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a social revolt
retired cultivator


Registered: 09/07/11
Posts: 833
Loc: Brooklyn, NYC
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US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent
#16294209 - 05/28/12 10:23 AM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent
Original Article Here
Quote:
According to the Honduran newspaper, Tiempo, as well as the Honduran human rights group, COFADEH, the agents of the U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA), dressed in military uniforms, killed at least four and possibly six civilians in a raid which took place on Friday, May 11. The victims included two pregnant women and two children. The newspaper Tiempo did not pull any punches, writing that those killed "were humble and honest citizens." Apparently, the DEA agents fired from helicopter gunships upon a boat carrying civilians on the Patuca back to their community of Ahuas which itself is located in the Mosquito coast of Honduras. According to Tiempo, the DEA mistakenly fired upon the civilian boat because it was well-lit while the intended target -- a boat carrying drug traffickers -- was floating down the river without its lights on.
According to Tiempo, the mayor of Ahuas decried the killings, saying that "[t]hese operations were performed irresponsibly" and that the people in his community live in fear "because they now have the threat of operations because they kill poor people... "
COFADEH, the Committee of the Families of the Disappeared of Honduras, has been very pointed in its condemnation of the role the U.S. played in these killings. COFADEH was founded in 1982 in response to the disappearance of 69 persons that year. As COFADEH explains on its website , it believes that the disappearances which took place in the 1980's (a total of 184 between 1980 and 1989), was the direct result of the National Security Doctrine which the U.S. imposed on Honduras. This doctrine, according to COFADEH, "included a systematic and selective form of human rights violations. The most emblematic violations were torture, murders and enforced disappearances" of the type which the U.S. had sponsored in the Southern Cone of South America in the 1970s.
COFADEH has taken on renewed importance in Honduras after the 2009 military coup against President Manual Zelaya which was at least tacitly supported by the United States. Since that time, the types of killings and disappearances which led to COFADEH's creation have started again, and are entirely the responsibility of the U.S.-supported coup government. Thus, according to a wonderful February, 2012 piece in the New York Times by Dana Frank, who relies heavily on COFADEH's figures, "at least 34 members of the opposition have disappeared or been killed, and more than 300 people have been killed by state security forces since the coup," including at least 13 journalists. Sadly, in researching this article, I discovered that a kind and brave woman, Vanessa Zepeda, who I had the honor of meeting on a School of Americas Watch delegation to Honduras shortly after the coup, has since been killed as a direct consequence of this coup. See, list of victims of the coup.
In response to the DEA killings, COFADEH put out a statement entitled, "Effects of the Military Occupation," which blames the U.S.'s decades-long policies in Latin America for the continued violence in countries like Honduras. As COFADEH stated:
... a foreign army [i.e., the U.S. army] protected under the new hegemonic concept of the "war on drugs," legalized with reforms to the 1953 Military Treaty, violates our territorial sovereignty and kills civilians as if it was in Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya or Syria.
Two pregnant women, two children and two adult males were killed by shots fired from helicopter gunships piloted by U.S. soldiers on a boat on River Patuca returning to their community. They were workers in the local lobster and shellfish diving industry.
... [T]he "failed state" of Honduras gave way to the foreign military occupation under the script of the "war against the drug cartels," similar to what has happened in the past eight years in Mexico, Colombia and Guatemala.
And this reality, from the perspective of a human rights organization, is unacceptable and reprehensible.
As COFADEH recognizes in this statement, the U.S. is very much at war in Latin America, from Mexico through Central America and to Colombia, leaving a wake of violence and bodies in its path. A recent article by Tom Burghardt describes in detail how the U.S. is indeed the prime source of the grisly violence plaguing this region. Thus, the U.S., in fighting the so-called "war on drugs," is fueling the conflict with guns and advanced weaponry -- weaponry which helps to prop up repressive governments such as those in Mexico, Honduras and Colombia; which in any case ends up in the hands of the very drug cartels the U.S. is claiming to fight (e.g., through the Fast & Furious program); and which is killing massive numbers of civilians (50,000 in Mexico and 250,000 in Colombia). No wonder then that the entire region was united against the U.S. and Canada in calling at the Summit of the Americas for the end to this war and to the de-criminalization of drugs.
Yet, due to the media blackout on such issues, the vast majority of Americans do not even know that the U.S. is at war just south of our borders and do not understand why our Southern neighbors are crying out for a change in this senseless policy. The media's failure in this regard is inexcusable.
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HybridprX
Biodegrader of coir



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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: a social revolt]
#16294514 - 05/28/12 12:00 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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Dumb D.E.A agents, but then again, drug traffickers will kill civilians (migrants) and then put the blame on government forces, happens all the time.
Just like the jihad's that surround themselves with women and children while they fire off R.P.G's and small arms fire and then blame the soldiers for defending themselves.... Legalization wont stop the flow of arms to the sub-human pieces of shit that use them to murder (Govs included) but it would help quash their profits and make them easier to hunt and dispose of.
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MrShroom
Spectral


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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: HybridprX]
#16294607 - 05/28/12 12:27 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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So we can pretty much bomb or invade any country now and for any reason. America fuck yeah.
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mushroom_sandwich
I'm Only Sleeping



Registered: 04/17/12
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: MrShroom] 2
#16294643 - 05/28/12 12:37 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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The DEA is useless. The war on drugs is pointless.
-------------------- “I believe in a long, prolonged derangement of the senses to attain the unknown. Our pale reasoning hides the infinite from us."
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HybridprX
Biodegrader of coir



Registered: 01/29/08
Posts: 2,237
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: mushroom_sandwich]
#16294685 - 05/28/12 12:46 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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The war on drugs is pointless..... they should have called it "The war on psychopaths that use drugs to fund their killing sprees" but that one was to long and they didnt want to hire me to think up cool names to group together the cause of 50,000+ dead.
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ydahs
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: HybridprX]
#16294744 - 05/28/12 01:02 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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I don't see how this is at all acceptable. I understand its not quite a rare occurrence, which just makes it even more astonishing. Say what you want on the effects cocaine (which I assume is the drug the DEA was after)use has, not only on the user, but also their family and community and it is still never as disastrous as killing pregnant women, children and innocent men. The solution is worth than the problem in this case.
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a social revolt
retired cultivator


Registered: 09/07/11
Posts: 833
Loc: Brooklyn, NYC
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: HybridprX]
#16294837 - 05/28/12 01:27 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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Good point!
Noone would have ever died in the drug war if they weren't illegal in the first place though.
The DEA claims that 60-70% of cartel's incomes come from marijuana- so if we completely decriminalize it at the federal level, wouldn't the price drop from ~$300/oz to like ~$15/oz?
How would they make money off it then? Americans that previously got Mexican cartel weed would get American pot instead.
And don't even get me started on cocaine.... the shit wouldn't even exist if it wasn't for the price inflation.
But the CIA and DEA are making too much money to care about it...
and most Americans are retarded on these issues, so how would anything ever change....
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Smitington
Unidentified Flying Object


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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: a social revolt]
#16295000 - 05/28/12 01:56 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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The drug war useless? You guys kidding me? Sure, it is useless for tackling drug problems, but that is not what it is about... get with the program guys.
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ganjhor
Monshroom Season


Registered: 04/14/12
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: Smitington]
#16295151 - 05/28/12 02:25 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
Smitington said: The drug war useless? You guys kidding me? Sure, it is useless for tackling drug problems, but that is not what it is about... get with the program guys.
...so, it's about spreading misinformation, hiding secret-ops funding, exploiting America's consumerism, and killing anyone who gets in the way....right?
-------------------- "Understanding is the apperception of pattern as such. To fear death, is to misunderstand life!"
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Smitington
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: ganjhor]
#16295206 - 05/28/12 02:37 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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It's about control, imperialism, funding secret-ops, etc. There are also industries which lobby to keep the drug war going because they have vested interest in it.
http://www.alternet.org/drugs/155269/5_special_interest_groups_that_help_keep_marijuana_illegal/
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k00laid
NEMO


Registered: 05/03/10
Posts: 17,632
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: Smitington]
#16295479 - 05/28/12 03:29 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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he's right, the drug war is going exactly as planned.
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frylock91



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 8,604
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: k00laid]
#16297476 - 05/28/12 10:08 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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Additional generic drug war comment.
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PSN: Upperlevel804
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bigmike7104
Stranger

Registered: 07/12/10
Posts: 1,395
Loc: USA
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: k00laid]
#16297615 - 05/28/12 10:29 PM (1 year, 21 days ago) |
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how screwed it up is it that a guy gets democratically elected, then we help support a military coup to put someone else in place, and support them even though they're corrupt.
also notice since the coup, there's been a huge increase in drugs and trafficking, which is also when these type of disappearances and killings appear which at least indirectly involve the u.s.
yea our government wants to spread democracy and is in no way corrupt 
Quote:
Much of the press in the United States has attributed this violence solely to drug trafficking and gangs. But the coup was what threw open the doors to a huge increase in drug trafficking and violence, and it unleashed a continuing wave of state-sponsored repression.
The current government of President Lobo won power in a November 2009 election managed by the same figures who had initiated the coup. Most opposition candidates withdrew in protest, and all major international observers boycotted the election, except for the National Democratic Institute and the International Republican Institute, which are financed by the United States. President Obama quickly recognized Mr. Lobo’s victory, even when most of Latin America would not. Mr. Lobo’s government is, in fact, a child of the coup. It retains most of the military figures who perpetrated the coup, and no one has gone to jail for starting it.
This chain of events — a coup that the United States didn’t stop, a fraudulent election that it accepted — has now allowed corruption to mushroom. The judicial system hardly functions. Impunity reigns. At least 34 members of the opposition have disappeared or been killed, and more than 300 people have been killed by state security forces since the coup, according to the leading human rights organization Cofadeh. At least 13 journalists have been killed since Mr. Lobo took office, according to the Committee to Protect Journalists.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/27/opinion/in-honduras-a-mess-helped-by-the-us.html?_r=1
-------------------- Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind
Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must
Feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines
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EntheogenicPeace
Scholar



Registered: 10/04/05
Posts: 3,797
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: bigmike7104]
#16298019 - 05/28/12 11:36 PM (1 year, 20 days ago) |
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Yes, the ppl of most Latin American countries have made tremendous strides over the past few decades in gaining their sovereignty from U.S. vultures working in collaboration with the domestic oligarchy (an arrangement inherited from European colonialism). Trying to meddle via the so-called "drug war" is the last grasp of a dying empire. 100,000+ U.S. & NATO along with ~300,000 ANA & local police (who receive $4 billion in subsidies every year) can't even extinguish bands of illiterate, ragtag peasant farmers who number around 25,000.
Despite that the U.S. should abandon its empire overseas & focus on trying to salvage its domestic wreck & ever increasing debt, it can't divorce itself from the idea that it has some kind of exceptional right (or even divine imperative), immune from the laws of history & economics, to engage in self-serving meddling all over the world. As such, it not only can't bring itself to cut the largest part of its federal budget (the "national security state"), but instead there is always tremendous pressure to increase it (in significant part on borrowed/printed money).
Quote:
"A nation that continues year after year to spend more money on military defense than on programs of social uplift is approaching spiritual death." - Martin Luther King Jr.
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: bigmike7104]
#16298960 - 05/29/12 02:37 AM (1 year, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
bigmike7104 said: how screwed it up is it that a guy gets democratically elected, then we help support a military coup to put someone else in place, and support them even though they're corrupt.
do some more research into the killing the Libyan president, qaddafi
-------------------- AMU - AMU Q & A - MyVideo Teks!
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a social revolt
retired cultivator


Registered: 09/07/11
Posts: 833
Loc: Brooklyn, NYC
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: k00laid]
#16299763 - 05/29/12 09:15 AM (1 year, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
k00laid said:
Quote:
bigmike7104 said: how screwed it up is it that a guy gets democratically elected, then we help support a military coup to put someone else in place, and support them even though they're corrupt.
do some more research into the killing the Libyan president, qaddafi
Dude I was flippin out during the entire time way before he got popped!
Apparently the whole time the only foreign troops that were there was some dutch special forces squad that was "escorting an important citizen out of the warzone"
months later, turns out the US spec ops, SAS spec ops, etc., were also there doing shit....
Gaddafi was a puppet for the US and UK's intelligence and anti-terrorist community, and as soon as he started saying shit his government collapsed and france bombed the shit out of them.... or should I say "Nato".
Also, look up "structural oppression through neo-colonialism"
The world is exactly the same as it was in the 15,16, and 1700s- white people are still dominating everything and everyone
the "American dream" consists of keeping 90% of the world in poverty...
but hey, haven't we gotten a little off topic?
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Humility
Working on it



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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: a social revolt]
#16300454 - 05/29/12 01:23 PM (1 year, 20 days ago) |
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DEA is denying it.
http://www.bostonglobe.com/news/world/2012/05/17/officials-deny-that-dea-agents-were-involved-honduran-gunfight-that-left-four-dead/mefakV6YEKncXqwoUH5xwL/story.html
DEA did not kill 4 in Honduras, US says Deaths came in raid involving US strike team By Charlie Savage and Thom Shanker New York Times
May 18, 2012
WASHINGTON - US officials maintained Thursday that no Drug Enforcement Administration agents fired weapons during a shootout last week in the jungles of Honduras that left several people dead. The officials also offered new details about the episode, which has touched off anti-American protests in the Central American country.
The officials said the DEA agents - part of a commando-style squad called FAST, or Foreign-deployed Advisory Support Team, that was on a counternarcotics mission - were allowed by the rules of engagement to shoot back if fired upon to protect themselves and their Honduran counterparts. The agents involved said that only Honduran police on the ground and a Honduran officer in a helicopter fired weapons in the gunbattle.
“It is my understanding that no DEA agents discharged their weapons,’’ said a senior US government official who has been briefed on details of the episode.
The Associated Press reported last Friday that villagers in the northern coastal region of Honduras were burning government buildings there to protest the DEA presence.
A US official said an overhead surveillance video of part of the operation showed a plane landing in a small field around 1:46 a.m. last Friday and about 30 men unloading 14 bales of cocaine. The bales were then put on a pickup truck, which took the drugs to a boat on a river. Officials had been alerted to the incoming plane by the Colombian government.
Four helicopters, owned by the State Department but flown by Guatemalan pilots, carried the strike force of Honduran counternarcotics police officers to the river, where they landed and seized the boat and its cargo of what officials said was more than 1,000 pounds of cocaine. They also seized an M-4 assault rifle and several magazines of ammunition. As the helicopters approached, men who had been loading the boat fled into the jungle, the official said.
Nearly an hour later, at 2:40 a.m., a second boat approached and fired at the government forces, the official said. The Honduran police unit returned fire, supported by at least one helicopter. After a brief but intense firefight, the shooting stopped, and the second boat was said to have withdrawn. Because of uncertainty over the security of the area, the government returned to their base with the cocaine.
Initially, a Honduran official told reporters that two traffickers were believed to have been killed in the gunbattle. But local leaders offered a conflicting account, saying that the helicopter had pursued a boat with traffickers but mistakenly opened fire on a different boat carrying people who were out fishing. They said four people were killed, including two pregnant women.
The US official briefed on the matter expressed doubts that villagers would be out fishing in the middle of the night, near where helicopters carrying armed police had landed nearly an hour earlier. The large number of people unloading the plane in the video, the official said, was evidence that many members of the impoverished community of Ahuas were involved in lucrative narcotics trafficking.
“There is nothing in the local village that was unknown, a surprise, or a mystery about this,’’ the official said. “What happened was that, for the first time in the history of Ahuas, Honduran law enforcement interfered with narcotics smuggling.’’
But that explanation is unlikely to calm angry villagers in the region. Leaders of the Masta, Diunat, Rayaka, Batiasta, and Bamiasta ethnic groups said in a statement that “the people in that canoe were fishermen, not drug traffickers.’’
“For centuries we have been a peaceful people who live in harmony with nature, but today we declared these Americans to be persona non grata in our territory,’’ the statement continued.
The murky episode led Human Rights Watch to call for a “prompt, thorough, and impartial investigation.’’
“It is critical that both Honduran and US authorities ensure that the killings are thoroughly investigated to determine whether the use of lethal force was justified,’’ José Miguel Vivanco, Americas director at Human Rights Watch, said in a statement Thursday. “If evidence demonstrates that security forces violated international standards, they must be held accountable.’’
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bigmike7104
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Registered: 07/12/10
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: k00laid]
#16300468 - 05/29/12 01:27 PM (1 year, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
k00laid said:
Quote:
bigmike7104 said: how screwed it up is it that a guy gets democratically elected, then we help support a military coup to put someone else in place, and support them even though they're corrupt.
do some more research into the killing the Libyan president, qaddafi
yea i know, we supported him and gave him money as foreign aid, then the citizens turned on him then we go against him.
unfortunately, the u.s. has a history of overthrowing a democratic elected person and placing a dictator
http://www.colorado.edu/AmStudies/lewis/2010/vietnam.htm#order
also
CIA Assassination Program Revealed: Nothing New Under the Sun
http://www.infowars.com/cia-assassination-program-revealed-nothing-new-under-the-sun/
and
http://www.amazon.com/Killing-Hope-Military-Interventions-Since/dp/1567510523
"Is the United States a Force for Democracy? From China in the 1940s to Guatemala today, William Blum provides the most comprehensive study of the ongoing American holocaust. Covering U.S. intervention in more than 50 countries, KILLING HOPE describes the grim role played by the U.S. in overthrowing governments, perverting elections, assassinating leaders, suppressing revolutions, manipulating trade unions and manufacturing "news."
-------------------- Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind
Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must
Feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines
Edited by bigmike7104 (05/29/12 01:39 PM)
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EntheogenicPeace
Scholar



Registered: 10/04/05
Posts: 3,797
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: k00laid]
#16300820 - 05/29/12 02:55 PM (1 year, 20 days ago) |
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http://www.counterpunch.org/2012/05/25/libya-africa-and-africom/
A good article on Western involvement in the recent regime change in Libya. Gaddafi* had been providing aid & investment incentives to sub-Saharan African governments to refuse U.S. or NATO bases in their countries. With increasing foreign (namely, Chinese) diplomatic and economic activity in an area long considered to be in the Western orbit of influence, the West has an incentive to put some amount of boots/bases on the ground to be in a better position to secure its economic interests in the region (minerals, fossil fuels, probably some commodities as well).
* I fully acknowledge that the man, his family, & no doubt many others in prominent potions in his government were corrupt & lived in inexcusable luxury relative to the average worker or peasant. However, the NATO-backed people coming to power are likewise corrupt & self-serving, & as such it remains to be seen whether the condition of living for the average person improves, stays the same, or worsens during the post-Gaddafi era.
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bigmike7104
Stranger

Registered: 07/12/10
Posts: 1,395
Loc: USA
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Re: US DEA Kills Innocent Civilians in Honduras- US Media Silent [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
#16302100 - 05/29/12 08:03 PM (1 year, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
The Associated Press reported last Friday that villagers in the northern coastal region of Honduras were burning government buildings there to protest the DEA presence.
damn, shit is getting serious
-------------------- Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind
Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must
Feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines
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