Ixtlan so I may as well read em, heh.

Thanks again! :sun:


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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: morphius2661]
    #7203998 - 07/20/07 08:16 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

i defintly agree with mjshroomer on the cost of bud these days

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OfflineKapitthaka Mudra
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: LedHead]
    #13077775 - 08/20/10 09:45 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

man, you obviously have no knowledge to base that rudimentary opinion on.    even in the early 70's pure lsd went off the charts.  ever since then its been rare to find any.  and the restrictions regarding diethyladmine are so strict that anyone who as possession of D  is watched around the clock by feds.  so you are jjust plain wrong buddy.......i dont recommend indulging in lsd anymore.  stick to shrooms or peyote

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OfflineKapitthaka Mudra
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: kosmic_charlie]
    #13077783 - 08/20/10 09:47 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

How old is everyone here?  That article was written by someone who EXPERIENCED the 70's first hand.  I have also talked to 60, 70's veterans who say the same things.  no wonder our generation is fucked with all the misinformation being spread like stink on shit.  youd be a dumbass to think the speediness is part of the lsd.

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OfflineKapitthaka Mudra
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: Dark_Star]
    #13077803 - 08/20/10 09:53 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

no one can tell the difference cause all of you are uneducated fools.    read  acid dreams by martin a lee and learn the truth which is that  IT DOES MAKE A DIFFERENCE,    NO CID COMPARES TO THE PUREITY OF OWSLEY ACID    etc etc etc.    the most broad fact to back this up is that early 70's there has been a high increase with bad trips with everyone.  what does that tell you?  the cid is bad!  duhhh        you guys really dont know what your talking about.  and this is not subjective.  I am stating the god damn truth  so instead of puting in your.00002 sense  why dont you read that book I mentioned or learn about it you damn rubes    stop spreading misinformation

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OfflineKapitthaka Mudra
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: Kapitthaka Mudra]
    #13077822 - 08/20/10 10:01 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

last thing i will say is that    people who do drugs usually dont give 2 flying fucks about getting anything out of it.  just for kicks and fun times  thats why no one can or want to tell the difference between clean and impure lsd.  no one cares/    the chemists certainly dont care when substituting chemicals for lsd.  there shoukdbt be ANY sideeffects,  comedowns,  anything!  you are supposed to feel just like normal with PURE lsd.  and it may seem that avid acid eaters are snobby,  we just value what we get out of trips unlike you peolple who just eat it for fun.  if your doing that, you need to find a different drug

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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: Kapitthaka Mudra]
    #13077867 - 08/20/10 10:12 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

lol dude, this thread is 3 year old

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OfflineNetDiver
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: Kapitthaka Mudra]
    #13078399 - 08/20/10 12:29 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Kapitthaka Mudra said:
last thing i will say is that    people who do drugs usually dont give 2 flying fucks about getting anything out of it.  just for kicks and fun times  thats why no one can or want to tell the difference between clean and impure lsd.  no one cares/    the chemists certainly dont care when substituting chemicals for lsd.  there shoukdbt be ANY sideeffects,  comedowns,  anything!  you are supposed to feel just like normal with PURE lsd.  and it may seem that avid acid eaters are snobby,  we just value what we get out of trips unlike you peolple who just eat it for fun.  if your doing that, you need to find a different drug



I ate acid for fun, and it was awesome. Are you really gonna tell me not to do it anymore?

LSD isn't some magical force. It's a chemical, any spiritual effects it has are entirely subjective. Also, this thread is 3 years old and you need to learn how to use the Edit button. :facepalm:


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Offlinemesjnaloar
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: mjshroomer]
    #20411731 - 08/13/14 04:39 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Very nice article

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InvisibleInto The Woods
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: mesjnaloar]
    #20411734 - 08/13/14 04:41 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Another bumped thread. You're on a roll, bubba.

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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: Into The Woods]
    #20425915 - 08/16/14 04:38 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

A more likely reason for the different effects of street acid and LSD is that by-product impurities contaminate the product at various points in manufacture.
-------

I am still waiting for someone to state what these by products are and what side effects they produce.
All LSD side effects were noted before LSD was banned.


"With the Sunshine boom came increased reports of side effects. In addition to stimulant reactions and symptoms akin to those of strychnine poisoning"

Side effects never increased at any point in LSD's history. They are the same today as they were in the Sandoz days. People just get the fear (OMG its got syrychnine in it in 1970 and OMG it's impure today). There has never been a batch of LSD that caused symptoms in everyone, there has never been a poison batch either despite what Crystal Cole says. 


"The most common explanation regarding impurities seems to be adulteration with some other biochemical mind-changer such as speed (amphetamine) or strychnine additives"


Yeah this isn't even worth reading.

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InvisibleDark_Star
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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: my3rdeye]
    #20426616 - 08/16/14 10:28 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Most of the side effects, IME at least, appear to psychosomatic. For example; I tend to get a heavier body load if I'm indoors. I'm not claustrophobic, but there is something about being outdoors.....no walls around that lends itself to a cleaner feeling experience. This is something that I've noted over years of experience. I can be inside, and get a build up of that pins & needles feeling in my hands, and it dissipates as soon as I go outside. It's not a temperature thing either, cause I have the same experience going from the warm indoors to the cold outdoors as I do if the temperatures are reversed.


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Re: Decent Article on Real LSD [Re: vintage_gonzo]
    #20426801 - 08/16/14 11:15 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

vintage_gonzo said:
where has it been proven false? do you have any links




Erowid's disclaimer posted above their copy:

Erowid Note: [Note: The views expressed in this article are the opinion of the author and should not be taken as fact without consulting additional references. There are several known errors and/or disputed facts contained. This article is included for historical reference and debate and should not be considered complete nor state of the art information on the subjects it covers.]

https://www.erowid.org/chemicals/lsd/lsd_writings1.shtml

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