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InvisibleHerbBaker
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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: Leon Ferrum]
    #16142042 - 04/26/12 01:18 PM (2 years, 5 months ago)

haha. typical response.

Just gloss over my helpful suggestion and then make a generalization. Way to go! Now take your blinders off.


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OfflineLeon Ferrum
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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: HerbBaker]
    #16142061 - 04/26/12 01:23 PM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Watching some hippie documentary would not be helpful to me.

I have asked you to back up two statements that you made.  One was that genes from GMOs "jump species," and one that said that GMOs are acutely toxic.    You have failed to provide any evidence that you did not make them up.


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Invisiblepassifloracaerulea
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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: Leon Ferrum]
    #16142352 - 04/26/12 02:38 PM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Scientists Discover New Route for GM-gene 'Escape'
Genetically modified genes can jump species via wounds, yes horizontal gene transfer happens, and at high frequencies; it is the greatest, most underestimated hazard from GMOs released into the environment Dr. Mae-Wan Ho

Please circulate widely and forward to your elected representatives

Gene “escape” a misnomer for horizontal gene transfer
Scientists at Bristol University in the UK announced the discovery of [1] “a previously unknown route” whereby “GM genes may escape into the natural environment.”  “Escape” is a misnomer. There is no need for the GM (genetically modified) genes to “escape”, when genetically modified organisms (GMOs) have been released in great abundance and with gay abandon into the environment over the past 17 years. At issue is how fast and how widely the GM genes can spread, and what dire consequences could arise.

The “escape” referred to is horizontal gene transfer – the spread of GM genes by infection and multiplication (literally like a virus) regardless of species barriers; hence the rate of spread is much more rapid, and the extent virtually unlimited.  New combinations of genetic material are created at unprecedented speed; affecting species the most that reproduce the fastest, i.e., bacteria and viruses that cause diseases. Horizontal gene transfer and recombination is indeed a main route for generating new strains of bacteria and viruses that cause diseases. Genetic modification and release of GMOs into the environment is nothing if not greatly facilitated horizontal gene transfer and recombination. It has created highways for gene trafficking in place of narrow by-ways and occasional footpaths that previously existed.

Some of us have long considered horizontal gene transfer to be the most serious hidden and underestimated hazard of genetic engineering, and have alerted regulators accordingly, time and again, since GMOs were first released (see for example [3, 4] (Gene Technology and Gene Ecology of Infectious Diseases, ISIS scientific publication; Genetic Engineering Dream or Nightmare, ISIS publication). The recent “emergency” warning sent by a senior US Department of Agriculture scientist to US Secretary of Agriculture on a suspected pathogen “new to science” associated with GM crops may prove to be a case in point [5] (Emergency! Pathogen New to Science Found in Roundup Ready GM Crops? SiS 50).

Plant wounds hotspots for gene trafficking
The researchers at Bristol University showed that plant wounds, that could be created by insect bites, abrasion and other mechanical damage, are hotspots for gene trafficking due to the wound hormones produced by the plant. Under such circumstances, the soil bacterium Agrobacterium tumefaciens, which causes crown gall disease in plants, could enlarge its host range to infect fungi, and insert foreign genes into the fungi’s genome [2]. This has large implications on the safety of GMOs already widely released into the environment.

A. tumefaciens is probably unique among natural plant pathogens in carrying out trans-Kingdom horizontal gene transfer during an infection, and it is this ability that has been widely exploited for creating GM crops, grown on an estimated 134 million hectares worldwide in 2009, and “jumped’ another 10 percent in 2010, according to industry-funded International Service for the Acquisition of Agri-biotech Applications (ISAAA) [6].

Research commissioned by the UK Department of the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (DEFRA) in the 1990s had already revealed that it is very difficult, if not impossible to get rid of the Agrobacterium vector used in creating the transgenic plant [7], and the bacterium is likely to remain dormant even after the transgenic plants are transplanted into the soil. Hence, it is expected to facilitate horizontal gene transfer, in the first instance, to wild-type Agrobacterium in the soil, and further afield.

Disease-causing strains of A. tumefaciens have an extrachromosomal Ti (tumour-inducing) plasmid that enables the horizontal transfer of a segment of the Ti plasmid, the T-DNA, into the plant cell genome when the bacterium’s virulence (disease causing) system is activated by hormones produced by the wounded plant. This feature is exploited in creating genetically modified organisms (GMOs), by disarming the bacterium, and incorporating the virulence genes in a ‘binary’ vector that has to be used in conjunction with the disarmed Agrobacterium strain.

In the 1990s, it was shown that the range of organisms transformed by Agrobacterium could be extended if the wound hormone acetosyringone was used to induce the virulence system.

The researchers at Bristol University reasoned that as A. tumefaciens is a soil-dwelling pathogen that often infects plants through wounds, it is conceivable that the bacterium could encounter numerous species of microorganisms, including pathogenic fungi that the same method to gain entry into the plant. The wound sites are likely to be exuding wound hormones such as acetosyringone, so the bacteria are primed for T-DNA transfer.

Experiments confirmed their suspicion in full
They carried out their investigation using the wilt-causing fungus Verticillium albo-atrum, a strong candidate for encounters with Agrobacterium in the plant, as it has a similar wide host range in plants, infecting both root and crown. Previous lab experiments have shown that V. albo-atrum cannot be transformed by Agrobacterium in the absence of acetosyringone. So, if it is presented with Agrobacterium on plant tissue, and transformation does occur, it must be the plant that supplies the wound hormone.

Peeled and sliced potato tubers and carrots, leave- and stem-sections from tobacco plants were used as the plant tissues for testing. After sterilization, they were inoculated with both A. tumefaciens and V. albo-atrum and left at room temperature in a covered agar dish for a minimum of 8 days and a maximum of 42 days.

Successful transformants of V. albo-atrum were obtained from every kind of plant tissue. 2 out of 17 potato slices, 1 out of 15 carrot slices; 14 out of 42 dishes each with 3-5 leaf pieces, and 10 out of 31 stem sections (without agar plate, so as to be as close to the natural condition as possible). These transformants were confirmed with molecular genetic analyses.

Implications on risk assessments of GMOs still understated
The researchers concluded [2]: “This work therefore raises interesting questions about whether the host range of A. tumefaciens in nature is greater than just plants. It is possible that evidence of such events could be looked for retrospectively in the increasing number of genome sequences becoming available....

“In addition, the result may well have implications for the risk assessment of GM plants generated via Agrobacterium-mediated transformation, as Agrobacterium can survive within plant tissue through transformation and tissue culture and can therefore be found within regenerated transgenic plants...”

This is an understatement of a serious risk that has been known almost since the first release of Agrobacterium-transformed GMOs into the environment.

The risks are far greater than admitted
We have repeatedly drawn attention to the possibility of facilitated horizontal gene transfer from GMOs created with Agrobacterium vector, which is even stronger than originally envisaged due to other discoveries made since then. I reproduce what we wrote in 2008 [8] (Horizontal Gene Transfer from GMOs Does Happen, SiS 38), which repeats an earlier account [9] (Living with the Fluid Genome , ISIS publication) (see Box).

Agrobacterium vector a vehicle for facilitated horizontal gene transfer [8, 9]
“We have ..provided evidence strongly suggesting that the most common method of creating transgenic plants may also serve as a ready route for horizontal gene transfer [9, 10].

“Agrobacterium tumefaciens, the soil bacterium that causes crown gall disease, has been developed as a major gene transfer vector for making transgenic plants. Foreign genes are typically spliced into the T-DNA - part of a plasmid of A. tumefaciens called Ti (tumour-inducing) – which ends up integrated into the genome of the plant cell that subsequently develops into a tumour.

“But further investigations revealed that the process whereby Agrobacterium injects T-DNA into plant cells strongly resembles conjugation, the mating process between bacterial cells.

Conjugation, mediated by certain bacterial plasmids requires a sequence called the origin of transfer (oriT) on the DNA that’s transferred. All the other functions can be supplied from unlinked sources, referred to as ‘trans-acting functions’ (or tra). Thus, ‘disabled’ plasmids, with no trans-acting functions, can nevertheless be transferred by ‘helper’ plasmids that carry genes coding for the trans-acting functions. And that’s the basis of a complicated vector system devised, involving Agrobacterium T-DNA, which has been used for creating numerous transgenic plants.

“It soon transpired that the left and right borders of the T-DNA are similar to oriT, and can be replaced by it. Furthermore, the disarmed T-DNA, lacking the trans-acting functions (virulence genes that contribute to disease), can be helped by similar genes belonging to many other pathogenic bacteria. It seems that the trans-kingdom gene transfer of Agrobacterium and the conjugative systems of bacteria are both involved in transporting macromolecules, not just DNA but also protein.

“That means transgenic plants created by the T-DNA vector system have a ready route for horizontal gene escape, via Agrobacterium, helped by the ordinary conjugative mechanisms of many other bacteria that cause diseases, which are present in the environment.

“In fact, the possibility that Agrobacterium can serve as a vehicle for horizontal gene escape was first raised in 1997 in a study sponsored by the UK Government [7, 12], which found it extremely difficult to get rid of the Agrobacterium in the vector system after transformation. Treatment with an armoury of antibiotics and repeated subculture of the transgenic plants over 13 months failed to get rid of the bacterium. Furthermore, 12.5 percent of the Agrobacterium remaining still contained the binary vector (T-DNA and helper plasmid), and were hence fully capable of transforming other plants.

“Agrobacterium not only transfers genes into plant cells; there is possibility for retrotransfer of DNA from the plant cell to Agrobacterium [13]. High rates of gene transfer are associated with the plant root system and the germinating seed, where conjugation is most likely [14]. There, Agrobacterium could multiply and transfer transgenic DNA to other bacteria, as well as to the next crop to be planted. These possibilities have yet to be investigated empirically.

“Finally, Agrobacterium attaches to and genetically transforms several human cell lines [15, 16] (Common plant vector injects genes into human cells ISIS News 11/12). In stably transformed HeLa cells (a human cell line derived originally from a cancer patient), the integration of T-DNA occurred at the right border, exactly as would happen when it is transferred into a plant cell genome. This suggests that Agrobacterium transforms human cells by a mechanism similar to that which it uses for transforming plants cells.

“The possibility that Agrobacterium is a vehicle for horizontal transfer of transgenic DNA remains unresolved to this day.”


Agrobacterium transfers genes into human cells
It is also worth reiterating our comment on the scientific paper [15] documenting that Agrobacterium can transfer genes into human cells [16].

“The paper shows that human cancer cells along with neurons and kidney cells were transformed with the Agrobacterium T-DNA. Such observations should raise alarm for those who use Agrobacterium in the laboratory.

“The integrated T-DNA will almost certainly act as a mutagen as it integrates into human chromosomes. Cancer can be triggered by activation of oncogenes (ie, cancer genes) or inactivation of cancer-suppressing genes. Furthermore, the sequences carried within the T-DNA in the transforming bacterium can be expressed in the transformed cells (the viral promoter CaMV has been found to be active in HeLa cells [17]) ….

“It is clear that little has been done to prevent environmental escape of the transforming bacteria or to quantify such releases. In conclusion, a study of cancer incidence among those exposed to Agrobacterium tumefaciens in the laboratory and in the field is needed. It would be worthwhile to screen workers for T-DNA sequences.”

To conclude
The discovery by the Bristol University researchers barely scratches the surface of the hidden hazards of GMOs from horizontal gene transfer. It is high time for a global ban to be imposed on further environmental releases of GMOs, and all those responsible for releasing them should be brought to book.

References
1. “Hazards of GMOS: Agrobacterium mediated transformation”http://www.bristol.ac.uk/news/2010/7279.html

2. Knight CJ, Bailey AM, Foster GD. Investigating Agrobacterium-mediated transformation of Verticillium albo-atrum on plant surfaces. PLOS ONE 2010, 5(10): e13684. Doi:10.1371/journal.pone.0013684

3. Ho MW. Gene technology and gene ecology of infectious diseases. Microbial Ecology in Health and Disease 1998, 10, 33-59.

4. Ho MW. Genetic Engineering Dream of Nightmare? The Brave New World of Bad Science and Big Business, Third World Network, Gateway Books, MacMillan, Continuum, Penang, Malaysia, Bath, UK, Dublin, Ireland, New York, USA, 1998, 1999, 2007 (reprint with extended Introduction). http://www.i-sis.org.uk/genet.php

5. Ho MW. Emergency! Pathogen new to science found in Roundup Ready GM crops? Science in Society 50 (to appear).

6. Global Status of Commercialized Biotech/GM Crops, 2009, ISAAA, http://www.isaaa.org/

7. Mc Nicol MJ, Lyon GD, Chen MY, Barrett C and Cobb E. Scottish Crop Research Institute. Contract No RG 0202.The Possibility of Agrobacterium as a Vehicle for Gene Escape. MAFF. R&D and Surveillance Report: 395.

8. Ho MW and Cummins J. Horizontal gene transfer from GMOs does happen. Science in Society 38, 22-24, 2008

9. Ho MW. Living with the Fluid Genome, ISIS/TWN, London/Penanag, 2003. http://www.i-sis.org.uk/fluidGenome.php

10. Ferguson G and Heinemann J. Recent history of trans-kingdom conjugation . In Horizontal Gene Transfer 2nd ed., Syvanen M and Kado CI. (eds.) Academic Press, San Diego, 2002.

11. Ho MW. Horizontal gene transfer, book review. Heredity 2003, 90, 6-7.

12. Barrett C, Cobb E, MacNicol R and Lyon G. A risk assessment study of plant genetic transformation using Agrobacterium and implication for analysis of transgenic plants.Plant Cell Tissue and Organ Culture 1997, 19,135-144.

13. Kado C. in Horizontal Gene Transfer 2nd ed., Syvanen M and Kado CI. (eds.) Academic Press, San Diego, 2002.

14. Sengelov G, Kristensen KJ, Sorensen AH, Kroer N, and Sorensen SJ. Effect of genomic location on horizontal transfer of a recombinant gene cassette between Pseudomonas strains in the rhizosphere and spermosphere of barley seedlings. Current Microbiology 2001, 42, 160-7.

15. Kunik T, Tzfira T, Kapulnik Y, Gafni Y, Dingwall C, and Citovsky V. Genetic transformation of HeLa cells by Agrobacterium. PNAS USA, 2001, 98, 1871-87.

16. Cummins J.  “Common plant vector injects genes into human cells.  ISIS News 2002, 11/12, p. 10.

17. Ho MW, Ryan A and Cummins J. CaMV 35S promoter fragmentation hotspot confirmed and it is active in animals. Microbial Ecology in Health and Disease, 2000, 12, 189.


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Invisiblepassifloracaerulea
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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: passifloracaerulea]
    #16142488 - 04/26/12 03:17 PM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Soy allergies jumped 50% in the U.K. just after GM soy was introduced.2 If GM soy was the cause, it may be due to several things. The GM protein that makes Roundup Ready Soy resistant to the herbicide does not have a history of safe use in humans and may be an allergen. In fact, sections of its amino acid sequence are identical to known allergens.3

A portion of the transgene from ingested GM soybeans, along with the promoter that switches it on, transfers into human gut bacteria during ingestion.4 The fact that the transformed bacteria survives applications of Roundup’s active ingredient, glyphosate, suggests that the transgene continues to produce the Roundup Ready protein. If true, then long after people stop eating GM soy they may be constantly exposed to its potentially allergenic protein, which is being created within their gut. (This protein may be made more allergenic due to misfolding, attached molecular chains, or rearrangement of unstable transgenes, but there is insufficient data to support or rule out these possibilities.1)

Studies suggest that the GM transformation process may have increased natural allergens in soybeans. The level of one known allergen, trypsin inhibitor, was 27% higher in raw GM soy varieties. More worrisome, it was as much as sevenfold higher in cooked GM soy compared to cooked non-GM soy.5 Not only is this higher amount potentially harmful, the finding also suggests that the trypsin inhibitor in GM soy might be more heat stable and, therefore, even more allergenic than the natural variety.6

It is also possible that changes in GM soy DNA may produce new allergens. Although there has never been an exhaustive analysis of the proteins or natural products in GM soy, unpredicted changes in the DNA were discovered. A mutated section of soy DNA was found near the transgene, which may contribute to some unpredicted effects. Moreover, between this scrambled DNA and the transgene is an extra transgene fragment, not discovered until years after soy was on the market.7 The RNA produced is completely unexpected. It combines material from all three sections: the full-length transgene, the transgene fragment, and the mutated DNA sequence. This RNA is then further processed into four different variations,8 which might lead to the production of some unknown allergen.

Another study verified that GM soybeans contain an IgE-binding allergenic protein not found in nonGM soy controls, and that one of eight subjects who showed a skin-prick allergic reaction to GM soy had no reaction to nonGM soy.9 Although the sample size is small, the implication that certain people react only to GM soy is huge.

The increased residue of Roundup herbicide in GM soy might contribute to increased allergies.10 In fact, the symptoms identified in the U.K. soy allergy study are among those related to glyphosate exposure. The allergy study identified irritable bowel syndrome, digestion problems, chronic fatigue, headaches, lethargy, and skin complaints including acne and eczema.2

Symptoms of glyphosate exposure include nausea, headaches, lethargy, skin rashes, and burning or itchy skin.11 It is also possible that glyphosate’s breakdown product, AMPA, which accumulates in GM soybeans,12,13 might contribute to allergies.

Finally, mice fed GM soy had reduced levels of pancreatic enzymes.14,15 When protein-digesting enzymes are suppressed, proteins may last longer in the gut, allowing more time for an allergic reaction to take place. Any reduction in protein digestion could therefore promote allergic reactions to a wide range of proteins, not just to the GM soy.

Bt Toxin Triggers Immune Response

Bt toxin is consistently associated with immune and allergic-type responses. Although the unpredicted consequences of the GM transformation process might also contribute to allergic reactions from Bt crops, evidence suggests that the Bt toxin itself is a major factor. The Bt proteins found in most currently registered Bt-corn varieties would not pass the allergy test protocol described in the 2001 FAO/WHO report,16 because they have amino acid sections identical with known allergens17 and are too stable in simulated digestive solutions.18,19

Furthermore, immune responses are triggered by both the natural Bt toxin in spray form and Bt crops. The concentration of Bt toxin in crops, however, can be thousands of times higher than in sprays;20 and changes in its protein structure make the crop version more likely to provoke reactions in humans.21,22

Additional evidence:

• When populations were exposed to Bt spray, hundreds complained of allergic reactions; exposed farm workers also exhibited antibody responses.23–27

• Indian farm workers exposed to Bt cotton developed moderate or severe allergic reactions.28

• Bt toxin fed to mice induced a significant immune response and an increased reactivity to other substances.29-31

• Male rats fed MON 863 Bt corn had a significant increase in three types of blood cells related to the immune system: basophils, lymphocytes, and total white cell counts.32

• Thousands of consumers complained to food manufacturers about possible reactions to StarLink corn,33 and an expert panel determined that its Bt protein had a “medium likelihood” of being a human allergen.34

The consistency between the reactions related to Bt sprays and those reported by Bt-cotton workers is astounding. The Bt spray was associated with sneezing, runny nose, watery eyes, skin inflammation and irritation, rashes, itching and burning, swelling, red skin and eyes, exacerbations of asthma, facial swelling, and fever. Some people required hospitalization.23,24 Bt-cotton workers in India reported sneezing, runny nose, watery eyes, skin eruptions, itching and burning, red skin and eyes, facial swelling, and fever. Some people required hospitalization.28 The two lists are nearly identical—only “exacerbations of asthma” was on the spray list and not the other.

Asthma and breathing difficulties were reported by Filipinos who inhaled Bt-corn pollen.35 They also described swollen faces, flu-like symptoms, fever, and sneezing. Some individuals in both India and the Philippines also reported long-term effects after exposure. The list of symptoms in the Philippines, however, did contain items not reported by the other two groups. These included coughs, headache, stomachache, dizziness, diarrhea, vomiting, weakness, and numbness.36

Toxicity and Reproductive Problems

In addition, there is substantial evidence of toxicity and reproductive effects associated with GM foods. Sheep that grazed on Bt-cotton plants in India, for example, exhibited nasal discharge, reddish and erosive mouth lesions, cough, bloat, diarrhea, and occasional red-colored urine. Shepherds report that 25% of their herds died within 5–7 days. Post mortems on some of the estimated 10,000 dead sheep in the region indicated toxic reactions.37 Rats fed Bt corn showed toxicity in their livers and kidneys.38 And farmers link Bt corn with deaths among cows,39 water buffalo, horses, and chickens,36 as well as sterility in thousands of pigs or cows.1 Animal feeding studies with Roundup Ready soy indicated toxic livers,40 altered sperm cells,41 significant changes in embryo development,42 and a fivefold increase in infant mortality, among others.43

Our understanding of DNA has progressed rapidly since genetic engineering was applied to food crops, and many key safety assumptions have been proven wrong. Perhaps some day scientists will be able to safely and predictably alter food crops for the benefit of mankind and the environment.

Until then, it is not responsible to risk the health of the entire population with this infant science or to release these crops into the ecosystem where they may self-propagate for generations. An immediate ban of GM foods and crops is more than justified.

Notes

1. Smith, J.M. Genetic Roulette: The Documented Health Risks of Genetically Engineered Foods (Yes! Books, Fairfield, IA, 2007).

2. Townsend, M. Why soya is a hidden destroyer. Daily Express, Mar 12, 1999.

3. Kleter, G.A. & Peijnenburg, A.A.C.M. Screening of transgenic proteins expressed in transgenic food crops for the presence of short amino acid sequences identical to potential, IgE-binding linear epitopes of allergens. BMC Struct. Biol. 2 (2002): 8–19.

4. Netherwood et al. Assessing the survival of transgenic plant DNA in the human gastrointestinal tract. Nature Biotech. 22 (2004): 2.

5. Padgette, S.R. et al. The composition of glyphosate-tolerant soybean seeds is equivalent to that of conventional soybeans. J. of Nutrition 126, no. 4 (1996).

6. Pusztai, A. & Bardocz, S. GMO in animal nutrition:

potential benefits and risks. Ch. 17, Biology of Nutrition in Growing Animals (Elsevier, 2005).

7. Windels, P. et al. Characterisation of the roundup ready soybean insert. Eur. Food Res. Technol. 213 (2001): 107–112.

8. Rang, A. et al. Detection of RNA variants transcribed from the transgene in roundup ready soybean. Eur. Food Res. Technol. 220 (2005): 438–443.

9. Yum, H. et al. Genetically modified and wild soybeans: an immunologic comparison. Allergy and Asthma Proceedings 26, no. 3 (May–Jun 2005): 210–216.

10. Benbrook, C. Genetically engineered crops and pesticide use in the United States: The First Nine Years. October 2004.

11. Cox, C. Herbicide fact sheet: glyphosate. J. of Pest. Reform 24, no. 4 (Winter 2004).

12. Duke, S.O. et al. Isoflavone, Glyphosate and aminomethylphosphonic acid levels in seeds of glyphosate-treated, glyphosateresistant soybean. J. Agric. Food Chem. 51 (2003): 340–344.

13. Sandermann, H. Plant biotechnology: ecological case studies on herbicide resistance. Trends in Plant Sci. 11, no. 7 (Jul 2006): 324–328.

14. Malatesta, M. et al. Ultrastructural analysis of pancreatic acinar cells from mice fed on genetically modified

soybean. J. of Anat. 201, no. 5 (Nov 2002): 409.

15. Malatesta, M. et al. Fine structural analyses of pancreatic acinar cell nuclei from mice fed on GM soybean.

Eur. J. Histochem. 47 (2003): 385–388.

16. FAO/WHO. “Evaluation of allergenicity of genetically modified foods.” (FAO/WHO, Jan 22–25, 2001).

17. Gendel. The use of amino acid sequence alignments to assess potential allergenicity of proteins used in genetically modified foods. Advan. in Food and Nutrition Research 42 (1998): 45–62.

18. Noteborn, H.P.J.M. Assessment of the stability to digestion and bioavailability of the LYS mutant Cry9C protein from Bacillus thuringiensis serovar tolworthi. Unpublished study to EPA (AgrEvo, EPA MRID No. 447343-05, 1998).

19. Engel, K. et al. Genetically modified foods: safety

issues. American Chemical Society Symposium Series 605 (Washington DC, 1995): 134–47.

20. Mendelsohn, M. et al. Are Bt crops safe? Nature Biotech. 21, no. 9 (2003): 1003–1009.

21. Dutton, A. et al. Uptake of Bt-toxin by herbivores feeding on transgenic maize and consequences for the predator Chrysoperia carnea. Ecol. Entomology 27 (2002): 441–7.

22. Romeis, J., Dutton, A., & Bigler, F. Bacillus thuringiensis toxin (Cry1Ab) has no direct effect on larvae of the green lacewing Chrysoperla carnea (Stephens) (Neuroptera: Chrysopidae). J. of Insect Phys. 50, no. 2–3 (2004): 175–183.

23. Washington State Dept. of Health. “Report of health

surveillance activities: asian gypsy moth control program (Washington State Dept. of Health, Olympia, WA, 1993).

24. Green, M. et al. Public health implications of the microbial pesticide Bacillus thuringiensis: an epidemiological study, Oregon, 1985–86. Amer. J. Public Health 80, no. 7 (1990): 848–852.

25. Noble, M.A., Riben, P.D., & Cook, G.J. Microbiological and epidemiological surveillance program to monitor the health effects of Foray 48B BTK spray (Ministry of Forests, Vancouver, B.C., Sept 30, 1992).

26. Swadener, C. Bacillus thuringiensis. J. of Pest. Reform 14, no. 3 (Fall 1994).

27. Samples, J.R. & Buettner, H. Ocular infection caused by a biological insecticide. J. Infectious Dis. 148, no. 3 (1983): 614.

28. Gupta, A. et al. “Impact of Bt cotton on farmers’ health (in Barwani and Dhar district of Madhya Pradesh)”

(Investigation Report, Oct–Dec 2005).

29. Vazquez et al. Intragastric and Intraperitoneal Administration of Cry1Ac protoxin from Bacillus thuringiensis induces systemic and mucosal antibody responses in mice. Life Sci. 64, no. 21 (1999): 1897–1912.

30. Vazquez et al. Characterization of the mucosal and

systemic immune response induced by Cry1Ac protein from Bacillus thuringiensis HD 73 in mice. Brazilian J. of Med. and Biol. Research 33 (2000): 147–155.

31. Vazquez et al. Bacillus thuringiensis Cry1Ac protoxin is a potent systemic and mucosal adjuvant. Scandanavian J. of Immunology 49 (1999): 578–584.

32. Burns, J.M. 13-week dietary subchronic comparison study with MON 863 corn in rats preceded by a 1-week baseline food consumption determination with PMI certified rodent diet #5002. (Monsanto Co. report, Dec 17, 2002).

33. Freese, B. The StarLink affair. Submission by Friends of the Earth to the FIFRA scientific advisory panel considering assessment of additional scientific information concerning StarLink corn (Jul 17–19, 2001).

34. Assessment of additional scientific information concerning StarLink corn (FIFRA scientific advisory panel report, No. 2001–09, Jul 2001).

35. Smith, J.M. Bt-maize (corn) during pollination, may

trigger disease in people living near the cornfield (Press release, Feb 2004).

36. Ho, M. GM ban long overdue, dozens ill & five deaths in the Philippines (ISIS press release, Jun 2, 2006).

37. Mortality in sheep flocks after grazing on Bt cotton fields—Warangal district (Andhra Pradesh report of the preliminary assessment, Apr 2006).

38. Seralini, G., Cellier, D., & Spiroux de Vendomois, J. New analysis of a rat feeding study with a genetically modified maize reveals signs of hepatorenal toxicity. J. archives of Env. Contam. and Toxicology (Springer, New York).

39. Strodthoff, H. & Then, C. Is GM maize responsible for deaths of cows in Hesse? Greenpeace e.V. 22745

(Greenpeace, Hamburg, Germany, Dec 2003).

40. Malatesta, M. et al. Ultrastructural morphometrical and immunocytochemical analyses of hepatocyte nuclei from mice fed on genetically modified soybean. Cell Struct. Funct. 27 (2002): 173–180.

41. Vecchio, L. et al. Ultrastructural analysis of testes

from mice fed on genetically modified soybean.

Eur. J. of Histochem. 48, no. 4 (Oct–Dec 2004):449–454.

42. Oliveri et al. Temporary depression of transcription in mouse pre-implantion embryos from mice fed on genetically modified soybean. (48th Symposium of the Society for Histochemistry, Lake Maggiore, Italy, Sept 7–10, 2006).

43. Ermakova, I. Genetically modified soy leads to the decrease of weight and high mortality of rat pups of the first generation. Preliminary studies. Ecosinform 1 (2006): 4–9.


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: Leon Ferrum]
    #16142606 - 04/26/12 03:53 PM (2 years, 5 months ago)

You know how to read, right? haha


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: HerbBaker]
    #16143325 - 04/26/12 06:57 PM (2 years, 5 months ago)



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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: Constantine]
    #16143893 - 04/26/12 09:00 PM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Evaluation of the safety of genetically modified (GM) crops seems to be hampered by the unwillingness of regulators recognize and to evaluate the impact of genetic effects that are outside simplistic models of genes and their behavior. It has been presumed that the organism destroys food genes during digestion and excretion. However, studies on DNA immunization showed that DNA could be delivered to the immune system through oral uptake. A few daring German researchers have also explored the fate of orally ingested genetic material. The papers below show that ingested DNA is not only circulated through the animal body but may be associated with nucleus and chromosomes.

The first paper "The fate of forage DNA in farm animals" by Einspanier et al (2001), studies ingestion of maize DNA and of GM maize DNA, while the second is an earlier study "On the fate of foreign DNA in mice" by Shubbert et al (1998) that showed that ingested DNA from a bacterial virus or from a plasmid transgene is incorporated in chromosomes and is passed from mother to fetus. The authors of the study ask "is maternally ingested foreign DNA a potential mutagen for developing fetus?" If food DNA sequences are randomly incorporated into coding sequences including introns, exons or promoters they will certainly act as mutagens.





If DNA is destroyed on the skin by nucleases, I'm pretty sure the bulk of ingested DNA is destroyed by nucleases as well. If this is true, then the genes of everything you eat would show up in your bloodstream.

That thing with BioAcoustics is bullshit by the way. BioAcoustics is generally used on the macroscopic scale to detect biomass. It can also refer to animal sounds like bird calls. Sound waves are not small nor precise enough to detect properties of proteins.

I don't see how this can be such a big argument. Again, it's fine to be opposed to Monsanto and monopolistic biotech firms, but the entire technology of GM is a godsend to science. There needs to be safeguards -- obviously proteins incorporated into certain foods should be monitored and subject to immunoassay procedures, but I would rather eat approved GMO food than that organic bullshit you're all wasting money on.


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: aperson444]
    #16144894 - 04/27/12 12:27 AM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Just like nuclear power is a godsend until you live next to Chernobyl. or we all kill ourselves through nuclear war.

Heaven's blessings are pouring down. Just accept the goodness that is, and go back to sleep.


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: passifloracaerulea]
    #16145592 - 04/27/12 03:59 AM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

passifloracaerulea said:
Soy allergies jumped 50% in the U.K. just after GM soy was introduced.
2




Interesting that the first time you finally cite a statistic indicating that the general public has experienced any sort of health problems related to GM food, it comes from a tabloid.

Found a text version of the article on an anti-soy site.  The study that demonstrated the jump was done in 1999 by York Nutritional Laboratory, a company which sells do-it-yourself allergen tests and consultations with "Nutritional Therapists".  So, to sum up: your statistic come from an non-reputable source that cites a non-reputable source.

Not to mention that that was the first year in 17 that soy had caused those many reactions, despite the fact that GM soy had been widespread in British food long before 1999.  Random variation much?

Quote:

If GM soy was the cause, it may be due to several things. The GM protein that makes Roundup Ready Soy resistant to the herbicide does not have a history of safe use in humans




Yes, it does.  Aren't we eating it right now?  Haven't we been eating it for years?  Where is the evidence of unsafe effects?

Quote:

and may be an allergen. In fact, sections of its amino acid sequence are identical to known allergens.3




That's like saying that mescaline and MDMA will have similar effects simply because they share a common chemical backbone.  It simply isn't true.

Quote:

A portion of the transgene from ingested GM soybeans, along with the promoter that switches it on, transfers into human gut bacteria during ingestion.4




Bacteria have been absorbing DNA from other organisms for literally billions of years.  Completely expected.

Quote:

The fact that the transformed bacteria survives applications of Roundup’s active ingredient, glyphosate, suggests that the transgene continues to produce the Roundup Ready protein. If true, then long after people stop eating GM soy they may be constantly exposed to its potentially allergenic protein, which is being created within their gut.




Or, who knows, the bacteria may only produce the protein in response to the presence of glyphosate.  Do you continue to have a runny nose for weeks after you beat off a cold?  At any rate, speculation is just speculation, not science.

Quote:

(This protein may be made more allergenic due to misfolding, attached molecular chains, or rearrangement of unstable transgenes, but there is insufficient data to support or rule out these possibilities.1)




Same points as before.

Quote:

Studies suggest that the GM transformation process may have increased natural allergens in soybeans. The level of one known allergen, trypsin inhibitor, was 27% higher in raw GM soy varieties. More worrisome, it was as much as sevenfold higher in cooked GM soy compared to cooked non-GM soy.5




Jesus, did you even notice the name of the study cited here?

Quote:

Padgette, S.R. et al. The composition of glyphosate-tolerant soybean seeds is equivalent to that of conventional soybeans. J. of Nutrition 126, no. 4 (1996).




:facepalm:

Anyway, on to the conclusion of the piece:

Quote:

It is typical for the measured levels of all nutrients and
antinutrients in crops to vary depending on the environmental
conditions, cultivar grown, and method used (39, 40). Because
the GTS and conventional soybean seed were not matched for
genetic backgrounds and were not grown at the same field site,conditions, the variation observed for the isoflavone values of
GTS and conventional soybeans was expected.

The comparative safety assessment process of a food or feed
derived from biotechnology crops is based upon the concept
that there is a “reasonable certainty of no harm” from its
intended use. This process compares the phenotypic characteristics and composition of the biotechnology-derived crop to that
of conventional crops with a known history of safe use. Previous
studies have shown that the composition of GTS is substantially
equivalent to that of conventional soybeans in previous studies.
The results of this study further indicate that the composition
of commercialized GTS over three years of breeding into
multiple genetic backgrounds remains substantially equivalent
to that of conventional soybeans.




Oh, gee, soybeans can differ from one field or one year to another, and the variation they found was perfectly normal.  Well, let's look at the results from trypsin in particular.  Maybe that protein was the exception to the conclusion:

Quote:

The trypsin inhibitor content across all three years ranged
from 23.7 to 90.6 trypsin inhibitor unit (TIU)/mg dw for GTS
seed and 27.9-75.5 TIU/mg dw for conventional soybean seed
with a SE ranging from 1.8 to 3.4. The trypsin inhibitor values
for the GTS and conventional soybean seed are also within or
similar to the range reported in the literature (33.2-54.5 TIU/
mg dw) (15) and ILSI Crop C




Oh, no.  No, it wasn't.

Quote:

Not only is this higher amount potentially harmful, the finding also suggests that the trypsin inhibitor in GM soy might be more heat stable and, therefore, even more allergenic than the natural variety.6




Well, the previous study makes this irrelevant now, doesn't it?

Quote:

It is also possible that changes in GM soy DNA may produce new allergens. Although there has never been an exhaustive analysis of the proteins or natural products in GM soy, unpredicted changes in the DNA were discovered. A mutated section of soy DNA was found near the transgene, which may contribute to some unpredicted effects. Moreover, between this scrambled DNA and the transgene is an extra transgene fragment, not discovered until years after soy was on the market.7 The RNA produced is completely unexpected. It combines material from all three sections: the full-length transgene, the transgene fragment, and the mutated DNA sequence. This RNA is then further processed into four different variations,8 which might lead to the production of some unknown allergen.




More speculation that something could happen that might possibly cause a bad things.  I am unmoved.  Bring me evidence it actually happened, and we'll talk.

Quote:

Another study verified that GM soybeans contain an IgE-binding allergenic protein not found in nonGM soy controls, and that one of eight subjects who showed a skin-prick allergic reaction to GM soy had no reaction to nonGM soy.9 Although the sample size is small, the implication that certain people react only to GM soy is huge.




Quote:

Although the sample size is small




Eight subjects?  Eight?

Quote:

The increased residue of Roundup herbicide in GM soy might contribute to increased allergies.10




Oh shit, That thing I brought up but you never mentioned that completely destroys your argument shows up again!


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: sonamdrukpa] * 1
    #16145612 - 04/27/12 04:09 AM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

In fact, the symptoms identified in the U.K. soy allergy study are among those related to glyphosate exposure. The allergy study identified irritable bowel syndrome, digestion problems, chronic fatigue, headaches, lethargy, and skin complaints including acne and eczema.2




Back to the sketchy allergy study again.  Only now...they're talking about a combination of vague, wishy-washy problems like "digestion problems" and things that can have multiple causes, like acne and "chronic fatigue."  Hold on, chronic fatigue?

Quote:

Mr. Graham said researchers tested 4,500 people for allergic reactions to vegetables including soya.




Was this an allergy test?  How did they determine chronic fatigue from an allergy test?  Allergy tests take at most a couple hours.  I call bullshit.

Quote:

Symptoms of glyphosate exposure include nausea, headaches, lethargy, skin rashes, and burning or itchy skin.11




But not irritable bowel syndrome, huh?  So if something is causing these completely ordinary symptoms + the runs in people, then...there's no reason to suspect glyphosate is the main cause.  If I have a runny nose, a sore throat, and am also shitting blood, you shouldn't suspect the flu.  You know what I suspect here?  Any positive correlation between soy consumption and these effects was not statistically significant.  Again, not that this matters, since any indictment of soy here only means people shouldn't be eating Roundup.

Quote:

It is also possible that glyphosate’s breakdown product, AMPA, which accumulates in GM soybeans,12,13 might contribute to allergies.




You know the old chestnut about making assumptions, right?

Quote:

Finally, mice fed GM soy had reduced levels of pancreatic enzymes.14,15 When protein-digesting enzymes are suppressed, proteins may last longer in the gut, allowing more time for an allergic reaction to take place. Any reduction in protein digestion could therefore promote allergic reactions to a wide range of proteins, not just to the GM soy.




Another study on non-human animals.  You know what, you can have this one, it's not worth my time researching it given what your other sources have turned out to be.  GM soy is like cyanide for mice.  There you go.


So, that Bt corn stuff all sounds legit.  Bt corn sounds pretty fucking shitty.  Even if it's not, after going through all this, I'm not doing more research.  You win on this one.

Why am I so complacent on the corn?  Because the strain of corn they're talking about was suspected to be dangerous, was only allowed to be used for animal feed, and, once it turned out some of it was slipping into human food supplies, it was eradicated and we haven't seen it in our food supply since 2004.  Here's a link, though I doubt you'll find it convincing given your government conspiracy theories.  That's fine, ignore the EPA results - but when was the last time you got sick after eating corn?  (And, if we still want to play the GM-soy-is-in-everything game, I want to point out that corn syrup is even more ubiquitous)

The moral of the story to me sounds like GM technology is actually safe and manageable.  Hell, GM food is safer than canteloupe - canteloupes killed 15 people last year due to listeria infections. Or should we play the speculate-and-fearmonger game for canteloupe as well?


Quote:

Until then, it is not responsible to risk the health of the entire population with this infant science or to release these crops into the ecosystem where they may self-propagate for generations. An immediate ban of GM foods and crops is more than justified.




After seeing the quality of your evidence, I respectfully disagree.


Edited by sonamdrukpa (04/27/12 04:14 AM)


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: sonamdrukpa]
    #16145745 - 04/27/12 05:32 AM (2 years, 5 months ago)

So, that Bt corn stuff all sounds legit.  Bt corn sounds pretty fucking shitty.  Even if it's not, after going through all this, I'm not doing more research.  You win on this one.

yeah, i think the bt corn has been the biggest issue regarding gmos anyway lately. look even further into it and watch a few documentaries(some are put out by farmers, not hippies.) if you have the spare time to kill.


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: sonamdrukpa]
    #16145749 - 04/27/12 05:34 AM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

sonamdrukpa said:


Quote:

Until then, it is not responsible to risk the health of the entire population with this infant science or to release these crops into the ecosystem where they may self-propagate for generations. An immediate ban of GM foods and crops is more than justified.




After seeing the quality of your evidence, I respectfully disagree.




How do you respectfully disagree?

Thing is, if all this GM stuff was being grown in airtight bio-containment labs or off-world/undersea greenhouses then that's fine, you could have all the GM food you want and knock yourself out.

But do you see the concerns I and others have in that pollen from GM crops can and will contaminate no GM life, and we don't want that?


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: Visionary Tools]
    #16145899 - 04/27/12 08:03 AM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Herbbaker- consider reading the articles you posted yourself.  First of all, an allergen is not a toxin.  Second, genes "may" undergo horizontal transfer through that path.  That is why they are studying it- to prevent such a process from occurring.  You have again failed to do any actual research.


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: Leon Ferrum]
    #16146183 - 04/27/12 10:44 AM (2 years, 5 months ago)

First, I have read the articles I posted, that's why I posted them.

Second, toxic substances are commonly allergenic.

Third, genes have been shown to transfer to bacteria inside the gut. There is no "may" about it.

Fourth, I fully realize that there are sites that are quite bias in their opinion. There are also people on the other side of the aisle that say there is nothing to worry about, let the market sort it out.

One side is fear mongering the other side is pandering to a status quo that breeds mediocre thought patterns.

Fifth, I like to try and keep my feet planted firmly in the middle. It's not an easy task. Yet, if it was easy everyone would be able to comprehend what I'm talking about and apply these ideas in a constructive way.


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: Leon Ferrum]
    #16146481 - 04/27/12 12:49 PM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Leon Ferrum said:
GM foods are the least of our worries here in the States in terms of an unhealthy diet.  GMOs might increase certain diseases after long term exposure.  So might and number of weird chemical ingredients in food including coloring and preservatives, various nutrition deficiencies or imbalances, pollution (in air, water, everything), and toxins.  GMOs are the least of your concern in terms of health.  I'm sure everyone here knows that they could be eating healthier but opt not to anyway.  Don't start blaming your future illness on Monsanto already.




According to the food pyramid, grains are supposed to be the majority of our diet, in reality, this is very true.
the very same grains that monsanto has genetically re-engineered that are in 90% of the food sold at any grocery store here in america. The offending proteins are listed as: w-5 gliadin (from wheat); g-3 hordein (from barley); and g secalins (from rye). Peer reviewed studies and scientific journals are being composed and compiled, those grains in question are under scrutiny in the USA and in other countries. they have been found to be disruptive to metabolic pathways, and as interfering with nearly all systems of the human body, generating inflammation and immune dysfunction. What the genetically engineered proteins do is disrupt inter-cellular communication: they prevent cells communicating with each other intelligently, as nature intended. The scrambling of this natural communication causes inflammation and disease.

This is from the July 21st, 201 edition of Science Translational Medicine.^^ (recent and relevant study pertaining to the issue at hand, i have yet to see anyone here arguing against these studies)

Its not like groups of farmer/scientists out their aren't talking about it or studying what we are talking about, they are, and the links that have been posted in the past 12 pages are not irrelevant. I appreciate your manners sonmadrukpa, i don't take offense to debate, though i will get heated about it at times, because unlike you, I'm dealing with this issue first hand in my family. My wife cant touch anything but gluten free breads, cereals, and grains. Even coming in contact with bread crumbs will cause a number of illnesses & auto-immune deficiency symptoms (its not just celiacs or some random allergy that permanently manifests itself) to rampantly spring forth out of her normally healthy condition.
She has enjoyed gluten laden cereal, pizza, and sandwich's all her life, until 2 years ago, when strange illnesses started occurring. Her family has no history of allergies and no previous auto-immune deficiencies. We went to multiple doctors, each with a different idea on what was happening, each one we mentioned diet, and each doctor immediately threw it out the window. We have a good doctor now, one who also is experiencing what we are going through. So we have isolated gluten from her diet (not preservatives, or additives, or food coloring, JUST GLUTEN (no doctor had told us to do this, we researched and read what others we're experiencing, there are A LOT of others) and it worked, like a miracle, everything from chronic fatigue, hives, blackouts, celiacs, etc. GONE! by removing these toxic grains that cause internal disruption at a cellular level. If long term exposure to this stuff causes illness, and its being reported, why is it not a good idea to immediately ban and re-approach the standards of safety that we have here in America? Other countries are catching on fast. Maybe its cause were all dumb fat slow Americans riddled with disease and cancers like no other country. I personally believe its to late for most of us that have been steadily eating this crap for 20-30 years. Someone said it was all in the name of having enough food for the world? excuse me while i dump half my plate in the trash, I'm full.:laugh2: (AMERICA!!!)


Edited by treesniper119 (04/27/12 12:58 PM)


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: treesniper119]
    #16147578 - 04/27/12 05:39 PM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Sounds to me like they have diagnosed a problem and are now going to fix it.  If they put the proteins in, they can take them out.  And the system is already about to do so.  And nobody has died from it.
You should also consider that many foods that you eat naturally have a negative element to them when eaten in excess.  Any seafood has mercury, broccoli is toxic, corn syrup has been shown to be toxic, etc. 
You also need to realize that people did not evolve to eat as much grain as we do now.  We stopped evolving naturally when agriculture was adopted, so a gluten free diet is likely to be healthy simply due to the lack of gluten.  A lot of people are allergic to gluten.


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: treesniper119]
    #16148669 - 04/27/12 09:48 PM (2 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Visionary Tools said:
Quote:

sonamdrukpa said:


Quote:

Until then, it is not responsible to risk the health of the entire population with this infant science or to release these crops into the ecosystem where they may self-propagate for generations. An immediate ban of GM foods and crops is more than justified.




After seeing the quality of your evidence, I respectfully disagree.




How do you respectfully disagree?

Thing is, if all this GM stuff was being grown in airtight bio-containment labs or off-world/undersea greenhouses then that's fine, you could have all the GM food you want and knock yourself out.

But do you see the concerns I and others have in that pollen from GM crops can and will contaminate no GM life, and we don't want that?




I disagree for the reasons I said.  There are examples of GM tech going wrong and it being fixed with no further consequences.  Not a big deal.  It's just like any other technology, it needs fine tuning sometimes.

Worst case scenario, it's possible to eradicate organisms from the Earth.  We did it with smallpox, we did it with that corn strain.  If suddenly every field in America was GM Soy, we'd just plow under, salt the field and replant somewhere else - there are seed banks out there with every single strain and type of seed we'd need ever, non-GM varieties included.  Worrying about pollination risks seems like worrying about kudzu taking over the SE US.

Quote:

treesniper119 said:
Quote:

Leon Ferrum said:
GM foods are the least of our worries here in the States in terms of an unhealthy diet.  GMOs might increase certain diseases after long term exposure.  So might and number of weird chemical ingredients in food including coloring and preservatives, various nutrition deficiencies or imbalances, pollution (in air, water, everything), and toxins.  GMOs are the least of your concern in terms of health.  I'm sure everyone here knows that they could be eating healthier but opt not to anyway.  Don't start blaming your future illness on Monsanto already.




According to the food pyramid, grains are supposed to be the majority of our diet, in reality, this is very true.
the very same grains that monsanto has genetically re-engineered that are in 90% of the food sold at any grocery store here in america. The offending proteins are listed as: w-5 gliadin (from wheat); g-3 hordein (from barley); and g secalins (from rye). Peer reviewed studies and scientific journals are being composed and compiled, those grains in question are under scrutiny in the USA and in other countries. they have been found to be disruptive to metabolic pathways, and as interfering with nearly all systems of the human body, generating inflammation and immune dysfunction. What the genetically engineered proteins do is disrupt inter-cellular communication: they prevent cells communicating with each other intelligently, as nature intended. The scrambling of this natural communication causes inflammation and disease.

This is from the July 21st, 201 edition of Science Translational Medicine.^^ (recent and relevant study pertaining to the issue at hand, i have yet to see anyone here arguing against these studies)

Its not like groups of farmer/scientists out their aren't talking about it or studying what we are talking about, they are, and the links that have been posted in the past 12 pages are not irrelevant. I appreciate your manners sonmadrukpa, i don't take offense to debate, though i will get heated about it at times, because unlike you, I'm dealing with this issue first hand in my family. My wife cant touch anything but gluten free breads, cereals, and grains. Even coming in contact with bread crumbs will cause a number of illnesses & auto-immune deficiency symptoms (its not just celiacs or some random allergy that permanently manifests itself) to rampantly spring forth out of her normally healthy condition.
She has enjoyed gluten laden cereal, pizza, and sandwich's all her life, until 2 years ago, when strange illnesses started occurring. Her family has no history of allergies and no previous auto-immune deficiencies. We went to multiple doctors, each with a different idea on what was happening, each one we mentioned diet, and each doctor immediately threw it out the window. We have a good doctor now, one who also is experiencing what we are going through. So we have isolated gluten from her diet (not preservatives, or additives, or food coloring, JUST GLUTEN (no doctor had told us to do this, we researched and read what others we're experiencing, there are A LOT of others) and it worked, like a miracle, everything from chronic fatigue, hives, blackouts, celiacs, etc. GONE! by removing these toxic grains that cause internal disruption at a cellular level. If long term exposure to this stuff causes illness, and its being reported, why is it not a good idea to immediately ban and re-approach the standards of safety that we have here in America? Other countries are catching on fast. Maybe its cause were all dumb fat slow Americans riddled with disease and cancers like no other country. I personally believe its to late for most of us that have been steadily eating this crap for 20-30 years. Someone said it was all in the name of having enough food for the world? excuse me while i dump half my plate in the trash, I'm full.:laugh2: (AMERICA!!!)




Thanks for the thanks.  I don't think your wife's case is indicative of a trend and, like I said, I will stay in my position until I can get statistics that say people are getting sick.  I am sorry your wife and your family have to go through that, it sounds really shitty.  Keep fucking with Montsanto.


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Re: Outrageous Lies Monsanto and Friends Are Trying to Pass off to Kids as Science [Re: sonamdrukpa]
    #16159877 - 04/30/12 01:23 PM (2 years, 4 months ago)

First, let’s be clear about what gluten intolerance is. It isn’t a food allergy. It’s a physical condition in your gut. Basically, undigested gluten proteins (prevalent in wheat and other grains) hang out in your intestines and are treated by your body like a foreign invader, irritating your gut and flattening the microvilli along the small intestine wall. Without those microvilli, you have considerably less surface area with which to absorb the nutrients from your food. This leads sufferers to experience symptoms of malabsorption, including chronic fatigue, neurological disorders, nutrient deficiencies, anemia, nausea, skin rashes, depression, and more.

If you remove gluten from the diet, the gut heals and the myriad of symptoms disappears. Depending on the level and degree of the intolerance (which can range anywhere from a gluten sensitivity to a full-blown celiac disease), it may be possible to eventually re-introduce properly prepared grains (sourdough that has fermented for up to a month, sprouted grains, etc) into the diet.

Others are not so lucky. Their guts may heal, but their bodies will never be able to digest gluten — even if it’s been “bent” by traditional preparation methods (see below). They have a genetic pre-disposition that causes gluten-sensitivity.

We all know a genetic-predisposition doesn’t mean that developing a disease is written in stone. Our environment & diet has a lot to say about how our genes are expressed. The following theories are possible culprits which increase the likelihood of the pre-disposing genes “turning on”:

    Some people may possess as-yet unidentified genes that cause their immune system to think an undigested fragment of the gluten protein looks like a microbial invader.
    Some people who consume gluten may have dysbiosis — damaged gut flora — from antibiotic use or consuming foods that they cannot digest. Feeding infants grains before they are able to digest them may raise the risk of dysbiosis. In this scenario, the immune system may see the products of microbial invasion from the dysbiosis and the undigested gluten fragment at the same time and be tricked into thinking that the gluten fragment is the microbial invader.
    Low-nutrient diets may interfere with the body’s ability to suppress immune cells that are capable of attacking harmless proteins. For example, one of the chemicals the body uses to suppress these immune cells is TGF-beta,c which is upregulated by vitamin A.d A diet deficient in vitamin A, then, might undermine the body’s ability to keep its immune system from attacking harmless proteins like gluten.

I think the greatest weight should be given to the second suggestion, as damaged gut flora is on the rise in our society for a number of reasons. Sugar, alcohol, antibiotics, environmental toxins, and other allergens (like the introduction of GMOs into our food supply within the last 15 years) all contribute to imbalanced intestinal flora which can lead to gluten-intolerance.

Just a decade ago, gluten-intolerance levels were at 1 in 2500 worldwide. Today, it’s at 1 in 133.

According to research posted at the Weston A Price Foundation’s website, modern wheat varieties are wildly different than more traditional varieties. In short, modern wheat is simply not the same plant it used to be.

I believe that this, along with our recent and dramatic increases in improperly prepared grain consumption, is what has led to the rise in levels of gluten-intolerance. Gluten-free diets aren’t simply fads; they’re coping mechanisms.

also studies of blood samples of military from the 1950′s actually show that from then to now has been an extreme rise in actual gluten sensitivity / celiac problems. People back then did not have as much of a problem. The logical conclusion is that the modifications to food processing and hybridization of wheat has increased the gluten content in our foods which is the source of the problem.


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Icelander said: I'd like to fund unlimited abortions. Finally some good coming from my tax dollars.

Repetoire89 said: I love abortion and fully condone it - some should make it into a sport.

Treesniper119 said: Any one who is willing to start life & also willing to deny life to their form/seed/child/offspring is cursed.
For you have severed your own cord to lifes worth.
Anyone who condones these actions is cursed as well...



Edited by treesniper119 (04/30/12 01:34 PM)


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