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 circastes
Being too serious
 
Registered: 01/14/10
Posts: 5,652
Loc: 
Last seen: 10 hours, 54 minutes
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 The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? 
#16729802 - 08/20/12 07:12 AM (8 months, 27 days ago) |
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Can anyone explain?
Is there a non-differentiated awareness called the Self, and the literal God being, literally He?
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"Your salvation may lie in a rational apprehension of the present moment."
-Terence McKenna
she said there's good men
that there's God in everyone
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crkhd
☾☼☽
Registered: 12/29/08
Posts: 1,911
Loc: A human sphere enfolding ...
Last seen: 7 hours, 9 minutes
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Re: The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? [Re: circastes]
#16729806 - 08/20/12 07:14 AM (8 months, 27 days ago) |
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I would say yes there is. Selves arise from source but they are not source. A self is only a self because it has form to it; its form is its selfhood. Source encompasses the idea of selfhood and non-selfhood too.
You can reside in your self-hood and as long as you are happy with it, then you will feel still. But to reside in Godhood you have to shed away all that does not align with Godliness to even feel the stillness. But of course the latter never wavers and the prior waves, and is swept around. To make an analogy, there is an awareness that feels pain, and an awareness that encompasses that pain, unaffected by it and is purposefully dishing it out 
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"Everything there is, and all that there is, is a Pattern of unspeakable proportion. The Pattern contains everything that is, completely fixed in succession, all the minimal particles interconnected in every way that is. Every way that is is not every conceivable way, because not everything that can be conceived is manifest in the pattern."
"THE Human, you, is a miniscule but essential part of that pattern. In it lies complete fulfillment. It will never become something it is not, but it will never need to be anything else." - Wiccan_Seeker
<i AM breath rippling through water|light reflecting to self with thought AM i>
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circastes
Being too serious
Registered: 01/14/10
Posts: 5,652
Loc:
Last seen: 10 hours, 54 minutes
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Re: The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? [Re: crkhd]
#16729887 - 08/20/12 07:45 AM (8 months, 27 days ago) |
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--------------------
"Your salvation may lie in a rational apprehension of the present moment."
-Terence McKenna
she said there's good men
that there's God in everyone
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Buster_Brown
atlatl
Registered: 09/17/11
Posts: 1,671
Last seen: 3 hours, 24 minutes
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Re: The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? [Re: circastes]
#16729905 - 08/20/12 07:53 AM (8 months, 27 days ago) |
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God, by default, is ancient. The difference between God realization and self realization may be the difference between dwelling in a tent or a condo.
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Vahn421
Awakening Moonlighter
Registered: 04/03/12
Posts: 327
Loc: Portland
Last seen: 2 days, 3 hours
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Re: The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? [Re: Buster_Brown]
#16730421 - 08/20/12 11:10 AM (8 months, 27 days ago) |
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Sometimes I prefer tents and sometimes I prefer condos. Being stuck in either for eternity sounds like hell.
-V
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Dive into the heart... but don't be afraid.
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 Olympus Mons
esprit de l'univers
Registered: 09/15/09
Posts: 5,770
Loc: ∞
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Re: The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? [Re: Vahn421]
#16730453 - 08/20/12 11:18 AM (8 months, 27 days ago) |
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I like to think of it as being no different than the difference between ultimate bliss and ultimate agony. Same state,different city.
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I close my eyes and seize it
I clench my fists and beat it
I light my torch and burn it
I am the beast I worship....
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The Chronic
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 12,003
Loc: 
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Re: The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? [Re: circastes]
#16731517 - 08/20/12 02:36 PM (8 months, 27 days ago) |
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It depends on how you define them
Self-realization can only be experienced really, right now i would describe it as infinity realizing itself
God-realization could be realizing there is something much greater than your ego, something much greater than the idea you have held about yourself for so long, some enormous love/bliss/silence swallows you & spits you out, so you still feel separate from it & then you refer to it as 'God', you have realized it does exist, you've realized God, or it can be referring to Self-realization where you realize You Are That
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Satyapriya
Registered: 01/18/10
Posts: 1,110
Loc: Southern California
Last seen: 1 month, 14 days
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Re: The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? [Re: crkhd]
#16732015 - 08/20/12 04:24 PM (8 months, 26 days ago) |
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Quote:
crkhd said:
I would say yes there is. Selves arise from source but they are not source. A self is only a self because it has form to it; its form is its selfhood. Source encompasses the idea of selfhood and non-selfhood too.
You can reside in your self-hood and as long as you are happy with it, then you will feel still. But to reside in Godhood you have to shed away all that does not align with Godliness to even feel the stillness. But of course the latter never wavers and the prior waves, and is swept around. To make an analogy, there is an awareness that feels pain, and an awareness that encompasses that pain, unaffected by it and is purposefully dishing it out
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www.collectivelyconscious.net - Hive mind for the awakened. A global community focused on sharing politically, socially, environmentally, and spiritually conscious artwork, music, film, and various other forms of media. "Like" us on Facebook for a daily supply!
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paulioni613
Stranger
Registered: 07/11/10
Posts: 102
Last seen: 3 months, 6 days
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Re: The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? [Re: Satyapriya]
#16735156 - 08/21/12 01:39 AM (8 months, 26 days ago) |
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I have, i don't even want to write it here. If you want to talk PM and message me.
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Kickle
A Dying Hope
Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 13,081
Last seen: 15 hours, 1 minute
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Re: The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? [Re: circastes]
#16736888 - 08/21/12 04:18 PM (8 months, 25 days ago) |
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Quote:
circastes said:
Can anyone explain?
Is there a non-differentiated awareness called the Self, and the literal God being, literally He?
The difference would be in the experience for the individual if anywhere.
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cbub
it
Registered: 10/17/10
Posts: 1,137
Last seen: 3 days, 21 hours
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Re: The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? [Re: Kickle]
#16739646 - 08/25/12 07:33 AM (8 months, 22 days ago) |
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I belive mind&body is ego. Not freudian ego obviously (the man only made a mess), but the latin word ego which means I.
What remains is the self - the soul - the life force - atma.
... and atman is brahman.
Therefor the self realization is no different than god realization.
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It's fine.
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder
Registered: 12/10/99
Posts: 9,142
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 16 hours, 59 minutes
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 Re: The difference between self-realization and God-realization, is? [Re: circastes]
#16740869 - 08/27/12 01:38 AM (8 months, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
circastes said:
Can anyone explain?
Is there a non-differentiated awareness called the Self, and the literal God being, literally He?
This is a good question! It can be answered in general but ambiguous ways, but I pursued this during the writing of my book (which is finished and in need of editing before publication). I addressed this in the context of Saint Paul's theology which is about 'Christ-mysticism,' but NOT about 'God-mysticism.' This Wiki synopsis is not a bad description: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pauline_mysticism .
For those who have an immediate dislike for anything Christian - get over yourselves! The Sacrificial Death-Ascension-Resurrection, is archetypal and is adapted from Egypt by Paul. In fact, so many Christian archetypal themes are lifted directly from the Pyramid Texts and the Coffin Texts of Egypt, it would give people a whole new depth of understanding of Christianity, and they would no longer be able to throw baby Jesus out with his bathwater (see Christ in Egypt by D.M. Murdock)
The mysticism in the Gospel of Thomas is closer to a God-mysticism since it speaks to an immediate Realization of God as Logos (which is what the "the mind of Christ" is supposed to be. So, in other words, in our own Realization of the immediacy of the Christ/Logos, we possess "the mind of Christ," and as such become 'Christs.' In Eastern Orthodox Christianity, this process is called Theosis. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theosis. The Gospel of Thomas does not hold to a 'vicarious death' theology, and there is no talk of taking on the cross of Christ. Thomas is only pro to-Gnostic however. The Gnostics did not value that extraverted egoic bravado of martyrdom. Sacrificing oneself and one's children in the arena was not considered to be anything but needlessly suicidal. The true 'conversion' takes place interiorly. One could be a good Roman citizen, for example, pay homage to the Emperor, to the local divinities, and still cultivate one's interior life.
Shoot, I've been an Entheogen Enthusiast for over 40 years, but I've worked as a substance abuse specialist for the last 28 of those years. Like the Gnostics, I'd be considered a 'Fifth Columnist,' if my employers knew. I genuinely do my best to keep kids off drugs because they are not seeking Self-Realization, they are just troubled kids or idiotic followers. I never reveal my Heart-of-hearts to them until they're adults, if there is any contact.
It is in Hindu mysticism that one finds the terms Self and God used interchangeably, but understand that the word Self (capitalized) never refers to the individual ego of a person, the jivatma[n], but rather to the Atman, which is an equivalent concept to the Logos - that aspect of God which is immanent in space-time and as such, able to be experienced by human consciousness. Jung adopted this term to mean the archetypal Self, not the ego. The Absolute, or Brahman refers to the utterly transcendent Reality, which is personified as Saguna Brahman, with attributes, just as God is said to be loving, fatherly, etc., or as Nirguna Brahman, without, or void of attributes. This is the aspect that the 'heretical' Buddha put forth as Sunyata, the Clear Light of the Void. Buddha also established the Anatman (Anatta in Pali) because too many people confused the jivatman with Atman, and came to believe that we had individual immortality. The Atman is really the Void, which exists eternally, while the jivatman perishes. Christians make the same error, confusing Eternal Life (of God) with personal immortality of the soul - the same error that Buddha sought to eradicate in his tradition. One would not, therefore, say Self-Realization in Buddhism. Buddhism is about Awakening to this truth, that the individual perishes at death, but that the Clear Light endures forever, and the goal is to Realize this. Moreover, we ARE the Clear Light at bottom, therefore, live so as to dis-identify with our existential selves, become unattached to the world (be "in the world but not of the world" in Christian terms), and be compassionate to all beings who are totally lost in error and illusion.
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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Sauton - Know Thyself
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