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 zappaisgod
horrid asshole
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 Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment  [Re: Enlil]
#19760937 - 03/28/14 05:14 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2014/jan/26/ted-cruz/labor-force-participation-its-lowest-point-1978-sa/
If you want to talk about before 1978 we are going to have to talk about what constitutes the labor force. You probably don't recall those days but women were a much smaller portion of the labor market as defined as someone with a paying job. This is somewhat similar to the rationale for not including people who have given up looking for work as counting towards the unemployment rate.
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imachavel
I loved and lost but I loved-ftw
 
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: zappaisgod]
#19761425 - 03/28/14 07:10 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Im trying to figure this out
$7.50 an hour equals about $1000 a month roughly with/without taxes. Most people pay minimum $650 a month rent, so that leaves $350 for the month for food and gas as well as health insurance etc.
 Now Joe Blow makes and extra $1 an hour and small business shuts down from over head too high...... even after lease cost, licensing, product, maintenance 
On an unrelated note I was just talking to someone about this recently, I remember when going to get fast food was ridiculous it was like "hey dont go to taco bell go to the store, taco bell is expensive!" Now its like "dont go to the store, go to taco bell, the store is expensive!"
REALLY???? Inflation will get WORST with a wage increase??!!!??!! Im supposed to swallow that shit?!!?!!???
Well..... maybe we can drop the federal mw to $2.00, and see what happens. Maybe things will be cheap again cuz of lower over head 
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 I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!
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 Shins
Fun guy
Registered: 09/15/04
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: imachavel]
#19761434 - 03/28/14 07:12 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Stop inflaton.
Minimum wage is a bandaid on a gaping wound.
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psyconaught
Chemical Connoisseur
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: Shins]
#19761484 - 03/28/14 07:26 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
$7.50 an hour equals about $1000 a month roughly with/without taxes. Most people pay minimum $650 a month rent, so that leaves $350 for the month for food and gas as well as health insurance etc.
Its actually $1,200 a month before taxes full time. And $650 a month maybe if you are living by yourself, but why are you cutting your margins so short if thats all you make? Get a fucking roommate, my rent was $180 a month sharing an apartment with 4 other people when i first moved out. And that was about a year ago.
Quote:
REALLY???? Inflation will get WORST with a wage increase?
Of course it will. Its simple economics, as the price of doing business increases one of two things will happen, either the business cannot sustain and will shut down, OR they will increase the price of goods/services to keep up.
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Think for yourself, question authority
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qman
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: Shins]
#19761563 - 03/28/14 07:48 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
Shins said:
Stop inflaton.
Minimum wage is a bandaid on a gaping wound.
Stop off-shoring work, and stop letting illegals from working in the US, and then the natural forces of supply (labor) and demand (business) will create stronger real wages.
Stronger real wages eliminate the "bandaid" approach to solving a structural problem, hiking the minimum wage does NOT help the inequality that is taking place today, if it were only so simple.
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: qman]
#19761573 - 03/28/14 07:50 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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You cannot stop off-shoring work but you can keep the illegals from working.
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qman
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: psyconaught] 1
#19761580 - 03/28/14 07:52 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
psyconaught said:
Quote:
$7.50 an hour equals about $1000 a month roughly with/without taxes. Most people pay minimum $650 a month rent, so that leaves $350 for the month for food and gas as well as health insurance etc.
Its actually $1,200 a month before taxes full time. And $650 a month maybe if you are living by yourself, but why are you cutting your margins so short if thats all you make? Get a fucking roommate, my rent was $180 a month sharing an apartment with 4 other people when i first moved out. And that was about a year ago.
Quote:
REALLY???? Inflation will get WORST with a wage increase?
Of course it will. Its simple economics, as the price of doing business increases one of two things will happen, either the business cannot sustain and will shut down, OR they will increase the price of goods/services to keep up.
Or profit margins shrink, it's not a black and white issue.
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qman
Stranger
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: zappaisgod]
#19761605 - 03/28/14 07:57 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
zappaisgod said:
You cannot stop off-shoring work but you can keep the illegals from working.
Tariffs and various forms of taxation could discourage off-shoring, but it's not likely to happen in this corrupt political environment.
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BoldAsLove
Pokemon Master
Registered: 03/10/11
Posts: 2,549
Loc: Kanto Region
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: qman]
#19761646 - 03/28/14 08:10 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
zappaisgod said:
What do you mean by "lots" of job losses? Can we afford any at all now that the labor participation rate is at an historic low and expected to take a hit due to Obamacare as well?
Replace "lots" with "any." There is no consensus on whether or not raising the minimum wage will cause job losses. And there is a definite benefit to it.
Quote:
Stonehenge said:
If the min was raised it would not only cause unemployment and offshoring to increase, it would also cause prices to rise. Think about it, restaurants, etc charge cost plus a profit. Wages are big part of costs for any business, especially someplace like macdonalds.
Not necessarily true. The paper in the OP directly investigates minimum wage increases on restaurants and finds no employment effects. The review zappaisgod posted says there is no consensus. It is not a fact that raising the minimum wage will lead to greater unemployment.
It does seem intuitive that a higher minimum wage will lead to job losses, but the data don't necessarily reflect that.
Quote:
qman said:
Stronger real wages eliminate the "bandaid" approach to solving a structural problem, hiking the minimum wage does NOT help the inequality that is taking place today, if it were only so simple.
I can agree with that, but raising the minimum wage does have tangible benefits. It increases the buying power of millions of people and can reduce the number of people on welfare programs.
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DISCLAIMER: None of the ideas expressed above are actually mine. They are told to me by Luthor  and Ferdinand  , the five inch tall space aliens who live under my desk. In return for these ideas, I have given them permission to eat any dust bunnies they may find under there.
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: qman]
#19761708 - 03/28/14 08:35 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
zappaisgod said:
You cannot stop off-shoring work but you can keep the illegals from working.
Tariffs and various forms of taxation could discourage off-shoring, but it's not likely to happen in this corrupt political environment.
Trade war? No thanks. We shouldn't be punishing foreign competition. We should be easing domestic competition
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psyconaught
Chemical Connoisseur
Registered: 11/04/10
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Last seen: 7 years, 5 months
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: qman]
#19761889 - 03/28/14 09:31 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
psyconaught said:
Quote:
$7.50 an hour equals about $1000 a month roughly with/without taxes. Most people pay minimum $650 a month rent, so that leaves $350 for the month for food and gas as well as health insurance etc.
Its actually $1,200 a month before taxes full time. And $650 a month maybe if you are living by yourself, but why are you cutting your margins so short if thats all you make? Get a fucking roommate, my rent was $180 a month sharing an apartment with 4 other people when i first moved out. And that was about a year ago.
Quote:
REALLY???? Inflation will get WORST with a wage increase?
Of course it will. Its simple economics, as the price of doing business increases one of two things will happen, either the business cannot sustain and will shut down, OR they will increase the price of goods/services to keep up.
Or profit margins shrink, it's not a black and white issue.
well most small business's are operating at extremely small profit margins in the first place they don't exactly have room to shrink that even more.
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Think for yourself, question authority
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imachavel
I loved and lost but I loved-ftw
Registered: 06/06/07
Posts: 31,488
Loc: You get banned for saying that
Last seen: 7 hours, 36 minutes
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: qman]
#19763762 - 03/29/14 11:33 AM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
Shins said:
Stop inflaton.
Minimum wage is a bandaid on a gaping wound.
Stop off-shoring work, and stop letting illegals from working in the US, and then the natural forces of supply (labor) and demand (business) will create stronger real wages.
Stronger real wages eliminate the "bandaid" approach to solving a structural problem, hiking the minimum wage does NOT help the inequality that is taking place today, if it were only so simple.
I think everyone likes to compare the economy to a 1985 model. Lets not forget, in 1985 there was no world wide web and no internet. Today a knowledgeable skilled person is replaced by a google search.
Otherwise I agree, unhindered inflation simply means trading among the rich. Its FUCKED up things that whole sale used to be .10 cents are like $5 now. There should be price caps, subject to change of course, but implemented every time inflation goes through the roof, possibly even removed later to allow growth.
This shit is ridiculous, a $1 minimum wage increase and whole salers now act like $5 needs to be $10. And Donald Trump acts like $500,000,000 now needs to be $1 billion. How much worst can inflation get? How much richer can the rich get, while they blame everyone else for the poverty they create
Perfect example: Anhueiser Bush(did I spell that right?) is trying to push a regulation stopping microbrew bars from selling their own beer without selling their beer first to a distributor then buying it back. This is what Budweiser prefers? Being a brewery? Its an obvious attempt to monopolize on the market. The notion should be outlawed
The rich get away with murder
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I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!
I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk
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imachavel
I loved and lost but I loved-ftw
Registered: 06/06/07
Posts: 31,488
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Last seen: 7 hours, 36 minutes
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: qman]
#19763768 - 03/29/14 11:36 AM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
zappaisgod said:
You cannot stop off-shoring work but you can keep the illegals from working.
Tariffs and various forms of taxation could discourage off-shoring, but it's not likely to happen in this corrupt political environment.
Yay taxes, the continous answer to everyones problems. Im surprised there isnt a flush tax when I take a shit
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I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!
I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk
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psyconaught
Chemical Connoisseur
Registered: 11/04/10
Posts: 6,100
Last seen: 7 years, 5 months
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: imachavel]
#19764026 - 03/29/14 12:41 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
Perfect example: Anhueiser Bush(did I spell that right?) is trying to push a regulation stopping microbrew bars from selling their own beer without selling their beer first to a distributor then buying it back. This is what Budweiser prefers? Being a brewery? Its an obvious attempt to monopolize on the market. The notion should be outlawed
This is a perfect example of why government should stay the fuck out of the market. People are always open to being bought, no matter what, the only solution is to let people control their own lives and business's.
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Think for yourself, question authority
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Stonehenge
Alt Center
Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: psyconaught]
#19764641 - 03/29/14 03:23 PM (10 years, 21 days ago) |
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People seem to think they should not have to compete on a global market. They want price controls on goods and the min wage hiked on a regular basis. Ask yourself why didn't the last hike in the min work? If raises in min do not cause inflation, why didn't the last raise fix the problem, why are you asking for another?
All these schemes have been tried over and over. Russia in the early 1900's tried it, and production turned to crap, russian people wouldn't even buy goods made in russia after a while. People got the same amount no matter how much they produced so they produced the least amount they could get away with and russia rapidly became a third world country. The left wishes the same fate on usa. It may happen, the power of the free lunch is very enticing. Worthless politicians taking bribes from big companies and giving the public bread and circuses has lead to our downfall and could lead us in the same path as russia, cuba, n korea, etc. All those countries have massive corruption.
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“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)
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zappaisgod
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: Stonehenge]
#19764877 - 03/29/14 04:24 PM (10 years, 20 days ago) |
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I believe socialist leaders consider corruption a feature.
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starfire_xes
I Am 'They'
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: imachavel]
#19767186 - 03/30/14 02:16 AM (10 years, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
imachavel said:
The GOVERNMENT LETS THE rich get away with murder
There. Fixed it for ya.
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qman
Stranger
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: imachavel]
#19767674 - 03/30/14 08:28 AM (10 years, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
imachavel said:
Quote:
qman said:
Quote:
zappaisgod said:
You cannot stop off-shoring work but you can keep the illegals from working.
Tariffs and various forms of taxation could discourage off-shoring, but it's not likely to happen in this corrupt political environment.
Yay taxes, the continous answer to everyones problems. Im surprised there isnt a flush tax when I take a shit
"Yay taxes, the continous answer to everyones problems."
No one said tariffs are the cure all, but when off-shoring is the core reason why real wages and minimum wage are at all-time lows there needs to be a counter balance, tariffs are NOT just another tax.
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zappaisgod
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: qman]
#19767789 - 03/30/14 09:27 AM (10 years, 20 days ago) |
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Off shoring has nothing to do with minimum wage and the core reason wages have stagnated (not declined) is because of illegal border jumping scum who suck government resources, cheat on taxes and contribute to a higher than natural supply of workers in jobs that cannot be off shored.
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Stonehenge
Alt Center
Registered: 06/20/04
Posts: 14,850
Loc: S.E.
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Re: Minimum Wage Effects On Employment [Re: zappaisgod]
#19778638 - 04/01/14 02:42 PM (10 years, 18 days ago) |
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Quote:
zappaisgod said:
Off shoring has nothing to do with minimum wage and the core reason wages have stagnated (not declined) is because of illegal border jumping scum who suck government resources, cheat on taxes and contribute to a higher than natural supply of workers in jobs that cannot be off shored.
The issue is settled.
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“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)
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