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 Swan Song
Registered: 02/08/06
Posts: 522
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 do I have to be a member of the NAC? 
#15752690 - 02/02/12 04:49 PM (3 months, 24 days ago) |
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So from what I've read regarding the laws surrounding Lopho's in the US. if I live in the US and would like to order a L. Williamsii cactus to grow in my home, would I need to be a member of the Native American Church?
I am not that clear on all that but I do want to be careful. any help would be appreciated.
Sorry if this post is uninformed but I am fascinated by these cacti and would love to know more about them. 
Edited by Swan Song (02/02/12 05:06 PM)
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Ieponumos
Mycophile/Phytophile
Registered: 09/02/09
Posts: 4,052
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 Re: do I have to be a member of the NAC? [Re: Swan Song]
#15752763 - 02/02/12 05:06 PM (3 months, 24 days ago) |
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Quote:
lostinnc said:
So from what I've read regarding the laws surrounding Lopho's in the US. if I live in the US and would like to order a L. Williamsii cactus to grow in my home, would I need to be a member of the Native American Church?
Is it not legal at all in any way?
I am not that clear on all that but I do want to be careful. any help would be appreciated.
Sorry if this post is uninformed but I am fascinated by these cacti and would love to know more about them.
It is not legal unless you are a member of the NAC. You can, however, register your own branch with them for a measly sum of $2500.
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Swan Song
Registered: 02/08/06
Posts: 522
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Re: do I have to be a member of the NAC? [Re: Ieponumos]
#15752773 - 02/02/12 05:09 PM (3 months, 24 days ago) |
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understood. guess I'll just have to be happy with my Peruvian torches. 
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Swan Song
Registered: 02/08/06
Posts: 522
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Re: do I have to be a member of the NAC? [Re: Ieponumos]
#15752820 - 02/02/12 05:22 PM (3 months, 24 days ago) |
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Quote:
Ieponumos said:
Quote:
lostinnc said:
So from what I've read regarding the laws surrounding Lopho's in the US. if I live in the US and would like to order a L. Williamsii cactus to grow in my home, would I need to be a member of the Native American Church?
Is it not legal at all in any way?
I am not that clear on all that but I do want to be careful. any help would be appreciated.
Sorry if this post is uninformed but I am fascinated by these cacti and would love to know more about them.
It is not legal unless you are a member of the NAC. You can, however, register your own branch with them for a measly sum of $2500.
Ok, now according to the information on that link, I can obtain an AP card for 200$ that will allow me to carry a sacrament if I understood that right. Thats what I mean about not being clear on this issue. I was hoping somebody could clue me in. I am not good with legal interpretation.
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Ieponumos
Mycophile/Phytophile
Registered: 09/02/09
Posts: 4,052
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Re: do I have to be a member of the NAC? [Re: Swan Song]
#15752842 - 02/02/12 05:29 PM (3 months, 24 days ago) |
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Quote:
lostinnc said:
understood. guess I'll just have to be happy with my Peruvian torches.
Quote:
lostinnc said:
Quote:
Ieponumos said:
Quote:
lostinnc said:
So from what I've read regarding the laws surrounding Lopho's in the US. if I live in the US and would like to order a L. Williamsii cactus to grow in my home, would I need to be a member of the Native American Church?
Is it not legal at all in any way?
I am not that clear on all that but I do want to be careful. any help would be appreciated.
Sorry if this post is uninformed but I am fascinated by these cacti and would love to know more about them.
It is not legal unless you are a member of the NAC. You can, however, register your own branch with them for a measly sum of $2500.
Ok, now according to the information on that link, I can obtain an AP card for 200$ that will allow me to carry a sacrament if I understood that right. Thats what I mean about not being clear on this issue. I was hoping somebody could clue me in. I am not good with legal interpretation.
It says that, despite the fact that you are not a registered tribal member, you may present that card and it is supposed to justify your possession of said sacrament. THis doesn't mean the law won't give you a hard time and you'll probably have to fight some stupid legal battle (I don't know, I'm not a lawyer). Also,
Quote:
Note: Contributions for AP Cards and Independent Branches do not include legal counsel in the event of governance challenges. Our Attorneys and Founders provide the basis of an educational campaign to alert or inform governing bodies of the unique characteristics of the rights and protections of Independent Branches and their participants through an online knowledge-base and references to court precedents.
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naum
Registered: 10/09/07
Posts: 1,797
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Re: do I have to be a member of the NAC? [Re: Swan Song]
#15753157 - 02/02/12 06:24 PM (3 months, 24 days ago) |
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NAC members do not have the legal right to grow L. williamsii. The DEA has stated this time and time again. Unless you're prepared to fight a court battle I wouldn't even consider growing any species of Lophophora in the US. Yes, the "legal" ones are de facto illegal if not only for the trace amounts of mescaline they contain. If you want to go ahead and be the guinea pig be my guest.
That being said if you already cultivate mushrooms, marijuana, or poppies then what's a Lophophora on top of that? Also awareness about Lophophora is relatively low so it's much safer than the aforementioned things in some ways. Let's try to keep it that way.
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Swan Song
Registered: 02/08/06
Posts: 522
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Re: do I have to be a member of the NAC? [Re: naum]
#15754757 - 02/03/12 04:17 AM (3 months, 24 days ago) |
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got it, thanks to all for clearing that up for me.
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SuperD
Lophophiend
Registered: 10/05/03
Posts: 5,189
Loc: My stash box
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Re: do I have to be a member of the NAC? [Re: Swan Song]
#15754936 - 02/03/12 06:42 AM (3 months, 24 days ago) |
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The only thing I grow that's illegal is L. Williamsii so I feel fairly safe in the event law enforcement finds themselves in my home or green house. However they'd need a warrant for that anyway so I'd have to be doing something to gain their attention in the first place. The only time I've heard of a peyote bust (on a small scale) was when someone's pack from overseas was seized and they followed up with a search warrant for the home. The owner had a collection of peyote already growing so he got nailed for that too. Bottom line, it's relatively safe to grow once you get the seeds assuming you aren't already on LE's radar.
--------------------
I'd like you to meet my local drug dealer 
Bruce Campbell for a day! said: Go misidentify a mushroom please.
I'm a psilovibin' psilocybeing 
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psi
Registered: 09/05/99
Posts: 1,147
Loc: 
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Re: do I have to be a member of the NAC? [Re: naum]
#15756146 - 02/03/12 12:58 PM (3 months, 24 days ago) |
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Quote:
naum said:Yes, the "legal" ones are de facto illegal if not only for the trace amounts of mescaline they contain.
It seems like people often gloss over the fact that a plant or other material that contains a detectable amount of a controlled substance is generally a controlled substance itself. In Canada it's a bit different because there is a special exception for peyote, but I haven't been anything in Canadian or US law that exempts any other mescaline bearing cactus such as Trichocereus species. Doesn't mean your local garden store or anyone else is too likely to face criminal charges over selling/growing Trichocereus cacti of course.
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naum
Registered: 10/09/07
Posts: 1,797
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Re: do I have to be a member of the NAC? [Re: psi]
#15756194 - 02/03/12 01:17 PM (3 months, 23 days ago) |
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Right, but since Lophophora look very similar to one another they'll seize the cactus, test it for mescaline, and then declare it L. williamsii and/or a container of mescaline. Then you could get an expert witness to argue that it's not L. williamsii, but that would be difficult and costly and you'll still get stuck with the mescaline charge. Plus back when that law was written I believe L. williamsii was the only species scientifically accepted so it could be argued that the legislative intent was to make all species of Lophophora illegal.
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Swan Song
Registered: 02/08/06
Posts: 522
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Re: do I have to be a member of the NAC? [Re: naum]
#15756900 - 02/03/12 04:18 PM (3 months, 23 days ago) |
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I understand. I was curious about getting one and am still of coarse wanting one. but it looks like you have to know somebody or take your chances sneaking something through customs... yikes.
I dont have that kind of balls. Too much to risk and I like my low profile as far as LE is concerned.
I was once stationed in germany and during that time i visited holland a few times. I never even thought about buying it at the smart shops. I got everything else I wanted though. HE HE HE.
If I could only move there... it would be heaven.   
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