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 Mufungo
Coming at ya
Registered: 04/03/07
Posts: 2,642
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 BEWARE: AVOID MULTICROP PYRETHRUM INSECTICIDE SPRAY 
#15984262 - 03/23/12 02:53 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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On the weekend I sprayed a few of my plants with a pyrethrum insecticide and in the process I gave a few of my cacti a spray. Bad news. My big bridg. monstrose did not like it and neither did a bridg. stock with grafted loph. The other trichs I sprayed didn't mind it but these two, two of my favorites did. The bridg stock and a few knobs of my big monstrose look like they're dying. Their colour changed a bit and they look severly bruised. Is it too late for these guys or is it possible they'll bounce back? Anything I can do?
Luckily the loph, although it looks a little damaged, isn't looking like it'll die. So I'm thinking, worse case scenario, chop off the loph and regraft or root, and also chop off the knobs that look unhealthy.
If you're wondering "Why would you do such a thing?!" I've been asking myself the same question, but, naively I didn't think the spray would do any harm, because I've used it before, and I thought it would kill a few spider mites I've seen crawling about (although, there weren't too many so it was more preventative than anything else; I had a spider mite infestation a few years ago).
  
I didn't give it a spray all over, just on one side, the other side looks fine (and I hope that it will heal itself...).
       
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UPDATE: They're all screwed. Had to chop a lot and many of them are dying. Multicrop and Bunnings both didn't accept that the spray could do this damage, shirking any responsibility as companies do. But as you see from the shots below, the Multicrop Pyrethrum spray obviously is dangerous to cacti. Other brands of pyrethrum spray haven't done this damage, so it might just be the Multicrop brand or maybe it was a dodgy batch.. anyway, beware.
                          
Review: Multicrop Pyrethrum Spray damages and kills cacti
Edited by Mufungo (04/04/12 06:25 AM)
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atomicshaman
in love with a dream
Registered: 02/02/11
Posts: 2,395
Loc: germany
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 Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! [Re: Mufungo]
#15984319 - 03/23/12 03:28 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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i cant offer you any advise , but thanks for the warning.
i have resorted to the same spray but will now not use it on my precious bridgesii monstrose.
maybe the spray got through the skin somehow?
i hope they come good.
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 atomicshaman is a bad machine being sent back to the factory for minor adjustments:
/forums/thumbs/13-16/635584864-thumb_large.jpg[/image][/url]
  
i have stapelia variegata and zygocactus cuttings for trade {au}
Edited by atomicshaman (03/23/12 03:30 AM)
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 GoOnThen
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! [Re: Mufungo]
#15984342 - 03/23/12 03:45 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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It looks like the black weeping rot that some bridgesii get some times a had a few last year with it. It looks really bad and be warned if it is the same it will get worse. They will start weeping black ooze and then they should start healing and you will end up with some nasty scars.
This is going to sound a bit strange but I hope it is what I have just described because in the long term this black oozy rot doesn't seem to effect the cacti other than leaving a scar.
I have sprayed pyrethrum on my loph's before and it did leave some marks so I wont be doing it again unless I have to. It did stop the spider mites in there tracks though.
Cheers
Got
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Mufungo
Coming at ya
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Posts: 2,642
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! [Re: GoOnThen]
#15984457 - 03/23/12 04:56 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Scars I don't mind too much, so I hope you're right too! 
I certainly learned a lesson!
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Quinkin
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! [Re: Mufungo]
#15984892 - 03/23/12 10:11 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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It's not the pyrethrins themselves, more often than not, but the surfactant that is part of most commercially available products. Strips the waxy protective coat off some cacti and creates a perfect window for later bug n heat damage.
Treat as black rot. Most will heal up fine, leaving a scar and some, well, you'll just watch em melt into a heap of rotten ooze.
Give em a good mist with pure water, then don't water until it scars up.
I've applied aloe vera gel (fresh) to cacti in the past with good recovery but it's hardly an exhaustive study! 
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Ever changing range of ethically gathered and produced seeds, cuttings and prints of herbs, medicinals, fruit, veg and cactus. Sale and trade by arrangement. PM's welcome 
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Quinkin
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! [Re: Quinkin]
#15984900 - 03/23/12 10:13 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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I haven't tried pestoil (agricultural oil, or white oil) on cacti before but may be worth a try if you have serious bugs. Spot test on a less than special specimen first of course.
I know some collectors that swear by flyspray, others by repellants like ti tree or eucalyptus oil, garlic, etc.
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"Has anyone seen Uncle Sid? Or Lucy? Anyone?"
Ever changing range of ethically gathered and produced seeds, cuttings and prints of herbs, medicinals, fruit, veg and cactus. Sale and trade by arrangement. PM's welcome
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ferrel_human
cactus fucker
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! [Re: GoOnThen]
#15984963 - 03/23/12 10:44 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
GoOnThen said:
It looks like the black weeping rot that some bridgesii get some times...
sounds about right. my bridgesii get that and mine are all scared up. new growth is fine but now you know for next time.
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HarveyWalbanger
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! [Re: Mufungo]
#15985800 - 03/23/12 02:54 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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I don't have any good advice on the subject, but I have seen this before. Those cacti hate surfactants.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/10403779#10403779
Edited by HarveyWalbanger (03/23/12 03:04 PM)
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Mufungo
Coming at ya
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Oh heck... that be some nasty stuff! They should have a warning on the bottle... but then again, they probably do and I don't read the bottle. 
Thanks for the words guys. I'll take them out of the sun and rain and keep a close eye on them over the next week. Fingers crossed they recover on their own.
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Mufungo
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! [Re: Mufungo]
#15987904 - 03/24/12 12:12 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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God damn! I just noticed it did f@#k up my other columnars that I sprayed. I looked at the bottle and it said nothing about this as a possiblity. I'm tempted to go down and rage at the employees at the hardware store I bought it from. Rarr! 
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Quinkin
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! [Re: Mufungo]
#15988856 - 03/24/12 08:43 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Here in Aus just about every garden product carries a disclaimer, effectively "we're not liable for anything, even if you follow instructions carefully".
You can grow your own pyrethrum plants, make a water and/or alcohol based extract and use strained aloe vera gel, soapwort or yucca saponin as a spreading agent... Most pyrethrin products are synthetic pyrethroids with added piperazines and detergents,etc. About as natural as Valium
Natural pyrethrum is quite unstable and broken down by heat, light, air etc but a lot of organic growers appreciate its limited toxicity and persistance in the environment.
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"Has anyone seen Uncle Sid? Or Lucy? Anyone?"
Ever changing range of ethically gathered and produced seeds, cuttings and prints of herbs, medicinals, fruit, veg and cactus. Sale and trade by arrangement. PM's welcome
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Quinkin
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! [Re: Quinkin]
#15988865 - 03/24/12 08:48 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Wouldn't feel too bad anyway, just about every cultivated bridgesii gets a bit of the black death at times, I notice especially at the start of the growth season.
Almost always recover, just adds to their rugged, kind of ugly charm
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"Has anyone seen Uncle Sid? Or Lucy? Anyone?"
Ever changing range of ethically gathered and produced seeds, cuttings and prints of herbs, medicinals, fruit, veg and cactus. Sale and trade by arrangement. PM's welcome
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Mufungo
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BEWARE: AVOID MULTICROP INSECTICIDE SPRAY [Re: Quinkin]
#16010451 - 03/28/12 09:25 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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One of my pedros is a write off... I'm going to have to chop him to try and save him.  The picture doesn't quite show how swollen and spongy it is; I think rot is setting in.
    
Multicrop chemical burns cacti
The others seem to be getting worse too...
 
Multicrop chemical burns cacti
The stock is getting blacker and blacker... I took a photo of the side that didn't get spray, just for comparison.
  
Multicrop chemical burns cacti
And here's the culprit... Stay away from Multicrop Pyrethrum Insect Spray.
 
I called the hardware store and lodged a complaint. They said they'd inform their staff and recommended I write a complaint to Multicrop. ...the good ol' palm off.
Edited by Mufungo (04/01/12 04:38 AM)
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Mufungo
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! ***Update*** [Re: Mufungo]
#16010582 - 03/28/12 09:54 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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...and of course, when I call, the company claim there's nothing in the spray that could possibly do this to cacti. Either they're liars or they haven't thoroughly tested their own product and thus are ignorant to the damage their product can do to plants.
I noticed on my psychotria, that the leaves have spots of brown now where I had sprayed them a couple of weeks ago. But thankfully they're not damaged, just don't look as pretty.
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GoOnThen
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! ***Update*** [Re: Mufungo]
#16011486 - 03/29/12 01:22 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Maaate I didn't realise you were an Aussie
That spray has made a mess of your plants. I have never used the off the shelf ready to spray stuff. I buy the small bottles and mix up a litre in a pump spray bottle.
I hope they all pull through
Cheers
Got
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russokeefe
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! ***Update*** [Re: GoOnThen]
#16011513 - 03/29/12 01:30 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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@Got can you provide info such as brand of the small bottles that you buy? And do you just mix it up as per directions on bottle? Just interested for future reference. my cactus collection has expanded from 0 plants a month ago to 10 plants now. at some stage I will get bug problems I am sure.
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karode13
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! ***Update*** [Re: Mufungo]
#16011771 - 03/29/12 02:42 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Aww shit Mufungo. This is no good at all. Hopefully you can save some of that pedro and keep an eye on the loph graft. You don't want that traveling through to the scion.
What time of day did you spray? It was more than likely the spray itself but if you sprayed them when the sun was still out it could of compounded the issue. Always spray when the sun goes down and then give a few days out of sunlight to be sure whatever you sprayed hasn't dissolved the waxy protective layer. It's also wise to test any new product out on unimportant plants to avoid these problems.
I know my advice isn't helpful to you now but it may be useful to someone in the future.
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Mufungo
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! ***Update*** [Re: karode13]
#16011795 - 03/29/12 02:55 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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I think it was in the afternoon when the sun had already ducked behind the wall. The graft is inside on a table in my garage, so only gets sun for a few hours during the day through a window.
I've used pyrethrum on my cacti before with no probs, but I have never used this brand before, so I'm suspecting it might be a dodgy batch or maybe just the Multicrop brand.
On the weekend I think I might remove the loph from the stock (to avoid it spreading like you say K) and chop the affected middle 2 feet out of the pedro to save the rest of the plant. I think it's gone deeper than just the surface with those two. The others I'm going to cross my fingers but at this rate I'm expecting some more loss. I am just lucky that I didn't spray all of my plants. D'oh!
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karode13
Tāne Mahuta
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! ***Update*** [Re: Mufungo]
#16011833 - 03/29/12 03:18 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Don't wait for the weekend if time allows. It may be too late by then. This stuff once it sets in moves quite fast. Also let me know if you need a new stock for that loph.
I've also used pyrethroids, not this one specifically, on my cacti without problems so I did think this quite weird. If the sun was down it may of had something to do with the secondary ingredient, Piperonyl butoxide, which is there as a synergist for the pyrethrum. Just guessing which doesn't help your cactus unfortunately.
I'm staring at my insecticide stash as I type and all I use is neem oil, natrasoap(Yates), derris dust, spinosad(Yates success). For last resorts I have Yates Mavrik which is a synthetic pyrethroid. All of these I've used on my plants with no issues at all. Try one of these next time depending on the pests you have.
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GoOnThen
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Re: I f#@ked up big time, help! ***Update*** [Re: russokeefe]
#16011887 - 03/29/12 03:50 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
@Got can you provide info such as brand of the small bottles that you buy? And do you just mix it up as per directions on bottle? Just interested for future reference. my cactus collection has expanded from 0 plants a month ago to 10 plants now. at some stage I will get bug problems I am sure.
http://www.yates.com.au/products/pest-control/insects-concentrates/yates-pyrethrum-insecticide/
I have used this product around my garden and yard for years. I have only used it a few times on or around cacti. I use it to try and keep the red back spider population in check around the pots that my cacti are in. I all so have used it in my shed where I have all of my grafts and my loph's.
I did use it on spider mites on my grafts and it did leave marks on the loph's but it was more cosmetic and it didn't seem to effect the trich and pere stock. I am going to do some more tests on a couple of lophs and trichs with pyrethrum and natrasoap as I still need something to combat spider mites when I get another infestation.
I always use the minimum recommended amount on my plants.
Cheers
Got
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Edited by GoOnThen (03/29/12 04:39 AM)
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