|
 liquidlounge
Puppet bullshit
Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 6,323
|
 Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum?  [Re: SlashOZ]
#16720010 - 08/18/12 12:43 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
Quote:
liquidlounge said:
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
belief and uncertainty are two different things.
How? We believe that we're uncertain, dont we? Or, we're uncertain that we believe?
you can believe that you are uncertain. but that is a belief about your uncertainty and your uncertainty is about something else. for example, "i believe i am uncertain about the exact physics of the mars rover landing" is a totally legitimate statement. however, that is far different from your statements of "i believe in god therefore i am uncertain" which are basically nonsensical.
But you forget that i dont believe there is a God aswell.
One more time, i believe there is a God - i do not believe there is a God. How is that possible without being uncertain?
--------------------
OrgoneConclusion said:
Looney
|
SlashOZ
:D
Registered: 10/20/06
Posts: 3,546
Loc: Following the water cycle
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: liquidlounge] 3
#16720015 - 08/18/12 12:45 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
liquidlounge said:
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
Quote:
liquidlounge said:
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
belief and uncertainty are two different things.
How? We believe that we're uncertain, dont we? Or, we're uncertain that we believe?
you can believe that you are uncertain. but that is a belief about your uncertainty and your uncertainty is about something else. for example, "i believe i am uncertain about the exact physics of the mars rover landing" is a totally legitimate statement. however, that is far different from your statements of "i believe in god therefore i am uncertain" which are basically nonsensical.
But you forget that i dont believe there is a God aswell.
One more time, i believe there is a God - i do not believe there is a God. How is that possible without being uncertain?
If you want to more accurately convey your ideas you should probably say things like "i am uncertain about the existence of a god" rather than absurdities you keep posting. it would clear up a lot of confusion and it would make you look like you know what you are talking about.
--------------------
"Life sucks but in this really beautiful way" - Axl Rose
"Life's a bitch and then you die that's why we get high cuz you never know when you're gonna go." - NAS
"When people don't know what you're about they put you down and shut you out" - Black Sabbath
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" - Gandhi
"Look up at me I am God, look down on me and I am evil, look at me I am you." - Charles Manson.
"Don't question my reality." - Me (as far as I know)
|
liquidlounge
Puppet bullshit
Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 6,323
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: SlashOZ]
#16720045 - 08/18/12 12:53 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
If you want to more accurately convey your ideas you should probably say things like "i am uncertain about the existence of a god" rather than absurdities you keep posting. it would clear up a lot of confusion and it would make you look like you know what you are talking about.
Do you think i run around and say that "i believe there is a God, i do not believe there is a God" in public? No, i say i believe im agnostic.
Saying that you believe there is a God and dont believe there is a God on forums like these are puzzles for you all too figure out, clearly you didnt see the psychology in it until i told you the answer.
--------------------
OrgoneConclusion said:
Looney
|
SlashOZ
:D
Registered: 10/20/06
Posts: 3,546
Loc: Following the water cycle
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: liquidlounge] 2
#16720072 - 08/18/12 12:57 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
liquidlounge said:
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
If you want to more accurately convey your ideas you should probably say things like "i am uncertain about the existence of a god" rather than absurdities you keep posting. it would clear up a lot of confusion and it would make you look like you know what you are talking about.
Do you think i run around and say that "i believe there is a God, i do not believe there is a God" in public? No, i say i believe im agnostic.
Saying that you believe there is a God and dont believe there is a God on forums like these are puzzles for you all too figure out, clearly you didnt see the psychology in it until i told you the answer.
other than purposely obfuscating your own ideas, generally not making sense, and using the term agnostic incorrectly i'm not sure what you think you've accomplished?
--------------------
"Life sucks but in this really beautiful way" - Axl Rose
"Life's a bitch and then you die that's why we get high cuz you never know when you're gonna go." - NAS
"When people don't know what you're about they put you down and shut you out" - Black Sabbath
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" - Gandhi
"Look up at me I am God, look down on me and I am evil, look at me I am you." - Charles Manson.
"Don't question my reality." - Me (as far as I know)
|
liquidlounge
Puppet bullshit
Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 6,323
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: SlashOZ]
#16720161 - 08/18/12 01:15 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
Quote:
liquidlounge said:
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
If you want to more accurately convey your ideas you should probably say things like "i am uncertain about the existence of a god" rather than absurdities you keep posting. it would clear up a lot of confusion and it would make you look like you know what you are talking about.
Do you think i run around and say that "i believe there is a God, i do not believe there is a God" in public? No, i say i believe im agnostic.
Saying that you believe there is a God and dont believe there is a God on forums like these are puzzles for you all too figure out, clearly you didnt see the psychology in it until i told you the answer.
other than purposely obfuscating your own ideas, generally not making sense, and using the term agnostic incorrectly i'm not sure what you think you've accomplished?
Thought it was obvious that you're uncertain when you believe there is a God and also believe there is no God? Clearly you didnt get it. I believe what i see is true, but i also believe what i see is not true - am i uncertain then?
How did i use the term agnosticism wrong? Who are you to determine whether i used it right or wrong? 
I believe there is a God, i do not believe there is a God = "I cannot know whether a deity exists or not"
Atleast you got it figured out in the end. 
No facepalming, it does not fit.
--------------------
OrgoneConclusion said:
Looney
|
liquidlounge
Puppet bullshit
Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 6,323
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: liquidlounge]
#16720210 - 08/18/12 01:26 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
liquidlounge said:
I believe there is a God, i do not believe there is a God = "I cannot know whether a deity exists or not"
I liked this.
Belief is not knowledge.
--------------------
OrgoneConclusion said:
Looney
|
SlashOZ
:D
Registered: 10/20/06
Posts: 3,546
Loc: Following the water cycle
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: liquidlounge] 3
#16720218 - 08/18/12 01:27 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
liquidlounge said:
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
Quote:
liquidlounge said:
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
If you want to more accurately convey your ideas you should probably say things like "i am uncertain about the existence of a god" rather than absurdities you keep posting. it would clear up a lot of confusion and it would make you look like you know what you are talking about.
Do you think i run around and say that "i believe there is a God, i do not believe there is a God" in public? No, i say i believe im agnostic.
Saying that you believe there is a God and dont believe there is a God on forums like these are puzzles for you all too figure out, clearly you didnt see the psychology in it until i told you the answer.
other than purposely obfuscating your own ideas, generally not making sense, and using the term agnostic incorrectly i'm not sure what you think you've accomplished?
Thought it was obvious that you're uncertain when you believe there is a God and also believe there is no God? Clearly you didnt get it. I believe what i see is true, but i also believe what i see is not true - am i uncertain then?
How did i use the term agnosticism wrong? Who are you to determine whether i used it right or wrong?
I believe there is a God, i do not believe there is a God = "I cannot know whether a deity exists or not"
Atleast you got it figured out in the end.
No facepalming, it does not fit.
who am i to say you are not properly using the word agnostic? heck, look up the word and see for yourself or just look at the root words of agnostic. its like atheist. you get it yet? probably not. once again, saying you are uncertain about the existence of a god is far clearer and more accurate than your contradictory statements about a belief in god. anyways, i'm done. i haven't the time or energy to continue chatting with people like you.
--------------------
"Life sucks but in this really beautiful way" - Axl Rose
"Life's a bitch and then you die that's why we get high cuz you never know when you're gonna go." - NAS
"When people don't know what you're about they put you down and shut you out" - Black Sabbath
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" - Gandhi
"Look up at me I am God, look down on me and I am evil, look at me I am you." - Charles Manson.
"Don't question my reality." - Me (as far as I know)
|
 MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs
  
Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,348
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 14 days, 21 hours
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: SlashOZ]
#16720254 - 08/18/12 01:34 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
who am i to say you are not properly using the word agnostic? heck, look up the word and see for yourself or just look at the root words of agnostic. its like atheist. you get it yet? probably not. once again, saying you are uncertain about the existence of a god is far clearer and more accurate than your contradictory statements about a belief in god. anyways, i'm done. i haven't the time or energy to continue chatting with people like you.
Quote:
ag�nos�tic
[ag-nos-tik] Show IPA
noun
1.
a person who holds that the existence of the ultimate cause, as God, and the essential nature of things are unknown and unknowable, or that human knowledge is limited to experience. Synonyms: disbeliever, nonbeliever, unbeliever; doubter, skeptic, secularist, empiricist; heathen, heretic, infidel, pagan.
2.
a person who denies or doubts the possibility of ultimate knowledge in some area of study.
3.
a person who holds neither of two opposing positions on a topic: Socrates was an agnostic on the subject of immortality.
It seems to me that liquidlounge definitely fits as an agnostic in the second definition. He doubts the existence of god, and doubt implies both the possibility that god might or might not exist. Do you have any reasons to think that his
--------------------
    
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs
|
liquidlounge
Puppet bullshit
Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 6,323
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: liquidlounge]
#16720279 - 08/18/12 01:41 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
who am i to say you are not properly using the word agnostic? heck, look up the word and see for yourself or just look at the root words of agnostic. its like atheist. you get it yet? probably not. once again, saying you are uncertain about the existence of a god is far clearer and more accurate than your contradictory statements about a belief in god. anyways, i'm done. i haven't the time or energy to continue chatting with people like you.
I use some of the words in strong agnosticism to communicate my belief.
I believe there is a God (there could be one), i do not believe there is a God (there could not be one) = "I cannot know whether a deity exists or not"
Belief is not knowledge but i am open towards a possible God(s), i am also open towards the possibility of no God(s) - this openness is built on belief and belief is not knowledge which leaves us with: "I cannot know whether a deity exists or not"
Thats what most say, bye bye.
--------------------
OrgoneConclusion said:
Looney
|
liquidlounge
Puppet bullshit
Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 6,323
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: liquidlounge]
#16720312 - 08/18/12 01:45 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
Religious believes there is a God, atheists believes there is no God. Agnostic or strong agnostic as i would call myself believe there is a God but i also believe there is no God based on what religion told us and what atheism told us - i believe in both.
Very hard to comprehend.
--------------------
OrgoneConclusion said:
Looney
|
johnm214
Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 16,578
Loc: Americas
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: MushroomTrip] 2
#16720313 - 08/18/12 01:46 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
SlashOZ said:
It seems to me that liquidlounge definitely fits as an agnostic in the second definition. He doubts the existence of god, and doubt implies both the possibility that god might or might not exist. Do you have any reasons to think that his
Yes, he does, but he is still using the word inappropriately as distinct from atheism, which it is not. He's also incredibly sloppy in his posting and its difficult to know wtf he's talking about because he conflates positive and negative beliefs constantly.
|
liquidlounge
Puppet bullshit
Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 6,323
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: johnm214]
#16720321 - 08/18/12 01:49 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
johnm214 said:
because he conflates positive and negative beliefs constantly.
Because i am uncertain, cant you see it?
--------------------
OrgoneConclusion said:
Looney
|
liquidlounge
Puppet bullshit
Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 6,323
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: MushroomTrip]
#16720378 - 08/18/12 02:00 PM (8 months, 30 days ago) |
|
|
How would strong agnosticism ("I cannot know whether a deity exists or not.") work without the belief of God and non-belief of God?
MT's quote works too:
Quote:
MushroomTrip said:
2.
a person who denies or doubts the possibility of ultimate knowledge in some area of study.
--------------------
OrgoneConclusion said:
Looney
|
visonary2.0
Stranger
Registered: 08/16/12
Posts: 12
Last seen: 8 months, 29 days
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: Newbie]
#16720689 - 08/18/12 03:44 PM (8 months, 29 days ago) |
|
|
I believe they are out there in the world of the internet..
Atheism is boring... Paganism is the way forward, demigod's are so cool!...
only j/k 
|
Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!
Registered: 01/22/03
Posts: 168,358
Loc: Pvt. Pubfag NutSuck 
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: johnm214]
#16723254 - 08/19/12 12:12 AM (8 months, 29 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
johnm214 said:
As for your observation that someone who does believe there are no gods is an atheist, so what? The fact remains that your depiction was false: atheism describes the rejection of belief, not a positive claim.
which is in itself a belief
--------------------
there are 923 words in the english language that do not follow the "I before E"
rule, there are 44 words in the english language that follow the rule. this is
the shit our education funding is paying for and these liberals want more money
for education to keep making students stupid
|
liquidlounge
Puppet bullshit
Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 6,323
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: Prisoner#1]
#16723314 - 08/19/12 12:18 AM (8 months, 29 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:
johnm214 said:
As for your observation that someone who does believe there are no gods is an atheist, so what? The fact remains that your depiction was false: atheism describes the rejection of belief, not a positive claim.
which is in itself a belief
Everything is a belief until knowledge is obtained.
--------------------
OrgoneConclusion said:
Looney
|
johnm214
Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 16,578
Loc: Americas
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: Prisoner#1]
#16723440 - 08/19/12 12:42 AM (8 months, 29 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:
johnm214 said:
As for your observation that someone who does believe there are no gods is an atheist, so what? The fact remains that your depiction was false: atheism describes the rejection of belief, not a positive claim.
which is in itself a belief
So what?
If you want to conflate a meta belief with a belief on the question at hand, yes, but its equivocation to do this. Further, its easy to demonstrate someone has a belief, such as a belief that no god claims have convinced them, and this is not at all similar in credibility to the claim that not only do you believe in god, but that belief is justified.
This is the same nonsense that people do when they appeal to the lack of absolute certainty and then conflate that with lack of probable conclusions.
|
Newbie
User of semicolons.
Registered: 07/18/04
Posts: 23,015
Loc: Suburbia
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: Prisoner#1]
#16723449 - 08/19/12 12:45 AM (8 months, 29 days ago) |
|
|
If atheism is a religion then bald is a hair color, unemployment is a career, health is a disease, starvation is a meal, off is a TV channel.
|
Cactilove
Mystic
Registered: 02/17/11
Posts: 4,497
Last seen: 12 hours, 51 minutes
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: Newbie]
#16723664 - 08/19/12 01:24 AM (8 months, 29 days ago) |
|
|
No, religion is just something that one practices habitually meaning, for instance I can beat my wife religiously, and still have no belief in god, so I could be an religious atheist, because I beat that bitch every sunday
--------------------
I don't nor ever will know shit, stop acting like I do!
Stop claiming I have magic powers!
|
DieCommie
El Guapo
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 25,374
Loc: Street of Dreams
|
Re: Can we please have an Atheist forum? [Re: Cactilove]
#16723814 - 08/19/12 02:08 AM (8 months, 29 days ago) |
|
|
Quote:
No, religion is just something that one practices habitually
Where do you get that idea? When people say things like 'he goes to taco bell religiously' that doesnt make going to taco bell a religion... Its a figure of speech comparing it to the obsessions of the religious.
|
|
Images only 
Threaded
Previous
Index
Next
Shop for: 
Edit 
Reply 
