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midnightmaraude
Stranger
Registered: 05/09/14
Posts: 1,260
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: camplo]
#20051671 - 05/28/14 01:53 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
camplo said: Magnesium 8.68 % Mg 14.39 % MgO Aluminum 23.01 % Al 43.48 % Al2O3 Iron 9.97 % Fe 12.82 % FeO Silicon 5.57 % Si 11.92 % SiO2 Hydrogen 2.00 % H 17.87 % H2O Oxygen 50.77 % O
nutritional value data of vermiculite, ummm yeah a lot of NOTHING, verm benfit is texture and ability to hold and supply waterrrrrrrrrr.
So instead of using the verm as the substrate would using coir be better off for spawning into with my brf cakes ?
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cronicr
Registered: 08/07/11
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Loc: Van Isle
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don't listen to cap,verm is a direct food source for fungi...but yes i think coir and verm would be a better option
-------------------- It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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midnightmaraude
Stranger
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: VYBE]
#20054912 - 05/29/14 06:30 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'm sorry for this question but what does "at field capacity" mean when referencing the verm?
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bodhisatta
Smurf real estate agent
Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,891
Loc: Milky way
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Field capacity is how much water something holds before saturation at saturation water will flow out of the substrate without additional pressure at field capacity you have to squeeze to remove moisture. Its right before saturation and anything over saturation is over saturation and water will easily leave
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Captain Myco
Superfly
Registered: 05/05/14
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Loc: Midwest USA
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: bodhisatta]
#20076296 - 06/02/14 11:42 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Great thread, Iv done this several times for fun, to test a strain, or just for a few prints. It also works when I find something I cant identify and want to watch it grow over a soil sample I took. Iv usually got a few sitting on my desk that I can look at whenever I want. Good work and Thanks.
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midnightmaraude
Stranger
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: Captain Myco]
#20078270 - 06/03/14 01:24 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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So if I were to do the coir/verm mixture using this tek, would you guys suggest taking the brick out of the container when it's done colonizing or leave it in?
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VYBE
The universe
Registered: 07/05/13
Posts: 314
Loc: USA
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Take it out!
Sorry people! I've been moving back to kentucky! I haven't had any time to get on!
-------------------- BEEF UP YOUR CAKES!
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chaos
uno con kaos
Registered: 03/30/14
Posts: 226
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: VYBE]
#20114243 - 06/11/14 12:36 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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did you sterilize the container first?
-------------------- "if you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading" lao zi "the angel is free because of his knowledge, the beast because of his ignorance. between the two remains the son of man to struggle." rumi
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VYBE
The universe
Registered: 07/05/13
Posts: 314
Loc: USA
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: chaos]
#20114292 - 06/11/14 12:48 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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No sir! Neither the container nor the verm!
-------------------- BEEF UP YOUR CAKES!
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camplo
Freedom!
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: VYBE]
#20137936 - 06/16/14 02:01 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Once again, verm nor coir have no nutritional value in comparison to a true bulk sub. #fact. They do in fact have awesome texture and ability to hold water thus making a great additive. Yes, you can go from grains straight to coir, or verm, but your gains will simply be from the characteristics stated above....
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cronicr
Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: camplo]
#20137980 - 06/16/14 02:35 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
camplo said: Once again, verm nor coir have no nutritional value in comparison to a true bulk sub. #fact. They do in fact have awesome texture and ability to hold water thus making a great additive. Yes, you can go from grains straight to coir, or verm, but your gains will simply be from the characteristics stated above....
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5977627#5977627
Wrong. That's nonesense. Coir is as nutritious as horse manure, and is not suitable for use as a casing layer due to the nutrition unless massively diluted with vermiculite. That's why coir casings overlay so often. Coir is far better suited as a substrate, and there is not one single shred of evidence that coir does not deliver superior potency in cubensis. RR
Quote:
RogerRabbit said:
Quote:
truskool said:
Quote:
RogerRabbit said: My point was adding verm makes almost any bulk substrate perform better. RR
So what does it add? Its considered non nutritive when it comes to casing
That's what I thought too until further research. Verm is not non-nutritive. It contains minerals and other compounds which mycelium feeds on. We used to think of it simply as a moisture reservoir, but it's much more, and that explains why performance is better when verm is added, especially with manure or coir. RR
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/15972506#15972506
Quote:
RogerRabbit said: Nice flush! It's hard to believe it's actually been nearly four years since coir has been 'out of the closet'. There was a mindset previously that coir had no 'nutes' and thus was a casing material, rather than a substrate.
I was flamed by the admin at another mushroom site for the heresy of claiming coir actually HAD nutrition, and was accused of being on a 'jihad' against coir casings. This is the exact reason I left that site for good. (of course, I was also on a 'jihad' against popcorn spawn)
Check it out-These are some of the earliest threads I could find on coir as a substrate using the shroomery search engine: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/2247201#Post2247201
And another thread: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/2521776#Post2521776
How times change. RR
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/7732236#7732236
-------------------- It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire
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Loc: Orbiting Earth
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: cronicr]
#20138016 - 06/16/14 03:07 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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-------------------- THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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chaos
uno con kaos
Registered: 03/30/14
Posts: 226
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: PussyFart]
#20154650 - 06/19/14 10:58 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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would it make any difference if the jars were consolidating for a few days before crumbling them into your container?
-------------------- "if you do not change direction, you may end up where you are heading" lao zi "the angel is free because of his knowledge, the beast because of his ignorance. between the two remains the son of man to struggle." rumi
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cronicr
Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: chaos]
#20155107 - 06/19/14 12:47 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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no, not really
-------------------- It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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camplo
Freedom!
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 1,675
Last seen: 2 years, 6 months
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: cronicr]
#20240933 - 07/08/14 06:43 AM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Its not overrrrr!!! This is the deciding factor. BE. Straw has been known to be the most efficient bulk substrate. Its also known to be the most easily contaminated. Coincidence? I think not. Coir and or Verm have little to no nutes and thus have this characteristic of contaminate resistant. Its that simple to me. Mushies main diet consist of carbs and protein, verm and coir have very little of either. So if I have to be forced to consider them as an official "bulk sub" I'd have to put them on the super low nutritional value side. A nominal figure of 200 has been established for straws BE....I wonder how coir and verm compare? Probably not very well.
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sololas
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Registered: 12/26/13
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: camplo]
#20241121 - 07/08/14 08:08 AM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Straw holds and hides contaminates very good within the structure of the straw's hollow form. In the agriculture industry straw is a non-nutritious filler feed for cattle, horses etc. I would think using wheat oats instead of straw would give better results, but I could be wrong let me know.
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camplo
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: sololas]
#20241266 - 07/08/14 09:08 AM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Buddy I can't even fully retort to your statement cause I have no idea what wheat oats are...they look like grains to me and would be better suited for spawn.
wheat oats Amounts per 1 cup (156g) Protein 26.4g Carbohydrate 103g
Rye Amounts per 1 cup (169g) Protein 24.9g Carbohydrate 118g
Judging by those numbers oats are too nutritious for a bulk sub and would make better spawn....
but to comment about straw, I'm sure you are right and that is a good reason to really make sure you have pasteurized your straw completely and properly.
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Edited by camplo (07/08/14 09:10 AM)
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camplo
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: camplo]
#20241303 - 07/08/14 09:20 AM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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wheat straw - Protein-3.20% NonStructuralCarbs-6.80% source -http://www.bevet.com/news_and_articles/nutritional_information/
As a bulk sub should be straw is low in nutritional value. Verm and and Coir seem to only provide trace elements.
FYI -trace el·e·ment noun plural noun: trace elements a chemical element present only in minute amounts in a particular sample or environment. a chemical element required only in minute amounts by living organisms for normal growth.
lol "coco binds to calcium and magnesium" source - http://www.advancednutrients.com/bigbudcoco/
Guess as long as its being eaten it don't matter. But like I stated already, coir is on the low side when compared to the rest of the bulk subs, and so is verm....
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Edited by camplo (07/08/14 09:30 AM)
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Quexl
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: camplo]
#20241378 - 07/08/14 10:01 AM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Verm provides trace elements (in abundance), and a lot of things that would normally be present in an enriched soil. The coir provides complex dissolved organ (edit: organic) carbon (decaying dead shit). Mushrooms are pretty indiscriminate about food sources. Where did you see that carbs and proteins were limiting nutrients though? That's an interesting idea..
Edited by Quexl (07/11/14 02:35 PM)
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blindingleaf
blue collar underworld
Registered: 07/19/13
Posts: 22,008
Loc: sub-surface unseen
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Re: VYBE'S simple verm brick tek [Re: Quexl]
#20245075 - 07/08/14 10:21 PM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Where did you see that carbs and proteins were limiting nutrients though? That's an interesting idea..
yea...source? ur making a generalization amoung an entire kingdom of organisms....so...source?
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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