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 Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 67,603
Loc: underbelly
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 Re: When I am Depressed [Re: xFrockx]
#15760333 - 02/04/12 12:40 PM (3 months, 23 days ago) |
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What kind of nut doesn't care about how their body feels?
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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 4896744
Small Town Girl
 
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Re: When I am Depressed [Re: xFrockx]
#15760453 - 02/04/12 01:08 PM (3 months, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
xFrockx said:
You seem to care an awful lot about how your body feels. You mentioned in the other thread that feeling good is what you value. You even say you want your death to be as unpleasant to feel. Is this all you care about?
Obviously, what else can you care about besides how you feel? Our very experience is nothing more than feelings.
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Live your Life! 
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tribesman
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Re: When I am Depressed [Re: 4896744]
#15761237 - 02/04/12 04:22 PM (3 months, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
iThink said:
Quote:
tribesman said:
We have a saying here in England, "chin up lad" 
That seems like the equivalent of saying "just be happy". It is obviously not that easy, or everyone would be happy all of the time.
Sorry if it sounded so condescending, it's usually just offered as a show of support, and I take it to mean something more like "you'll get through this".
I'm not in any position to preach to you, not to take your own life, nor can anyone make that decision for you. I can't help but empathize with you and your suffering, and I just wanted to show my support without trying to pressure you either way.
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tempusvita
PLATONIC
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Re: When I am Depressed [Re: tribesman]
#15761287 - 02/04/12 04:33 PM (3 months, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
That seems like the equivalent of saying "just be happy". It is obviously not that easy, or everyone would be happy all of the time.
It's possible to just make yourself happy. If not, something is holding you back, like conflicting beliefs, and societal supression.
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tribesman
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I think it is possible to mask your unhappiness from others, but a person can't just will themselves happy.
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tempusvita
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Re: When I am Depressed [Re: tribesman]
#15761332 - 02/04/12 04:41 PM (3 months, 22 days ago) |
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Not in every situation. Like I don't think someone in a prisoner cell can really make himself happy. But for the typical citizen of the West?
And not just "will" youself happy through the same situation, but actually changing your situation and enviroment.
If you throw everything you were, everything you've done, and start fresh, with some acceptance for somethings and some stubborness for others, it can happen. Doing things in a radical new way, deliberately denying negative situations and pursing happy ones, ignoreing the judgement of others. I think its easier now than it has been for the last thousand of years.
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Edited by tempusvita (02/04/12 04:42 PM)
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 67,603
Loc: underbelly
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No person has any real clue what some other person can or cannot do emotionally.
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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tribesman
Knew it all along
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Re: When I am Depressed [Re: tempusvita] 1
#15761383 - 02/04/12 04:54 PM (3 months, 22 days ago) |
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Are you saying that as the world and our lives have got more intricate and complicated, finding inner peace has got easier ?
I doubt it, and there is a gulf between ~
"It's possible to just make yourself happy."
and
"If you throw everything you were, everything you've done, and start fresh, with some acceptance for somethings and some stubborness for others, it can happen. Doing things in a radical new way, deliberately denying negative situations and pursing happy ones, ignoreing the judgement of others"
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tribesman
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Re: When I am Depressed [Re: Icelander]
#15761423 - 02/04/12 05:03 PM (3 months, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
No person has any real clue what some other person can or cannot do emotionally.
I don't even know what I am capable of emotionally, but I have exceeded my own estimates in recent years.
I haven't had to do it alone though, I've had the support of close friends and family. It is hard for me to talk about my depression with those around me, and there is always an assertion that they won't understand. That's where some of the denizens of the Shroomery have been vital to my dealing with the dark. 
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tempusvita
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Re: When I am Depressed [Re: tribesman]
#15761465 - 02/04/12 05:11 PM (3 months, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
Are you saying that as the world and our lives have got more intricate and complicated, finding inner peace has got easier ?
Oh please, 99% of the population from two centuries ago to the begining of our species suffered back breaking work and utter poverty from dawn till dusk, and most of the population of this planet still does. I take it you haven't travel to a third world country before or you would not have said that. Intricacy and complication would gladly be taken over what most people suffer through daily.
Quote:
"It's possible to just make yourself happy."
and
"If you throw everything you were, everything you've done, and start fresh, with some acceptance for somethings and some stubborness for others, it can happen. Doing things in a radical new way, deliberately denying negative situations and pursing happy ones, ignoreing the judgement of others"
Yeah, the gulf is action. I assumed it would have been obvious thats was something necessary.
So yeah, it is probably impossible to just make yourself happy without action. Anyone who isn't willing to take action will be chained to depression.
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tribesman
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People will always find new and innovative ways to suffer. 
Here is a wiki page showing the suicide stats globally,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate
I can't see a correlation between third world countries and a high suicide rate. In all honesty, I think that when people are faced with the struggle to survive everyday they may have a higher appreciation for life.
Modern living makes somethings easier,
but it also brings a shit load of stress and aggravation to the table.
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Kickle
A Growing Hope
Registered: 12/16/06
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Quote:
tempusvita said:
Quote:
Are you saying that as the world and our lives have got more intricate and complicated, finding inner peace has got easier ?
Oh please, 99% of the population from two centuries ago to the begining of our species suffered back breaking work and utter poverty from dawn till dusk, and most of the population of this planet still does. I take it you haven't travel to a third world country before or you would not have said that. Intricacy and complication would gladly be taken over what most people suffer through daily.
You make a lot of statements about what others would or should do. Why is that?
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tribesman
Knew it all along
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Quote:
tempusvita said:
Yeah, the gulf is action. I assumed it would have been obvious thats was something necessary.
So yeah, it is probably impossible to just make yourself happy without action. Anyone who isn't willing to take action will be chained to depression.
Action would require that a person feel in control,
without that there is just a desire to act.
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tempusvita
PLATONIC
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Re: When I am Depressed [Re: tribesman]
#15761657 - 02/04/12 06:02 PM (3 months, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
tribesman said:
People will always find new and innovative ways to suffer.
Here is a wiki page showing the suicide stats globally,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate
I can't see a correlation between third world countries and a high suicide rate. In all honesty, I think that when people are faced with the struggle to survive everyday they may have a higher appreciation for life.
Well suicide rates are not a good measure, there is a lot of other factors other thatn plain unhappiness that goes into suicide. In cultures like Russia, suicide probably seems acceptable at a different threshold than a country like Iraq, where Islam is prevalent and suicide is a huge sin in Islam (unless your doing it to kill the infadel apparently). And I think its fairly obvious for Iraqi is on the whole a lot worse than Russian.
Quote:
Modern living makes somethings easier,
but it also brings a shit load of stress and aggravation to the table.
I have to say, you have got to be delusional if you really think life in a first world country is on average more depressing than life in a third world country.
I mean even a typical soul sucking, patty flipping job (that pays 8$ an hour) in a first would country is a thousand times better than say, sulphur mining (that pays a 10$ a day)?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-12301421
Would you really prefer to live in a slum in Argentina or Zimbabwe where brutality and poverty is an everyday occurance than a typical repressed suburb? Like what point are you trying to make?
Quote:
Action would require that a person feel in control,
without that there is just a desire to act.
The typical citizen of the West has an effective degree of control over their lives.
Have you ever been to a third world country?
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People who have helped me: VicariousGreg , Garfelt , occollegeboi , psilocybinjunkie , PrimalSoup
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Edited by tempusvita (02/04/12 06:16 PM)
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tribesman
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I watched a series on tv called "Slumming it.", it took a British architect/designer to the slums of Mumbai.
http://www.abc.net.au/tv/programs/kevinmccloudslummingit.htm
You might want to have a look, it painted a completely different picture.
In countries where suicide is considered a huge sin, wouldn't the denial of that form of release only add to the suffering ?
Asking if I would prefer to live in London or Sierra Leone is irrelevant as I am already tainted by my experience of first world abundance.
If you've never had it, you won't miss it.
Take a look at any articles you can find on "Slumming It", it was an interesting take on the lives of those poor unfortunate third worlders.
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tempusvita
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Re: When I am Depressed [Re: tribesman]
#15761791 - 02/04/12 06:36 PM (3 months, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
tribesman said:
I watched a series on tv called "Slumming it.", it took a British architect/designer to the slums of Mumbai.
http://www.abc.net.au/tv/programs/kevinmccloudslummingit.htm
You might want to have a look, it painted a completely different picture.
In countries where suicide is considered a huge sin, wouldn't the denial of that form of release only add to the suffering ?
Asking if I would prefer to live in London or Sierra Leone is irrelevant as I am already tainted by my experience of first world abundance.
If you've never had it, you won't miss it.
Take a look at any articles you can find on "Slumming It", it was an interesting take on the lives of those poor unfortunate third worlders.
I will check it out, but I have to say I am doubtful. I have been to Mexico, and Lebanon, and have been to slums and seen starving kids.
Its horrible, I mean its really really horrible. Thinking about the disfigured children I saw brings tears to my eyes.
People in the first world have problems, no doubt, but the experience left me with the impression people suffering in the West lack autocracy over their lives, when people in other places would do anything for a slimmer of the oppurtunities avalable to us.
But I will check it out.
--------------------
People who have helped me: VicariousGreg , Garfelt , occollegeboi , psilocybinjunkie , PrimalSoup
On a mission to pay it forward!
Edited by tempusvita (02/04/12 06:39 PM)
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tribesman
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Third world populations have something obvious to aspire to maybe. Alternately those from developed nations are on the top rung already, and so when faced with adversity and hardship, the means of escape is not so obvious.
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tribesman
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Re: When I am Depressed [Re: tribesman]
#15761915 - 02/04/12 07:07 PM (3 months, 22 days ago) |
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4896744
Small Town Girl
Registered: 03/06/10
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Loc: United States
Last seen: 15 days, 18 hours
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Quote:
tempusvita said:
Quote:
That seems like the equivalent of saying "just be happy". It is obviously not that easy, or everyone would be happy all of the time.
It's possible to just make yourself happy. If not, something is holding you back, like conflicting beliefs, and societal supression.
So are you happy all of the time? You don't have bad moods?
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Live your Life!
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tempusvita
PLATONIC
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Re: When I am Depressed [Re: 4896744]
#15763935 - 02/05/12 10:03 AM (3 months, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
iThink said:
Quote:
tempusvita said:
Quote:
That seems like the equivalent of saying "just be happy". It is obviously not that easy, or everyone would be happy all of the time.
It's possible to just make yourself happy. If not, something is holding you back, like conflicting beliefs, and societal supression.
So are you happy all of the time? You don't have bad moods?
No, I didn't mean for it to sound like that. Anyone who tells you they don't have bad moods occasionally is lying. I meant like, happiness is my default emotion. It's cause I made it that way.
Friends, freedom and an examined life = the keys to happiness
I screened and made friends, started a (now successful) business, and read a lot of philosophy. I just turned 20 btw
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People who have helped me: VicariousGreg , Garfelt , occollegeboi , psilocybinjunkie , PrimalSoup
On a mission to pay it forward!
Edited by tempusvita (02/05/12 10:05 AM)
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