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Invisibleatricoz
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Morel mycelium comparison
    #16285198 - 05/25/12 10:36 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

Hi everybody. Since I'm at my very first experience with morel cloning, I need some help from more experienced guy.
Some times ago, I cloned this nice M. esculenta specimen



I cutted some tissue fragments from the stem and the cap. During the process, several kinds of mold and bacteria appeared, and I had to perform many transfers; and here come the problems :crazy:
What I actually have, is this selection of petri dishes.



As you can see, the content of each looks pretty different from that of each other. The weird thing is that pretty every culture is starting to form micro-sclerotia, white in the beginning, becoming brown and finally black with ageing. My question is: does morel mycelium look very different even if coming from the same fruitbody, or maybe there's some kind of contamination in some of my petri dishes, along with true morel mycelium? And if so, what is the most "morel-looking" plate? :ooo:

Here some detailed pic:

No sclerotia here, but this looks like the more morel-looking plate to me
#1


This is very cottony and not very morel-looking
#2


Same as the precedent. But this plate has been inoculated with a micro-sclerotium, that grew a little, and another one is forming near it.
#3




In this plate, culture looks more like cobweb mold than mycelium, except that some days ago, a lot of things that look like sclerotia became to form
#4


Here there are some bacteria, but sclerotia formed anyway
#5


And finally, the last one. Here 2 different kind of growth are visible, along with some micro-sclerotia.
#6




If you're able to help me, please do :grin:


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Edited by atricoz (06/10/12 08:38 AM)


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: atricoz]
    #16286973 - 05/26/12 11:16 AM (2 years, 2 months ago)

:takingnotes:

I am still starting this species Articoz, but I hope mister or others
more experienced with it stop by.

I do have two sub blocks hopefully growing sclerotia.

Do you recall how long such a sub should be allowed ti sit?

Onward and upward,

JD


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: Javadog]
    #16286982 - 05/26/12 11:19 AM (2 years, 2 months ago)

im haveing the same trouble i cloned a yellow morels and i cant tell if the mycelium is morel or something nasty...


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: bakenast]
    #16287052 - 05/26/12 11:53 AM (2 years, 2 months ago)

Cloning morels is often a waste of time, as they are so full of contams. Starting with spores from a dried fruitbody on the other hand is almost foolproof.
See below for M. esculenta mycelium on agar with early sclerotia growth. Usually the mycelium is almost invisible, though an overdose of nutrients can cause dense growth, coupled with less sclerotia.

Carsten



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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: Mycelio]
    #16287074 - 05/26/12 11:59 AM (2 years, 2 months ago)

Wow.  Good stuff.

That mycelium reminds me of Volvariella.  As it gets started it looks that wispy too.

Danke Carsten!

JD


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: Javadog]
    #16287153 - 05/26/12 12:20 PM (2 years, 2 months ago)

Love the pictures.

Off topic but....carsten do you have/know of a good tek for starting from spores of a dried fruiting body?  Is there a prefered way to produce large sclerotia?


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: evolve_h2o]
    #16287315 - 05/26/12 01:04 PM (2 years, 2 months ago)

Right JD, the speed of Volvariella mycelium is also very similar.

@evolve_h2o
I once described my way to grow sclerotia from morel spores here:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/9681720#9681720
It was Morchella conica, but the procedure is the same for M. esculenta. My sclerotia started small, but then grew and fused, filling all air spaces in the top layer, so I ended up with one, large chunk.

Carsten


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: Mycelio]
    #16288252 - 05/26/12 04:58 PM (2 years, 2 months ago)

Thank you!!!


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: evolve_h2o]
    #16291467 - 05/27/12 10:55 AM (2 years, 2 months ago)

The more similar to your pic, Carsten, is #5. Now I'll wait to see if that little balls will brownish :cool:
thank you all :thumbup:

P.S. @JD

no, I'm still at the cloning phase, I didn't try it with any substrate until now. Will post my future experiment :smile:


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: atricoz]
    #16291558 - 05/27/12 11:22 AM (2 years, 2 months ago)

Deleted: I decided to make this a new thread. 


Edited by Javadog (05/28/12 01:10 AM)


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: Javadog]
    #16352768 - 06/08/12 06:36 PM (2 years, 2 months ago)

I inoculated a wbs jar with myc from petri #1. Looks like culture is not clean: sclerotia formed, but with a greenish coloration. Day by day they're growing more and in some part "escaping" from the contamination, because color is pretty different.






In addiction, some weird red thing appeared on the top of the jar:





I'm wondering how I can clean this culture :crazy:


--------------------


Edited by atricoz (06/08/12 06:44 PM)


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: atricoz]
    #16359741 - 06/10/12 07:55 AM (2 years, 2 months ago)

Hey atricoz,

that looks weird, the mycelium shouldn't be so short and dense, even in presence of green mold and yeast. You should still be able to see all the kernels and have fuzzy, white sclerotia forming in between or on top, turning grayish brown after some days.

I am confused by your numbering. Before, I was counting your single plate pics from top to bottom, so I thought you were planning to use this one:
Quote:

atricoz said:





Now I see little numbers on the lids. :confused:

However, for cleaning, you can transfer tiny samples, place it at the side of a new dish (the larger the better). After a few days you can transfer from the opposite side, as Morchella mycelium should grow about 3cm per day, there is a good chance it leaves everything else behind.
Pouring hot agar on top may also be an option. I know morel mycelium grows through agar easily.

Cheers, Carsten


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: Mycelio]
    #16359823 - 06/10/12 09:00 AM (2 years, 2 months ago)

The number on lids has no meaning, sorry for making things even more confusing, now I wrote a number on every pic :smile:.
I used this one for the jar



However, I had the same thought about mycelium coloration, I ever saw thin and greyish mycelium, nothing like this. However I guess that those little things forming are sclerotia, or at least, they look like them :crazy:. This jar colonized at incredible speed, far faster than any contamination I ever sees until now, but then it became white like this.... who knows? :confused:
In a while I'll try opening it and took one of these black balls to better examine it :thumbup:


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: atricoz]
    #16359876 - 06/10/12 09:32 AM (2 years, 2 months ago)

Spots of green mold can turn black like this, when being grown over by another mycelium.

I'd also try samples from plate #4, in case it still exists.

Carsten


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: Mycelio]
    #16360487 - 06/10/12 12:55 PM (2 years, 2 months ago)

I inoculated 4 wbs jars with a plate derived from #4, I'll follow growing in the next days.

I also inspected that jar. I can say that it is definitely contaminated, because there are some greenish spots, and also weird formations (fruitbodies?) like this one, growing over 3 millet kernels:




Anyway, I guess that all the black spots visible along jar's wall could be sclerotia, I picked some of them and cutted in half. They're pretty hard, with consistency of rubber, and black outside and inside







What do you think?


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: atricoz]
    #16361160 - 06/10/12 03:34 PM (2 years, 2 months ago)

This grayish three-kernel-thing should be something else. Solid and rubbery sounds good for sclerotia, but they look odd for Morchella deliciosa. Together with this untypical mycelium, I'm skeptical, but it is hard to say. The presence of other species often changes the appearance of morel mycelium.

These were the M. esculenta sclerotia I once had:





The final color was a dark grayish brown, inside too.


Carsten


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: Mycelio]
    #16361641 - 06/10/12 05:08 PM (2 years, 2 months ago)

Mycelium in your pics really looks like the one in #4 petri. I can't wait to see how the 3 jars I inoculated will grow. However, I guess that even if with some unwanted guests, in that jar there's morel mycelium.
Little black sclerotia are forming in the plate, also, but becoming immediately black (this due to the contaminant that surrounds them, I guess). This is happening in the jar too, but unluckily pics don't do justice.
Anyway, I'll stop bothering you for the moment, at least until I'll have some growth in the new inoculated jars. :smile:
Thank you for now my friend :smile:


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: atricoz]
    #16361946 - 06/10/12 06:30 PM (2 years, 2 months ago)

No problem, it's fascinating how many different things you can isolate out of one morel fruitbody. Let's see how the #4 jars turn out. I wouldn't be surprised about different sclerotia.

Carsten


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: Mycelio]
    #16361983 - 06/10/12 06:40 PM (2 years, 2 months ago)

how big do these sclerotia get till they can be used to grow some mushrooms?


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Re: Morel mycelium comparison [Re: madadi]
    #16365555 - 06/11/12 02:08 PM (2 years, 2 months ago)

Oh... from pea to golfball size I guess (they often fuse), depending on strain, substrate and conditions. Then what counts is the combined mass of sclerotia plus your luck with fruiting. So far nobody succeeded here.

Carsten


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