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OfflineBanJankri
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islam and hash/weed
    #4525554 - 08/12/05 06:40 AM (9 years, 1 month ago)

I was having a conversation with a friend and we started to talk about how the Sufi's were hash smokers and how even today hash is very popular in some muslim places. My friend said Mohammed did not outlaw the use of weed/hash, as he did with the alcohol. And that there is nothing in the Koran against this. What would you all say to this, anyone have specific knowledge on this issue? Any thoughts?
Peace.


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: islam and hash/weed [Re: BanJankri]
    #4525662 - 08/12/05 07:31 AM (9 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

The general rule in Islam is that any beverage that get people intoxicated when taken is unlawful, both in small and large quantities, whether it is alcohol, drugs, fermented raisin drink, or something else.



In his book Al-Halal wal Haram fil Islam (The Lawful and the Prohibited in Islam) Sheikh Yusuf Al-Qaradawi states the following:



?The first declaration made by the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, concerning this matter was that not only is Khamr (wine or alcohol) prohibited but that the definition of Khamr extends to any substance that intoxicates, in whatever form or under whatever name it may appear. Thus, beer and similar drinks are haram.



The Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, was once asked about certain drinks made from honey, corn, or barley by the process of fermenting them until they became alcoholic. The Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, succinctly replied, "Every intoxicant is Khamr, and every Khamr is haram." Reported by Muslim.)



And `Umar, may Allah be pleased with him, declared from the pulpit of the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, that "Khamr is that which befogs the mind." (Reported by Al-Bukhari and Muslim.)



Islam takes an uncompromising stand in prohibiting intoxicants, regardless of whether the amount is little or much. If an individual is permitted to take but a single step along this road, other steps follow; he starts walking and then running, and does not stop at any stage. That is why the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, said, "Of that which intoxicates in a large amount, a small amount is haram." (Reported by Ahmad Abu Dawood, and At-Tirmidhi.) And again, "If a bucketful intoxicates, a sip of it is haram." (Reported by Ahmad, Abu Dawood, and At-Tirmidhi.)



Prohibition of Drugs:



"Khamr is what befogs the mind." These are the words spoken by `Umar Ibn Al-Khattab, may Allah be pleased with him, from the pulpit of the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, providing us with a decisive criterion for defining what falls under the prohibited category of khamr. There remains then no room for doubts and questions: any substance which has the effect of befogging or clouding the mind, impairing its faculties of thought, perception, and discernment is prohibited by Allah and His Messenger, peace and blessings be upon him, and will remain so until the Day of Judgment.



Drugs such as marijuana, cocaine, opium, and the like are definitely included in the prohibited category of khamr. It is well known that the use of such drugs affects the sensory perceptions, making what is near seem distant and what is distant seem near; that their use produces illusions and hallucinations, so that the real seems to disappear and what is imaginary appears to be real; and that taking drugs in general impairs the faculty of reasoning and decision-making. Such drugs are taken as a means of escape from the inner reality of one's feelings and the outer realities of life and religion into the realm of fantasy and imagination.

Added to this psychological fact are the physical effects: bodily lassitude, dullness of the nerves, and decline in overall health. The moral consequences, moral insensitivity, weakening of the will power, and neglect of responsibilities are also well known. Eventually, drug addiction weakens a person and makes him a diseased member of society. Furthermore, drug addiction may result in the destruction of the family or even drive one to a life of crime. Since obtaining drugs involves a great outlay of money, drug addiction may take its toll on the family budget and even it may tempt the drug addict to resort to illegal means to pay for drugs.



When we recall the principle that all impure and harmful things have been made haram, there can be no doubt in our minds concerning the prohibition of such detestable substances such as drugs, which cause so much physical, psychological, moral, social and economic harm.



Muslim jurists are unanimous on the prohibition of those drugs which were found during their respective times and places. Foremost among them was Sheikh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyyah, who said: ?This solid grass (hashish) is haram, whether or not it produces intoxication. Sinful people smoke it because they imagine it producing rapture and delight, an effect similar to drunkenness. While wine makes the one who drinks it active and quarrelsome, hashish produces dullness and lethargy; furthermore, smoking it disturbs the mind and temperament, excites sexual desire, and leads to shameless promiscuity, and these are greater evils than those caused by drinking. This perverted habit has spread among the people after the coming of the Tartars. The hadd (prescribed punishment) for smoking hashish, whether a small or large amount of it, is the same as that for drinking wine, that is, eighty or forty lashes.



He explained the imposition of hadd for smoking hashish in the following manner: It is the rule of the Islamic Shari'ah that any prohibited thing which is desired by people, such as wine and illicit sexual relations, is to be punished by imposing hadd, while the violation of a prohibited thing which is not desired, such as (eating) the flesh of a dead animal, calls for Ta'zeer (disciplinary punishment). Now hashish is something desired and craved for, and it is hard for the addict to renounce it. Accordingly, the application of the texts of the Qur'an and Sunnah to hashish is similar to that of wine. (Fatawa Ibn Taymiyyah, vol. 4, p. 262 f. Also see his book, As-Siyasah Ash-Shar'iyyah.)



Do keep in touch. If you have any other question, don't hesitate to write to us.




From http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satel...d=1119503545310

MAIA


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Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
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OfflineUnagipie
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Re: islam and hash/weed [Re: MAIA]
    #4526030 - 08/12/05 12:30 PM (9 years, 1 month ago)

He's talking about Sufis, not the Dial-a-Fatwa crowd


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: islam and hash/weed [Re: Unagipie]
    #4526094 - 08/12/05 01:02 PM (9 years, 1 month ago)

He introduced Sufism and then asked for Muslim and Koran references.
Mind you, although Sufism is a form of Islamic doctrine, it is considered a sect tolerated by some Muslims and not tolerated by others. It incorporates aspects of christian ism and Hinduism, and it also includes some gnostic and Zoroastrian teachings.

So if you ask me, does Sufism incorporates hashish in their religion ? Yes, a few Sufi sects smoke Hashish as part of their religion, but the majority do not. They even do wine, as seeking and experience are a key motif of Sufism. But if you ask me about Sunnis or Shiites, no they don't do hashish and wine.

MAIA


--------------------
Spiritual being, living a human experience ... The Shroomery Mandala



Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
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Offlinecrunchytoast
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Re: islam and hash/weed [Re: MAIA]
    #4526099 - 08/12/05 01:15 PM (9 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

"Khamr is what befogs the mind."




so if someone smokes for the rush of philosophical-type thoughts, then pot is not khamr? if someone smokes for medicinial purposes, then pot is not khamr? although i know very little about islam, i think there's still some interpretive leeway.

also all moslems don't follow every letter of the strictest interpretation.

Quote:

the Sufi's were hash smokers and how even today hash is very popular in some muslim places



interesting. islam is a big religion and i think maybe it's unfair to say 'all moslems don't smoke'- some may be okay with mj, others may not ?


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OfflineUnagipie
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Re: islam and hash/weed [Re: MAIA]
    #4526104 - 08/12/05 01:19 PM (9 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MAIA said:
He introduced Sufism and then asked for Muslim and Koran references.
Mind you, although Sufism is a form of Islamic doctrine, it is considered a sect tolerated by some Muslims and not tolerated by others. It incorporates aspects of christian ism and Hinduism, and it also includes some gnostic and Zoroastrian teachings.

So if you ask me, does Sufism incorporates hashish in their religion ? Yes, a few Sufi sects smoke Hashish as part of their religion, but the majority do not. They even do wine, as seeking and experience are a key motif of Sufism. But if you ask me about Sunnis or Shiites, no they don't do hashish and wine.

MAIA




Then why don't you find a Sufi resource on the drug issue instead of pasting something from a literalist Sunni site?


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Don't fight it. Just let the illuminados take over your mind. You be at bliss soon.


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: islam and hash/weed [Re: Unagipie]
    #4526129 - 08/12/05 01:30 PM (9 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Then why don't you find a Sufi resource on the drug issue instead of pasting something from a literalist Sunni site?




Because the poster didn't objectively asked for it. I pasted that info because it's relevant for the discussion, in fact it is a part of the explanation about how Islam interprets drugs and their use.

Please, do yourself a favor and instead of trolling this thread, find yourself the missing information and try to play a constructive role in the discussion.

MAIA


--------------------
Spiritual being, living a human experience ... The Shroomery Mandala



Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
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OfflineUnagipie
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Re: islam and hash/weed [Re: MAIA]
    #4526141 - 08/12/05 01:34 PM (9 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MAIA said:
Because the poster didn't objectively asked for it. I pasted that info because it's relevant for the discussion, in fact it is a part of the explanation about how Islam interprets drugs and their use.




Ok, you have a point here. My apologies.


--------------------

Don't fight it. Just let the illuminados take over your mind. You be at bliss soon.


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: islam and hash/weed [Re: MAIA]
    #4526145 - 08/12/05 01:38 PM (9 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

so if someone smokes for the rush of philosophical-type thoughts, then pot is not khamr? if someone smokes for medicinial purposes, then pot is not khamr? although i know very little about islam, i think there's still some interpretive leeway.

also all moslems don't follow every letter of the strictest interpretation.




That is true. Just as Christianism and the several interpretations of the bible created several sub-religions and sects, Islam is also prone to several interpretations of the Koran depending on the sect.

MAIA


--------------------
Spiritual being, living a human experience ... The Shroomery Mandala



Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
Voltaire


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OfflineBanJankri
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Re: islam and hash/weed [Re: MAIA]
    #4526306 - 08/12/05 02:37 PM (9 years, 1 month ago)

thanks maia, I appreciate your contribution. heres some parts of a text I found.

"Cannabis has a tradition of use in the Near East that stretches back farther than recorded history, and it has served the Arab people as an initiator and healing medicine for at least six millennia.

Unlike alcohol, cannabis was not prohibited by Mohammed (570-632 AD). Many Moslems have used and praised marijuana over the centuries, and coffeehouses that served the drug were at one time commonplace. Some have even suggested that Mohammed himself was a secret imbiber of the herb, noting the prophet's shamanistic out of body flight to Mecca.

Although it is generally prohibited in Islamic countries today, at different times many Moslems have seen cannabis as a holy plant. Medieval Arab doctors considered cannabis a useful medicine, calling it kannab among other names. Yet like the establishment of today, the ancient Arab elite viewed marijuana with suspicion, seeing it as a subversive element that usurped the work ethic and seduced the youth away from their orthodox heritage.

Part of the reason for cannabis' eventual prohibition in some Moslem countries had to do with the drug's association with certain heretical sects that existed on the fringes of Islam. The Sufis were one such group ? they originated in the 8th century and are referred to by cannabis historian Ernest Abel as "the hippies of the Arab world." The Sufis used hashish, along with wine and coffee, to stimulate mystical consciousness and appreciation of the nature of Allah.

(The Sufis are actually considered to be the inventors of the drink coffee, which they would consume in potent brews that enabled them to stay up for hours singing and chanting. An Arabic story records how a wandering Sufi revealed the drink's preparation to a Moslem woman, brewing a pot over his hash-filled hookah.)

Cannabis was made into a chewy medicinal confection called ma'joun, and to the Sufis eating hashish was an act of worship. The benefits they claimed from their use of hashish included otherwise unattainable insights into themselves, as well as laughter, happiness, reduced anxiety, reduced worry, and increased music appreciation. But most importantly, as the Sufi al-Is'irdi noted, was the "secret" of the drug, which permits "the spirit to ascend to the highest points in a heavenly ascension of disembodied understanding." It was for this reason that many of the more mystically inclined of the Sufi preferred cannabis over wine."

full text http://cannabisculture.com/articles/1883.html


--------------------
Just let everything flow, just flow right to the center of everything. You gotta turn off your mind and relax, and then just float downstream...


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InvisibleSimisu
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Re: islam and hash/weed [Re: BanJankri]
    #6145957 - 10/08/06 09:15 AM (7 years, 11 months ago)

can anyone please add on this?
i've had an expiriance with hash and whirling around like the sufi darwish and i'm looking for specific information on the uses of cannabis/hash by the sufi people...
(i'm gonna take a class on the subject of sufi whirling in a week or so but i'd like to know more befor i go and do that, my expiriance made me understand what they were looking for with all that spinning around. it's quite amazing actualy, as if your whole being is consentrated and released to infinety... hard to explain really)

thanks in advance!


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Re: islam and hash/weed [Re: crunchytoast]
    #6146478 - 10/08/06 02:45 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

so if someone smokes for the rush of philosophical-type thoughts, then pot is not khamr? if someone smokes for medicinial purposes, then pot is not khamr? although i know very little about islam, i think there's still some interpretive leeway.




Having talked to a Muslim before about this issue, he said that drugs used for strictly medicinal purposes were fine, even if they were also illegitimately used as intoxicants. Islam does not prohibit medicines, so if marijuana is used as a medicine and not as an intoxicant, it would not be prohibited. Philosophical smoking, however, would be just the same as using it as an intoxicant- its thought-provoking properties are considered part of its intoxicating properties.

In reality, though, Islamic theocracies are just like most of the US and attach such a stigma to marijuana that even its medicinal use is shunned in favor of modern drugs.


--------------------
So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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