|
 Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
 
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 26,724
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 1 hour, 18 minutes
|
 Jury nullification duty 
#16085953 - 04/13/12 07:03 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Okay, so this thread is a sequel to my 'Help me get out of jury duty' thread. When I made that thread, I had forgotten all about how important jury nullification is in it's potential to help change drug laws or at least free people who have been busted for drugs. I hadn't read about it for some time and all I was thinking was that I needed to get out of this fucking jury duty. Then Pris reminded me of the importance of jury nullification, but he did it in the most negative way possible in a Pub setting. So I thought "Hmm, Pris is right. I actually should do the jury nullification thing. But he's is acting like an asshole, so I'm going to fuck with him." So then I clicked on his link and started reading more about jury nullification. I then split time between reading about it and responding to his suggestions in the most obnoxious way I could. 
So for the next day I thought about it. I need to be at work, but my boss won't/can't fire me over going to jury duty, so if I pull a drug case, then it is indeed my duty to set this guy free. So then I needed to decide which drug cases I would do this for. I decided that I won't do it for all drug cases. I'll probably play it by ear, but for now, even though I support legalization of ALL drugs, I probably will not do it for cases involving cocaine, opiates or meth. But if someone got busted for marijuana, ecstasy, psychedelics, ketamine, etc., and they pull me as a juror, they're in luck. Because I'm going to pretend to be in line with the law until it's time for the verdict. Then I guess I'll say that I had a change of heart about drug legalization.
So Pris, even though I remembered jury nullification, thanks for bringing it up and reminding me of the importance of it. Next time, don't be such a jerk about it and maybe I'll publicly take your suggestion into consideration at the time it was given and we can have a civil conversation.
--------------------
--------------------------------
Mp3 of the month: The Human Expression - Readin' Your Will
|
 facepockets
In Search of Equilibrium
Registered: 10/31/11
Posts: 262
Loc: 5b
|
 Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Learyfan] 4
#16086048 - 04/13/12 07:30 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I don't understand the differentiation between different drugs. I'd
probably draw the line between violent and nonviolent offenders. Just
because you like certain drugs doesn't mean that they are beyond
addiction or misuse.
|
SlashOZ
:D
Registered: 10/20/06
Posts: 3,546
Loc: Following the water cycle
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Learyfan]
#16086073 - 04/13/12 07:37 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
yes! jury nullification for the win!
also, you should let any drug offense off the hook. the message must be clear and unequivocal that we the people will not tolerate a police state that punishes people who are making decisions about their bodies. mere drug possession and use should not be a crime regardless of the drug. tobacco killed more people last year than meth, heroin, and cocaine combined so why would you punish someone for those drugs if all they did was posses or use those drugs? if they were stealing or hurting someone that is a different story but drugs are drugs are drugs, m'kay? they should all be legal. fight the power if you can with jury nullification. this topic should be on the forefront of the minds of anyone that serves on a jury imo. It is the last best defense against a tyrannical criminal justice system. super stoked you brought this up in its own thread.
--------------------
"Life sucks but in this really beautiful way" - Axl Rose
"Life's a bitch and then you die that's why we get high cuz you never know when you're gonna go." - NAS
"When people don't know what you're about they put you down and shut you out" - Black Sabbath
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" - Gandhi
"Look up at me I am God, look down on me and I am evil, look at me I am you." - Charles Manson.
"Don't question my reality." - Me (as far as I know)
|
Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 26,724
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 1 hour, 18 minutes
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: SlashOZ]
#16086117 - 04/13/12 07:48 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I'm not married to the idea of differentiating the drugs. It's just where I'm at right now. I still have two more days to think this through. Like I said, I don't use coke, opiates or meth, and I'm 75% against them, but I'm 100% for legalization of all of them. Unless you guys can completely convince me, it'll probably be a game time decision in regard to those drugs.
--------------------
--------------------------------
Mp3 of the month: The Human Expression - Readin' Your Will
|
DivineIntensity
Techno-Optimist
Registered: 09/03/11
Posts: 2,706
Loc: Florida
Last seen: 1 day, 17 hours
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Learyfan]
#16086137 - 04/13/12 07:57 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Why are you 75% against them? There are plenty of responsible users in every branch of drugs.. You should know that the airtime those drugs receive is usually not the norm or representative of all drug users.
And I don't think you're using the fact they're less safe as your rational - because if I'm not mistaken Ketamine can be pretty dangerous.
--------------------
 
|
facepockets
In Search of Equilibrium
Registered: 10/31/11
Posts: 262
Loc: 5b
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Learyfan]
#16086150 - 04/13/12 08:05 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I don't look at the chemicals in terms of who specifically uses them,
but rather at the effects they have and their potential for medical use.
Cocaine is currently produced in the US by one company for local
anaesthetic purposes. Opiates are commonly used by the medical
field, and there is in fact of shortage of them because the developed
countries think that it's a good idea to restrict their production,
to the detriment of all the suffering in 3rd world countries. Meth...
is prescribed to children for ADHD treatment. Hahahaha.
But really, those reasons above will probably not do much to
influence you.
Do you see differences within the classes? Say: someone who got
caught smoking opium vs. another who was caught with a rig and some
heroin/morphine. If so, why? And why do you accept certain
stimulating compounds (MDMA, phenylethylamines) but look down on the
use of other stimulants (methamphetamine, cocaine)?
The environment that one grows up in determines where they will go to
a great extent. If you grew up impoverished and kept getting put
down, both financially and mentally, by events after birth, and
eventually turned to one of these "hard" drugs in order to relieve
the distress, wouldn't you be more deserving of another's mercy than
just someone who smoked weed to enjoy the weekends?
Obviously a highly specific scenario that will not encompass what you will be involved in, but worth a thought.
|
cinic
Registered: 02/04/12
Posts: 592
Last seen: 11 months, 9 days
|
|
fuckit
|
trip forever
Stranger
Registered: 08/21/09
Posts: 5,839
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: cinic]
#16086223 - 04/13/12 08:23 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
You posted a picture about with liberty and justice for all implying we don't have it.
Shouldn't those drug offenders (meth, heroin, crack) have the liberty to choose any drug they can ingest?
Just trying to convince you to let any offender go 
If it was a violent drug crime then by all means I'd say guilty, regardless of the drug.
--------------------
|
Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!
Registered: 01/22/03
Posts: 168,361
Loc: Pvt. Pubfag NutSuck 
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Learyfan]
#16086228 - 04/13/12 08:27 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Learyfan said:
So I thought "Hmm, Pris is right.
have you lost your damn mind?
you shouldnt start thinking that way
Quote:
So Pris, even though I remembered jury nullification, thanks for bringing it up and reminding me of the importance of it. Next time, don't be such a jerk about it
you're welcome and I wasnt trying to be a jerk about it, I trying to queen
it up as a reminder to you to do the same. I'm glad you changed your mind
because in my own views, the two most important civic duties every citizen
has is voting and jury duty. Geo is right, when you're in that jury box you
learn a great deal, far more than you get on perry mason reruns and more
importantly you at least have the chance to make some change. even if
you're just the guy that hangs the jury
now if we can do away with congressional elections and revert to a lottery
to select people to serve in congress we may be able to get this country
straightened out. 536 men and women chosen randomly with no party affiliations
it's gotta be better
than what we have
--------------------
there are 923 words in the english language that do not follow the "I before E"
rule, there are 44 words in the english language that follow the rule. this is
the shit our education funding is paying for and these liberals want more money
for education to keep making students stupid
|
ima kitten
meow
Registered: 11/12/11
Posts: 70
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Prisoner#1] 1
#16086289 - 04/13/12 08:44 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
 needless to say, i've been looking forward to my first *and probably only* time of jury duty for a while now
--------------------
  please... keep on the grass!
 
|
Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 26,724
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 1 hour, 18 minutes
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Prisoner#1]
#16086302 - 04/13/12 08:45 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Right on. I hear you.
But yeah, you guys are all right about the legalization of all drugs. I'm totally for that. I definitely don't agree with you that crack and MDMA are the same, but as far as legality, you're right. Neither should be illegal and no one should go to jail based on possession or distribution to adults.
--------------------
--------------------------------
Mp3 of the month: The Human Expression - Readin' Your Will
|
Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!
Registered: 01/22/03
Posts: 168,361
Loc: Pvt. Pubfag NutSuck
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Learyfan]
#16086358 - 04/13/12 08:55 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Learyfan said:
But yeah, you guys are all right about the legalization of all drugs. I'm totally for that. I definitely don't agree with you that crack and MDMA are the same, but as far as legality, you're right. Neither should be illegal and no one should go to jail based on possession or distribution to adults.
we're on the same page, I believe that personal choices such as this shouldnt
be punished by big daddy government, the only time a crime should be punished
is when it involves an actual victim. rape, robbery, murder, etc... drugs
shouldnt be a crime and shouldnt be an extenuating factor in a crime because
most of us have used drugs and havent harmed anyone in the process, the meth
monkey that decided to break into houses did so of his own volition
I think where our views split is when I dont believe we should pay for
medical treatment for drug related illnesses
--------------------
there are 923 words in the english language that do not follow the "I before E"
rule, there are 44 words in the english language that follow the rule. this is
the shit our education funding is paying for and these liberals want more money
for education to keep making students stupid
|
Salomon
living on borrowed time
Registered: 01/17/09
Posts: 20,291
Loc: I dont even care anymore
Last seen: 25 minutes, 20 seconds
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Prisoner#1]
#16086386 - 04/13/12 09:01 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:
Learyfan said:
So I thought "Hmm, Pris is right.
have you lost your damn mind?
you shouldnt start thinking that way
it's 2012, bro.
omens of the doom yet to unfold.
|
Azure Essence
ॐ |MagicBonerTonic| ॐ
Registered: 10/03/10
Posts: 4,381
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 9 hours, 43 minutes
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Learyfan]
#16086402 - 04/13/12 09:05 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
I think with the overewhelming annoyance of meth users, I'd probably be OK with letting a meth user go to jail. Seriously, do they EVER SHUT THE FUCK UP?
--------------------
|
trip forever
Stranger
Registered: 08/21/09
Posts: 5,839
|
|
By the way I'd like to point out this Deja vu involving the same exact posters. (pris/learyfan)
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/13901315
--------------------
|
Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!
Registered: 01/22/03
Posts: 168,361
Loc: Pvt. Pubfag NutSuck
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Salomon]
#16086433 - 04/13/12 09:12 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Salomon said:
Quote:
Prisoner#1 said:
Quote:
Learyfan said:
So I thought "Hmm, Pris is right.
have you lost your damn mind?
you shouldnt start thinking that way
it's 2012, bro.
omens of the doom yet to unfold.
I guess it's time that I admit that I support a cut in military spending as
well as cutting budgets across the board, and during the current time an
increase in social spending for health care and food stamps for those in
the poverty level
--------------------
there are 923 words in the english language that do not follow the "I before E"
rule, there are 44 words in the english language that follow the rule. this is
the shit our education funding is paying for and these liberals want more money
for education to keep making students stupid
|
Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 26,724
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 1 hour, 18 minutes
|
|
ima kitten, that video was awesome! I'm a big Doug Stanhope fan and I haven't seen Deadbeat Hero. I want to more than ever now. Thanks!
Quote:
Prisoner#1 said:
I think where our views split is when I dont believe we should pay for
medical treatment for drug related illnesses
I don't want to derail the thread, but one could claim that you're paying way more to imprison people for drugs than you would treating them.
Quote:
trip forever said:
By the way I'd like to point out this Deja vu involving the same exact posters. (pris/learyfan)
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/13901315
I need to read that, actually. I remember the thread, but I don't remember anything about it. There's probably some good info in there.
--------------------
--------------------------------
Mp3 of the month: The Human Expression - Readin' Your Will
|
Prisoner#1
Even Dumber ThanAdvertized!
Registered: 01/22/03
Posts: 168,361
Loc: Pvt. Pubfag NutSuck
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Learyfan]
#16086598 - 04/13/12 09:52 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Learyfan said:
Quote:
Prisoner#1 said:
I think where our views split is when I dont believe we should pay for
medical treatment for drug related illnesses
I don't want to derail the thread, but one could claim that you're paying way more to imprison people for drugs than you would treating them.
consider it's $30k/mo for drug treatment, it's $100k -$200k for a liver transplant
prison is by far the cheaper of the two but I dont want to see people
locked up for drugs and I shouldnt have to pay for their treatment
since this is all shit they did to themselves
--------------------
there are 923 words in the english language that do not follow the "I before E"
rule, there are 44 words in the english language that follow the rule. this is
the shit our education funding is paying for and these liberals want more money
for education to keep making students stupid
|
1ve5w4hu
Registered: 03/11/12
Posts: 125
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: Prisoner#1]
#16086811 - 04/13/12 10:50 PM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
When people advocate jury nullification, they don't realize the harm they might be doing. They're telling the jury to ignore the evidence, ignore the law, and just vote based on how they feel. The majority seems to be for the legalization of marijuana so no harm there, but what if it's not a drug case? Let's say the juror is racist, has an extreme hatred toward insurance companies, or something else. Then, what the jury nullification advocator is doing (without realizing it) is telling the juror to vote to lock someone up for the rest of their life based on their skin color or to vote against an insurance company even though they were in the right... Just be careful with it.
--------------------
 
|
SlashOZ
:D
Registered: 10/20/06
Posts: 3,546
Loc: Following the water cycle
|
Re: Jury nullification duty [Re: 1ve5w4hu]
#16087149 - 04/14/12 12:06 AM (1 year, 1 month ago) |
|
|
Quote:
1ve5w4hu said:
When people advocate jury nullification, they don't realize the harm they might be doing. They're telling the jury to ignore the evidence, ignore the law, and just vote based on how they feel. The majority seems to be for the legalization of marijuana so no harm there, but what if it's not a drug case? Let's say the juror is racist, has an extreme hatred toward insurance companies, or something else. Then, what the jury nullification advocator is doing (without realizing it) is telling the juror to vote to lock someone up for the rest of their life based on their skin color or to vote against an insurance company even though they were in the right... Just be careful with it.
Jury nullification doesn't lock people up bro.
--------------------
"Life sucks but in this really beautiful way" - Axl Rose
"Life's a bitch and then you die that's why we get high cuz you never know when you're gonna go." - NAS
"When people don't know what you're about they put you down and shut you out" - Black Sabbath
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" - Gandhi
"Look up at me I am God, look down on me and I am evil, look at me I am you." - Charles Manson.
"Don't question my reality." - Me (as far as I know)
|
|
Images only 
Access 
Threaded
Previous
Index
Next
Reply 
