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 Diploid
Cuban
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 18,281
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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He had said to the police (according to sources that I've read), that his heading was being bashed into the concrete
Actually, an eye witness said that. I don't think Zimmerman has spoken to the media and the investigation, which is where is exact statement will be, hasn't been completed.
If this claim doesn't check out
There's an eye witness who corroborates the self-defense claims. The physical evidence the arresting officer saw at the scene also corroborates the self-defense claims. How much corroboration do you need?
Irrational outrage.
Outrage at the presumption of guilt? Hell yes.
Irrational? Not at all. That's the lynch mob's specialty, not mine.
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"The axioms for a group are short and natural... Yet somehow hidden behind these axioms is the monster simple group, a huge and extraordinary mathematical object, which appears to rely on numerous bizarre coincidences to exist. The axioms for groups give no obvious hint that anything like this exists." -- Richard Borcherds
If there is a creator, he definitely has a sense of humor.
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EntheogenicPeace
Scholar
Registered: 10/04/05
Posts: 3,797
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 Re: trayvon martin shooting  [Re: Diploid]
#16050325 - 04/05/12 11:40 PM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Police: George Zimmerman Claims Trayvon Martin Slammed His Head Into Concrete
http://blogs.miaminewtimes.com/riptide/2012/03/police_george_zimmerman_claims.php
Presumption of guilt? Calling for a trial is not a presumption of guilt. For anyone to say that it should not be investigated and the (un-reviewed) decision of the local police department should be accepted w/o question is a blatant bias & a message potential killers throughout the U.S. that they can get away so long as the local cops are on board or otherwise don't really care about the victim. Long history of this in America... results in actual lynchings, not the metaphorical one you are complaining about.
Different eye witness say different things (including that they were on the ground in the grass, not the sidewalk.) Further, if he and/or an eyewitness (but especially Zimmerman) make a claim about the beating, then it should be supported by the physical evidence. The conclusion of the officer(s) that night is precisely what is being investigated, whether or not they adequately and accurately investigated all possible evidence b4 decided to let him go.
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Diploid
Cuban
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 18,281
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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For anyone to say that it should not be investigated and the (un-reviewed) decision of the local police department should be accepted w/o question is a blatant bias
I agree. That's why I haven't said that. 
results in actual lynchings, not the metaphorical one you are complaining about.
Ah, this must be some strange new usage of the word "metaphorical" I hadn't previously been aware of. The Black Panthers have a $10,000 bounty on Zimmerman's head before the investigation, let alone any trial, is complete.
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"The axioms for a group are short and natural... Yet somehow hidden behind these axioms is the monster simple group, a huge and extraordinary mathematical object, which appears to rely on numerous bizarre coincidences to exist. The axioms for groups give no obvious hint that anything like this exists." -- Richard Borcherds
If there is a creator, he definitely has a sense of humor.
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 Nullface
Registered: 09/04/11
Posts: 4,713
Loc: USA 
Last seen: 50 minutes, 10 seconds
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: Diploid]
#16050441 - 04/06/12 12:02 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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EntheogenicPeace
Scholar
Registered: 10/04/05
Posts: 3,797
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: Diploid]
#16050494 - 04/06/12 12:15 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ah, this must be some strange new usage of the word "metaphorical" I hadn't previously been aware of. The Black Panthers have a $10,000 bounty on Zimmerman's head before the investigation, let alone any trial, is complete.
I understand the confusion among the majority of ppl who are not "radicals" like myself (e.g. media reports from the '08 election where "Black Panthers" were harassing ppl at some voting place somewhere), but just to clarify... the New BPP is a fringe hate group w/almost zero support, even among African-Americans. I am 99% certain I read that the Martin family denounced them & their bounty.
This group has no connection to, and has been denounced by the living members of, the original, actual BPP. They are racist, backwards, do nothing to actually help/benefit their communities, and are just plain dumb (if you've ever heard them speak, it's obvious very quickly.) Regardless of one's views of the BPP, they were of the internationalist/Marxist position and were aligned w/similar-minded groups of all colors. Ironically, the "New BPP" is basically everything that COINTELPRO painted the original as in a propaganda campaign to discredit them among more moderate-left segments of the population.
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"I did not know then how much was ended. When I look back now from this high hill of my old age, I can still see the butchered women and children lying heaped and scattered all along the crooked gulch as plain as when I saw them with eyes still young. And I can see that something else died there in the bloody mud, and was buried in the blizzard. A people's dream died there. It was a beautiful dream.
And I, to whom so great a vision was given in my youth; you see me now a pitiful old man who has done nothing, for the nation's hoop is broken and scattered. There is no center any longer, and the sacred tree is dead."
- Oglala Lakota medicine man Black Elk, reflecting on the 1890 Wounded Knee massacre
Edited by EntheogenicPeace (04/06/12 12:25 AM)
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Nullface
Registered: 09/04/11
Posts: 4,713
Loc: USA
Last seen: 50 minutes, 10 seconds
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 25,049
Loc: Lost In Space
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Quote:
EntheogenicPeace said:
Moreover, the (as it very much appears) lack of life-threatening injuries
The Florida SYG law does not require that there be ANY injuries.
Not a single scratch. Not a single blow.
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“In politics, few talents are as richly rewarded as the ability to convince parasites that they are victims. Welfare states on both sides of the Atlantic have discovered that largesse to losers does not reduce their hostility to society, but only increases it. Far from producing gratitude, generosity is seen as an admission of guilt, and the reparations as inadequate compensation for injustices – leading to worsening behavior by the recipients.
Thomas Sowell
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kiss_the_sky03
human being
Registered: 08/19/05
Posts: 1,266
Loc: where I want
Last seen: 1 day, 7 hours
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: Nullface]
#16051721 - 04/06/12 09:34 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Nullface said:
http://news.yahoo.com/nbc-news-regrets-editing-trayvon-shooting-call-220720073.html
 at this point I'm just sitting back and enjoying this gigantic shitfest
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Diploid
Cuban
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 18,281
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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As it should be, IMO.
Why should I have to be injured before I can meet force with force? Why should I have to let someone intent on harming me or someone I care about to even get CLOSE before taking steps to protect myself. It's absurd.
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"The axioms for a group are short and natural... Yet somehow hidden behind these axioms is the monster simple group, a huge and extraordinary mathematical object, which appears to rely on numerous bizarre coincidences to exist. The axioms for groups give no obvious hint that anything like this exists." -- Richard Borcherds
If there is a creator, he definitely has a sense of humor.
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 25,049
Loc: Lost In Space
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: Diploid] 2
#16051763 - 04/06/12 09:57 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Diploid said:
As it should be, IMO.
Why should I have to be injured before I can meet force with force? Why should I have to let someone intent on harming me or someone I care about to even get CLOSE before taking steps to protect myself. It's absurd.
I agree completely.
One should not have to suffer harm, nor flee from potential harm, to protect ones self, family, friends, co-workers or even strangers.
It takes an odd mindset to advocate otherwise.
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“In politics, few talents are as richly rewarded as the ability to convince parasites that they are victims. Welfare states on both sides of the Atlantic have discovered that largesse to losers does not reduce their hostility to society, but only increases it. Far from producing gratitude, generosity is seen as an admission of guilt, and the reparations as inadequate compensation for injustices – leading to worsening behavior by the recipients.
Thomas Sowell
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johnm214
Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 16,657
Loc: Americas
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Quote:
luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:
Diploid said:
As it should be, IMO.
Why should I have to be injured before I can meet force with force? Why should I have to let someone intent on harming me or someone I care about to even get CLOSE before taking steps to protect myself. It's absurd.
I agree completely.
One should not have to suffer harm, nor flee from potential harm, to protect ones self, family, friends, co-workers or even strangers.
It takes an odd mindset to advocate otherwise.
I disagree- it makes it much more risky to rob homes. When I break in, I try and plan it for a time when they're on vacation or at work, but if they do turn up, its much more convenient for them to be forced to leave me alone, on pain of imprisonment. That way I can finish up and leave at a leisurely pace in the rural areas I work in.
Especially since a citizen has no right to police protection anyways, that removes pretty much any threat to my livelihood.
I do kinda worry what happens if someone breaks into my home or is beating me, since the state is under no obligation to protect me and I'm prohibited from enforcing my rights by th elaw, but since I don't obey the law anyways, its not that big a deal for me- I'm much more worried about the law abiding citizens.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 80,482
Loc: underbelly
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Quote:
luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:
Diploid said:
As it should be, IMO.
Why should I have to be injured before I can meet force with force? Why should I have to let someone intent on harming me or someone I care about to even get CLOSE before taking steps to protect myself. It's absurd.
I agree completely.
One should not have to suffer harm, nor flee from potential harm, to protect ones self, family, friends, co-workers or even strangers.
It takes an odd mindset to advocate otherwise.
I think this is a mindset often of someone who has never experienced a real threat to their person or been violently injured. They often live in very safe and secure protected areas and rarely venture into the unknown.
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"People convince themselves of their own lies, becoming victims of their own inventions as they begin to direct their lives by standards of behavior, ideas, feelings, or instincts which do not correspond to their inner reality. What is truly serious in this matter is that the individual loses all points of reference regarding what comprises truth, and what comprises lies. He becomes used to considering as true only that which is convenient for his personal interests; everything that is in opposition to his self-esteem or in conflict with already established prejudices, he considers false."
- John Baines
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 25,049
Loc: Lost In Space
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So:
1. No racial slur from Zimmerman - CNN
2. Video DOES show wound - ABC
3. Zimmerman only said "black" after he was asked - NBC
Race baiters... be ashamed. Be very ashamed. It's quite sad how many on this site rushed to judge this guy before all the dust had settled and the facts were known.
And yet, not one has stepped up and said they were wrong on so many points.
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“In politics, few talents are as richly rewarded as the ability to convince parasites that they are victims. Welfare states on both sides of the Atlantic have discovered that largesse to losers does not reduce their hostility to society, but only increases it. Far from producing gratitude, generosity is seen as an admission of guilt, and the reparations as inadequate compensation for injustices – leading to worsening behavior by the recipients.
Thomas Sowell
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 25,049
Loc: Lost In Space
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Re: trayvon martin shooting [Re: johnm214]
#16051991 - 04/06/12 11:35 AM (1 year, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
johnm214 said:
Quote:
luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:
Diploid said:
As it should be, IMO.
Why should I have to be injured before I can meet force with force? Why should I have to let someone intent on harming me or someone I care about to even get CLOSE before taking steps to protect myself. It's absurd.
I agree completely.
One should not have to suffer harm, nor flee from potential harm, to protect ones self, family, friends, co-workers or even strangers.
It takes an odd mindset to advocate otherwise.
I disagree- it makes it much more risky to rob homes. When I break in, I try and plan it for a time when they're on vacation or at work, but if they do turn up, its much more convenient for them to be forced to leave me alone, on pain of imprisonment. That way I can finish up and leave at a leisurely pace in the rural areas I work in.
Especially since a citizen has no right to police protection anyways, that removes pretty much any threat to my livelihood.
I do kinda worry what happens if someone breaks into my home or is beating me, since the state is under no obligation to protect me and I'm prohibited from enforcing my rights by th elaw, but since I don't obey the law anyways, its not that big a deal for me- I'm much more worried about the law abiding citizens.
Excellent.
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“In politics, few talents are as richly rewarded as the ability to convince parasites that they are victims. Welfare states on both sides of the Atlantic have discovered that largesse to losers does not reduce their hostility to society, but only increases it. Far from producing gratitude, generosity is seen as an admission of guilt, and the reparations as inadequate compensation for injustices – leading to worsening behavior by the recipients.
Thomas Sowell
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Not Quite Social
Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 1,336
Loc: Midwest
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Quote:
A guy with a machete has to first inflict a deadly wound before I'm allowed to blow the fucker's head off (if I'm still able to after such an injury)? A guy with a gun has to mortally shoot me FIRST before I can shoot back?
Did Martin have a machete? ... No.
Did Martin have a gun? ... No.
Was Zimmerman's life imperiled by a lethal package of Skittle's or by a deadly can of Arizona Iced Tea? ... No.
Your analogies suck.
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The People's History
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 80,482
Loc: underbelly
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Quote:
Not Quite Social said:
Quote:
A guy with a machete has to first inflict a deadly wound before I'm allowed to blow the fucker's head off (if I'm still able to after such an injury)? A guy with a gun has to mortally shoot me FIRST before I can shoot back?
Did Martin have a machete? ... No.
Did Martin have a gun? ... No.
Was Zimmerman's life imperiled by a lethal package of Skittle's or by a deadly can of Arizona Iced Tea? ... No.
Your analogies suck.
Did anyone claim he did?... NO
Your logic sucks.
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"People convince themselves of their own lies, becoming victims of their own inventions as they begin to direct their lives by standards of behavior, ideas, feelings, or instincts which do not correspond to their inner reality. What is truly serious in this matter is that the individual loses all points of reference regarding what comprises truth, and what comprises lies. He becomes used to considering as true only that which is convenient for his personal interests; everything that is in opposition to his self-esteem or in conflict with already established prejudices, he considers false."
- John Baines
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luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 25,049
Loc: Lost In Space
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Quote:
Not Quite Social said:
Quote:
A guy with a machete has to first inflict a deadly wound before I'm allowed to blow the fucker's head off (if I'm still able to after such an injury)? A guy with a gun has to mortally shoot me FIRST before I can shoot back?
Did Martin have a machete? ... No.
Did Martin have a gun? ... No.
Was Zimmerman's life imperiled by a lethal package of Skittle's or by a deadly can of Arizona Iced Tea? ... No.
Your analogies suck.
You replied to me, yet they weren't my analogies.
Your comprehension sucks.
State law does not require there to be a weapon.
Your comprehension sucks.
State law does not require a wound.
Your comprehension sucks.
State law does not require a single blow.
Your comprehension sucks.
You decided Zimmerman was guilty without all evidence being in.
Your humanity sucks.
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“In politics, few talents are as richly rewarded as the ability to convince parasites that they are victims. Welfare states on both sides of the Atlantic have discovered that largesse to losers does not reduce their hostility to society, but only increases it. Far from producing gratitude, generosity is seen as an admission of guilt, and the reparations as inadequate compensation for injustices – leading to worsening behavior by the recipients.
Thomas Sowell
Edited by luvdemshrooms (04/06/12 12:50 PM)
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Diploid
Cuban
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 18,281
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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Your analogies suck
They aren't analogies. They're a sub-discussion about the SYG law. Why am I not surprised that you're not quite sharp enough to grasp that without a hand-held explanation?
But since you brought it up, Martin was in athletic shape, played football, and had two fists. If you think that isn't a potentially threatening combination, you live under a rock and have never faced a pissed off person intent on beating your ass in the real world.
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"The axioms for a group are short and natural... Yet somehow hidden behind these axioms is the monster simple group, a huge and extraordinary mathematical object, which appears to rely on numerous bizarre coincidences to exist. The axioms for groups give no obvious hint that anything like this exists." -- Richard Borcherds
If there is a creator, he definitely has a sense of humor.
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 zappaisgod
horrid asshole
Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 42,732
Last seen: 24 seconds
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Quote:
Not Quite Social said:
Quote:
A guy with a machete has to first inflict a deadly wound before I'm allowed to blow the fucker's head off (if I'm still able to after such an injury)? A guy with a gun has to mortally shoot me FIRST before I can shoot back?
Did Martin have a machete? ... No.
Did Martin have a gun? ... No.
Was Zimmerman's life imperiled by a lethal package of Skittle's or by a deadly can of Arizona Iced Tea? ... No.
Your analogies suck.
I can beat the shit out of and kill most of the people on the planet with my bare hands. The percentage goes up drastically if I attack them from behind.
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Diploid
Cuban
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 18,281
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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Quote:
1. No racial slur from Zimmerman - CNN
2. Video DOES show wound - ABC
3. Zimmerman only said "black" after he was asked - NBC
4. In the seven phone calls that George Zimmerman made to the Sanford non-emergency line from August 2011 to February 2012, he NEVER ONCE mentioned the race of a person he deemed suspicious before he was explicitly asked by the dispatcher. See NY Daily Times.
An unforgivable oversight by the racist pig Zimmerman has been painted as by certain Shroomerites who've been conspicuously quiet recently in this thread.
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"The axioms for a group are short and natural... Yet somehow hidden behind these axioms is the monster simple group, a huge and extraordinary mathematical object, which appears to rely on numerous bizarre coincidences to exist. The axioms for groups give no obvious hint that anything like this exists." -- Richard Borcherds
If there is a creator, he definitely has a sense of humor.
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