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 musher_420
Stranger
Registered: 08/01/05
Posts: 2,691
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 Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms  [Re: Snaggletooth]  2
#5169262 - 01/11/06 08:54 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Snaggle tooth do you mean like cutting out the center of the tray to leave the outside ring? If so. This would reduce the amount of mushrooms you could fit into the dehydrator. Not to mention those trays arn't exactly CHEAP for what they are.
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 Snaggletooth
Stranger in a Strange Land
 
Registered: 10/24/05
Posts: 6,109
Loc: blinks stupidly
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: musher_420]
#5169277 - 01/11/06 09:00 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Yeah...though I did not know that they were not cheap.
And since there stackable...up to 12 is it..then one or two trays could be sacafied to make more room....I was just thinking out loud.
I haven't had the problem of too big caps...yet  ...but I have no idea 
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krill
absolute gonzo
Registered: 10/25/05
Posts: 521
Loc: mars hotel
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: musher_420] 1
#5169300 - 01/11/06 09:05 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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well, i guess i stand corrected. i've never used a dehydrator cuz i've never wanted to F w/ buying one. i have never had a problem getting freshly picked shrooms 80% dry (finger-tight, if ya will) w/ box fans set horizontally on milk crates.
Agar said "9 lbs of 10 lbs of wet shrooms is water" VERY TRUE. which is why i say air-drying the 1st 80% of water out (takes less than 12-24 hours) and THEN dessicating so they'll be cracker hard. i always let them desiccate for 2 full days before bagging and tagging (or storing for long term).
i just always tried to stay away from heat.
i would NEVER throw wet shrooms into a damp-rid chamber. they would be mushy and blue by the time they dried... and would've lost alot of potency by that point.
maybe a dehydrator is a better bet, but box fans and plastic desiccant chambers have always fit the budget and never let me down.
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Oatman2000
-=Outa Space=-
Registered: 05/10/05
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: krill]
#5171105 - 01/12/06 07:58 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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i believe magash said that he would fill those trays up and have to place a jar of water on top, because he had soo many in there. even if you have a very large fruit. stick it in the nesco, and squish it down... it's gonna shrink anyway. 90% water.
load up those trays, and bango! cracker dry in like 8 hrs. WHOLE CROPS!
i like my nesco dehydrator... it goes down to 95 degree F
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 Spawning to COIR
 My Chocolate Recipe
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Oatman2000
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Registered: 05/10/05
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: Oatman2000]
#5171107 - 01/12/06 07:59 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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nesco has a model that can fit 30 trays.
it's in the book when you buy one.
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Spawning to COIR
My Chocolate Recipe
WBS QUART SPAWN JAR PREPERATION
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4-PO-DMT; 4-phosphoryloxy-N,N-dimethltryptamine
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Orranis
Getting there
Registered: 01/07/06
Posts: 119
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms *DELETED* [Re: Oatman2000]
#5171193 - 01/12/06 08:35 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Post deleted by OrranisReason for deletion: had to
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thenewguy05
The Mushroom Man
Registered: 02/11/05
Posts: 2,123
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: Orranis]
#5171256 - 01/12/06 09:06 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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well if you want to bring chemical analysisinto it, then you would be screwing yourself because each mushroom has a different level of psilocybin from the next. i beleive you would have to do a general range and not an exact figure, not being able to prove you or myself right or wrong.
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coda
Banjo Goiter
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: thenewguy05]
#5171522 - 01/12/06 10:40 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
How can any of you make an accurate note of potentcy without actually taking a chemical analysis of your mushrooms
they cant, its all subjective opinions.
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i really am glad you came back to us instead of taking the other path. *hug*
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thekeeper
not a grower
Registered: 07/29/05
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: coda]
#5171610 - 01/12/06 11:03 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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my friend swears that using a fan to dry actually causes loss in potency b/c the bruising turns black and the shrooms look ugly. he says id have more potent and nicer looking mushrooms with a dehydrator. any truth to this?
-shaw
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everything i said above is fictional....i don't grow illegal mushrooms!
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Hotnuts
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: thekeeper]
#5171800 - 01/12/06 11:48 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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200 is way too hot. I oven dried some fruit trying to get some sort of feel for the highest temperature you could get up to without damaging potency. I found that there was a dramatic degrade past 160 degrees. 150 is max IME's
Edited by hotnutz (01/12/06 11:48 AM)
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thenewguy05
The Mushroom Man
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: thekeeper]
#5171827 - 01/12/06 11:57 AM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
thekeeper said:
my friend swears that using a fan to dry actually causes loss in potency b/c the bruising turns black and the shrooms look ugly. he says id have more potent and nicer looking mushrooms with a dehydrator. any truth to this?
-shaw
i find this statement untrue as the blueing reaction is going to happen anyway. what you are witnessing is the oxidation of psilocin not to be confused with psilocybin. psilocin is an unstable chemical and breaks with air exposure. psilocybin is far more stable and that is what is preserved in the magic mushrooms. when you injest them, psilocybin breaks down into psilocin in the body causeing you to "trip". by no means does this mean that fan drying is degrading the potency in any way(unless they start to rot or something). if there were any truth to this then there would be some explaining to do as a dehydrator contains a FAN.
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Blek
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: thenewguy05]
#5173291 - 01/12/06 05:55 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Ok, I know it's been said a bunch of times in this thread but I'll add..
AN F'ING FOOD DEHYDRATOR DOES NOT CAUSE POTENCY LOSS!!!! 
People who claim that the mild heat of a food dehydrator causes potency loss probably have never even used a dehydrator. They're just spreading misinformation.
A food dehydrator is normally 90?F - 150? F.
What I'm wondering is.. have any of these people with this "heat causes potency loss" theory ever made shroom tea? Then how would they explain no potency loss with BOILING water, which is 212?F?
Stop spreading misinformation. A heated food dehydrator does not cause potency loss.
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biggc1
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: Snaggletooth]
#5173353 - 01/12/06 06:12 PM (18 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Snaggletooth said:
Yeah...though I did not know that they were not cheap.
And since there stackable...up to 12 is it..then one or two trays could be sacafied to make more room....I was just thinking out loud.
I haven't had the problem of too big caps...yet ...but I have no idea
Thats a great idea I had some that were to big to fit in mine today. The trays are not expensive I got my dehydrators for 4 bucks a piece at a thrift store with 4 trays each.
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fastfred
Old Hand
Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: biggc1] 1
#5815032 - 07/03/06 07:32 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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> my friend swears that using a fan to dry actually causes loss in potency b/c the bruising turns black and the shrooms look ugly. he says id have more potent and nicer looking mushrooms with a dehydrator. any truth to this?
That's one of the most foolish and wrong things I've heard. Fan drying will remove the surface moisture quicker than a dehydrator will. Surface bruising is what causes the bluing and fan drying will dry the surface quicker and result in LESS bluing.
I can't believe that so many people waste money on dehydrators. A $5-$10 box fan is all you need. Dehydrators don't produce enough airflow to do as good of a job as they could.
Everyone who wants to rail on about how heat doesn't affect potency should do a little research first. Just because YOU can't detect the potency lost by drying at higher temps doesn't mean it's not happening. It's a basic fact of chemistry that reactions happen faster at higher temps. The rule of thumb is that for every 10C the reaction rate doubles. So for even the lower temp dehydrators that means that you are tripling the rate of reaction. If you could dry them in 1/3 of the time that would be fine, but you can't. Dehydrating vs. fan drying isn't even going to dry them in half the time, so you ARE loosing potency. But then again maybe the rules of physics and chemistry don't apply to you.
This thread has a much more intelligent discussion of heat drying.
Notes on heat preservation of cubes
Perhaps now this thread lives up to it's title.
-FF
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It drinks the alcohol and abstains from the weed or else it gets the hose again. -Chemy
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hyphae
born to grow
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: Barnelby]
#5815083 - 07/03/06 08:24 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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Look at how many times science has recanted there findings! I for one don't use heat and want to preserve as much psilocin as possible. I also believe when making tea the duration is so short there is no noticeable potency loss. Cubies potency varies considerably all by itself so the fact that I dried a QP in a dehydrator on high and left myself with nothing but garbage while the rest were dried naturally left me with some great potency means nothing except the fact that I will never use heat. I know why doesn't everyone dry some of their harvest in the oven at 400F. and the rest naturally and do a side by side with a friend and post their results? 
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fastfred
Old Hand
Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: hyphae]
#5815152 - 07/03/06 09:03 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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> I know why doesn't everyone dry some of their harvest in the oven at 400F. and the rest naturally and do a side by side with a friend
Because they already have a good idea what will happen. Even people that claim "Psilocybin IS NOT DESTROYED at temps as high as 442F" aren't going to actually try it with their own crop.
-FF
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jfoster
"That" guy
Registered: 05/14/06
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: fastfred]
#5815282 - 07/03/06 09:52 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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where i live there is no humidity. i could just put them out with a fan going and they could be cracker dry in 2 days or so. right?
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Yamidude
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: jfoster]
#5815379 - 07/03/06 10:16 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
jfoster said:
where i live there is no humidity. i could just put them out with a fan going and they could be cracker dry in 2 days or so. right?
most likely yes.
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creamcorn
mad scientist
Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: Yamidude]
#5815510 - 07/03/06 11:06 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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a little side note on the tea thing... like fastfred notes the speed of chemical reactions speeds up with heat... but an oxidation reaction does what it sounds like, the psilosin reacts with oxygen. heated water contains very little to no free oxygen. water's capacity to hold dissolved gases greatly decreases as the temperature increases, and adding enery in the form of heat to water to bring it to a boil drives off the oxygen content (and nitrogen and other gas content for that matter) from water before it even reaches a boil. i'm not sure how the numbers and such actually work out in practice but making tea might be a loophole (and cause for some of the arguments back and forth) but we might actually be dealing with an "inert" atmosphere of sorts when making tea and the oxidation doesn't occur on any greater a level because of the heat, since there's no oxygen there to react with. could be wrong but its just a thought. (the part where i could be wrong is i don't know if the oxygen molecules can be taken from the H2O to cause the oxidation anyway, im no chemist. )
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fastfred
Old Hand
Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
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Re: Let's get the truth on heat drying mushrooms [Re: creamcorn]
#5815665 - 07/03/06 11:51 AM (17 years, 9 months ago) |
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That's an interesting point. I had assumed that the psilocybin might be somewhat or even completely dephosphorylated when making tea, but the fact that it's quickly consumed meant that the psilocin would still be active.
Oxygen might not really be required for the oxidation of psilocin though. If my understanding and prediction of the oxidation product is correct then any base (or oxygen) could oxidize it.
-FF
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