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deff said:
hmmm those quotes don't correspond to any translation of the diamond sutra i've read - are you sure it was the original sutra, or was it something inspired by it? like it's quite a bit different to what i'm used to anyways

that said, i'm glad you liked it! the version i have i really enjoy too... i used to recite it daily along with the heart sutra

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Do none of them sound familiar? Hmm... No, it wasn't the original, as it had a lot of added passages, like the first quote I listed was from something called "The Voice of the Silence." And the last quotes were from what I guess was the writer's summary of the Buddha's essential teaching at the end of the book. Honestly, I liked those parts better than what was in the sutra itself

Would you say the quotes I posted coincide with what is taught in the Diamond Sutra?

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deff said:
hmm they coincide a bit, but some of them sound more new-age (like the one about souls going through the school of life) than they sound buddhist - buddhism doesn't talk about a soul really

not to put the book down though, if you enjoyed it then that's great

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Not cool

Meh, still vibes with me. I think I'll order the original though..

Deff, can you share with me some of your favorite passages from the Diamond Sutra by chance? If you have them bookmarked or written down or something?

You also recommended to me the book "How to Realize Emptiness", as well as "The Heart Sutra", so I'll probably order those as well. Thanks for that

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deff said:
those quotes White Beard posted i really like

here is the whole sutra for free online: http://www.diamond-sutra.com/diamond_sutra_translation.html

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Nice! Thank you

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White Beard said:
"As a lamp, a cataract, a star in space
an illusion, a dewdrop, a bubble,
a dream, a cloud, a flash of lightning
view all created things like this."

"The Buddha said to him, "Subhuti, those who would now set forth on the bodhisattva path should thus give birth to this thought: 'However many beings there are in whatever realms of being might exist, whether they are born from an egg of born from a womb, born from the water or born from the air, whether they have form or no form, whether they have preception or no perception or neither perception nor no perception, in whatever conceivable realm of being one might conceive of beings, in the realm of complete nirvana I shall liberate them all. And though I thus liberate countless beings, not a single being is liberated.'

"And why not? Subhuti, a bodhisattva who creates the perception of a being cannot be called a 'bodhisattva.' And why not? Subhuti, no one can be called a bodhisattva who creates the perception of a self or who creates the perception of a being, a life, or a soul.""

Two of my favourites.

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Nice poetry, but still, those are the teachings I don't care much for. Teachings on emptiness just don't appeal to me, and honestly, I wonder if they ever will. Is it so wrong to love the illusion that has been created? What about recognizing that yes, we are not the ego, but perhaps looking at it as like a role that we play in our present life in this world? And perhaps learning to love it and enjoy the experience?

Here's a question that no Buddhist or Buddhist practitioner has ever been able to answer for me:

Why would one want to attain complete enlightenment in order to escape from the cycle of life and death? What is the point? Seriously. Does it mean to merge with the divine and remain in a state of eternal bliss as pure awareness? Or does it mean to completely blink yourself out of existence so as to escape the "suffering" that is life/existence itself? I hear conflicting opinions all the time in regards to this argument. What is the truth?

Life is just too complex and too beautiful for the sole purpose of life to be to escape from it Or is it just me that feels that way?

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deff said:
here is the whole sutra for free online: http://www.diamond-sutra.com/diamond_sutra_translation.html

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Whoa! Thanks a lot!

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White Beard said:
The way I view the teachings is that it isn't about a being in life trying to escape trying to reach nirvana, or heaven or whatever. It's trying to point out that the there is no self, and never was one, so there's no need to worry about escaping, or getting into heaven. That's just my interpretation though.

Like the Heart sutra says: No suffering, no source, no release, no path.

teachings of emptiness don't appeal to 'you' I think because they are effectively saying there is no separate you, and a you or a me just hates being told it's empty.

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The teaching that you pointed out is one that really resonates with me. Most religions today try to point out that there's this "spiritual problem." Like, you're not good enough, repent, be desire-less, etc... but I think in reality, there is no spiritual problem. There's just this -- life.

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r72rock said:
The teaching that you pointed out is one that really resonates with me. Most religions today try to point out that there's this "spiritual problem." Like, you're not good enough, repent, be desire-less, etc... but I think in reality, there is no spiritual problem. There's just this -- life.

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The problem is we're convinced there is a problem.

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Shrooomtastic said:
And thought it was pretty awesome Plenty of great teachings in there. Here are some of the passages that stood out the most to me:

"The mind is like a mirror; it gathers dust while it reflects. It needs the gentle breezes of soul-wisdom to brush away the dust of our illusions. Seek, O' Beginner, to blend thy mind and thy soul."

"Spiritual life, like ordinary life, is a process of progress through repetition. It takes the form of a steady, spiral-like ascent, going round and round through similar phases, but all the time going higher and higher."

"Self-knowledge is in the mind of man, it is not gained by the mind of man; it is merely unfolded."

"Buddhist psychology is one of fulfillment, balance, and peace."

"We are taught to look upon every human being as an individual soul gaining experience, learning from the school of life, suffering for a purpose, coming back again and again to live on Earth so that greater knowledge and more freedom may be attained."  

Has anyone else here read it? If so, what are your thoughts on it?

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White Beard said:
The way I view the teachings is that it isn't about a being in life trying to escape trying to reach nirvana, or heaven or whatever. It's trying to point out that the there is no self, and never was one, so there's no need to worry about escaping, or getting into heaven. That's just my interpretation though.

Like the Heart sutra says: No suffering, no source, no release, no path.

teachings of emptiness don't appeal to 'you' I think because they are effectively saying there is no separate you, and a you or a me just hates being told it's empty.

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Shrooomtastic said:
There are so many different interpretations out there, I don't know which to listen to anymore. I listen to my own intuition now, and that's pretty much it. I listen to everything, but do not accept it as truth unless it resonates deep within me first. Even then, I still question it. I feel like that's the only way.

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Sounds like you're doing good.

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Mr.Al said:
I am sure that if you took one culinary ingredient each from a multitude of cook books and tried to combine them and cook it up you would make something even a dog wouldn't eat.

Even if you were a master chef.......

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White Beard said:

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Mr.Al said:
I am sure that if you took one culinary ingredient each from a multitude of cook books and tried to combine them and cook it up you would make something even a dog wouldn't eat.

Even if you were a master chef.......

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That's a silly analogy. Cooking is a totally different process then studying yourself.

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deff said:
i find the more i understand emptiness (which isn't much), the less burdened i become by appearances / the illusion. i can still enjoy the illusion, even more so, as i'm freer from it - looking at it from a state of peace and serenity.

also, understanding emptiness means you see the infinity of appearances. a chair isn't just a chair - it's infinite things and yet ultimately none of them. to me, this makes things more interesting and less boring.

though one thing that goes is the strong story we tell ourselves about life. and to some people i guess that's a very meaningful part of their lives. but for me, i overall feel much better, less burdened, and happier when i become less entrenched in my life story of 'the way things are', etc.

but to each his own. if teachings on emptiness do not appeal to you then  i guess looks elsewhere? as white beard says though, it might be beneficial to examine why they don't appeal to you, or maybe not. you're right that there's a lot of different teachings and views out there, so it can be very hard to decide upon one. the good thing in this regard with teachings on emptiness is that skepticism is encouraged and will even strengthen your understanding of it imo.

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