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 XUL
student of exercise physiology
 
Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 6,213
Last seen: 4 days, 3 hours
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 Asymmetry and Weight Lifting 
#15800005 - 02/12/12 07:52 PM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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For years I have been asking the question "why do I have a weaker side of my body and a stronger side". I had looked for answers as to why such an issue existed and solutions to fix the issue but I was never able to find anything real. Most people rambled about using dumbells or doing extra repetitions with one limb. Finally I have found solid evidence regarding asymmetry (unevenness, stronger/weaker side).
The information I found was discovered by Arizona State University and the University of Northern Colorado. The article was taken from my monthly research journal, which I got from the NSCA.
Sato, Kimitake, and Gary D. Heise. "Influence of Weight Distribution Asymmetry on the Biomechanics of a Barbell Back Squat." the Journal of Strength and Conditioning Research. 26.2 (2012): 342-349. Print.
The purpose of this study was to find the influence of Weight Distribution (WtD) asymmetry on the biomechanics of a barbell back squat. The subjects included two groups of 14 trained lifters. They performed the barbell back squat with 2 resistance levels (60 and 75% of their 1RM) to measure vertical ground reaction force (GRF), tilting, and rotational angular bar displacements. A symmetry index (SI) score of the vertical GRF and the 2 bar displacements were examined to identify the group difference. Results showed that the unequal WtD group displayed a higher vertical GRF SI score and a greater degrees of the tilting and rotational angular bar displacements. The 2 resistances did not influence the magnitude of the dependent variables.
The entry goes on to explain how the experiment was done and depicts more details. One important explanation is mentioned, which explains how uneven WtD sometimes developes during quiet standing (normal standing). An individual commonly favors one side of their body habitually. This habit may seem like a minor issue, but it may also extend to potentially unwanted movement patterns during bilateral resistance exercises(squat).
I compared the study to my own experience and found that it might strongly correlate with some problems or issues I have always had.
It seems that asymmetry, influenced by WtD throughout the body, could have impacted my very own bio-mechanics, thus creating a dominant side, a weaker side, and possibly influencing an injury that I occurred during lifting.
Like I said before, many people often prescribe dumbells or extra repetitions to the weak side as to fix asymmetry. Is this really the best answer and what are some key factors that could be influencing asymmetry while lifting?
Posture is definitely a factor here. Proper alignment of the body combined with a tight core is an excellent base for working against asymmetry. But even with perfect posture and a tight core couldnt bilateral movements still potentially be asymmetric? I think so. But Why?
Having superior neuro-muscular activity in one leg but not the other could be an issue. This is my main concern. During a squat we activate muscle fibers and motor units. If one side of my body lacks the ability (compared to the other side) to recruit fibers and motor units then it may fire at a slower rate. That is, during the concentric contraction of the squat the weaker leg may very well fire later than the right, thus creating a lag, asymmetry, possible tilting angular displacements, and rotational angular bar displacements. I guess the issue, as far as my thoughts are concerned, would be trying to gain more neuro-muscular activity in the weaker areas. I have read several methods on how to harness in neuro activity and now I am my own lab rat.
So how would you solve the problem?
I have my ideas and I have read recommendations that came with this entry but I will hold off for now. I want to hear what you guys think first.
This forum is for discussion and so I would like to discuss methods of rehabilitation.
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Edited by XUL (02/13/12 06:17 AM)
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Uzziel
Stranger
Registered: 12/30/10
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 Re: Asymmetry and Weight Lifting [Re: XUL]
#15803204 - 02/13/12 01:07 PM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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We all have a dominate side. A side that we naturally always use to normally do things. For me, it is my right. Opening a door, picking something up, etc, etc.
Being stronger on that dominate side just makes sense.
For a lift, you could be unconsciously doing more work with your right side.
Things like that.
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crkhd
☾☼☽
Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 1,255
Loc: A human sphere enfolding ...
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Re: Asymmetry and Weight Lifting [Re: Uzziel]
#15805497 - 02/13/12 07:58 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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SHABOOM
Edited by crkhd (02/13/12 08:06 PM)
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XUL
student of exercise physiology
Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 6,213
Last seen: 4 days, 3 hours
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Re: Asymmetry and Weight Lifting [Re: crkhd]
#15805508 - 02/13/12 08:01 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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Quote:
crkhd said:
Thats true though.
Leaning on one side while standing, jerking it, using your dominant side to do scrub or kneel. It all effects bi-lateral movement and possibly in negative ways depending on the severity.
I have more info to post but I have to sleep now. Work 6a-10p
peace. Keep jerkin. Left hand.
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crkhd
☾☼☽
Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 1,255
Loc: A human sphere enfolding ...
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Re: Asymmetry and Weight Lifting [Re: XUL]
#15805546 - 02/13/12 08:06 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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On a serious note... Maybe squatting with a tilt to the opposite side. With every exercise you push your body through a path of most force but least resistance. If your body's path of least resistance has a tilt it stands to reason that by tilting the opposite way you could reshape that path such that it becomes centered/symmetrical.
Doing extra isolation sets on one side seems like it would probably create another neuromuscular imbalance to deal with. Whereas doing compounds with a forced tilt would balance everything. Also you'd have to factor in things like bone length/density asymmetry and wear. Which over a 20+ year period would presumably be very difficult if not impossible to realign. If it's a major factor then doing forced-tilt exercises could potentially be more likely to cause injury.
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SHABOOM
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 cateyes
Registered: 12/16/03
Posts: 2,753
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 Re: Asymmetry and Weight Lifting [Re: XUL]
#15807109 - 02/14/12 05:48 AM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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if you look at his greamlin carefully you'll notice he's using his right hand, not left hand!!!  no all kidding aside there is always a natural tendency for a strong side based on use and it tends to always correlate to the hand you use to write from what i've read although this is not always the case. when i was in my senior year of high school i slightly injured my back during basketball season and they of course paid for chiropractic visits and on my very first visit i brought this very same question up and the chiropractor removed his shirt to show me that he was visibly unequally developed on his dominant side and said at that time he considered it completely normal... it wasn't weird looking or anything but you could clearly see he was more developed on his dominant side...
simply working that leg through favoring the weak side without weight and do knee bends using the dominant leg to barely help maintain balance you force the weak leg to fully incorporate more balance muscles which as a physiologist you already know is critical for fully developing nerve firing of muscle tissue, or am i wrong? or even simply doing hopping exercises favoring the weak side... now watch you go and over develop the weak side!!! but what about the entire weak side? the entire arm, lats, shoulders and so forth... Christ, i bet even the one side of your face muscles are dominant although in that instance it may not correlate to the dominant side... have you ever heard that saying, " i loved her little crooked smile?"  my wife has a crooked smile, when she's just smiling, when she's laughing hard it all comes into play! you could say she's a symmetrical laugher!!!
as far as posture goes i began to make a concentrated effort about 9-10 months ago to stand level on both feet so i don't favor one side with a hip tilt like i used to do... i have a gravity table and when i first started reusing it, there was always a significant stretch on one side of my hip area. it was very noticeable but by faithfully using the inversion table and focusing on posture by spreading my feet further apart while naturally standing, it is a complete even stretch now... whenever i stand my feet are always at least 14-18 inches apart so that i never favor one hip... this was and remains part of my mindfulness practice and now it is completely auto pilot for me. you'll never catch me standing foot to foot... even recently in an elevator i stacked my ground even though it was crowded as all hell and just about everyone got off on my floor!!! just thought I'd throw that out there... 
by the way, you never did tell me what you do for a living in your saving cans thread... i'm very curious what type of job you were alluding to when you said you basically get paid 40 hours over time for doing nothing... this is mind blowing as i've already pointed out considering there are millions who can't even find a job and those who do are employed marginally to the degree they can't get more then 20 hours of work per week!!! why can't you share this information with the rest of us? i'm back to work on a part time basis right for the moment now, 16-24 hours per week but if i could find an evening job doing nothing I'd take it in a heart beat and buy an Ipad so i could continue to post on the shroomery server while working! believe it or not, i'm at work now and controlling one of my computers remotely. i have a two day technical training session and the first day starts in about 15 minutes, everyone is eating breakfast and i've already eaten at home and i bring lunch, but anyway the administrator gave me permission to access my computer to download technical manuals, and the branch manager said what he doesn't know won't hurt him!
i love your passion regarding training XUL... i honestly can't say i've ever known anyone who gets into it half as much as you do... you're definitely going to make a good physiologist one day, hopefully there will be jobs for them in the future...
there are so many other ideas i have regarding balancing out and stretching is one i'll end with... do it! there is real strength in complete flexibility... do not try and kid yourself on this single issue. i just can't wait to hear all of your ideas now that you've basically peaked my interest in how deeply you've thought about this...
PeaCe2U...
K~~~ 
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4896744
Small Town Girl
Registered: 03/06/10
Posts: 5,128
Loc: United States
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Re: Asymmetry and Weight Lifting [Re: XUL]
#15807971 - 02/14/12 11:09 AM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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I think using dumbbells and having each side of your body work separately during lifts is a good idea that seems to have worked for me. I also make an attempt to use my left side more in daily life.
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Live your Life! 
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XUL
student of exercise physiology
Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 6,213
Last seen: 4 days, 3 hours
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Re: Asymmetry and Weight Lifting [Re: 4896744]
#15810665 - 02/14/12 08:24 PM (3 months, 12 days ago) |
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Cateyes,
I enjoyed your response. I think you are right on about the whole balance thing. I have some things to ask and say about asymmetry but I am about ready to pass out at my computer. Too much overtime and too little sleep. Ill post in the morning.
Quote:
i'm very curious what type of job you were alluding to when you said you basically get paid 40 hours over time for doing nothing... this is mind blowing as i've already pointed out considering there are millions who can't even find a job and those who do are employed marginally to the degree they can't get more then 20 hours of work per week!!! why can't you share this information with the rest of us?
I work for a company that houses mentally challenged individuals. I make 12 dollars an hour and get as much overtime as I want. Lately I have been working 80 hour weeks. Everything past 40 hours I make 17 some dollars an hour. The best part is that I get my 40 hours in 2.5 days. That is, I work tuesday at 2pm - saturday at 10pm and that is my 40 hours. The rest of the week I study and work overtime. Another plus is that we get free food. And we have a garage gym at the house where I work the most.
These mentally challenged agencies vary in their pay and hours. Some of them pay shit and wont offer you convenient hours like I have. Usually there are 3-5 companies in one area depending where you live.
I do chill a lot at work but I also spend time with my client (the mentally challenged guy). He is real cool and I enjoy his company. I would say its 40% hanging with him and 60% chillin.
One of the coolest things I just learned about is called shared living, which is a great way to jump start your finances. What you do is pretty much adopt a mentally challenged individual for 80,000 a year. 80,000 is your salary. The company pays for the individuals car, gas, groceries, clothing, house, and more. The only catch is that you are their parent pretty much. From what I hear you still have a social life because a lot of them go to school and stuff, but for the most part you are tied down. The company tries to encourage you to keep them for life but you can house them up for a couple years and then back out. I was considering this but it all depends on what life throws at me. Right now I dont think I need it. Its just hard to say no to so much money.
Ill hit ya up in the morning regarding the topic of the thread. Sorry for the choppy reponse, spelling errors, and cut up thoughts. I am just so tired. peace.
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cateyes
Registered: 12/16/03
Posts: 2,753
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Re: Asymmetry and Weight Lifting [Re: XUL]
#15812046 - 02/15/12 02:43 AM (3 months, 12 days ago) |
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man that's such an awesome job XUL!!! you are having an impact on someone else in such a positive way... KUDOS!!!
my problem is i'll be in training all day today so i'll just have to look at what you post later on...
again man, cool job!!!
K~~~
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XUL
student of exercise physiology
Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 6,213
Last seen: 4 days, 3 hours
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Re: Asymmetry and Weight Lifting [Re: cateyes]
#15869482 - 02/27/12 07:10 AM (3 months, 7 hours ago) |
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My asymmetry in the upper body is coming along very well. I didnt seem to need any kind of special training so far. I really concentrate on perfect form and distributing my weight equally. So far it has been working. Yesterday I did an upper body workout I am equally sore on both sides. Actually my weaker side is extremely sore!
On my lower body day I ran into major trouble. Deadlifts are no problem for me but I have a very very uneven squat. I pinpointed one major factor that may have even effected the rest of my body over the years.
During a squat I unintentionally slide my right and stronger leg backward as to seemingly use it as a powerhouse. I tried a set and in my mind I said "dont move the foot back" but it didnt work. I cant even tell when it moves back. It just happens. So I tried something.
I put a 35 lb plate on the ground behind my right foot which likes to slide back. The result was my left leg getting a HUGE punishment! I still felt a little uneven but I think it will take time before my neuromuscular system works things out. I am going to continue to use the 35 lb plate behind my dominant leg and see what happens.
The result of my leg workout with the plate behind my foot was great. I am sore equally on both sides and especially in my left and weaker glute which normally struggles to get a workout.
I am happy about all this.
P.S. In fact after this upper body workout I have never felt such awareness or soreness in my scapular area before. I hit it perfectly.
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Edited by XUL (02/27/12 07:24 AM)
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Beanhead
Sobriety&Love:)
Registered: 10/11/08
Posts: 10,917
Loc: Geospatial inversion
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Re: Asymmetry and Weight Lifting [Re: XUL]
#15869938 - 02/27/12 09:20 AM (3 months, 5 hours ago) |
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poland_syndrome ? Try having this as asymmetry
Your assymetry will be alright, just train your less dominant side. You're overthinking it a bit too much; don't strife for perfection
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Psychiatry is used for political reasons. (...) It explains why pathological governments always have considered dissidents as "mentally abnormal".
Edited by Beanhead (02/27/12 09:20 AM)
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XUL
student of exercise physiology
Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 6,213
Last seen: 4 days, 3 hours
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Re: Asymmetry and Weight Lifting [Re: Beanhead]
#15909225 - 03/06/12 01:04 PM (2 months, 23 days ago) |
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I have still been putting a 35 pound plate behind my dominant leg in order to stop my foot sliding. Its working like a charm. I have never ever felt such evenness during a squat. The next day I am usually very evenly sore too.
My bench press has also improved 10 fold. I used to treat the bench press as a open kinetic chain exercise. I know treat this lift strictly as a closed kinetic chain exercise.
What I mean by this is that I use form in such a way that my legs and entire torso is activated and unable to move. My hams are tight, my glutes are tight, my feet are planted, I keep my butt on the bench and maintain a lumbar curve which I allow to rise off the bench, I pinch my scapula together and I lower the bar with elbows at roughly a 45 degree angle. I also practice controlled breath. I dont exhale in one puff during my concentric contraction, rather I slowly exhale, which helps me maintain a rigid torso and stable scapula by avoiding destabilization of core pressure due to a sudden shrinkage of the diaphragm(exhaling in puffs). I have actually been feeling sore in my chest, which for most of my lifting career was rare due to lack of form.
I owe my bench press form to Mark Ripptoes videos. Those were an amazing find. He is well thought and an a very experience coach/lifter.
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Edited by XUL (03/06/12 01:10 PM)
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