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 frylock91
 
Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 8,366
Loc: Richmond, VA 
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Yeah, I agree that people that are known to kill others should have their own lives taken for the safety of everyone around them. But I never said he should've been shot for being a thug, I was just saying he got the worst outcome of attacking somebody, cuz that happens when you ground and pound armed people who clearly can't defend themselves without a gun. 
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 Baby_Hitler
Anarcho-Technologist
Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 21,404
Loc: To the limit!
Last seen: 8 hours, 27 minutes
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 Re: trayvon martin shooting  [Re: frylock91]
#16255495 - 05/19/12 10:15 PM (1 year, 1 day ago) |
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It is still very unclear who attacked whom.
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Diploid
Cuban
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 18,207
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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You're all about "guilty until proven innocent"
No. That's Not Quite Social's specialty. I've held fast that both parties are innocent until proven guilty while the investigation was underway and the evidence was gathered. Now that the investigation is completed and the evidence is released, I've formed an opinion based on the evidence, yes. What's wrong with that?
I believe beyond reasonable doubt that Marin was a violent thug who attacked Zimmerman for simply being followed around, which Zimmerman was entitled to do in a public space if he felt like it. I believe Zimmerman is a self-important asshole for following people around, but that is not illegal. I also believe Martin was likely a burglar and liar, I believe he stole the jewelry or knew that it was stolen by someone else, and I believe he may have been casing houses to burglarize that night. I'm not convinced beyond reasonable doubt that he attacked a bus driver.
I believe the evidence now available proves him (Martin) guilty AT THIS POINT and not before this point of attacking Zimmerman without cause, your mis-statement to the contrary notwithstanding. And no, following someone around is cause for harsh language perhaps, not not a vicious attack.
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Wanna hear something depressing? One out of four Shroomerites wants to lock me in a government cage for using a substance they don't like.
Hard to believe, right? Read it for yourself:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/7874721#Post7874721
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Not Quite Social
Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 1,336
Loc: Midwest
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: frylock91]
#16255544 - 05/19/12 10:25 PM (1 year, 1 day ago) |
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Quote:
Yeah, I agree that people that are known to kill others should have their own lives taken for the safety of everyone around them.
Liberal as I am, it's not surprising that I am against capital punishment. I am surprised you think Zimmerman deserves it. I think he should get manslaughter. I've always thought that. The guy is a moron. I never thought he was a racist, never said he was, and don't think he is, but I do think he wrongly profiled Martin. I think Zimmerman and Diploid were twins separated at birth, which is kinda a compliment to Diploid for managing (I assume) not to kill any thugs.
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The People's History
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frylock91
Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 8,366
Loc: Richmond, VA
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I have my own opinion like everyone here, whether I'm wrong or not I can't be 100% sure. But in my opinion, Martin died because he made a man fear for his life. Simple as that. Getting pretty common for you guys to twist words.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 79,839
Loc: underbelly
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Then, Icelander insisted I recognize the fact that he has "stones" for not having an opinion, and he condemned people with opinions.
At least you're consistent. Wrong with every post. I never said anything about anyone not having an opinion. I have opinions and suspicions but do not draw absolute conclusions based on them without sufficient evidence. This bypasses you every time. And you will likely never understand it from all indications due to your blind bias against someone and an event which you do not understand. I'll likely give my opinion on who's guilty after the trial when all the evidence is out. Like a sane person.
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"Hang on tightly, let go lightly" -anonymous
“under the present brutal and primitive conditions on this planet, every person you meet should be regarded as one of the walking wounded. we have never seen a man or woman not slightly deranged by either anxiety or grief. we have never seen a totally sane human being.”
― Robert Anton Wilson
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Not Quite Social
Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 1,336
Loc: Midwest
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: Icelander]
#16255592 - 05/19/12 10:37 PM (1 year, 1 day ago) |
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Frylock said,
Quote:
I have my own opinion like everyone here, whether I'm wrong or not I can't be 100% sure. But in my opinion, Martin died because he made a man fear for his life.
So stated, I think yours is a reasonable opinion, even though I disagree for reasons I've given.
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The People's History
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Not Quite Social
Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 1,336
Loc: Midwest
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Icelander, I kinda like you even though you don't like me. Unrequited like 
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The People's History
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 79,839
Loc: underbelly
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I don't dislike you. I don't know you. I do dislike that you are willing to rush to judgment on another human based on so little actual evidence. I find it frightening. It's one of the reasons humans scare me. They seem so irrational about important issues.
I've taken a pretty hard look at the evidence presented and due to the amount of unsubstantiated "evidence" bandied about not just here but in the media I find it impossible to condemn either as the guilty party at this time. I think it's very likely that neither is completely innocent but even that I do not know at this time. I see no harm in speculation or opinion as long as it's acknowledged that that is all it is. My problem with your position is that you, from the beginning judged Zimmerman the guilty party, which could be true but you've deliberately ignored most all the evidence that might indicate that the opposite could be true. As I said I find that callous and frightening.
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"Hang on tightly, let go lightly" -anonymous
“under the present brutal and primitive conditions on this planet, every person you meet should be regarded as one of the walking wounded. we have never seen a man or woman not slightly deranged by either anxiety or grief. we have never seen a totally sane human being.”
― Robert Anton Wilson
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Baby_Hitler
Anarcho-Technologist
Registered: 03/06/02
Posts: 21,404
Loc: To the limit!
Last seen: 8 hours, 27 minutes
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: Diploid]
#16255719 - 05/19/12 11:12 PM (1 year, 1 day ago) |
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Quote:
Diploid said:
You're all about "guilty until proven innocent"
No. That's Not Quite Social's specialty. I've held fast that both parties are innocent until proven guilty while the investigation was underway and the evidence was gathered. Now that the investigation is completed and the evidence is released, I've formed an opinion based on the evidence, yes. What's wrong with that?
I believe beyond reasonable doubt that Marin was a violent thug who attacked Zimmerman for simply being followed around, which Zimmerman was entitled to do in a public space if he felt like it. I believe Zimmerman is a self-important asshole for following people around, but that is not illegal. I also believe Martin was likely a burglar and liar, I believe he stole the jewelry or knew that it was stolen by someone else, and I believe he may have been casing houses to burglarize that night. I'm not convinced beyond reasonable doubt that he attacked a bus driver.
I believe the evidence now available proves him (Martin) guilty AT THIS POINT and not before this point of attacking Zimmerman without cause, your mis-statement to the contrary notwithstanding. And no, following someone around is cause for harsh language perhaps, not not a vicious attack.
I meant "innocent until proven guilty".
My bad.
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johnm214
Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 16,569
Loc: Americas
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: Memories]
#16256622 - 05/20/12 03:34 AM (1 year, 1 day ago) |
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Quote:
Memories said:
Quote:
Baby_Hitler said:
Quote:
Enlil said:
Stalking? What evidence do you have that he was stalking him?
Evidence Schmevidence.
What evidence do you have that Martin stole the jewelery other than:
!.) He had some jewelry.
2.) He's black.
More straw man, race baiting bullshit.
agreed, baby hitler's posts have been completely worthless time and time again on this topic. He consistantly erects straw men and then destroys them, over and over. If he could make an argument or ask a cogent question without false premises his point of view might be worth a damn, but so far that's not happened.
Same with the people who make baseless claims of stalking and so on. These dishonest charecterizations continue to be incorporated into the claims of guilt. Its pretty telling when those claiming guilt can't simply rely on the fact but have to invent them or use loaded language.
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Cervantes
Devil's Advocate
Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 15,826
Loc: Dark Side of the Windmill
Last seen: 4 hours, 27 minutes
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: johnm214]
#16256994 - 05/20/12 07:05 AM (1 year, 1 day ago) |
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Give BH some credit. He is a smart satirist. He is playing by the pro-Zimmerman-er rules more or less (and mocking said rules at the same time).
I've been reading his posts for about twice as long as you have.
BH's logic always comes with a slice of humor, which can make his intentions ambiguious if you don't know how to filter his thoughts.
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I know you think you understand the words I have just said to you but, what you fail to realize is, what you thought I said is not what I actually meant by saying what I said, when I said it.
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Not Quite Social
Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 1,336
Loc: Midwest
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: Cervantes]
#16257007 - 05/20/12 07:18 AM (1 year, 1 day ago) |
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Yes, Cervantes, BH summed up this topic weeks ago,
Quote:
So since I live in a stand your ground state, i can legally kill someone by simply:
1.) Start a fight
2.) Lose the fight
3.) Shoot the guy who kicked my ass.
SWEEEEEET!
That's the pro-Zimmerman argument in a nutshell. Best comment on the whole thread.
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The People's History
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fireworks_god
SexyButt McDanger
Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,193
Loc: Red Panda Village
Last seen: 2 hours, 31 minutes
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Quote:
Not Quite Social said:
You're funny. You--not me--You made distinctions between normal and stigmatized regarding seeing a psychologist.
No, you did. It's all very clear. You said he obviously has a mental illness because he has a psychologist. That's viewing psychologist clients in a stigmatized fashion - that they, as a rule, have a mental illness. You went on to ask "how many friends and family members do you have who have a psychologist?". The implication is clear to everyone that you're suggesting with this question that normal people don't have a psychologist.
Quote:
You want to pretend people see psychologists and take psych meds for no reasons related to their mental health.
No, I simply know that most people who see psychologists don't actually have a mental illness. I never said that they don't visit a psychologist for reasons related to their mental health and well-being. That's a far cry from actually having "mental illness". 
Quote:
You speculate that the medications prescribed to Zimmerman were based on a Google Search and are probably irrelevant. Ha!
I'd suggest basic reading comprehension. I suggested that one could easily ascertain with a google search the nature of these medications, the conditions for which they are prescribed, and the side-effects that they cause.
As in, go and do it. And suggest to us why it's relevant to the case. Stop propagating this nonsensical idea that having a psychologist or having been prescribed these medications is very suspect and relevant to the matter. Actually demonstrate it. You continue to completely ignore this. It's no question why.
Quote:
If you feel the importance of going off on someone here about 'stigmatization of the mentally ill' why don't you give Icelander grief about his orange "brain damaged" cartoon?
I don't know which cartoon you're talking about. Was he somehow using this cartoon to support his viewpoints on this matter? If not, I don't see what interest I'd have in addressing.
Quote:
Because you reserve your self righteousness for those with whom you disagree on politics?
Oh, it's not a matter of self-righteousness. It's simply a matter of calling an ace an ace.
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If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
  
 
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 79,839
Loc: underbelly
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Quote:
Not Quite Social said:
Yes, Cervantes, BH summed up this topic weeks ago,
Quote:
So since I live in a stand your ground state, i can legally kill someone by simply:
1.) Start a fight
2.) Lose the fight
3.) Shoot the guy who kicked my ass.
SWEEEEEET!
That's the pro-Zimmerman argument in a nutshell. Best comment on the whole thread.
Once again you show your true colors.
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"Hang on tightly, let go lightly" -anonymous
“under the present brutal and primitive conditions on this planet, every person you meet should be regarded as one of the walking wounded. we have never seen a man or woman not slightly deranged by either anxiety or grief. we have never seen a totally sane human being.”
― Robert Anton Wilson
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frylock91
Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 8,366
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Quote:
Not Quite Social said:
Yes, Cervantes, BH summed up this topic weeks ago,
Quote:
So since I live in a stand your ground state, i can legally kill someone by simply:
1.) Start a fight
2.) Lose the fight
3.) Shoot the guy who kicked my ass.
SWEEEEEET!
That's the pro-Zimmerman argument in a nutshell. Best comment on the whole thread.
Except it isn't really looking like that's how it happened. 
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 79,839
Loc: underbelly
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: frylock91]
#16257232 - 05/20/12 10:05 AM (1 year, 1 day ago) |
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He doesn't care about that. He's the most biased person in this thread imo.
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"Hang on tightly, let go lightly" -anonymous
“under the present brutal and primitive conditions on this planet, every person you meet should be regarded as one of the walking wounded. we have never seen a man or woman not slightly deranged by either anxiety or grief. we have never seen a totally sane human being.”
― Robert Anton Wilson
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Diploid
Cuban
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 18,207
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: frylock91]
#16257831 - 05/20/12 01:27 PM (1 year, 1 day ago) |
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Except it isn't really looking like that's how it happened.
Not Quite Social is still insisting it was Martin screaming for help that night even though the now-released evidence contains testimony from TWO independent eye witnesses who both stood there watching Zimmerman scream as he endured a broken nose and bloody head.
Even Martin's father said it WAS NOT Martin screaming after listening to the 911 recording. He changed his story later, but only after the family registered Trayvon® and talking to his lawyer.
But Not Quite Social does not-quite accept any evidence unless it swings his pre-judged way.
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Wanna hear something depressing? One out of four Shroomerites wants to lock me in a government cage for using a substance they don't like.
Hard to believe, right? Read it for yourself:
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/7874721#Post7874721
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Not Quite Social
Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 1,336
Loc: Midwest
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: Diploid]
#16258757 - 05/20/12 05:31 PM (1 year, 20 hours ago) |
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Fireworks_god,
You're worried about stigmatizing people? Really?
You started a thread titled "Wow What Retards".
That's so pre-1991 of you.
Quote:
The stigma is like the slang word kids use in school," he said. "A 'retard' doesn't know anything, can't do anything. It's a slur just like a racial slur is a slur against a minority.
http://www.nytimes.com/1991/10/28/us/citing-retard-slur-group-changes-name.html
Like I said, you're the guy who separates people into " normal" and "stigmatized" ... and who labels people "retards". Shame on you.
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The People's History
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole
Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 42,267
Last seen: 17 hours, 6 minutes
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The difference is between the involuntarily retarded and those who embrace retardation with both fists. Some people have retardation thrust upon them and others choose it.
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