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 Harri
Wirrurr
Registered: 10/29/08
Posts: 1,191
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 Past/Future aren't real  1
#15800608 - 02/12/12 09:37 PM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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They're concepts and exist because they're the result of functions of the brain, such as having a memory, imagination and anticipation, being able to formalize information into an idea,etc. Time only exists now, its infinitely right now, with reactions infinitely small/large happening within its self.
I just realized this now  am I correct? could anyone prove this wrong?
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 lar20
Strange guy in a park
Registered: 01/17/11
Posts: 220
Last seen: 1 minute, 24 seconds
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: Harri]
#15800660 - 02/12/12 09:45 PM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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i would say your correct for the most part. although if something happens in the past that makes a big impact on the planet or something you can see its effects down the road years later (pollution for example) but for the most part past and future are just memories and ideas
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I <3 DRUGS
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 mylfgur
Untitled
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Loc: Ohio 
Last seen: 3 hours, 42 minutes
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: Harri]
#15800667 - 02/12/12 09:47 PM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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Time is a function of the brain, but only to an extent. Time is the brain's recognition of entropy, or the change in the universe. Because your brain is a part of the universe and is also subject to entropy, it kind of records the flow of change and give it a scale.
Think about it this way, if our universe was one thing with only enough space to occupy that one thing, there would be no such thing as time. However, space is expanding and there are many, MANY things in the universe which are all moving with respect to each other because of energy, and therefore there is a flow of change which your brain can recognize as time.
Time is as real as you.
Anything past there, well, that's metaphysics.
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Help on the Way
Slipknot420
Registered: 08/12/00
Posts: 2,610
Loc: Another World
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: lar20]
#15800685 - 02/12/12 09:50 PM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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There is simply one eternal moment which happens right here and now, and every moment that ever happened or ever will happen happens here and now, all of time, all places, the entire universe all happens simultaneously in one spot and one beautiful infinite divine moment. Wow!
Or you're just crazy. If time wasn't real, why would we have all these clocks?
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 *Divine Moments of Truth*
"Limitless undying love which shines around me like a million suns - it calls me on and on across the universe" ~ John Lennon
"Once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right" ~The Grateful Dead
"Religionists, with their guaranteed eventual paradise, of which they know nothing, taking it all on 'faith,' can't be expected to understand or sympathize with those with a yen to storm the Gate of Heaven and see for themselves what all the praying's about!" ~Robert Hunter
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Harri
Wirrurr
Registered: 10/29/08
Posts: 1,191
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: mylfgur]
#15800778 - 02/12/12 10:05 PM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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Time (past/present/future) is only in the brain, us being the only conscious organisms that we know of that recognize the concept "time" we all have a general opinion that time is linear but we only think this because of having memory and imagination to imagine a future of possibilities based on past experiences which are also just memories, it is only now, forever. 
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frost458
Stranger
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: Harri]
#15801605 - 02/13/12 02:22 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
Harri said:
They're concepts and exist because they're the result of functions of the brain, such as having a memory, imagination and anticipation, being able to formalize information into an idea,etc. Time only exists now, its infinitely right now, with reactions infinitely small/large happening within its self.
I just realized this now am I correct? could anyone prove this wrong?
I disagree, Time do exist. and it is streched by gravity.
Time passes faster for sattelite than us because they are less exposed to the earth gravity field, that's why GPS sattelites needs a constant time corection or else the system wouldn't be able to keep track of us.
it is also function of speed, when you go faster, time slows down.
Edited by frost458 (02/13/12 02:23 AM)
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nonduality
Registered: 04/18/11
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: frost458]
#15801614 - 02/13/12 02:28 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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This is quite the conundrum.
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UnifiedField
Pure Abstract Potentiality
Registered: 02/11/12
Posts: 42
Loc: Everywhere
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: nonduality]
#15801932 - 02/13/12 06:42 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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There is only now. Learn from history, in all it's forms, and apply yourself to the logical way of functioning within your immediate reality. Make some art about it while your at it as well 
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This is me.
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Demonic_Chronic
Soul Surfin Psychonaut
Registered: 08/10/08
Posts: 1,490
Loc: The Grid
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: frost458]
#15802104 - 02/13/12 08:11 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
frost458 said:
Quote:
Harri said:
They're concepts and exist because they're the result of functions of the brain, such as having a memory, imagination and anticipation, being able to formalize information into an idea,etc. Time only exists now, its infinitely right now, with reactions infinitely small/large happening within its self.
I just realized this now am I correct? could anyone prove this wrong?
I disagree, Time do exist. and it is streched by gravity.
Time passes faster for sattelite than us because they are less exposed to the earth gravity field, that's why GPS sattelites needs a constant time corection or else the system wouldn't be able to keep track of us.
it is also function of speed, when you go faster, time slows down.
I second that motion
DC
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"Evolution. Evolution is the greatest force in the material world. Evolution will provide us the next step in intelligent life. But it will come from somewhere unexpected."
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday. Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery and today is a gift. Thats why its called the present.
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Harri
Wirrurr
Registered: 10/29/08
Posts: 1,191
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you can slow reactions in different conditions, it doesn't mean time is speeding up or slowing down it means it takes longer for a process/reactions to occur due to its environment, I'm sure gravity could have something to do with slowing or speeding reaction that causes what you think is time, it's just the reactions occurring.
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Demonic_Chronic
Soul Surfin Psychonaut
Registered: 08/10/08
Posts: 1,490
Loc: The Grid
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: Harri]
#15802481 - 02/13/12 10:21 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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Yes its called affecting time, gravity bends time. The more gravity the more bent and stretched time gets.
DC
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"Evolution. Evolution is the greatest force in the material world. Evolution will provide us the next step in intelligent life. But it will come from somewhere unexpected."
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday. Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery and today is a gift. Thats why its called the present.
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mylfgur
Untitled
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Loc: Ohio
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: Harri] 1
#15802521 - 02/13/12 10:36 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
Harri said:
Time (past/present/future) is only in the brain, us being the only conscious organisms that we know of that recognize the concept "time" we all have a general opinion that time is linear but we only think this because of having memory and imagination to imagine a future of possibilities based on past experiences which are also just memories, it is only now, forever.
you can slow reactions in different conditions, it doesn't mean time is speeding up or slowing down it means it takes longer for a process/reactions to occur due to its environment, I'm sure gravity could have something to do with slowing or speeding reaction that causes what you think is time, it's just the reactions occurring.
You seem to be ignoring the obvious in favor of attempting to apply metaphysics pragmatically.
Let me try to explain once more, hold onto your seat.
There is a linear flow of change in the universe which is what we perceive as time. Time is relative and is an inherent property of space, and gravity bends space and therefore time. Man invented clocks because his brain is advanced enough to recognize this flow of change.
This flow of change is called entropy, the ultimate natural law of gaseous longing. Some have described entropy as the tendency of the universe to go from a state of order to one of disorder. Energy in the universe wants to spread out and lower its potential, solids want to become gasses, space expands, and everything wants to spread out to lower energy states. In a way, energy wants to move from useful forms to useless (to us) forms. When you use energy, an amount is lost as heat, this is entropy in action. The second law of thermodynamics states that "the entropy of any closed system not in thermal equilibrium always increases." Because the universe is a closed system, its entropy is constantly increasing. Our universe will continue to change until it reaches thermal equilibrium (if it ever does). Because of the tendency of the universe to approach thermal equilibrium, there is not only a flow of change, but a direction of change. The concept of time is a simple tool that the brain developed to make sense of the order of the ridiculous world it inhabits. To say that humans are the only animals that recognize time is disingenuous. All living things are aware of the point of time they are in, though humans may be the only species able to conceptualize the idea.
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Harri
Wirrurr
Registered: 10/29/08
Posts: 1,191
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Heat speeds up reactions as well, heat speeds up time?
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mylfgur
Untitled
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Loc: Ohio
Last seen: 3 hours, 42 minutes
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: Harri]
#15802532 - 02/13/12 10:40 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
Harri said:
Heat speeds up reactions as well, heat speeds up time?
Heat, in a way, IS time.
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mylfgur
Untitled
Registered: 05/23/10
Posts: 650
Loc: Ohio
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: mylfgur]
#15802542 - 02/13/12 10:43 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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I'm not trying to bash you or anything, Harri, I'm just trying to clear some things up. A lot of people seem to have a very "mystical" view of time. It's rather simple and elegant, really.
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qman
Stranger
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: mylfgur]
#15802553 - 02/13/12 10:46 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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I don't think time travel is possible, the past is over, and the future has yet to happen.
One can travel back in time on certain drugs, and maybe the future as well, but this is just a mental process, it's not physical time travel.
If time travel was possible, where are the travelers?
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DZ74
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: mylfgur]
#15802555 - 02/13/12 10:47 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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But time is real! The concept we laid upon time isn't. but time is real. The pineal gland affects all living orignisms circadian rythem
which is induced by certain light I'm assuming 0.o
But another thing is...if the past and all memories of it only existed in the human mind then like one guy posted what if we keep making careless mistakes and it affect the environment does that mean that was only a mistake of the imagination if we just forget about it like the concepts of past and future? or did it just get real where the past met the present?
I don't agree with the solipsism philosophy even though I have thought about it before too. but overall, It makes people think it is only them that exist and that their actions affect nobody.
But who is to really say? Idk 
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mylfgur
Untitled
Registered: 05/23/10
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Loc: Ohio
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: DZ74]
#15802567 - 02/13/12 10:50 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
DZ74 said:
But time is real! The concept we laid upon time isn't. but time is real. The pineal gland affects all living orignisms circadian rythem
which is induced by certain light I'm assuming 0.o
But another thing is...if the past and all memories of it only existed in the human mind then like one guy posted what if we keep making careless mistakes and it affect the environment does that mean that was only a mistake of the imagination if we just forget about it like the concepts of past and future? or did it just get real where the past met the present?
I don't agree with the solipsism philosophy even though I have thought about it before too. but overall, It makes people think it is only them that exist and that their actions affect nobody.
But who is to really say? Idk
You seem to be potentially misguided about the pineal gland. It probably doesn't have much to do with time. There is a lot of conflicting information (and misinformation) about that specific part of the brain.
As for your inquiry about "if the past and all memories of it only existed in the human mind then like one guy posted what if we keep making careless mistakes and it affect the environment does that mean that was only a mistake of the imagination?" The answer would be yes, I think, for the OP. He seems to be in a romantic mindset, literally afflicted by the definition of philosophical idealism.
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windowlikcer
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Re: Past/Future aren't real [Re: mylfgur]
#15802640 - 02/13/12 11:11 AM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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I have thought about this many times. I would agree that the past and future are illusions. But because of that...that also means that the present is the biggest illusion of all. We are presented with the experience of motion and the passing of time, but because the past can never be experienced, and the future can never be experienced either, the present is actually an eternally immobile prison that you are forever trapped in.
The struggle to free yourself from restraints becomes your own shackles.
What a fucked up reality this is! Just be glad for those moments like the one you had that caused you to post this. The peeks behind the curtain.
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Harri
Wirrurr
Registered: 10/29/08
Posts: 1,191
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Quote:
windowlikcer said:
I have thought about this many times. I would agree that the past and future are illusions. But because of that...that also means that the present is the biggest illusion of all. We are presented with the experience of motion and the passing of time, but because the past can never be experienced, and the future can never be experienced either, the present is actually an eternally immobile prison that you are forever trapped in.
I completely agree
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