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 DeadHearts
Registered: 07/17/09
Posts: 21,149
Loc: MICHIGAN
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I don't doubt the the big bang is just a theory and a theory that is not entirely valid but the higgs
Seems to be real is not that it was fabricated and created by man. Much evidence has already pointed to
It's actual existence and with this announcement looming it seems as if it has been proven.
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Penguarky Tunguin
f n o r d
 
Registered: 08/08/04
Posts: 16,884
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Quote:
ellenallien said:
just leaves me scratching my head 
I just choked on water cuz of the emoticon. Well played.
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Every mistake, intentional or otherwise, in the above post, is the fault of the reader.
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DeadHearts
Registered: 07/17/09
Posts: 21,149
Loc: MICHIGAN
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Stop flirting with an intronet gurl. Not Gona get ya dick wet bruh.
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Penguarky Tunguin
f n o r d
Registered: 08/08/04
Posts: 16,884
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Weird, your mom would beg to differ, though she's a bit indisposed at the moment.
It puts the lotion on its skin.
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Every mistake, intentional or otherwise, in the above post, is the fault of the reader.
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 millzy
Registered: 05/12/10
Posts: 6,699
Last seen: 9 hours, 57 minutes
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Quote:
amilibertine said:
I'm probably gonna get ridiculed for this.
I think everyone interested in this supposed discovery should read this.
indeed, you are about to ridiculed by me for it.
aristotle believed in the unmoved mover, which catholic thinker thomas aquinas much later labeled "first cause" when he took aristotle's teachings and fused them with christianity. aristotle himself was an atheist. so beyond the ocean of data we have to support that an event happened about 15 billion years ago that caused, well everything, the article you cite presents a fallacious argument in that it was aquinas who put a religious slant on aristotle and not aristotle himself. i won't even entertain the rest of whatever he's saying because he can't even get that very simple, easily attainable fact straight that he uses to frame his argument.
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It is sometimes an appropriate response to reality to go insane.- Philip K. Dick
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The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire
Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 6,491
Loc: 'Merica 
Last seen: 5 days, 16 hours
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Patlal
The brain rapist
Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 14,353
Loc: Ottawa 
Last seen: 7 hours, 16 minutes
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Quote:
amilibertine said:
Read the article in the link I posted. There are way more problems with the big bang than the ones you just listed.
In fact, the reason they've been search for their made-up Higgs Boson particle is because every time they make a discovery that goes against or contradicts the big bang theory, instead of questioning the basic assumption (that the universe came from a big bang), they jump through ridiculous hoops to force the new info to fit the theory.
The Higgs Boson was only dreamed up because they needed it to make their theory make sense.
Only problem is that it still doesn't make sense. The big bang is bullshit. It's been completely disproved by every discovery they've made since it was dreamed up as a theory.
One day we will look back and laugh about the big bang just like we laugh about the earth being flat and the lying at the center of the universe.
The real explanation that no scientist want to say is that we don't know shit about 99.99% of what's going on.
In my head, the big bang theory is just too easy. It sounds too much like ''And then shit exploded and here we are''. What was going on before the big bang? Where was it?
Some people say it was a huge black hole that exploded. What was that black hole? How did it come to existence? Why is Donald Trumps hair so ugly?
I could go on and on.
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DieCommie
El Guapo
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 25,374
Loc: Street of Dreams
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 Re: Higgs Boson found  [Re: Patlal]
#16470408 - 07/02/12 03:54 PM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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Quote:
I could go on and on.
I'm sure you could. And it would probably be just as uninformed as your post here. So you probably shouldn't... 
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DeadHearts
Registered: 07/17/09
Posts: 21,149
Loc: MICHIGAN
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Re: Higgs Boson found [Re: DieCommie]
#16470445 - 07/02/12 04:02 PM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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My question, What kind of impact does the Higgs have on the theory of inflation if any?
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Penguarky Tunguin
f n o r d
Registered: 08/08/04
Posts: 16,884
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Quote:
The Ecstatic said:
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Every mistake, intentional or otherwise, in the above post, is the fault of the reader.
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DieCommie
El Guapo
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 25,374
Loc: Street of Dreams
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Re: Higgs Boson found [Re: DeadHearts] 1
#16470499 - 07/02/12 04:12 PM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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Quote:
DeadHearts said:
My question, What kind of impact does the Higgs have on the theory of inflation if any?
None. Finding the higgs has little impact on current theory. The theory that predicts the higgs has been the standard theory for 30-40 years. Its no surpirse that the higgs was found. Certain bounds on its parameters have been identified.
What is really wanted from the LHC is not confirmation of existing theories, but evidence of phenomenon that goes beyond our existing theories. That is what ever scientist really wants to do.
Using the terminology of Kuhn, finding the higgs is a triumph of normal science, not a scientific revolution or paradigm shift.
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DeadHearts
Registered: 07/17/09
Posts: 21,149
Loc: MICHIGAN
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Re: Higgs Boson found [Re: DieCommie]
#16470537 - 07/02/12 04:20 PM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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So with CERN taking so long just to find the higgs what can we expect to come from the future of this machine? Can its power still be increased for higher collision speeds?
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DieCommie
El Guapo
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 25,374
Loc: Street of Dreams
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I'm a little cynical about it. Particularly considering I'm in physics.
What can we expect? I dont know. A chance that we will find nothing else fundamental. The higgs rounds out the standard model and we can hone in on parameters by running it and getting better statistics. Or there is a chance that we will find evidence of phenomenon that cannot be described using the current theory. In that case there is a lot of work to be done, not only devising new theory but devising new experimental setups to flush out the new phenomenon.
I do believe its power can still be increased. The last time I spoke with a local prof who works on it, it was still being slowly ramped up with its limit being reached in the next year or two.
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DeadHearts
Registered: 07/17/09
Posts: 21,149
Loc: MICHIGAN
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Re: Higgs Boson found [Re: DieCommie]
#16470561 - 07/02/12 04:26 PM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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/thread
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amilibertine
Midwest Myconaught
Registered: 06/10/09
Posts: 2,578
Loc: Midwest, USA
Last seen: 6 days, 14 hours
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If I take two pieces of matter and smash them together at insanely high speeds I can't call the resulting pieces of matter anything other than the product of the explosion I created.
That doesn't mean the things that come out of the explosion exist in nature.
The big bang is bullshit.
1) Quantized red shift is a proven phenomenon. Proven by over 4 decades of trying to either disprove it or explain why it didn't fit the existing model of big bang physics.
2) The big bang operates under the assumption that the Earth is at the center of the universe.
3) Cosmic Background Radiation was looked for as a remnant of the big bang and indeed it was found. Problem is that once again it didn't fit the models in any way. So once again instead of questioning the basic assumption they've been trying for over four decades to explain why it doesn't fit what the models predicted.
4) "Population II stars are stars with no heavy elements in them. When they explode at the end of their life cycles, heavy elements are created. These are swept up by stars that form afterwards creating Population I stars, usually with planets around them. Population I stars have heavy elements. Population II stars do not.
If the Big Bang had happened, the universe would be filled with heavy elements created in those first few moments the universe started to operate under the rules of physics we know today. There should not be any stars in existence devoid of those heavy elements. And yet there are.
The existence of Population II stars, devoid of heavy elements, directly contradicts the theory of the Big Bang."
5) The Higgs Boson was only dreamed up to explain why the biggest black hole that ever existed didn't behave like a black hole at all. The scientists who support the big bang could never explain how all the matter in the universe could have escaped the initial singularity. So they invented a particle that gave them a easy way around this problem. They claim that at the big bang matter had no mass, that's why it could escape the event horizon of the singularity. THEN, after this mass-less matter was a safe distance outside the event horizon, every particle of this mass-less matter paired up with a Higgs Boson particle, which in turn gave the mass-less matter mass.
There's a reason they call this the "God" particle, because at the end of the day, it makes no sense at all.
So, are we going to go another 50 years trying to explain why every discovery we make doesn't fit the model and instead of questioning the basic assumption just try and force the bits together through the invention of things like the Higgs Boson?
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sonamdrukpa
Wayfarer
Registered: 10/18/11
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Last seen: 28 days, 5 hours
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amilibertine
Midwest Myconaught
Registered: 06/10/09
Posts: 2,578
Loc: Midwest, USA
Last seen: 6 days, 14 hours
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Re: Higgs Boson found [Re: millzy]
#16470860 - 07/02/12 05:28 PM (10 months, 12 days ago) |
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Quote:
millzy said:
Quote:
amilibertine said:
I'm probably gonna get ridiculed for this.
I think everyone interested in this supposed discovery should read this.
indeed, you are about to ridiculed by me for it.
aristotle believed in the unmoved mover, which catholic thinker thomas aquinas much later labeled "first cause" when he took aristotle's teachings and fused them with christianity. aristotle himself was an atheist. so beyond the ocean of data we have to support that an event happened about 15 billion years ago that caused, well everything, the article you cite presents a fallacious argument in that it was aquinas who put a religious slant on aristotle and not aristotle himself. i won't even entertain the rest of whatever he's saying because he can't even get that very simple, easily attainable fact straight that he uses to frame his argument.
Problem is, it doesn't say that at all. You're putting words in the articles mouth.
Also, for the universe to be 14-15 billion years old as you claim, the Earth would have to be at the very center of said universe. Seeing as how that particular age is calculated by measuring the limits of what we can see.
That's a pretty big fundamental flaw right off the bat.
Also, how can you ignore the ocean of data that proves the big bang theory is not possible?
Oh, I know, by assuming the theory is correct since that's what they taught you in school and on discovery channel.
So explain away all the mountains of data that for some reason never fit what we predicted so we have to invent things like the Higgs Boson to explain why all the matter in the universe didn't behave like matter at first or why the biggest black hole that ever existed didn't behave like a black hole at all.
But it's okay, because these scientists know what they are doing. Just like the ones who invented epicycles to keep the theory of an un-moving earth together, even though after hundreds of years they still could not predict the movement of the planets. But even in the face out countless failures they never questioned whether the basic assumption was flawed.
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amilibertine
Midwest Myconaught
Registered: 06/10/09
Posts: 2,578
Loc: Midwest, USA
Last seen: 6 days, 14 hours
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Quote:
sonamdrukpa said:
I know right, because to question anything isn't the basic premise of science.
Sorry if I have a hard time excepting the model of physics where physics has no laws.
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nice1
Not the droid your looking for
Registered: 09/26/09
Posts: 10,449
Loc: earth
Last seen: 4 months, 13 days
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Quote:
amilibertine said:
So, are we going to go another 50 years trying to explain why every discovery we make doesn't fit the model and instead of questioning the basic assumption just try and force the bits together through the invention of things like the Higgs Boson?
These types of predictive theories to be proven or dis-proven are good meat in science. It gives more weight to the theory (model) if you can predict something that is later shown to be correct. If not it means we have to alter the theory.
Nothing wrong with "making up" theories though. The are based on the known working model and will prove or disprove if we should continue to use it or alter it in any way or even use a diff model completely if necessary.
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MorphinTime
Lord Zedd's Going Down
Registered: 09/05/11
Posts: 3,038
Loc: Angel Grove
Last seen: 2 hours, 51 minutes
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Quote:
amilibertine said:
I know right, because to question anything isn't the basic premise of science.
Sorry if I have a hard time excepting the model of physics where physics has no laws.
Where did you study physics?
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