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 Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
 
Registered: 04/20/01
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 Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo
#15671006 - 01/15/12 07:09 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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What did you think about the Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc.? I thought overall, it was very positive. There was certainly some bullshit, like the prick DEA agent who accidentally ingested LSD during a acid lab dismantling, who said that the nurse at the hospital told him that had he not taken Valium, he would have died? WTF. Really? There's no way that really happened unless the nurse didn't know what she was talking about either. The DEA agent probably knows its bullshit, but had to throw some lies into his story, since it's what they do. They don't know anything else.
But overall it was very positive. They covered the Yage ceremonies pretty well. They talked about the psilocybin treatment for cluster headaches well. They did a good job with the ibogaine treatments for heroin addiction. They did a great job with the end of life LSD treatments. I thought it was terrific for the most part. You should check it out.
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
Edited by Learyfan (02/12/12 04:57 PM)
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realfuzzhead
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 Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan] 1
#15671010 - 01/15/12 07:10 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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thanks for reminding me, I was wanting to watch this.
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The Christian God is but an ever shrinking pocket of scientific ignorance.
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 AcidMonster
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: realfuzzhead] 1
#15671017 - 01/15/12 07:12 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Anyone have a link? I don't watch TV but I'd like to check it out.
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shroomie_glen
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: AcidMonster]
#15671031 - 01/15/12 07:16 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Yes links please... I don't get the opportunity to see tv much these days...
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No. No, man. Shit, no man. I believe you'd get your ass kicked sayin' somethin' like that man.
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Shpongle1
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: realfuzzhead] 3
#15671032 - 01/15/12 07:16 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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"That...that ceiling fan... It's Hwhiter than Hwhite! It's the Hwhitest Hwhite that hwhite could be!"
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There are more people imprisoned for the commission of drug offenses in the United States - close to 500,000 - than are incarcerated in England, France, Germany, and Japan for all crimes combined. Examined in another way, the United States has 100,000 more people incarcerated for nonviolent drug offenses than all the countries of the European Union combined, despite the fact that the European Union has 100 million more citizens. 
 - "Drugs and Drug Policy: The Control of Consciousness Alteration, 2007.
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PeterPanda209
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Shpongle1]
#15671043 - 01/15/12 07:19 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Been waiting for this one  I've heard it's perfect and unbiased so I'm really excited to watch it here shortly
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 superhigh
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan] 1
#15671054 - 01/15/12 07:21 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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AcidMonster
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: superhigh]
#15671067 - 01/15/12 07:25 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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On this note someone was watching some tv show (H@ was in the bottom right corner) and it was about ayahuasca in a tribe, did not catch which one but a neuroscienntist of some sort took and measured brain activity while he was in the state. Very interesting and positive. Downside was the commentator was paraphrasing things like a retard would.
The scientist shed a bright light on the subject matter and I was happy to have caught part of this show.
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superhigh
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15671071 - 01/15/12 07:25 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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The U.K. Nat Geo has a program called LSD: Trip to Hell?
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love2shpongleIRL
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15671085 - 01/15/12 07:29 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Thanks for reminding me. I totally forgot about this show and haven't seen any episodes from it's second season.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: PeterPanda209]
#15671089 - 01/15/12 07:29 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
PeterPanda209 said:
Been waiting for this one I've heard it's perfect and unbiased so I'm really excited to watch it here shortly
It's definitely not unbiased. They basically shitted all over the concept of taking psychedelics recreationally, but they praised the benefits of taking it for medicinal purposes.
No link yet. It just got done airing for the first time.
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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AcidMonster
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15671103 - 01/15/12 07:33 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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You would think that leaving out the recreational purpose is how to make a movement start rolling. Think of marijuana legalization. It's all about the clinical beneficiary. I like that point of view personally. I think it would sit more at ease with the closed minded folk.
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millzy
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15671110 - 01/15/12 07:34 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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all of the other ones have seemed biased to me. i'd watch this one though.
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It is sometimes an appropriate response to reality to go insane.- Philip K. Dick
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trANce
foolish
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: superhigh]
#15671181 - 01/15/12 07:52 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
superhigh said:
The U.K. Nat Geo has a program called LSD: Trip to Hell?
 thax for the link
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superhigh
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: trANce]
#15671195 - 01/15/12 07:56 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Your welcome. 
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Shpongle1
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan] 1
#15671236 - 01/15/12 08:07 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Learyfan said:
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There are more people imprisoned for the commission of drug offenses in the United States - close to 500,000 - than are incarcerated in England, France, Germany, and Japan for all crimes combined. Examined in another way, the United States has 100,000 more people incarcerated for nonviolent drug offenses than all the countries of the European Union combined, despite the fact that the European Union has 100 million more citizens.
- "Drugs and Drug Policy: The Control of Consciousness Alteration, 2007.
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: AcidMonster]
#15671324 - 01/15/12 08:30 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
AcidMonster said:
You would think that leaving out the recreational purpose is how to make a movement start rolling. Think of marijuana legalization. It's all about the clinical beneficiary. I like that point of view personally. I think it would sit more at ease with the closed minded folk.
Oh yeah, absolutely. That's why I'm fine with it for the most part. It's a step in the right direction.
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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Solo_Dolo
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15671326 - 01/15/12 08:31 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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The one last week on Ecstasy was great!Good show!
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My only dream is that yours never come true.
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PeterPanda209
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan] 1
#15671328 - 01/15/12 08:33 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Learyfan said:
It's definitely not unbiased. They basically shitted all over the concept of taking psychedelics recreationally, but they praised the benefits of taking it for medicinal purposes.
You know, I feel you... But I mean if we ever want to even consider a better view on the chems we like to play with the best route seems to be getting them accepted as medicinal first. So when they show an average white male going through pain where he can't find any help then show him eat his home grown fungi and feel so much better it might get a better response than you and I walking through the woods staring at trees
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Anthony
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15671351 - 01/15/12 08:38 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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about to watch this in 20 mins! glad to hear they did a good job.
I've watched a few other drugs inc. episodes, and there is always some bullshit mixed in with the truth. Just a lot of blatantly wrong statements.
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CaptainAhab
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15671439 - 01/15/12 08:57 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Learyfan said:
who said that the nurse at the hospital told him that had he not taken Valium, he would have died? WTF. Really? There's no way that really happened unless the nurse didn't know what she was talking about either.
I hate to be the one to tell you this, but most nurses are morons.
Complete and utter idiocy.
I went to nursing school*.
*and got out while the getting was good.
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claraclairvoyant
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: superhigh]
#15671449 - 01/15/12 09:00 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
superhigh said:
Clip. Magic Mushroom Medicine
http://video.nationalgeographic.com/video/player/national-geographic-channel/shows/drugs-inc/ngc-mushroom-medicine.html
I've read about that before as I was fucking around on the internet trying to find information on migraines. I wish that clip would've gotten into the "why" and "how"
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love2shpongleIRL
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: CaptainAhab]
#15671469 - 01/15/12 09:05 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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LOL yup, what do you call a person who completed medical school but finished at the bottom of his/her class? Doctor...
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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CaptainAhab
Honky
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15671490 - 01/15/12 09:06 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
love2shpongleIRL said:
LOL yup, what do you call a person who completed medical school but finished at the bottom of his/her class? Doctor...
It's even worse than that.
I've seen fence posts outsmart teams of nurses, before.
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2bakednate
Connect & Grow
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: CaptainAhab]
#15671516 - 01/15/12 09:15 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Im watching it right now, it started 15 minutes ago.
I really want to go to the healing center in chimbre!
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"The reason is for us all"
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trANce
foolish
Registered: 11/20/11
Posts: 5,754
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: 2bakednate]
#15671526 - 01/15/12 09:18 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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next sunday the ketamine episode is coming on
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Anthony
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: trANce] 2
#15671554 - 01/15/12 09:27 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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yea the DEA agent part of the show is ridiculous. "taking lsd is like playing russian roulette. you never know when the gun's gonna go bang"
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PeterPanda209
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: trANce]
#15671557 - 01/15/12 09:28 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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The cop took like 60mg of LSD and didn't die that's all I got out of his LSD is bad mmmmkay speech
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superhigh
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: PeterPanda209]
#15671560 - 01/15/12 09:29 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
PeterPanda209 said:
The cop took like 60mg of LSD and didn't die that's all I got out of his LSD is bad mmmmkay speech
60,000 mcg?
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PeterPanda209
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: superhigh]
#15671569 - 01/15/12 09:31 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Yep he said "average dose of LSD on the street is 60mcg I accidentally took 1,000 doses worth"
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superhigh
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: PeterPanda209] 1
#15671574 - 01/15/12 09:33 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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LOL he did a thumbprint.
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PeterPanda209
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: superhigh]
#15671582 - 01/15/12 09:36 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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More like a chin print! He dry shaved it up and it got into contact with broken skin
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trANce
foolish
Registered: 11/20/11
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: PeterPanda209]
#15671588 - 01/15/12 09:39 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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he said he got fried tho from that one dose
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SubMuncher
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: superhigh]
#15671593 - 01/15/12 09:39 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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I wonder if he changed his bad ways after it..
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Solo_Dolo
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: SubMuncher]
#15671606 - 01/15/12 09:42 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Lol dude tripped for 24 hours in a hospital room...anyone would be fucked up from that.
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My only dream is that yours never come true.
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Solo_Dolo
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Solo_Dolo]
#15671630 - 01/15/12 09:48 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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This guy hates to trip on shrooms so bad lol...they cure his cluster headaches.Gotta trip once every 2 months.
Thats sick tho!
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My only dream is that yours never come true.
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Solo_Dolo
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Solo_Dolo] 2
#15671635 - 01/15/12 09:50 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Oh and his daughter is smoking hot!!
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My only dream is that yours never come true.
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trANce
foolish
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Solo_Dolo]
#15671638 - 01/15/12 09:50 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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lol solo_dolo
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ButteredToast
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Solo_Dolo]
#15671650 - 01/15/12 09:52 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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I'm watching it right now.
The guy with cluster headaches kept going on about how he was dreading his next mushroom trip.. next thing I know he's rolling around in bed with the  look on his face tripping balls, obviously enjoying it.
..and his daughter is bangin'
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PeterPanda209
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: ButteredToast]
#15671666 - 01/15/12 09:56 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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200mcg capsule. Fantastic. Yessss please.
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trANce
foolish
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: PeterPanda209]
#15671686 - 01/15/12 10:00 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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drugs inc is off but you guys should watch sons of guns, they have some pretty sick shit going on i cant even lie
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ButteredToast
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: trANce]
#15671690 - 01/15/12 10:03 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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SubMuncher
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: ButteredToast]
#15671702 - 01/15/12 10:04 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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No links? I looked but cant find anything but clips
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Ghostwriter
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: SubMuncher]
#15671726 - 01/15/12 10:12 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Yeah that lsd and brain damage and death shit was bullshit!
But the ibogaine, and mushroom part was cool as hell.
The ayahusca part could of been better
All in all i would ive it 6 out of 10
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STARVE THE EGO, FEED THE SOUL
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Dimethyltryptamine
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: SubMuncher]
#15671730 - 01/15/12 10:14 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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They deffinatley did a great job on most of it but them putting that DEA agent getting dosed and saying he almost died and it was terrible kinda pissed me of..
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 Steal Your Face
 Turn on.Tune in.Drop out.
 Top 6: DMT, Mushrooms, LSD, Ketamine, Morphine, 2ci.
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cubes4cancer
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: ButteredToast]
#15671762 - 01/15/12 10:20 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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indeed,the daughter is hot!!
but what was the deal with the mushies he had growin,so small.
i mean is that what suma these spore sites are selling or is it due to his care/conditions??or the lack of?
not to ragg on online spores or cause a fuss,but just a couple of my local fieldies = his whole 8 cake flush,really whats the deal??
if  sizes do mean the more potent they are, hes got some kickass fruits..
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$$"IM ON A RAMAN NOODLE EVERY NIGHT BUDGET"$$
  
ROGERRABBIT: P cubensis will grow on stuffed animals, bibles, quarter pounds of weed, bras, etc.
In other words,it's hard to fuck up a cube grow.
RR
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PeterPanda209
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: cubes4cancer]
#15671776 - 01/15/12 10:24 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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He only needs like 6 doses a year. He is fine with his cakes
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cubes4cancer
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: cubes4cancer]
#15671795 - 01/15/12 10:28 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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oh yeah,what species could they have been possibly?
and could he had just been pickin too early?
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$$"IM ON A RAMAN NOODLE EVERY NIGHT BUDGET"$$
ROGERRABBIT: P cubensis will grow on stuffed animals, bibles, quarter pounds of weed, bras, etc.
In other words,it's hard to fuck up a cube grow.
RR
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psychotropical
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15671803 - 01/15/12 10:29 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Yeah I didn't come away thinking it was that positive. With the ayuhasca session, they focused on the one woman who was puking half the time, and then they showed the agent with the "brain damage" from LSD, then they showed a guy freaking out and having seizures from ibogane. They did show some positives, like the guy growing his own shrooms and getting relief from cluster headaches and the cancer patient who said LSD helped her overcome her fear of death. But it still seems like most viewers would have walked away from that show with the message "hallucinogens are so extremely dangerous they far outweigh the benefits". I think the "don't try this at home" aspect was a little overplayed.
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riverdweller
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: AcidMonster]
#15671827 - 01/15/12 10:37 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
AcidMonster said:
You would think that leaving out the recreational purpose is how to make a movement start rolling. Think of marijuana legalization. It's all about the clinical beneficiary. I like that point of view personally. I think it would sit more at ease with the closed minded folk.
actually the medical marijuana movement should never have been the warhorse for legalization. These are issues completely unrelated. Maybe
the snowjob gets the old snow ball running, but in what direction and at what cost.
Other than that, I just watched the show and enjoyed it.
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I'm still here 
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Divinity
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: cubes4cancer]
#15671852 - 01/15/12 10:44 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
cubes4cancer said:
oh yeah,what species could they have been possibly?
and could he had just been pickin too early?
Any species. A cubes a cube(besides PE)
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cubes4cancer
C0nn0IssuR Of s0rtS
Registered: 01/11/12
Posts: 1,267
Loc: thiswashereandthatwaswhen
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Divinity]
#15671874 - 01/15/12 10:51 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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yea i know this,its just some jeans of the same size, but different brand fit better,genetics i assume..
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$$"IM ON A RAMAN NOODLE EVERY NIGHT BUDGET"$$
ROGERRABBIT: P cubensis will grow on stuffed animals, bibles, quarter pounds of weed, bras, etc.
In other words,it's hard to fuck up a cube grow.
RR
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AcidMonster
Mindful Warrior
Registered: 07/13/11
Posts: 472
Loc: OR
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: riverdweller]
#15671884 - 01/15/12 10:53 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
riverdweller said:
Quote:
AcidMonster said:
You would think that leaving out the recreational purpose is how to make a movement start rolling. Think of marijuana legalization. It's all about the clinical beneficiary. I like that point of view personally. I think it would sit more at ease with the closed minded folk.
actually the medical marijuana movement should never have been the warhorse for legalization. These are issues completely unrelated. Maybe
the snowjob gets the old snow ball running, but in what direction and at what cost.
Other than that, I just watched the show and enjoyed it.
To me that's the most effective way I could see medical/legalized/decriminalized marijuana in place. What other angle do you think would be more effective? I think medicinally is the only angle towards reversing the war on drugs.
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Demonic_Chronic
Soul Surfin Psychonaut
Registered: 08/10/08
Posts: 1,490
Loc: The Grid
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: AcidMonster]
#15671889 - 01/15/12 10:55 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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That guy dan who grew mushrooms was a noob lawls. still stuck on the pf tek =p
They didnt totally bash everything too which was nice.
DC
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"Evolution. Evolution is the greatest force in the material world. Evolution will provide us the next step in intelligent life. But it will come from somewhere unexpected."
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday. Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery and today is a gift. Thats why its called the present.
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Solo_Dolo
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Demonic_Chronic]
#15671917 - 01/15/12 11:02 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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What yall talking about?...the cop guy did like an equivilent of like 1,000+ doses.Its quiet possible he couldve had sometypes of long term damage.
I thought the show portrayed it pretty well.
Whats the deal with the ibogaine?Anyone know people who have tried that shit before?
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My only dream is that yours never come true.
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Demonic_Chronic
Soul Surfin Psychonaut
Registered: 08/10/08
Posts: 1,490
Loc: The Grid
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Solo_Dolo]
#15671924 - 01/15/12 11:04 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Solo_Dolo said:
What yall talking about?...the cop guy did like an equivilent of like 1,000+ doses.Its quiet possible he couldve had sometypes of long term damage.
I thought the show portrayed it pretty well.
Whats the deal with the ibogaine?Anyone know people who have tried that shit before?
I wish i could try some ibogaine, ive done research on it and never realized to be a strong psychedelic. You never hear about it.
DC
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"Evolution. Evolution is the greatest force in the material world. Evolution will provide us the next step in intelligent life. But it will come from somewhere unexpected."
Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday. Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery and today is a gift. Thats why its called the present.
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Dimethyltryptamine
Psilocybin Lover
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Demonic_Chronic]
#15672002 - 01/15/12 11:48 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Next weeks ketamine episode is gonna be intresting..I have a felling there gonna make it out to be the worst drug in the world
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Steal Your Face
Turn on.Tune in.Drop out.
Top 6: DMT, Mushrooms, LSD, Ketamine, Morphine, 2ci.
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runningfox2002
Green Thumb
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First time i heard of ibogaine was on Law and Order lol...Africa in origin..etc.
I hate there's only clips and not online to watch the whole show.
As far as the  kinda drugs...personally, i'd love if they made them legal for religious purposes. Go to your priest of whatever religion you are(atheists...on your own :P), tell him you want to do a vision quest, expand your thoughts of your existance, etc, and they could somehow hand out spiritual sized doses. I dunno...just an idea
I'm more for the spiritual aspect of them. Something clicked one day when I was watching xfiles and an indian character told Mulder he should have the name running fox. Im partially some indian and an ex runner..so..it just fit. makes my experiences mean more.
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 ...to have some fun?  Nobody knows
Anything I say or talk about is strictly for my own search of knowledge and to satisfy my thirst of curiosity.
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eaSe
E@Se
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Shpongle1]
#15672063 - 01/16/12 12:22 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Shpongle1 said:
"That...that ceiling fan... It's Hwhiter than Hwhite! It's the Hwhitest Hwhite that hwhite could be!"
LMAO! Glad im not the only one who found that part hilarious!
I wish they would have discussed othr hallucinogens like mescaline and rc's, but the show was very interesting.
I wonder what kind of jail time the people behind that LSD lab got after being busted, especially since that DEA agent was accidently dosed so high.
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"Man, you go through life, you try to be nice to people, you struggle to resist the urge to punch 'em in the face, and for what?
For some pimpily little puke! To treat you like dirt! unless youre on a teeeam! Well I'm better than dirt. Well, most kinds of dirt, not that fancy store-bought dirt...That stuffs loaded with nutrients, I can't compete with that stuff."
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Nature Boy
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: PeterPanda209] 3
#15672491 - 01/16/12 04:57 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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I watched the show...man it pissed me off. Referred to Ayahuasca as a "narcotic", made it out to be all kinds of dangerous. Same treatment with LSD, still demonizing it and this show was just another in a long line of misinformation, scare tactic and propaganda.
The "patient" with the cluster headaches is going about "self-medicating" with mushrooms all wrong. He is taking enough to trip uncomfortably every two months. He should be sub-clinically dosing / micro dosing himself by taking ONE or TWO of his capsules three times a week. He won't trip, will have minimal to NO nausea, and no headaches. That man is ill-informed because his own doctors have no clue and he has no good resource or hasn't bothered to discover for himself a better way.
Overall, I grimaced throughout the whole show...it made me really angry that the producers once again failed to present an UNBIASED well informed and accurate depiction of the risks/benefits of the psychedelics they featured.
N.B.
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All submitted posts are by Someone Who Isn't Me (SWIM) - and in any event are works of pure fiction or outright lies. Any information, statement, or assertion contained therein should be considered pure unadulterated bullshit. Note well: Sorry, but I no longer answer PM's unless you are a long-time trusted friend, so don't bother. If you have a question, ask it in the appropriate thread...no exceptions. Anyone with less than 1,000 posts is automatically assumed to be a cop.
 
Edited by Nature Boy (04/28/12 09:27 AM)
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aNeway2sayHooray
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Nature Boy]
#15672504 - 01/16/12 05:09 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Nature Boy said:
I watched the show...man it pissed me off. Referred to Ayahuasca as a "narcotic", made it out to be all kinds of dangerous. Same treatment with LSD, still demonizing it and this show was just another in a long line of misinformation, scare tactic and propaganda. Sure glad my wife didn't see it, as SOME DAY I'd like her to perhaps try some changa.
The asshole with the cluster headaches is going about "self-medicating" with mushrooms all wrong. He is taking enough to trip uncomfortably every two months. He should be sub-clinically dosing / micro dosing himself by taking ONE or TWO of his capsules three times a week. He won't trip, will have minimal to NO nausea, and no headaches. That man is ill-informed because his own doctors have no clue and he has no good resource or hasn't bothered to discover for himself a better way.
Overall, I grimaced throughout the whole show...it made me really angry that the producers once again failed to present an UNBIASED well informed and accurate depiction of the risks/benefits of the psychedelics they featured.
N.B.
I completely agree and stressed some of the same concerns in the last Drugs,Inc thread. Next weeks ketamine episode will probably be more of the same.
I have seen similar shows do an even worse job of representing these drugs, that is for sure. But IMO Drugs,Inc is nothing more than mindless entertainment. It has a lot of drug imagery and shows some of the people who use these substances and I like seeing that, purely as entertainment.
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Mad_Larkin said: Death is just a thang.
MrJellineck said: Profits, prophets. That's all you jews think about.
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: aNeway2sayHooray]
#15672543 - 01/16/12 05:29 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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 I giggled at the mushroom guy's PF Tek cakes too. Not that I made it much further when I grew. It was just funny though. I wonder if he learned to grow from The Shroomery. Maybe he's a member here.
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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AbstraKt_I_Am
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan] 1
#15672548 - 01/16/12 05:33 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Learyfan said:
I giggled at the mushroom guy's PF Tek cakes too. Not that I made it much further when I grew. It was just funny though. I wonder if he learned to grow from The Shroomery. Maybe he's a member here.
I wouldn't hold it past him.See alot of older people and what not who just stop here, learn to grow or have some questions and then move on. Pathetic thing is he got more yield off those Pf cakes then I did from 8 mono's recently that gave me hell with their inferior MS genetics lol.
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Fair use of Rating's and Respect in the Pub? Lololololol.
Edited by AbstraKt_I_Am (01/16/12 05:34 AM)
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aNeway2sayHooray
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan] 1
#15672582 - 01/16/12 05:59 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Learyfan said:
I giggled at the mushroom guy's PF Tek cakes too. Not that I made it much further when I grew. It was just funny though. I wonder if he learned to grow from The Shroomery. Maybe he's a member here.
I was wodnering the same thing after I saw his PF tek and the way he stored his dried mushrooms.
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Mad_Larkin said: Death is just a thang.
MrJellineck said: Profits, prophets. That's all you jews think about.
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Its Pat
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: superhigh] 1
#15672595 - 01/16/12 06:06 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
superhigh said:
The U.K. Nat Geo has a program called LSD: Trip to Hell?
They also have that one hour show "Should I smoke Dope". Its where they follow some lassee who's never smoked pot into Amsterdam when she works at a Cafe and starts to experiment with Marijuana. I didn't like how they titled the show. Dope can mean many different things and has a negative connotation associated with it.
I just went by the NatGeo website and it has already started to peepee me off.
One thing I hate about Hollywood and people who write for TV Shows and Movies is how much bullshit they convey to the innocent masses who are more than ignorant on any subject that the writers present.
Think about it for a few momentitos. An investigative journalist will do his/her's due dillegence (Hopefully) in researching and presenting their story. That on the other hand compounded by political motivations a little further up, usually editors and such, can skew the story to support a pro nazi dea stance.
That and the writers can really screw-up what they are writing. Like someone mentioning above that the TV show mentioned Ayahuasca was a Narcotic. To us that is an obvious screw-up. But to the lay-person it makes perfect sense since anything that is illegal drug wise is a Narcotic.
They should remake this show but have a handful of us from HERE write the show
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BigUpRadio
WorldReggaeShow
DreaderThanDread - Listen!
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Solo_Dolo
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Its Pat]
#15672666 - 01/16/12 06:53 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Lol.Thats as unbiased as a show is gonna get.
It just makes you guys mad cuz all you want to hear is that all drugs are good and harmless for everyone,come on.lol
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My only dream is that yours never come true.
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Nature Boy
Stranger than most
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Solo_Dolo]
#15672732 - 01/16/12 07:23 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Solo_Dolo said:
Lol.Thats as unbiased as a show is gonna get.
It just makes you guys mad cuz all you want to hear is that all drugs are good and harmless for everyone,come on.lol
Not true. Not true at all. What I would love to see - and what needs to be seen as widely as this Drugs, Inc. propaganda and fear mongering - is an appraisal based upon professionally designed research and findings, academic, and apolitical SCIENCE. THEN you would see an entirely different assessment of the risks/rewards, benefits, and alternatives to the medical and psychological value of these compounds, not to mention the relative innocuousness of the "natural" hallucinogens compared to the big pharma alternatives.
N.B.
--------------------
All submitted posts are by Someone Who Isn't Me (SWIM) - and in any event are works of pure fiction or outright lies. Any information, statement, or assertion contained therein should be considered pure unadulterated bullshit. Note well: Sorry, but I no longer answer PM's unless you are a long-time trusted friend, so don't bother. If you have a question, ask it in the appropriate thread...no exceptions. Anyone with less than 1,000 posts is automatically assumed to be a cop.
Edited by Nature Boy (01/16/12 07:25 AM)
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
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Posts: 4,784
Last seen: 29 days, 21 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15672797 - 01/16/12 07:56 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Okay, now I remember why I forgot about this show in the first place. Couldn't get this particular episode so I watched the one on ecstasy last night and there is so much bad information it's laughable. I get too frustrated watching things like this, fluctuates from good to bad way too much. Shit, even the abc doc on ecstasy was more unbiased. There was no mix of accurate and inaccurate info like the natgeo production.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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psychotropical
Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 235
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: eaSe] 1
#15672804 - 01/16/12 07:56 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Shpongle1 said:
"That...that ceiling fan... It's Hwhiter than Hwhite! It's the Hwhitest Hwhite that hwhite could be!"
Yeah I got a kick out of that too, especially when he said "Maybe this is how things really are!" Lol, he'll figure it out eventually...
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Solo_Dolo
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Posts: 1,038
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Nature Boy]
#15672836 - 01/16/12 08:06 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Nature Boy said:
Quote:
Solo_Dolo said:
Lol.Thats as unbiased as a show is gonna get.
It just makes you guys mad cuz all you want to hear is that all drugs are good and harmless for everyone,come on.lol
Not true. Not true at all. What I would love to see - and what needs to be seen as widely as this Drugs, Inc. propaganda and fear mongering - is an appraisal based upon professionally designed research and findings, academic, and apolitical SCIENCE. THEN you would see an entirely different assessment of the risks/rewards, benefits, and alternatives to the medical and psychological value of these compounds, not to mention the relative innocuousness of the "natural" hallucinogens compared to the big pharma alternatives.
N.B.
I just failed to see this as "fear mongering" or propaganda.Like what was the problem?idk...even my non-drug user friends who have watched the show have told me that it portrays them in a good light and are more inclined to experiment with mdma or shrooms/lsd.Idk.Just think peeps here hold these drugs in such a way that no matter how any show is done yall have problems with it.lol
Its like watching a movie that was based from a book with a friend who loved the book.Like shut up we know you are gonna say "oh whatever the book was better and shit is wack"..lol ot something along those lines.
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My only dream is that yours never come true.
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Solo_Dolo] 1
#15672848 - 01/16/12 08:10 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Check out "Ecstasy rising" for a good example of a mainstream drug doc. With "Drugs inc" there is a mix of good,bad and plain 'ol misinformation. I cannot comment on the latest episode though, only the first season and the ecstasy episode.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
Edited by love2shpongleIRL (01/16/12 08:13 AM)
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aNeway2sayHooray
Spinning Into Place
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Posts: 6,988
Loc: Orphic Trench
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: psychotropical]
#15672905 - 01/16/12 08:26 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
psychotropical said:
Quote:
Shpongle1 said:
"That...that ceiling fan... It's Hwhiter than Hwhite! It's the Hwhitest Hwhite that hwhite could be!"
Yeah I got a kick out of that too, especially when he said "Maybe this is how things really are!" Lol, he'll figure it out eventually...
That was my favorite part. 
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Mad_Larkin said: Death is just a thang.
MrJellineck said: Profits, prophets. That's all you jews think about.
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Shpongle1
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: aNeway2sayHooray]
#15673400 - 01/16/12 10:59 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Anybody here remember Terence McKenna saying that ayahuasca makes language able to be beheld, or in other words, visible? I was intrigued by the black chick tripping on ayahuasca cause I'm pretty sure that she was figuring that out for herself...
When she was singing, she'd let out a couple notes and then say "Oooh..." with a wide eyed look as she appeared to "follow" the visible sound across the room with her eyes. I could be wrong about that, but as I watched it I heard Terence's voice echo in my head and feel fairly confident that that is what she was experiencing.
Not sure if anyone else noticed that or thought anything of it. Sounds like it would be pretty awesome to experience though.
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There are more people imprisoned for the commission of drug offenses in the United States - close to 500,000 - than are incarcerated in England, France, Germany, and Japan for all crimes combined. Examined in another way, the United States has 100,000 more people incarcerated for nonviolent drug offenses than all the countries of the European Union combined, despite the fact that the European Union has 100 million more citizens.
- "Drugs and Drug Policy: The Control of Consciousness Alteration, 2007.
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15673507 - 01/16/12 11:44 AM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
love2shpongleIRL said:
Check out "Ecstasy rising" for a good example of a mainstream drug doc.
That exactly what I was going to say. The LSD episode of "Histories Mysteries" on the History Channel was very unbiased as well. That one and "Ecstasy Rising" are, I think, the ONLY two non-biased drug shows I have ever seen.
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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psychotropical
Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 235
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Shpongle1]
#15673588 - 01/16/12 12:08 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Quote:
Shpongle1 said:
Anybody here remember Terence McKenna saying that ayahuasca makes language able to be beheld, or in other words, visible? I was intrigued by the black chick tripping on ayahuasca cause I'm pretty sure that she was figuring that out for herself...
When she was singing, she'd let out a couple notes and then say "Oooh..." with a wide eyed look as she appeared to "follow" the visible sound across the room with her eyes. I could be wrong about that, but as I watched it I heard Terence's voice echo in my head and feel fairly confident that that is what she was experiencing.
Not sure if anyone else noticed that or thought anything of it. Sounds like it would be pretty awesome to experience though.
Yeah no doubt that in between all the puking she was experiencing something pretty profound. Hard to say looking at it from the outside. These type of experiences can only be described as ineffable. Any time I've tried to put any of it into words, I just watch my words fall flat on the floor. Normal language such as English is woefully inadequate at that level.
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love2shpongleIRL
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: psychotropical]
#15673648 - 01/16/12 12:27 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Anyone got a torrent or stream link? I cannot find this episode anywhere.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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psychotropical
Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 235
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo *DELETED* [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15673740 - 01/16/12 12:52 PM (4 months, 11 days ago) |
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Post deleted by psychotropicalReason for deletion: .
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love2shpongleIRL
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: psychotropical]
#15675048 - 01/16/12 05:55 PM (4 months, 10 days ago) |
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Know what channel by chance? Still no streams or torrents up, found a rapidshare link but that turned out to be a fake.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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babydoll
trippy bitch
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15675063 - 01/16/12 05:58 PM (4 months, 10 days ago) |
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i missed it when is it on again?
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He takes the needle from the vein
the melody travels out of the skin
violins burn with shrieking
harps cut the flesh
he has opened his eyes
but he is not awake
"I wouldn't recommend sex, drugs, or insanity for everyone, but they've always worked for me."
my kitty love
the babydoll song by newgui ;] hehehe
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underfliptown
Just another person.
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: babydoll]
#15675096 - 01/16/12 06:06 PM (4 months, 10 days ago) |
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Is there any links yet?
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15675107 - 01/16/12 06:09 PM (4 months, 10 days ago) |
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Nope, not yet. The only ones I have come across have been fakes. What a bummer, even though the series as a whole has sucked I really want to see this.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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EvolveShrooms
Oneness and Shit
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15675177 - 01/16/12 06:28 PM (4 months, 10 days ago) |
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8 pm Western mountain time!!!
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You've only won when you realize there is no game.
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BlindSophist
drunken preacher
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan] 1
#15675201 - 01/16/12 06:34 PM (4 months, 10 days ago) |
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Quote:
Learyfan said:
There was certainly some bullshit, like the prick DEA agent who accidentally ingested LSD during a acid lab dismantling, who said that the nurse at the hospital told him that had he not taken Valium, he would have died? WTF. Really? There's no way that really happened unless the nurse didn't know what she was talking about either. The DEA agent probably knows its bullshit, but had to throw some lies into his story, since it's what they do. They don't know anything else.
I can only see this being true if he ingested truly massive amounts and was seizing up outta control.
Either way, prick shoulda minded his own business in the first place. 
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Love of one is a barbarism; for it is exercised at the expense of all others. The love of God, too.
--Friedrich Nietzsche
  
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kintos
Stranger
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: BlindSophist]
#15675265 - 01/16/12 06:54 PM (4 months, 10 days ago) |
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the dea agents story was fishy as hell, but otherwise, the show seemed on point, nat geo researches any stats or figures they put into the show, but they cant really do anything about a bullshit story someone tells like that except edit it down/out.
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dwpineal
Psychedelic Artist
Registered: 07/20/06
Posts: 3,703
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan] 1
#15677709 - 01/17/12 10:50 AM (4 months, 10 days ago) |
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I want one of those bottles! (signed )
I thought the program was not that great. It had some nice points, but they made sure to include horror stories in every segment...
The interesting thing, for me at least was the blotter that they used in the DEA agent sequence. Because they did not mention this, but the 1988 bust was one of Pickard's labs and it was releasing LSD with that EXACT print, which has not been reproduced exactly. There are reprints of that blotter sold as blotter art, but they are a totally different size. I was REALLY impressed that they used that exact blotter. I was wondering if they knew it was related to that bust, and if maybe they actually got the video from the DEA or something...
This is the real original blotter, correct size that was on the program
And here are the reprints
Quote:
Nature Boy said:
I watched the show...man it pissed me off. Referred to Ayahuasca as a "narcotic", made it out to be all kinds of dangerous. Same treatment with LSD, still demonizing it and this show was just another in a long line of misinformation, scare tactic and propaganda. Sure glad my wife didn't see it, as SOME DAY I'd like her to perhaps try some changa.
The asshole with the cluster headaches is going about "self-medicating" with mushrooms all wrong. He is taking enough to trip uncomfortably every two months. He should be sub-clinically dosing / micro dosing himself by taking ONE or TWO of his capsules three times a week. He won't trip, will have minimal to NO nausea, and no headaches. That man is ill-informed because his own doctors have no clue and he has no good resource or hasn't bothered to discover for himself a better way.
Overall, I grimaced throughout the whole show...it made me really angry that the producers once again failed to present an UNBIASED well informed and accurate depiction of the risks/benefits of the psychedelics they featured.
N.B.
Awesome post and it reminded me of the same thought sequence all the way around, especially for the micro-dosing the mushrooms for cluster headaches - that info needs to be more readily available!
Edited by dwpineal (01/17/12 11:08 AM)
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Dreamster1
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Nature Boy] 1
#15678761 - 01/17/12 02:39 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Glad you brought that up. I have a cousin who uses psilocybin for her cluster headaches. She takes really really low doses three times a week. If she gets worried that she feels an attack coming on she will double her dose - still not enough to trip.
She says its like her life before psilocybin was like a car engine without oil. One she lubricated her brain with psilocybin she was good to go. Been three years and she only had one attack - and thats because she was on vacation and was worried about flying with her capsules....
I am curious how the guy growing them is doing with the police....its not like they tried to hide his identity....
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superhigh
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Dreamster1]
#15678770 - 01/17/12 02:41 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
Dreamster1 said:
I am curious how the guy growing them is doing with the police....its not like they tried to hide his identity....
The police respect him?
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Dreamster1
Old School
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: superhigh] 1
#15678792 - 01/17/12 02:45 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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hope so.... but its the police they dont respect anyone
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Anthony
M1 A1
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Dreamster1] 1
#15678807 - 01/17/12 02:48 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
Dreamster1 said:
hope so.... but its the police they dont respect anyone
ya I was thinking the same thing. Like...the put a pic of his face on TV, then show him exposing his mushroom grow? seems pretty fuckin retarded
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Trippin? Click Me...... Me too!
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superhigh
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15678944 - 01/17/12 03:14 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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I'm really disappointed in the Internet for not having a pirate of this available to us yet.
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: dwpineal]
#15679185 - 01/17/12 03:53 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
dwpineal said:
The interesting thing, for me at least was the blotter that they used in the DEA agent sequence. Because they did not mention this, but the 1988 bust was one of Pickard's labs and it was releasing LSD with that EXACT print, which has not been reproduced exactly. There are reprints of that blotter sold as blotter art, but they are a totally different size. I was REALLY impressed that they used that exact blotter. I was wondering if they knew it was related to that bust, and if maybe they actually got the video from the DEA or something...
Yeah! I was wondering if they were talking about the first Pickard bust, since they said it happened in 1988. Only I don't know much about that one. I don't know how much he was busted with and what product he was putting out. How did you know he was using the Dead album cover blotter?
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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love2shpongleIRL
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15679227 - 01/17/12 04:00 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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And wasn't the guy that worked with Pickard known for setting booby traps and would dose people at random? At least that's what I recall reading.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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dwpineal
Psychedelic Artist
Registered: 07/20/06
Posts: 3,703
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan] 1
#15680689 - 01/17/12 08:28 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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I can't provide you with a source for that info Learyfan, I don't think that is floating around the net, but I am not sure...but trust me, to the best of my knowledge it is correct info.
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NWlight
Just look
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: dwpineal]
#15680702 - 01/17/12 08:30 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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that girl from neurosoup stayed with this guy who was a complete psycho, he dosed people maliciously and had his own little world. i watched a documentary about it... wish i remembered more details. anybody know what i'm talking about?
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Hilarious and inconsequential, the lot of it. Enjoy the ride.
Music is medicine.
Edited by NWlight (01/17/12 08:30 PM)
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dwpineal
Psychedelic Artist
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Posts: 3,703
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: NWlight] 2
#15680720 - 01/17/12 08:32 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Getting High on Krystle is the name of that documentary. I actually felt like I lost IQ points watching it though...
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underfliptown
Just another person.
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: NWlight]
#15680723 - 01/17/12 08:33 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
NWlight said:
that girl from neurosoup stayed with this guy who was a complete psycho, he dosed people maliciously and had his own little world. i watched a documentary about it... wish i remembered more details. anybody know what i'm talking about?
This what your talking about hommie?
http://www.vice.com/hamiltons-pharmacopeia/getting-high-on-krystle
Hamiltons pharmacopia is the best!
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underfliptown
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown] 1
#15680737 - 01/17/12 08:34 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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It's weird, shes not even that hot at all but for some reason her sex appeal is a 10.
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NWlight
Just look
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15680746 - 01/17/12 08:35 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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that's the one!
I feel like Krystle did that documentary rather reluctantly.
Also the narrator/cameraman seemed like he had a weird obsession with her and asked really dumb questions.
"so when he gave you the drugs you like, got high and stuff? niceeeeee"
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Hilarious and inconsequential, the lot of it. Enjoy the ride.
Music is medicine.
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underfliptown
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: NWlight]
#15680762 - 01/17/12 08:38 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
NWlight said:
that's the one!
I feel like Krystle did that documentary rather reluctantly.
Also the narrator/cameraman seemed like he had a weird obsession with her and asked really dumb questions.
"so when he gave you the drugs you like, got high and stuff? niceeeeee"
He does a buncha other cool shows. Shit on scopolamine, sapo, hatian zombies, and another favorite of mine: An interview with alexander (sasha) shulgin (here it is: UNDER)
http://www.vice.com/hamiltons-pharmacopeia/sihkal-shulgins-i-have-known-and-loved
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CrossingTheStar
Unoriginal Philosopher
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Posts: 2,232
Loc: U.S. of A.
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15680797 - 01/17/12 08:44 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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I saw the premiere and immidiently thought of starting a thread on the shroomery for it, as soon as it was over. DEA agent says he ingested 1000's of doses of LSD through shaving nicks? I mean, LSD and shrooms give you a little mental stress, but you're not going to permanently be "one step above a vegetable".
Also, the shroom/clusterfuckheadache guy was odd... the mushrooms that he was growing kind of looked like amanitas. I was switching between TV shows and only got a glimpse but I'm pretty sure...
I don't think that heroin addiction treatment belongs on a hallucinogen-themed episode of a TV show, and they kind of gave people the impression that you have to fly over to the amazon to try DMT.
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 Smoke enough weed and you'll never grow up, mentally. Peter Pan strain.
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BlindSophist
drunken preacher
Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 20,231
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15680799 - 01/17/12 08:44 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
underfliptown said:
Quote:
NWlight said:
that's the one!
I feel like Krystle did that documentary rather reluctantly.
Also the narrator/cameraman seemed like he had a weird obsession with her and asked really dumb questions.
"so when he gave you the drugs you like, got high and stuff? niceeeeee"
He does a buncha other cool shows. Shit on scopolamine, sapo, hatian zombies, and another favorite of mine: An interview with alexander (sasha) shulgin (here it is: UNDER)
http://www.vice.com/hamiltons-pharmacopeia/sihkal-shulgins-i-have-known-and-loved
Nice video but the narrator is a giant hipster.
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Love of one is a barbarism; for it is exercised at the expense of all others. The love of God, too.
--Friedrich Nietzsche
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underfliptown
Just another person.
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: BlindSophist] 1
#15680814 - 01/17/12 08:47 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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He totally is, but who really cares. As soon as you start getting pissed about labels you join a label yourself.
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CrossingTheStar
Unoriginal Philosopher
Registered: 11/13/11
Posts: 2,232
Loc: U.S. of A.
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Nature Boy]
#15680819 - 01/17/12 08:48 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
Nature Boy said:
I watched the show...man it pissed me off. Referred to Ayahuasca as a "narcotic", made it out to be all kinds of dangerous. Same treatment with LSD, still demonizing it and this show was just another in a long line of misinformation, scare tactic and propaganda. Sure glad my wife didn't see it, as SOME DAY I'd like her to perhaps try some changa.
The asshole with the cluster headaches is going about "self-medicating" with mushrooms all wrong. He is taking enough to trip uncomfortably every two months. He should be sub-clinically dosing / micro dosing himself by taking ONE or TWO of his capsules three times a week. He won't trip, will have minimal to NO nausea, and no headaches. That man is ill-informed because his own doctors have no clue and he has no good resource or hasn't bothered to discover for himself a better way.
Overall, I grimaced throughout the whole show...it made me really angry that the producers once again failed to present an UNBIASED well informed and accurate depiction of the risks/benefits of the psychedelics they featured.
N.B.
Reminds me, I was thinking the same thing during the headache part.
Why didn't he just make .5-1 gram of tea every week?
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Smoke enough weed and you'll never grow up, mentally. Peter Pan strain.
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BlindSophist
drunken preacher
Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 20,231
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15680821 - 01/17/12 08:48 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
underfliptown said:
He totally is, but who really cares. As soon as you start getting pissed about labels you join a label yourself.
I said I liked the video.
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Love of one is a barbarism; for it is exercised at the expense of all others. The love of God, too.
--Friedrich Nietzsche
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underfliptown
Just another person.
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: BlindSophist]
#15680825 - 01/17/12 08:49 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
BlindSophist said:
Quote:
underfliptown said:
He totally is, but who really cares. As soon as you start getting pissed about labels you join a label yourself.
I said I liked the video.
oh my bad. Im just saying.
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NWlight
Just look
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15680833 - 01/17/12 08:51 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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woah, unseen shulgin footage 
with lab footage ! nice thanks
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Hilarious and inconsequential, the lot of it. Enjoy the ride.
Music is medicine.
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superhigh
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15681034 - 01/17/12 09:32 PM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Oh shit, ketamine's next.
Drugs, Inc: Ketamine : SUN JAN 22 9p et/pt : http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/channel/drugs-inc
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: CrossingTheStar]
#15682116 - 01/18/12 05:28 AM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
CrossingTheStar said:
I don't think that heroin addiction treatment belongs on a hallucinogen-themed episode of a TV show,
Yes it does, because the treatment is Ibogaine, which is a psychedelic.
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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simon418
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15682683 - 01/18/12 09:08 AM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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it was a nice episode, I think that overall it was a bit pro-psychedelic use as they portrayed it as something that have it's place in society without ever questioning that.
LOL at that cop all shook about his lsd accident with his shaky voice like he's about to break out in tears. how do they know he took 1000 dose? is it something that show up in a blood test?
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love2shpongleIRL
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: simon418]
#15682728 - 01/18/12 09:18 AM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Still no streams or torrents! 
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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Shpongle1
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: simon418]
#15682821 - 01/18/12 09:41 AM (4 months, 9 days ago) |
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Quote:
simon418 said:
it was a nice episode, I think that overall it was a bit pro-psychedelic use as they portrayed it as something that have it's place in society without ever questioning that.
LOL at that cop all shook about his lsd accident with his shaky voice like he's about to break out in tears. how do they know he took 1000 dose? is it something that show up in a blood test?
That's the first thing I thought too. He gets some LSD "dust" in the air into the tiny abrasions on his neck and he thinks he can accurately estimate how many doses he took? He seems to remember the whole incident pretty well... I don't believe that if he took 60,000 micrograms he'd have as vivid a memory of the experience as he did.
"As I was about to die I said I didn't feel well. They walked me to a different room, that was a pediatrics room with wizards on the wall. They started flying around the room." Blow me pig. If you're on 60,000 doses I REALLY doubt you are seeing ANYTHING remotely relevant to this reality. Dude is full of pig shit.
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There are more people imprisoned for the commission of drug offenses in the United States - close to 500,000 - than are incarcerated in England, France, Germany, and Japan for all crimes combined. Examined in another way, the United States has 100,000 more people incarcerated for nonviolent drug offenses than all the countries of the European Union combined, despite the fact that the European Union has 100 million more citizens.
- "Drugs and Drug Policy: The Control of Consciousness Alteration, 2007.
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psychotropical
Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 235
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Shpongle1] 1
#15684473 - 01/18/12 03:46 PM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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They did get one thing absolutely right in the docu narrative - the very last line:
"...psychedelics are here to stay..."
lol...
don't think anyone's going to be eradicating the earth's mycelial mass anytime soon, or any of the other entheogens the planet's surface is teeming with...
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anunnakian
Cursed by Bewilderment
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Posts: 9,812
Loc: State of Jefferson
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15684583 - 01/18/12 04:08 PM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
love2shpongleIRL said:
Still no streams or torrents!
I can't find anything online except for the first 5 episodes or so, which might of been the first season. Even trying to find the previous episode to this proved futile.
Maybe after this season ends someone will upload season two pack.
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To Do List:
 Bananadine, Glue, Dust Off, Catnip, Jenkem, Gasoline, Nutmeg, Gold Paint, 5-MeO-W, Mothballs, 4Loko, Spice
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FurrowedBrow
Free yourself from yourself
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Posts: 2,397
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: anunnakian]
#15684703 - 01/18/12 04:42 PM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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So, apparently there are no links floating around for this. I did a brief search after not seeing one in this thread and found nothing. i'll keep looking. i'd love to see this and join the conversation.
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BlindSophist
drunken preacher
Registered: 07/11/06
Posts: 20,231
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15684721 - 01/18/12 04:44 PM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
underfliptown said:
Quote:
BlindSophist said:
Quote:
underfliptown said:
He totally is, but who really cares. As soon as you start getting pissed about labels you join a label yourself.
I said I liked the video.
oh my bad. Im just saying.
I actually watched a bunch more of his show and it's completely . I still wish he wouldn't wear such tight pants or talk with that ridiculous beatnik tone of voice but it's great stuff.
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Love of one is a barbarism; for it is exercised at the expense of all others. The love of God, too.
--Friedrich Nietzsche
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: anunnakian]
#15684733 - 01/18/12 04:45 PM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
anunnakian said:
Quote:
love2shpongleIRL said:
Still no streams or torrents!
I can't find anything online except for the first 5 episodes or so, which might of been the first season. Even trying to find the previous episode to this proved futile.
Maybe after this season ends someone will upload season two pack.
The previous episode to this one was on ecstasy, I can provide a link if you'd like. I really want to see this, like the poster above me I would love to discuss this, but can't.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
Edited by love2shpongleIRL (01/18/12 05:01 PM)
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love2shpongleIRL
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15684849 - 01/18/12 05:10 PM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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They aren't even selling drugs inc in dvd sets yet, so I doubt we will get a torrent. Im going to call natgeo tommorow and see what I can do to get a copy, if I can get one I will upload it.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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superhigh
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15684905 - 01/18/12 05:20 PM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
love2shpongleIRL said:
They aren't even selling drugs inc in dvd sets yet, so I doubt we will get a torrent. Im going to call natgeo tommorow and see what I can do to get a copy, if I can get one I will upload it.
The people who do these pirate releases always release DVRs.
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underfliptown
Just another person.
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: BlindSophist]
#15685815 - 01/18/12 08:52 PM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
BlindSophist said:
Quote:
underfliptown said:
Quote:
BlindSophist said:
Quote:
underfliptown said:
He totally is, but who really cares. As soon as you start getting pissed about labels you join a label yourself.
I said I liked the video.
oh my bad. Im just saying.
I actually watched a bunch more of his show and it's completely . I still wish he wouldn't wear such tight pants or talk with that ridiculous beatnik tone of voice but it's great stuff.
Totally man I agree with you, he's a bit of a weirdo but hes also on ritalin and really high most of the time so I cut him some slack. Thats vice magazine though, completely run by hipsters. lol they think their so cool cause they are from new york.
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imadr
Baking cakes
Registered: 07/22/09
Posts: 103
Last seen: 4 months, 7 days
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15686346 - 01/18/12 11:30 PM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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I wasn't a fan of the episode.
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that the cluster headaches guy's pupils were completely normal sized during his 'trip'.
One big bullshit fest.
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PostiveOutlook
Registered: 05/13/09
Posts: 10,509
Loc: Mars
Last seen: 13 hours, 10 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: imadr]
#15686357 - 01/18/12 11:35 PM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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The DEA part when he said "taking lsd is a risk", pissed me off
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underfliptown
Just another person.
Registered: 03/07/11
Posts: 4,387
Last seen: 1 hour, 25 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: PostiveOutlook]
#15686415 - 01/18/12 11:53 PM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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AddSnakes
Curious One
Registered: 11/21/11
Posts: 98
Loc: The Hawaiian Islands
Last seen: 21 days, 1 hour
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15686587 - 01/19/12 01:18 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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I really want to see these new episodes so badly!~
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( ﾟ ヮ・) ∠tumblr
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 25,441
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 9 hours, 26 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: PostiveOutlook]
#15686936 - 01/19/12 05:32 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
imadr said:
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that the cluster headaches guy's pupils were completely normal sized during his 'trip'.
I did notice that and thought it was strange. Hmmm......
Quote:
PostiveOutlook said:
The DEA part when he said "taking lsd is a risk", pissed me off
Oh yeah, I forgot about that. He used the old "like playing Russian Roulette" DEA line. Oh rly? So you have a one in six chance of dying? 
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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AbstraKt_I_Am
Registered: 12/21/10
Posts: 1,371
Loc: Prison.
Last seen: 3 days, 6 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15686938 - 01/19/12 05:33 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Has anyone found a decent place to stream this yet. Ive looked everywhere to no avail.
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Fair use of Rating's and Respect in the Pub? Lololololol.
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underfliptown
Just another person.
Registered: 03/07/11
Posts: 4,387
Last seen: 1 hour, 25 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: AbstraKt_I_Am]
#15687613 - 01/19/12 09:32 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
AbstraKt_I_Am said:
Has anyone found a decent place to stream this yet. Ive looked everywhere to no avail.
I've searched far and wide and nadda man. Its balls. We just gotta stay patient.
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superhigh
Stranger
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Posts: 3,374
Loc: Western Long Island
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15687642 - 01/19/12 09:42 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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http://480p.me/?s=drugs+inc just uploaded the last episode. So Halluciongens should be hitting the net soon.
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
Registered: 06/11/11
Posts: 4,784
Last seen: 29 days, 21 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: superhigh]
#15687691 - 01/19/12 09:54 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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superhigh
Stranger
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15687706 - 01/19/12 09:58 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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A torrent as well as a fileserve download.
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superhigh
Stranger
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Posts: 3,374
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15687767 - 01/19/12 10:14 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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I'm watching it now.
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
Registered: 06/11/11
Posts: 4,784
Last seen: 29 days, 21 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: superhigh]
#15687778 - 01/19/12 10:16 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Packing a bowl then I will watch.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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wellage
Strange
Registered: 01/31/09
Posts: 2,467
Last seen: 1 day, 4 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15687800 - 01/19/12 10:21 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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I work on a color farm in east Dakota and I am wondering if this Nat Geo episode has any truth to it?
My snakes obviously looked better on camera but the hallucinogens did not seem to effect??
Anyway, please go ahead and post the vimeo for the chick pulling her head out of a menstruating foetus floatation device.
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psychotropical
Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 235
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: BlindSophist]
#15687915 - 01/19/12 10:51 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
BlindSophist said:
Quote:
underfliptown said:
Quote:
BlindSophist said:
Quote:
underfliptown said:
He totally is, but who really cares. As soon as you start getting pissed about labels you join a label yourself.
I said I liked the video.
oh my bad. Im just saying.
I actually watched a bunch more of his show and it's completely . I still wish he wouldn't wear such tight pants or talk with that ridiculous beatnik tone of voice but it's great stuff.
Dude reminds me of a best friend I had back in the day - I thought the guy seemed pretty intelligent underneath the droopy face - seemed like he must have paid attention in chemistry class too, lol.
I thoroughly enjoyed the video and seeing Shulgin (thanks for posting the link) - for a guy approaching 90 he's incredibly lucid, and he's tripped on every psychedelic known (and usually unknown at the time) to man - so much for the "Russian Roulette" DEA agent analogy.
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FurrowedBrow
Free yourself from yourself
Registered: 10/26/06
Posts: 2,397
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15687925 - 01/19/12 10:56 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
love2shpongleIRL said:
Torrents are up! Let's hope they are legit. http://www.rlslog.net/drugs-inc-s02e04-hallucinogens-hdtv-xvid-diverge/
thanks! dloading now.
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
Registered: 06/11/11
Posts: 4,784
Last seen: 29 days, 21 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: FurrowedBrow]
#15688009 - 01/19/12 11:17 AM (4 months, 8 days ago) |
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Quote:
FurrowedBrow said:
Quote:
love2shpongleIRL said:
Torrents are up! Let's hope they are legit. http://www.rlslog.net/drugs-inc-s02e04-hallucinogens-hdtv-xvid-diverge/
thanks! dloading now.
You're welcome! Overall, I thought this was the best episode of drugs inc yet. The other episodes are far more biased, here I felt psychedelics were portayed in a positive light.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 25,441
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 9 hours, 26 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15688874 - 01/19/12 02:48 PM (4 months, 7 days ago) |
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I'm going to hate the Ketamine episode. They called it "The darkest drug of them all". WTF is that supposed to mean? 
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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LittleDipster
Registered: 06/18/10
Posts: 1,171
Loc: cats
Last seen: 6 hours, 19 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15688890 - 01/19/12 02:53 PM (4 months, 7 days ago) |
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haha cause it "kills all 5 senses"
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psychotropical
Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 235
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan] 1
#15690247 - 01/19/12 08:12 PM (4 months, 7 days ago) |
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Quote:
Learyfan said:
I'm going to hate the Ketamine episode. They called it "The darkest drug of them all". WTF is that supposed to mean?
It means they have to create drama and suspense to increase viewership. "Come with us as we slither down the dark alleys, past the junkies and crack whores, to the darkest hideous depths of DUM DUM DUM! Ketamine Alley!"
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sheldogg5
Stranger
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: imadr]
#15690363 - 01/19/12 08:48 PM (4 months, 7 days ago) |
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Quote:
imadr said:
I wasn't a fan of the episode.
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned that the cluster headaches guy's pupils were completely normal sized during his 'trip'.
One big bullshit fest.
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everything i post is entirely fictional
"and then one day you find 10 years have got behind you no one told you when to run...you missed the starting gun"
"for long you live and high you fly, but only if you ride the tide, balanced on the biggest wave you race towards an early grave"
"Whenever you feel like criticizing any one, just remember that all the people in this world haven't had the advantages that you've had."
 GIFSoup
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
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Posts: 4,784
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: sheldogg5]
#15690378 - 01/19/12 08:51 PM (4 months, 7 days ago) |
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Pupil size alone isn't indicative of anything.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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underfliptown
Just another person.
Registered: 03/07/11
Posts: 4,387
Last seen: 1 hour, 25 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL] 1
#15702213 - 01/22/12 01:30 PM (4 months, 5 days ago) |
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Ladies and gentlemen I present you with links:
http://www.videoweed.es/file/h0clvgkeq6qx7
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anunnakian
Cursed by Bewilderment
Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 9,812
Loc: State of Jefferson
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15702224 - 01/22/12 01:32 PM (4 months, 5 days ago) |
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Quote:
underfliptown said:
Ladies and gentlemen I present you with links:
http://www.videoweed.es/file/h0clvgkeq6qx7
Nice
I'll check it out later.
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To Do List:
Bananadine, Glue, Dust Off, Catnip, Jenkem, Gasoline, Nutmeg, Gold Paint, 5-MeO-W, Mothballs, 4Loko, Spice
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Ghostwriter
(I'm my own planet)
Registered: 06/18/10
Posts: 2,935
Loc: USA
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: anunnakian]
#15702884 - 01/22/12 03:38 PM (4 months, 4 days ago) |
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The new episode of DRUGS INC. is on tonight on NAT GEO at 9:00PM.
It will be on Ketamine. Can't wait for something good to come on television lol
I'm sure they will fuck everyone's view about this drug up too though
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STARVE THE EGO, FEED THE SOUL
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pwnasaurus
Stranger
Registered: 07/16/08
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Ghostwriter]
#15703136 - 01/22/12 04:27 PM (4 months, 4 days ago) |
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I thought the one on hallucinogens was the best one yet. It was pretty unbiased for the most part. I do think the part with the cop was a little bit fucked, but other than that it gave a good spin about the potential psychological benefits among other things.
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NWlight
Just look
Registered: 01/12/10
Posts: 5,539
Last seen: 1 minute, 12 seconds
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: pwnasaurus]
#15704916 - 01/22/12 10:11 PM (4 months, 4 days ago) |
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yeah what the fuck was with that cop talking about lsd in such a bad way.
total downer
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Hilarious and inconsequential, the lot of it. Enjoy the ride.
Music is medicine.
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Ghostwriter
(I'm my own planet)
Registered: 06/18/10
Posts: 2,935
Loc: USA
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: NWlight]
#15704962 - 01/22/12 10:20 PM (4 months, 4 days ago) |
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I thought the ketamine one was best one so far
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STARVE THE EGO, FEED THE SOUL
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FurrowedBrow
Free yourself from yourself
Registered: 10/26/06
Posts: 2,397
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Ghostwriter] 1
#15705051 - 01/22/12 10:38 PM (4 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
mamdbdylan said:
I thought the ketamine one was best one so far
http://uploading.com/files/get/ae776b27/
the ketamine episode from tonight.
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Ghostwriter
(I'm my own planet)
Registered: 06/18/10
Posts: 2,935
Loc: USA
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: FurrowedBrow]
#15705076 - 01/22/12 10:45 PM (4 months, 4 days ago) |
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The next episode is about prescription pills, should be alright but not excited like i was for the past few episodes
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STARVE THE EGO, FEED THE SOUL
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
Registered: 06/11/11
Posts: 4,784
Last seen: 29 days, 21 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Ghostwriter] 1
#15706190 - 01/23/12 08:33 AM (4 months, 4 days ago) |
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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psychotropical
Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 235
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15709505 - 01/23/12 09:58 PM (4 months, 3 days ago) |
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Think I'll stick with shrooms. Watching "Chris" K-Hole made me ill.
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underfliptown
Just another person.
Registered: 03/07/11
Posts: 4,387
Last seen: 1 hour, 25 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: psychotropical]
#15709512 - 01/23/12 09:59 PM (4 months, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
psychotropical said:
Think I'll stick with shrooms. Watching "Chris" K-Hole made me ill.
pretty wise decision man.
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Ghostwriter
(I'm my own planet)
Registered: 06/18/10
Posts: 2,935
Loc: USA
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15709526 - 01/23/12 10:02 PM (4 months, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
underfliptown said:
Quote:
psychotropical said:
Think I'll stick with shrooms. Watching "Chris" K-Hole made me ill.
pretty wise decision man.
I WISH i could get some ketamine lmao
For now MXE does the job
Like he said, he may look weird doing it but you dont know how he feels himself.
Don't bash it if you've never done it
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STARVE THE EGO, FEED THE SOUL
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superhigh
Stranger
Registered: 12/07/10
Posts: 3,374
Loc: Western Long Island
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Ghostwriter]
#15709542 - 01/23/12 10:05 PM (4 months, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
mamdbdylan said:
Don't bash it if you've never done it
Oh that's right, Erowid says everything is harmless as long as you know your source.
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Ghostwriter
(I'm my own planet)
Registered: 06/18/10
Posts: 2,935
Loc: USA
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: superhigh]
#15709565 - 01/23/12 10:09 PM (4 months, 3 days ago) |
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Just know what you are doing and don't be a dumbass with drugs
 
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STARVE THE EGO, FEED THE SOUL
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Viruk
Stranger
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Ghostwriter]
#15736873 - 01/30/12 03:15 AM (3 months, 28 days ago) |
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Hey why you guys ragging on Chris? Chris is a fucking champ guys! He's amazing, I'd like to see you do that much ketamine. And he was just chasing todays high, wait till tomorrow!
It's funny for me though because I live near Toronto and got to see this stuff develop all through highschool.
Chris is one of many, they don't know fucking anything about drugs, and don't care about looking it up. Really though the education around here is crap and Chris never stood a chance.
Really the only thing they do teach is that helping everyone with pamphlets crap that those girls were doing. A+ girls, now go shoot some K!
Back to the hallucinogens episode. I'm quite a bit happier for my knowledge and this website after seeing the cluster headaches guy. I knew these were used to prevent cluster headaches but I had no idea that they worked that well, or that those headaches happened that often, and in so many people.
It's really fucking criminal to ever hassle that guy for using mushrooms to stop those headaches.
Also the DEA agent, tripping for 24 hours, after valium, 1000doses, bullshit on all counts.
Edited by Viruk (01/30/12 03:22 AM)
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underfliptown
Just another person.
Registered: 03/07/11
Posts: 4,387
Last seen: 1 hour, 25 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Viruk]
#15737326 - 01/30/12 08:05 AM (3 months, 28 days ago) |
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lol the dea agent was a goof.
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Ghostwriter
(I'm my own planet)
Registered: 06/18/10
Posts: 2,935
Loc: USA
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15737580 - 01/30/12 09:52 AM (3 months, 28 days ago) |
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I didn't think the Pill Nation episode was all that great either
And I have very low doubts for the next episode on Designer Drugs. They are going to make everyone think that research chemicals are some kind of nasty drug that will fuck you up and do lots of harm because there isn't lots of research on it. Bath salts, yeah fuck that but spice and other things..
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STARVE THE EGO, FEED THE SOUL
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
Registered: 06/11/11
Posts: 4,784
Last seen: 29 days, 21 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Ghostwriter]
#15737791 - 01/30/12 11:06 AM (3 months, 28 days ago) |
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Quote:
mamdbdylan said:
I didn't think the Pill Nation episode was all that great either
And I have very low doubts for the next episode on Designer Drugs. They are going to make everyone think that research chemicals are some kind of nasty drug that will fuck you up and do lots of harm because there isn't lots of research on it. Bath salts, yeah fuck that but spice and other things..
One thing we can be thankful for is that no one will watch it besides those in the drug community anyway.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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underfliptown
Just another person.
Registered: 03/07/11
Posts: 4,387
Last seen: 1 hour, 25 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15738267 - 01/30/12 12:58 PM (3 months, 28 days ago) |
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Do you guys think theres any truth to the fucked up bladder and ketamine thing?
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Ghostwriter
(I'm my own planet)
Registered: 06/18/10
Posts: 2,935
Loc: USA
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15738273 - 01/30/12 12:59 PM (3 months, 28 days ago) |
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Quote:
underfliptown said:
Do you guys think theres any truth to the fucked up bladder and ketamine thing?
Yeah if you are an everyday user like what was shown then I dont see why not. Recreational use here and there shouldn't cause for concern tho
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STARVE THE EGO, FEED THE SOUL
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underfliptown
Just another person.
Registered: 03/07/11
Posts: 4,387
Last seen: 1 hour, 25 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Ghostwriter]
#15738282 - 01/30/12 01:01 PM (3 months, 28 days ago) |
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man i don't see how people could do a dissociative like ketamine on a daily basis. Where the fuck do you get the money for that shit?!
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Alabama Slim
Southern Gentlemen
Registered: 06/29/08
Posts: 6,719
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15738416 - 01/30/12 01:29 PM (3 months, 28 days ago) |
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Cluster headaches my fucking dick.
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 25,441
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 9 hours, 26 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15738806 - 01/30/12 02:54 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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Quote:
underfliptown said:
man i don't see how people could do a dissociative like ketamine on a daily basis. Where the fuck do you get the money for that shit?!
That's what I'm saying. The one guy said he used to inject 50 times a day or something outrageous? WTF?
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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Ghostwriter
(I'm my own planet)
Registered: 06/18/10
Posts: 2,935
Loc: USA
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15738823 - 01/30/12 02:57 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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MXE 
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STARVE THE EGO, FEED THE SOUL
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
Registered: 06/11/11
Posts: 4,784
Last seen: 29 days, 21 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Ghostwriter]
#15738824 - 01/30/12 02:58 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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I need to find me some mxe.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 25,441
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 9 hours, 26 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15739390 - 01/30/12 05:00 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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I loved MXE at first, but now.......I think I'm done with it. The shine wore off of it pretty quickly. It's just another disappointing research chemical now.
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
Registered: 06/11/11
Posts: 4,784
Last seen: 29 days, 21 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15739395 - 01/30/12 05:01 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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Have you combined it with LSD? If so, how did it compare?
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 25,441
Loc: High pride!
Last seen: 9 hours, 26 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15739411 - 01/30/12 05:05 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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I don't do psychedelics anymore. I can't handle it. And now I can't really handle MXE. Low doses don't do anything for me anymore and the high doses just put me in that confused/disoriented/panicked mind state. I give up on research chemicals. They all suck compared to the drugs they're trying to emulate.
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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Solo_Dolo
Registered: 09/26/10
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15739449 - 01/30/12 05:14 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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Man that Ketemine one was dope.Never tried that stuff.
What does it feel like if ur just doing small bumps or a lil line?
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My only dream is that yours never come true.
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Solo_Dolo]
#15739471 - 01/30/12 05:18 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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I only ever took a 20 bag of ketamine at a time, but I absolutely loved it. It made me feel like I was floating and instantly made me feel like I was at a rave again. I would just lay down and go into my mind. It was wonderful.
But people will probably start selling MXE as Ketamine until it's made illegal, so you probably won't be able to find it even if you do find it.
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Mp3 of the month: The Shy Guys - Black Lightning Light
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Solo_Dolo
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15739497 - 01/30/12 05:23 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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Haha damn well never tried mxe so i wouldnt know if i got that or K.
I was watching that show and dude injected twice to get into the khole or whatever...that was crazy lol.
But yea..wouldnt mind getting alittle and do a few bumps one night..
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My only dream is that yours never come true.
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psychotropical
Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 235
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Solo_Dolo]
#15742265 - 01/31/12 10:15 AM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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Quote:
Solo_Dolo said:
But yea..wouldnt mind getting alittle and do a few bumps one night..
Yeah, I'm thinking I'd like to try vitamin K too. Don't know about the K-Hole (it just looked a bit disturbing to me) but K sounds really interesting.
I just listened to an NPR radio piece about using K for depression and the people who got treated had nothing but wonderful things to say like "The fog is gone! Permanently!"
If you want to read some interesting experiences google:
john c. lilly ketamine
He did tons of it and recorded his experiences. There's also a couple YouTube vids with him talking about it. He was a far traveling psychonaut.
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shLong
:feelsgoodman:
Registered: 03/04/10
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Loc:
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: psychotropical] 1
#15742296 - 01/31/12 10:22 AM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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Idk if its been mentioned yet, but the dea agent getting dosed was during him taking down William Leonard Pickards 1st lad he got busted with in Mountain View cali.
 he did make some killer doses
Quote:
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When agents first encountered Pickard in the warehouse, he warned them not to dismantle the lab. "This is all bad stuff," Pickard advised. "If I were you, I'd burn this place to the ground. I wouldn't process this scene. Somebody'll get hurt.' "
Pickard proved to be right. One BNE agent on the scene, Max Houser, somehow got dosed upon entering the lab, even though he wore a full-body protective suit and a respirator. Within an hour or two, Houser went into convulsions. An article about the case in a California forensics journal describes what happened next: "The agent was taken to the hospital, where they administered Valium by IV to calm the anxiety. A few hours later, he was discharged and went home. He was in the shower when the Valium began to wear off and he began convulsing again. This time he was taken to the Haight-Ashbury clinic and treated.
"During his time in the emergency room," the article continues, "he reported a loud, buzzing and distressing sound that totally drowned out all the other sound. The hospital people were talking to him, and he could see their lips move but could only hear the loud noise. He was finally able to determine the noise was coming from the automatic door that leads to the emergency room.
"The agent is starting to feel better but still has bouts of depression and anxiety." These bouts continued for months.
Pickard expressed only limited sympathy for Houser's plight. "I regret his difficult moments," he told me, "although I suffered the same effects without benefit of protective suits" - a statement in which Pickard seems to admit, for the first time publicly, that he was indeed an acid cooker, or at least spent time around LSD labs. "Anxiety can spin out of control when taken to an ER with a mind-set expecting psychosis and surrounded by people who are inexperienced. Ideally, a talk-down should suffice. A meadow and friends would be a completely different experience than guns, radios and fear, I am told." Even now, it's almost impossible to study overdose phenomena like these. "Sustained exposure to unknown but massive dosages of LSD," Pickard pointed out, "as experienced by the few unknown individuals worldwide who are responsible for its distribution, has no parallel in clinical settings. I understand various psychiatrists and pharmacologists would like to interview them, but they are, necessarily, unavailable."
Edited by shLong (01/31/12 10:42 AM)
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psychotropical
Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 235
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: shLong]
#15742397 - 01/31/12 10:54 AM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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Well he gave them fair warning. But from the DEA's perspective you can also understand that they'd want to gather as much court evidence as possible rather than burn the place down. The potency of acid is astounding.
If you haven't seen it, here's a little vid of another famous LSD chemist, Nick Sands - shows a rare clip of his old lab:
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Learyfan
It's the psychedelic movement!
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Posts: 25,441
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: shLong]
#15742626 - 01/31/12 11:48 AM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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Nice, shLong, I have never read anything at all about Pickard's first bust. Where did you find that?
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shLong
:feelsgoodman:
Registered: 03/04/10
Posts: 6,651
Loc:
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15742647 - 01/31/12 11:54 AM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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Quote:
Learyfan said:
Nice, shLong, I have never read anything at all about Pickard's first bust. Where did you find that?
Here, this is a great read...taken from another drug forum, ill just copy and paste
I don't wanna break any rules linking to another site (if it is against em...?)
Its long, but well worth it if you're a fan.....
The acid king
Peter Wilkinson. Rolling Stone. New York: Jul 5, 2001. , Iss. 872; pg. 113, 10 pgs
Abstract (Summary)
[Gordon Todd Skinner] told [William Leonard Pickard] he was an expert in international finance and boasted about various celebrities he supposedly knew, including Warren Buffett, the Omaha, Nebraska, superinvestor. In the beginning, at least, Pickard says he believed Skinner, especially when Skinner told him that he could raise money from Buffett to fund his drug research. The Buffett money, Pickard figured, would be a ticket back to Harvard.
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[Headnote]
For more than two decades, authorities believe, Leonard Pickard was a major player in the LSD underground. Now, sitting in a federal prison, he tells his tale for the first time.
[Photograph]
Pickard after a 1988 bust: His rap sheet stretches back to his teens, and he has served two sentences for manufacturing illegal drugs.
LATE LAST YEAR, A NEW PRISONER arrived at the Shawnee County Jail in Topeka, Kansas - a polite beanstalk of a man from the San Francisco Bay Area who stood out among the petty criminals who make up the majority of Shawnee's inmate population. He spoke in a rapid whisper, practiced yoga, meditated in his cell and read difficult books on mathematics and physics. Along with his prison blues, he wore sandals with socks. A princely mane of silver hair fell almost to his shoulders.
The man's name was William Leonard Pickard. A few days before, on November 7th, 2000, the fiftyfive-year-old Harvard graduate had been arrested not far from an abandoned Atlas E missile silo outside Topeka and charged with being one of the busiest manufacturers of LSD in the world, a chemist with the means to cook up acid by the kilo. If the government's charges prove true, this would make him one of the high priests of acid manufacture, part of a clandestine fraternity that probably numbers no more than a dozen worldwide.
Acid cookers are notoriously hard to catch. A lab can be set up quickly and broken down easily, and it only takes about ten days to perform a series of complicated chemical reactions that produce a sizable batch of the drug enough, once diluted and dipped onto blotter paper, for hundreds of thousands of hits. The trickiest part of the process is obtaining the precursor chemical known as ergotamine tartrate, or ET. Heavily regulated in this country, where it is used to treat migraines, ET is often smuggled in from Eastern Europe, where sale of the compound is less restricted.
Acid manufacturing might be one of the last criminal enterprises where those involved are motivated by more than the prospect of making money. Even now, more than three decades on from the Summer of Love, to cook acid is to perform a sacrament, a public service. Members of this small band operate with great stealth and are rarely informed on by their associates, even those facing long prison terms. The Drug Enforcement Administration has not taken down an LSD lab since 1991.
The case of U.S. v. Pick is just the latest, and perhaps final, chapter in the strange and often fantastic tale of William Leonard Pickard and his journey from a privileged boyhood in Atlanta, through the manic, hallucinogenic heart of the ig6os, to the forefront of social-- drugs research in the i99os, conducted at some of the nation's most prestigious universities. Along the way - under various aliases - he crossed paths with such rock stars as Sting, and befriended members of the British House of Lords, State Department officials and the district attorney of San Francisco, Terence Hallinan. He earned a master's from Harvard's Kennedy School of Government, where he studied drug trends in the former Soviet Union.
Pickard also has a rap sheet stretching back to his teens and has served two prison terms for manufacturing drugs, including LSD and the rarely seen synthetic mescaline. In recent years, though, his life seemed to come together - he'd fathered a child and had become a serious convert to Buddhism. He had a job at a respected drug-policy think tank, and he planned to attend medical school so he could finally dedicate his life to alleviating the suffering of others. But he had also become bizarrely entwined with - and then, he says, hideously betrayed by - a man named Gordon Todd Skinner, a Porsche-driving pot dealer from Tulsa, Oklahoma, twenty years younger than Pickard.
When Pickard comes to trial, most likely later this year, the proceedings promise to shed light on the dangerous and secret world of LSD manufacturing for the first time in decades. Perhaps greater truths will be revealed, too. In some ways, the story of Leonard Pickard and Todd Skinner is a story about the collision of Sixties idealism with the materialism and pragmatism of the Nineties - Timothy Leary's America versus Bill Clinton's, if you will. And its moral will be clear even before the judge calls the court to order: The sweet but easily corruptible dream of the flower-power generation never really stood a chance - but it was fun while it lasted.
THE ACID TRIANGlE
MOST OF THE ACID CONSUMED IN THE PAST THIRTY YEARS IS believed to have been made in temporary basement and warehouse labs in and around San Francisco's Bay Area, a part of California drug agents call the Acid Triangle. The last time those agents made a significant (I million hits plus) acid bust, in 1993, they identified a supplier who lived in Bolinas, the northernmost point of the triangle. A supplier, that is - not a chemist. The narcs never located the chemist. LSD today is a much lower dose (20 micrograms versus zoo-plus) than the high-test stuff Augustus Owsley Stanley III sold as "orange sunshine" in the Sixties; more of a party high than an eight-hour trip. "Triple set - LSD that is reworked three times to increase purity - it's not found as often," says Dave Tresmontan, special agent in charge of the California Bureau of Narcotic Enforcement's San Francisco office. "The LSD today tends to be a little dirtier and not nearly as sophisticated as it once was." It's difficult to tell exactly when Leonard Pickard first involved himself with LSD. BNE believes he was part of the legendary Brotherhood of Eternal Love, which operated in and around the Acid Triangle in the late 1960s and early 1970s, selling hashish and LSD cooked by Owsley and other important chemists like Tim Scully and Nick Sand. The Brotherhood's philosophy, at least in the beginning, was simple and beneficent: with LSD, turning people on, expanding consciousness and changing the way people perceived the world took precedence over making a profit.
When the subject of the Brotherhood of Eternal Love came up one day in the Shawnee County jail, Pickard stopped short of admitting any contact with the group, but did speak of their activities with a certain knowing reverence: "I understand there have been a few LSD chemists that would never make a batch of LSD ever, ever, without offering prayers for the safety of the people that might use it. And it should act as a good medicine throughout the world. So I'm told." He added, "I think their mantra was something on the order of, `Those that say, don't know. And those that know, don't say."' Pickard smiled, conspiratorially, as he talked, sitting cross-legged and as calm as a Buddha on a plastic chair in an interview room barely big enough to contain his six-and-a-half-foot frame.
A federal trial in San Francisco in 1973 crippled Brotherhood operations and seemed to fragment the cooking culture, or at least send it further underground. BNE didn't take down a lab of any real size in the Acid Triangle for years after the Brotherhood case, just a few seizures now and again. "We might find some pretty good chunks, 15,000 hits or too,ooo hits," says Dave Tresmontan. Then, in 1988, reports came into the Bureau of strong chemical smells emanating from a warehouse in the city of Mountain View, California, about forty-five miles south of San Francisco. On December 28th, as the narcs arrived to execute a search warrant, a tall, pleasant man of forty strolled out of the warehouse, carrying multiple pieces of identification bearing a number of different names. His real name was William Leonard Pickard.
"A LICE PREPPY"
LEONARD PICKARD GREW UP PRECOCIOUSLY IN ATLANTA, A CITY
"LSD should act as good medicine: Blotters, vials and pills seized from Leonard Pickard's 1978 bust.
unfamiliar in the i96os with the concepts of tolerance and experimentation. His father, William, practiced civil law. His mother, Lucille, a Columbia University Ph.D., researched fungal diseases at the Centers for Disease Control. The Pickards lived comfortably in the city's genteel northwest suburbs, a social, church-oriented neighborhood populated by academic families. "The governor of Georgia's mother taught me Sunday school," Pickard rhapsodized in a letter from prison. "Suits on Sunday, no alcohol, learned to handle rifles at nine. Read endlessly. Azaleas, rhododendrons, lightning, fireflies. Many happy moments as a small boy observing paramecia under my greatgrandfather's microscope. Visiting scientists from all over the world stayed with us. Much conversation." Something of a science prodigy, Pickard spent the summer of 1962 interning at the Argonne National Laboratory in Illinois. A year later, at the age of seventeen, he won a Westinghouse Talent Search, one of forty teenagers recognized as the top science students in the United States. Twenty-two scholarship offers rolled in, unsolicited. Pickard chose Princeton. The temptations of Greenwich Village jazz clubs, a brief train ride away, distracted him, and after less than a year, he dropped out: "I wasn't as smart as I thought I was."
Supported by his trust fund, Pickard hit the road, looking for "greater experience of the human condition than tenure track might have provided." As he wandered the country in the mid-i96os, trouble found him everywhere. Eighteen years old and freshly removed from Princeton, Pickard was arrested twice in Alabama in 1964 for forging checks. The following January, he was arrested for stealing a car, "joy riding," as he recalls. "Youthful idiocy."
Pickard showed up on the West Coast in 1967, where he met Talitha Stills, Stephen Stills' sister. "It was an extraordinary time," she says. "Everybody was hanging around Berkeley and Stanford, whether they were enrolled or not, because they were involved in the protests. Leonard was hanging out at Stanford with a lot of the people who were in the know. He was beyond university before he ever got to university. He had a real interest in medicine and the chemistry and pharmacology underlying the drug movement."
Stills also remembers a less studious aspect of her friend's personality. "We were sort of the rich, bright kids," she says. "Leonard had his little trust fund, so he could just dedicate himself to going out. He was all over the place. It was almost impossible to keep tabs on him. He was a pretty serious ladies' man."
For a period of about seven years, Pickard lived the life of a psychedelic freebooter, part of it in a commune in Austin. It was a time, he says, of "naked moonlight swimming, endless campfires and theology in the High Sierra, refinement of the soul in the vast deserts, finding what was of true value in the world and what was proper conduct among others." In 1974, Pickard formally returned to school, enrolling at Foothill College, in Los Altos Hills, to study biology and chemistry. Then he was off to San Jose State, from 1976 through 1978, to study organic chemistry and neurophysiology.
[Photograph]
NI hold Sasha as a real hero": Pickard considers himself an acolyte of legendary psychedelic researcher Alexander Shulgin (above).
Then Pickard, in his early thirties, seemed to discover his calling: cooking illegal drugs, but doing so with a Californian epicure's taste and sophistication. Besides chemistry, he knew the law, and rather than brazenly break it, Pickard tried to skirt it. The first compound he experimented with was MDMA - a drug few had even heard of at the time but now known as Ecstasy. To get around the fact that it was illegal, Pickard fiddled with the formula and came up with a chemical cousin, MDA, a somewhat trippier version of the drug.
In time, Pickard's neighbors in Redwood City complained about chemical odors wafting from his apartment. Sheriff's deputies who knocked on the door on October loth, 1977, discovered a functioning drug lab in the basement. Alan Johnson, chief inspector at the Santa Cruz district attorney's office, interviewed the young chemist. "I had a delightful conversation with Leonard," Johnson says. "He struck me as a really bright kid. He was dressed in a little V-neck sweater. He was a little preppy.
"We're talking about a whole different culture back then," Johnson recalls. "Today's cookers just get a recipe from some criminal. They mix a little of this and a little of that. They don't really know what they're doing. This fellow was trying to change the MDMA to make it legal. He was making the argument, and it was a new argument, that he's manufacturing an analogue."
Ultimately, Leonard's analogue argument failed. In 1978, while taking chemistry classes at Stanford, he was found guilty of attempting to manufacture a controlled substance, a felony, and served eighteen months of a three-year sentence. In a letter from prison, Pickard offered up an elaborate excuse, denying that he had been brewing illegal drugs. He claims that he was busted after he was trying to sell some lab gear that had once belonged to a Brotherhood of Eternal Love chemist, gear that contained traces of MDA.
Incarceration didn't seem to quell his fascination with clandestine chemistry. In February i9, not long after his release, police in Gainesville, Georgia, arrested Leonard Pickard for making amphetamines. A few months later, in June, authorities in Deland, Florida, pinched him for distributing MDA, the Ecstasy analogue. No threat of imprisonment, it seemed, could interfere with Leonard's quest to liberate the collective mind. "I believe it was genuine, his belief that psychedelics were helpful," says Rick Doblin, a Harvard Ph.D. who is leading the effort to have Ecstasy approved for clinical study in the United States, and an acquaintance of Pickard's. "I think he was after money, but he had a romantic notion about the value of psychedelics, like a lot of us do."
123,278 PILLS AND 89,802 TABS
BY 1987, THE TWO STRANDS OF PICKARD'S LIFE CAME TOGETHER when he turned up at San Francisco State University and fell under the influence of the legendary drug researcher Alexander Shulgin, a white-haired eccentric who, with his wife, Ann, has dedicated his life to studying hallucinogens and advocating their therapeutic value. For many years, Shulgin counted himself among the few researchers in the nation allowed to possess Schedule i drugs (like MDMA and zC-B), and his books on the subject, among them PIHKAL, A Chemical Love Story (PIHKAL stands for "Phenethylamines I Have Known and Loved"), are perennial underground best sellers. "I hold Sasha as a real hero," says Pickard, who claims to have received "letters of condolence" from Shulgin after his arrest.
[Photograph]
LSD fueled the freak generation (above: the Isle of Wight, 1970).
Nobody is exactly sure when, or if, Pickard actually set up the LSD lab in Mountain View, but by 1988 it was operational. The lab was contained inside a trailer - of the type you might see at a construction site - that had been dragged into a warehouse in an industrial section of the city. It contained state-of-the-art lab equipment, including a roto-evaporator, heating mantles and a pill press, an item that DEA restrictions make almost impossible to obtain. On the floor were stacked boxes of blotter paper in a raft of colorful, eye-catching designs: Escher heads, album covers, samurai shields and black-and-white tropical scenes.
After Pickard had been at the spot for some time, apparently cooking acid by the kilo, neighboring businessmen reported smelling chemical odors. Agents of the BNE moved in. "It was a huge lab," says Ron Brooks, special agent in charge of the BNE's San Jose office, who was on the scene that day in Mountain View. "He was making windowpane, microdot and blotter." And it was a diversified operation. "Pickard was making not only LSD but also synthetic mescaline, which is very difficult to synthesize, and a bunch of other stuff. He was an excellent chemist."
Excellent and prolific, on par almost with Owsley himself in terms of output. Bear, as he was known, claimed to have turned out a total of three or four kilos during his storied career. Agents found a beguiling note tucked inside a brown vial in the Mountain View trailer, which seemed be addressed to one of the chemist's distributors and to describe the scale of his operation. "As I prepare my third kilogram of LSD," it said, "I think with amusement of our last conversation three years ago, when you called me a liar, and I had to walk you down the hall to get you the very first gram that was supposed to be offered to you preferentially. Since July of 1984, our friend has taken thirty grams in that year, thirty grams in the second year and seventy-five grams in the last six to eight weeks. The recent change indicates that someone close to you has accessed an existing system as well as its potential problems. I hope you can monitor these proceedings in some way, since you come from the finest psychedelic heritage, prior to being seduced by some sleazy cocaine and qualude [sic] nightmare." Whether Pickard wrote this note, and who the intended recipient was, have never been made clear.
A kilo of drugs might not sound like much if you're talking about pot or coke or heroin, but a kilo of pure acid is enough, DEA estimates, for io million trips. One of the criminalists who donned protective gear to process the trailer crime scene, Lisa Brewer, counted 89,am tabs of acid and 123,278 acid pills, a form of acid rarely seen in 1988. Only Pickard knew how much product had already been mailed to middlemen. "This was the big one," Brewer says of Pickard's laboratory. "Nobody sees these."
Later, when Ron Brooks consulted Darryl Inaba, a leading drug expert at the Haight-Ashbury Free Clinic, he mentioned the fact that he'd collared a guy making synthetic mescaline. "No fucking way," Inaba replied. "That's just too hard to make. There are only a very few people in the whole world that might have the capability."
"It was a beautiful, pure white, needlelike crystal," recalls Brooks. "Apparently, it was only synthesized several times, ever, and Pickard was a guy who knew how to do it. That was the only time we ever saw it. Guys like him do that just as a challenge, just to prove they can do it. I don't think there's a market for it, It probably cost him way more to make than he could ever sell it for."
Not surprisingly, a BNE search for Pickard accomplices proved fruitless. "We followed up leads in Daly City and in San Francisco," says Brooks, "also out in the southern East Bay, but we never had anything solid. He was very good about covering his tracks, and he and his circle of friends were all the masters of using multiple identities and blind mail drops and phones forwarded to other phones."
"I recall Mr. Pickard back in the interview room," says BNE agent Tresmontan. "He played a lot of things close to the vest. I remember him sitting there with his legs crossed, very calm, very friendly, somewhat guarded. My thought was, `Here's a very intelligent individual, maybe slightly eccentric.'"
When agents first encountered Pickard in the warehouse, he warned them not to dismantle the lab. "This is all bad stuff," Pickard advised. "If I were you, I'd burn this place to the ground. I wouldn't process this scene. Somebody'll get hurt.' "
Pickard proved to be right. One BNE agent on the scene, Max Houser, somehow got dosed upon entering the lab, even though he wore a full-body protective suit and a respirator. Within an hour or two, Houser went into convulsions. An article about the case in a California forensics journal describes what happened next: "The agent was taken to the hospital, where they administered Valium by IV to calm the anxiety. A few hours later, he was discharged and went home. He was in the shower when the Valium began to wear off and he began convulsing again. This time he was taken to the Haight-Ashbury clinic and treated.
"During his time in the emergency room," the article continues, "he reported a loud, buzzing and distressing sound that totally drowned out all the other sound. The hospital people were talking to him, and he could see their lips move but could only hear the loud noise. He was finally able to determine the noise was coming from the automatic door that leads to the emergency room.
"The agent is starting to feel better but still has bouts of depression and anxiety." These bouts continued for months.
Pickard expressed only limited sympathy for Houser's plight. "I regret his difficult moments," he told me, "although I suffered the same effects without benefit of protective suits" - a statement in which Pickard seems to admit, for the first time publicly, that he was indeed an acid cooker, or at least spent time around LSD labs. "Anxiety can spin out of control when taken to an ER with a mind-set expecting psychosis and surrounded by people who are inexperienced. Ideally, a talk-down should suffice. A meadow and friends would be a completely different experience than guns, radios and fear, I am told." Even now, it's almost impossible to study overdose phenomena like these. "Sustained exposure to unknown but massive dosages of LSD," Pickard pointed out, "as experienced by the few unknown individuals worldwide who are responsible for its distribution, has no parallel in clinical settings. I understand various psychiatrists and pharmacologists would like to interview them, but they are, necessarily, unavailable."
In 1988, Pickard was sentenced to eight years in California's Terminal Island Prison. Released early, in 1992, he went to live at the Zen Center, on Page Street in San Francisco, and came under the wing of the center's spiritual leader, Blanche Hartman, better known as the Abbess. "She took my hand when I left prison," Pickard said. "I lived there for two years as a monk."
Pickard claims he tried to chart a new course: "I lost contact with a large early portion of my life after the prison years." He paid about $350 a month for one of the forty small rooms at the center. With the other students, Pickard rose with the 5 A.M. bell, sat in meditation for an hour and a half, chanted, helped clean the temple and then ate breakfast. "Monastic practice involves twenty-four hours a day," says Hartman. "The bulk of the day he did whatever he was doing, and I have no idea what it was.
"I never felt fully invited into his personal life, Hartman adds. "There was always an air of mystery about him. I assumed he had some money left over from his earlier days dealing, but I have no idea.
"He was trying to change," she continues. "I don't know if I want to say `live more constructively.' I don't know how he felt about his manufacturing LSD, whether he thought that was good or bad. I never asked him about it. My guess is, even though it's illegal, he didn't think it was wrong to make LSD, because he thinks there's something beneficial about making it, or he wouldn't have done it."
Leonard Pickard returned to school during his two years on Page Street to study neurobiology at the University of California at Berkeley with David Presti, an authority on addiction and the way that drugs - from stimulants and depressants to psychedelics and steroids - affect the brain. Under Presti's guidance, Pickard focused on drugs of abuse rather than his old area of interest, the possible therapeutic applications of controlled substances. (Though Presti has described Pickard as a "dear friend," he was unwilling to discuss Pickard's work at Berkeley, missing an appointment for a planned telephone interview before backing out entirely.)
From Berkeley, with Presti's backing, Pickard arrived at Harvard in 1994 and found work as a neurobiology research associate at the medical school's Division on Addictions. There he met Mark Kleiman, a junior member of the faculty who was already a leading authority on social drugs and drug policy. Following the lead of Rick Doblin, another member of the Harvard drug-research crew, Pickard applied to the Kennedy School of Government's master's program. Kleiman oversaw Pickard's master's project, a second-year paper that focused on drug problems in Russia, discussing the extent to which the emergence of a free-market economy had led to a proliferation both of drug consumption and of drug production and traffic. "Leonard spent some time talking to people in Russia," says a Harvard source. "He was obviously very good at that. He made contact with various figures in law enforcement, including the FSB, which is the successor to the KGB."
[Photograph]
The LSD legend: Owsley was the most famous chemist of all, but authorities believe Pickard may have produced more.
Experts in this field have to be careful about their reputations. Researching the use of illegal drugs is regarded with suspicion by many in law enforcement and on the right wing, who worry that by not demonizing these drugs, researchers tacitly advocate their use. Everything, as Rick Doblin says, needs to be done with the "permission" of the DEA and other government agencies. When another of Pickard's teachers at Harvard, Mark H. Moore, Guggenheim Professor of Criminal Justice Policy and Management, heard vague details about Pickard's prospective funding sources in Russia, he felt uncomfortable. "I didn't know their reputations," recalls Moore, who knew nothing of Pickard's criminal record. "They were unfamiliar to me then and remain unfamiliar to me now." One Harvard source calls Pickard the kind of student who was more talk than action. "He presented himself as a person who was well-connected and could see what was happening in the drug scene, but he was never able to make much out of that or demonstrate the truth of what he was observing. I ended up regarding him with a great deal of skepticism. Nothing ever happened with him."
Pickard received his master's in public policy from the Kennedy School of Government in 1997, and when Mark Kleiman moved to California a short time later to head an influential drug-policy group at UCLA, Pickard followed. Pickard's work was not funded by the university. He took trips to Russia to seek funding, and on one of them he met his current wife, Natasha, a lovely pre-med student in her late twenties whom Pickard brought back to the United States with him. Pickard, Natasha and her father shared a small apartment. Kleiman was impressed enough with Pickard to name him as his deputy. Pickard gave Kleiman his word that he wasn't cooking any drugs in the United States.
Again, the subject matter of Pickard's research involved drug use in the former Soviet Union. This time, Pickard concentrated on evaluating a deeply flawed Russian system of estimating the extent of its drug problem. Working with Kleiman in California, however, Pickard seemed to grow lazy. "Even though it wasn't our money, he didn't actually produce much," says a UCLA source. "We fell for the story, that he was a brilliant guy with sort of an outlaw past that he was now trying to transcend."
During this period, Rick Doblin socialized with Pickard back in Cambridge, Massachusetts, and at Sasha Shulgin's home in Northern California. But Doblin says he never trusted Pickard: "What can you say about somebody who always wears a suit and tie to meetings that are usually more relaxed? He wanted to pass in a lot of professional circles or responsible circles, even anti-drug-abuse circles. It felt like he was playing a role.
"He'd tell these shadowy stories that were somehow connected to Russians who had made out in privatization in perhaps less than completely ethical ways and who wanted to help out their country by studying drugabuse issues. I didn't know what to believe. I always felt there was more going on than he was saying. There were some major missing pieces in what he was sharing."
A BRAND-NEW FRIEND
IN THE PSYCHEDELIC COMMUNITY, THE GRAY
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"There are only a few people in the world who have that capability": In 1988, drug agents collared Pickard in Mountain View, California, for running a lab where he manufactured LSD by the kilo.
ing tribe gathers several times a year, in this country or in Europe, to discuss new drugs and drug research, to burn incense and chat about Native American art. It was at one of these gatherings, devoted to the study of psychedelic mushrooms, in 1997, that Pickard met a man who impressed him with his generosity, intelligence, humor and charm. His name was Gordon Todd Skinner.
Like Pickard, Skinner is a big, rangy man, though Skinner is the bulkier of the two at about 24.o pounds, bald, with a ZZ Top-type beard. One acquaintance describes his look as a cross between an Amish man and Bozo the Clown. To Pickard, Skinner was something of a fellow traveler. "When I met him, he was using exotic structures every week or every few days," Pickard says. "He loved to eat ayahuasca [a hallucinogenic plant ]and its various analogues."
Skinner told Pickard he was an expert in international finance and boasted about various celebrities he supposedly knew, including Warren Buffett, the Omaha, Nebraska, superinvestor. In the beginning, at least, Pickard says he believed Skinner, especially when Skinner told him that he could raise money from Buffett to fund his drug research. The Buffett money, Pickard figured, would be a ticket back to Harvard. Skinner struck Pickard as somebody who had access to large amounts of money, often receiving electronic transfers but always cash poor. "He probably couldn't draw more than $3,000 out of his accounts at one time," Pickard says. Besides Warren Buffett, Skinner also
claimed to know Sting. In October 1999, when the star hit San Jose, California, on a tour stop, he attended a party Skinner threw at a house he was renting in Stinson Beach, a home formerly owned by Jerry Garcia. Chris Malone, who installed a stereo system in the house for Sting's visit, says Skinner and Sting acted like old friends. Pickard was there, too. Through his publicist, Sting acknowledges attending the party, where he met some "very charismatic people," but would comment no further.
By Tulsa standards, Skinner's family was well-to-do. His father, Gordon, operates the Skinner Clinic, a chiropractic office. His mother, Katherine Magrini, one of "Tulsa's leading hostesses," according to the Tulsa World, runs Gardner Spring, for many years a manufacturer of standard and custom-made industrial springs, with sales of $5 million to so million annually. She also started a "gourmet" candy company, Katherine's Supreme Gourmet Chocolates, and sits on a wide variety of Tulsa benefit committees. After divorcing Gordon Skinner, Katherine, in i98i, married Gary Magrini, an agent with the Criminal Enforcement Division of the IRS. For a time, Magrini was assigned to the Organized Crime Drug Enforcement Task Force, in the Northern District of Oklahoma.
As a boy, Todd Skinner loved math. He attended Cascia Hall Prep, a Catholic boys' high school in Tulsa, and though he never earned a college degree, he says he studied for a while at the University of Heidelberg, in Germany. "There is no way for me to describe the depth of Todd's knowledge," says Moise Seligman, a retired Army major general who has been a friend of the Skinner family for twenty years. "I've never met anyone who could sit in the same room with Todd Skinner, as far as brain power is concerned."
All along, Skinner would tell Seligman that he loathed drugs. "He was bitterly opposed to the whole dope process. He would never stick a needle in himself, he would never sniff something, or whatever you do to take it."
On and off through his twenties, Skinner worked at his mother's spring plant. Other times, he wandered around California and the Caribbean, sometimes with a friend from Holland who described himself as a manufacturer of "powdered milk." Skinner, like Pickard, used a number of aliases, telling different people in different places that he was Dwayne Miller or P.C. Carroll or Gerard T. Finegan. He also developed a nose for trouble. After leasing a seventy-eight-foot oil-field utility vessel for use off the coast of Louisiana, Skinner installed fancy electronic gear on the boat, then wrecked the craft, which he had failed to insure, off the coast of Jamaica in a hurricane. Customs officials in the Cayman Islands boarded the boat and gave Skinner an hour to leave the country. Skinner's friend Mo Seligman ended up getting stuck for part of the 580,ooo in unpaid lease bills.
By 1989, Skinner was in the pot business. He made a poor showing with that, too. When he and a friend from Tulsa tried to move forty-two pounds of weed in Cherry Hill, New Jersey, undercover cops nailed them and indicted Skinner on conspiracy charges that left him facing life in prison as a drug "kingpin" and held him on St million bail. Waiting for trial, Skinner spent about a year in prison in New Jersey. Then, from behind bars, he cut his teeth on another business, one he would return to during his friendship with Leonard Pickard: the unclean business of being a snitch. Skinner struck up a friendship with another inmate, John Worthy, and mentioned he had thirty pounds of pot to sell. Having piqued Worthy's interest, Skinner went straight to the D.A. and laid out the deal. His bail was reduced to $500,ooo, and he returned to Tulsa, where, at the behest of the New Jersey prosecutors, he taped some calls to John Worthy. These calls are almost comical. On the tape, Skinner pleads with Worthy, who can barely scrape together $2,000, to meet him at a hotel in Vineland, New Jersey, and take possession of $34,000 worth of weed.
If Worthy wasn't satisfied with the quality, Skinner assured him, he'd take the load back. "I can sell it the next day. You're not gonna be stuck with anything with me. I'm not in the business of screwing someone over. I'm too fuckin' busy. I want you to find a product that you can get rid of in a hurry." Anyway, a man in Skinner's position never stuck people with bad shit. "The big weed dealers don't do that," Skinner tells Worthy on tape.
"Skinner was a motherfucker," says Brian O'Malley, one of Worthy's lawyers. "He got friendly with my client and said, `Hey, we can make a million bucks,' giving my guy visions of the life of Riley, whoever the black Riley is. This guy wove a web. The way he saw it, he had no choice but to screw somebody else, pass the weight on."
The day after Worthy's arrest at the Vineland hotel, Skinner pleaded guilty to one reduced count of conspiracy and was back on the street, with a threeyear term of probation, which was terminated in less than two. Years later, an appeals court would throw out John Worthy's case, ruling that Skinner's taping of phone calls from Oklahoma violated New Jersey's wiretapping laws.
Owing hundreds of thousands of dollars to various lawyers and other creditors, Skinner filed for Chapter 7 bankruptcy in Tulsa in 1992. He didn't fold his tent in the face of adversity. He simply relocated. He meandered north to Kansas, and in 1996, through a trust, took control of an abandoned Atlas E missile base on Say Road, in Wamego, and moved in. Decommissioned Atlas E and Atlas F sites ring the city of Topeka. The last nuke left the state in 1986, and since then, these eerie monuments to the Cold War have been snapped up by people looking for unusual places to live. One former nuke base serves as part of a Kansas high school. Most consist of vast, multilevel underground chambers, connected by metal ladders. Built to withstand the blast from the world's most powerful nuclear weapons, the Wamego base provided Skinner with 15,000 square feet of underground space on a twenty-eight-acre plot of land. Why would Skinner be attracted to such a place? "I have no idea," says his mother, "and I don't give a damn."
Skinner offered her a deal. "Todd said to me, `Why don't you put your manufacturing up here in Kansas?' " says Magrini. "And we did." This arm of the company, went the word around Wamego, would manufacture springs for NASA's Space Shuttle program. Some Gardner employees arrived from Tulsa. Skinner also hired a few local people to work a small spring-making machine. Big rolls of wire would arrive from Tulsa about twice a month, the wire would be wound, and the springs would be shipped back to Oklahoma. Skinner employed local cops to work around the base as security officers and gardeners.
Drawing on what seemed like an unlimited budget, Todd set about sprucing up the base interior. Computers were installed, as well as a new kitchen and a twelve-line phone system. Skinner mounted his oak bed on a pedestal and installed a bathtub lined with marble. Baskets of massage oil sat in the corner of another room. Young women, local girls in their twenties, were in and out of Skinner's tub. From an audiophile shop in Sacramento came an Boo-pound, $120,000 Dynaudio Evidence stereo system. The speakers, one of only five pairs in the United States, went for eighty-five grand. Connecting cables alone cost $10,000. "Todd would buy CDs and never listen to or even open them, just leave them scattered around the floors," Pickard recalls. His tastes didn't compare with his equipment. According to Chris Malone, who installed the system, Skinner mostly listened to Seventies pop - Cat Stevens and Styx. Outside the underground chamber, Skinner parked his latest automotive purchases: three late-model Porsches, including a 4WD Boxster, which sells for about $225,000.
Life at the missile base resembled some sort of kooky Sixties idyll. Every few days in the course of a year or so, Skinner would call Pickard in California and regale him with tales of psychedelic drug trips. Pickard, of all people, understood where Skinner was coming from. "He was in his early thirties," says Pickard. "I guess he was exploring. He had nothing else to do." Livestock, including llamas and chickens and rabbits, and even Clydesdale horses and a mule, roamed the property. A vegetable garden thrived. Fruit, nut and pine trees were planted, and a water-pumping windmill was installed. Skinner employed a number of local people, at around $7 an hour, to clean, paint and garden, paying them with checks drawn on the Tulsa accounts of Gardner Spring Inc. Much of the time, it didn't seem to matter what work got done or how quickly. One woman, who baby-sat Skinner's two young children once in a while, spent three days digging thistles, for which she received a $235 bonus.
Men, friends of Skinner's, would arrive from California and other points west and stay for weeks at a time, guys with long beards and long hair who looked like zombies. One spent hours cutting up apples for oatmeal; another urinated in a glass jar and carried it around with him wherever he went. These guests smoked weed freely. Morning beers were available. Strange deliveries were common: a dozen pressure cookers here, a truckful of acetone there. Todd and his friends worked at night. "Some of them would still be there in the mornings when I'd arrive for work, but they didn't stay around long," says Janice Eichem, a Wamego resident who worked at the base for a year. "You'd ask them their name, and they'd only tell you their first name.
"Todd thought he had all the money in the world," Eichem says. "He could buy anything in the world he wanted - to hear him tell it."
One day in April 1999, the party turned deadly. An employee of a Tulsa computer company, Paul K. Hulebak, 41, slumped over in front of a computer screen. Pickard, it turned out, was sort of a witness to Hulebak's death. "Skinner was on the phone to me, describing his latest drug episode," Pickard says, "at the time Hulebak overdosed on narcotics."
"I've got a problem," Skinner told him. "Call you back."
An autopsy turned up track marks on Hulebak's body and listed the cause of death as a multidrug overdose - methadone and hydromorphone, a methadone derivative. Sheriff's deputies investigated but found no drugs or needles. "The base," Pickard explained, "had been sanitized of fentanyl, dilaudids, et cetera."
Several rooms underground, always locked, remained off limits to all except Skinner and his right-hand man, Gunnar Guinan. The son of a carpet-industry executive from Hoboken, New Jersey, Guinan, like Skinner, loved computers but didn't seem to have an extensive employment history. Gunnar's sister, Dr. Eva Guinan, director of the Bone Marrow and Stem Cell Transplantation program at the Dana-Farber Cancer Institute in Boston, says her brother had lived in Kansas for a while but that she had seen him only twice in the last ten years, at family gatherings. She says she knew nothing of the DEA investigation in Wamego and had never heard the name Todd Skinner.
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The marble bathroom Todd Skinner installed in his abandoned missile silo-cum-drug factory
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Men in blue: Agents donned protective suits before inspecting Skinner's missile silo.
Residents of Wamego, a down-at-the-heels village of 5,000, wrote Skinner off as a spoiled rich kid and Gunnar Guinan as his loopy factotum. But coffee-shop conversation often came around to the question of what was really going on at the missile base. What was the spring-plant story a cover for? A few locals figured the base for a methamphetamine lab. The county sheriff called the DEA, but nothing came of it.
Two years ago, Skinner abruptly evicted his mother's business from the missile base. "One day he tells me to move out, at enormous cost," Magrini recalls angrily. "You've hit a subject here that I'm not going to relive. I brought everything back to Tulsa, and that's where it's going to stay."
In the course of the last year or so, neighbors noticed Ryder trucks rumbling along Say Road almost twenty-four hours a day and then disappearing behind the locked gate. "You'd see all these rigs from Oklahoma, Missouri," says Linda Lada, who runs a beauty shop near the base entrance. "I couldn't figure out why, because the spring factory was supposed to have been closed."
Security, always tight, included a sophisticated camera monitoring system, motion detectors and infrared sensors. "One day I was driving a pickup that had New Mexico tags on it," recalls Janice Eichem. "And, boy, as soon as I pulled in there and walked up to the Quonset hut to clock in, here comes Gunnar: `Whose pickup is that?' I said, `I'm driving that. It's my ex-husband's: And he said, `You're the only one in it, then?' I said, `Yeah.'" Finally, Gunnar relaxed.
Pickard and Skinner - and an entourage that included Skinner's mother and Moise Seligman - spent a few days in Las Vegas last June. Seligman came along to talk with Skinner about a solenoid valve that Skinner was sure could make them millions: "I was out there to discuss this valve with Todd, and I met Pickard. I came home from there and told my wife, 'I met a man named Leonard Pickard, and he was a distinguished gentleman. I've never met anybody who's impressed me as favorably in recent years.'"
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At Leavenworth: Pickard has offered himself, and his knowledge of the drug underground, to DEA.
Katherine Magrini, there at Skinner's invitation to celebrate Mother's Day, was less impressed by her son's new friend. Pickard, she says, introduced himself as Leonard Thiessen. " `This Leonard is a real sleazeball, whatever his name is. He sounds like a bag of crap.' I was immediately suspicious of him."
Pickard alleges that Skinner, in Vegas, had more on his mind than solenoid valves. Skinner, he claims, also engaged in some "smurfing," or money laundering, buying $200,000 worth of chips, gambling a bit and then redeeming the chips for the casino's cash. Why Skinner was doing this, if he did, remains unclear. Skinner, through his Topeka attorney, Thomas Haney, declined to be interviewed for this story.
Renovating the base, Skinner did business with several local contractors and for a while paid his bills promptly, or at least his Kansas sidekick Gunnar Guinan paid them. "Gunnar was the one who would call on us when he needed work done or wanted to buy parts," says Toni Stremel, office manager at Thermal Comfort Air, which installed a hot-water pump on the property. "He would come in with his shirt unbuttoned, the hair on his chest sticking out, and he'd be bragging about how he had to go to Kansas City to pick up a bride that he'd ordered out of a magazine." Guinan would lay a briefcase full of cash on the desk and flip it open. "He'd take out what he owed us and walk away."
Leonard Pickard visited Todd Skinner at the Wamego missile base a handful of times over the past couple of years, staying either a few days or as long as a few weeks each time. But, he says, he never enjoyed the place: "It wasn't comfortable, and the karma was wrong." The only real bedroom belonged to Skinner; guests slept on mattresses out in the old missile bay. Leonard also disapproved of Skinner's manner toward his so-called friends: "Todd was imperious. He treated everybody as workers." Rather then a "psychedelic temple," as Skinner intended, Pickard says the base became more of a "temple to the ego."
Last summer, Skinner's cash flow mysteriously dried up, and, Pickard says, his use of psychedelics increased. Skinner cracked up one of his Porsches and totaled Gunnar's truck. Concerned, Pickard approached Skinner's mother, Katherine Magrini: "I talked with her numerous times about Todd's profligate ways and about how he's very accident-prone. `This boy's got to slow down, because not a week goes by where there's not some sort of situation happening. There's no peace ever.' "
Magrini's voice exploded over the phone when I asked her to verify this exchange. "What?" she shouted. "That is a bald-faced lie! Why, that sack of lying crap! Where is that son of a bitch? I'm going to go up and sue his ass with a bevy of lawyers."
For the first time, bills, thousands and thousands of dollars' worth, went unpaid. A number of contractors sued to get their money. "Gunnar," Toni Stremel says, "called here wanting to know if we would trade out a baby grand piano for our debt." The Sacramento audio store filed suit against Skinner in August, having been paid nothing on its $120,000 bill.
More important, as far as Pickard was concerned, Skinner wasn't making good on a promise to come up with $440,000 to fund some new drug research at Harvard. Months and months dragged by while Skinner supposedly arranged for the money to come from a foundation run by Warren Buffett. "I was hanging on because I really wanted to do this project," Pickard says. 11 1 was dying to get back to Cambridge." When Pickard contacted officials at the Kennedy School about the Buffett arrangement last June, they knew nothing of it. "I was taken for an enormous ride," Pickard claims. "I'd been lied to. Once I realized it was all a charade, I felt very used and started backing away."
Skinner faced difficulties of his own. One night the previous January, gambling at Harrah's Prairie Band Casino on the Pottawatomi Indian reservation, not far from Wamego, he had hit a run of good luck. Asked for identification when cashing in his chips, he produced a phony Interpol badge and declared himself to be a special agent of United States Treasury Department. Sheriff's deputies, alerted by casino officials, arrested Skinner later that night, and federal prosecutors in Topeka soon filed a two-count felony indictment against him. Skinner pled guilty last June to possession of a false identification, a misdemeanor, and was fined $10,000.
Pickard says he tried to avoid Skinner. "I decided it was best to step away from him. He was unpredictable and kind of crazy. From mid-July until October, we had no contact. His life was unraveling. Then he called me." Remembering the conversation, Pickard's eyes hardened. "It was a controlled call." Controlled in the sense that DEA agents, including Special Agent Karl Nichols, a clandestine lab hunter with the agency's Richmond, California, office, were listening in, tape recorders rolling.
Just what they discussed, and precisely why Skinner may have fallen into the arms of the DEA in the first place, remains unclear at this point, although both mysteries may be cleared up at trial, during which Pickard will be represented by William K. Rork, one of Topeka's leading criminal-defense attorneys. This much is certain: That monitored call last fall set in motion a series of events that could end Leonard Pickard's colorful life as a free man and snuff out whatever future he might have had as an innovative scientist. It may also, if the government is to be believed, have significantly curtailed the production of American-made LSD.
THE SILVER BUICK
OCTOBER 23RD, 2000, 8:40 P.M. DRIVING A RENTED TAN Buick Century, Leonard Pickard swung into the parking lot of the Four Points Sheraton Hotel in San Rafael, California. While his pregnant Russian wife, Natasha, waited in the hotel bar, Pickard met with Todd Skinner in a room upstairs, as DEA agents listened in an adjoining room. The sit-down lasted about thirty minutes. Skinner and Pickard talked about a number of LSD-related topics, including the eventual setup of an offshore lab. Skinner called Pickard on October 29th, wanting to know when he could get "the keys to the Dodge," a phrase the two men used to describe the acid lab.
Pickard and a friend of his, Clyde Apperson, a computer consultant from Sunnyvale, California, appeared at the Wamego missile base a few days later, on November 4th, driving two rented vehicles, a silver Buick Le Sabre and a fifteen-foot Ryder truck. Skinner, never shy, seemed fuller than ever of braggadocio. "I'm not afraid of the Mafia or the government!" Pickard recalls Skinner declaring, "I'm more powerful than you realize!" - whereupon Skinner left for parts unknown. Pickard and Apperson set about loading the Ryder truck with military crates full of glassware and chemicals. Six kilos of ergotamine tartrate, worth 8600,ooo, were stashed in the silver Buick. That much ET, the government claims, is enough to manufacture 15 million doses of LSD. Loading complete two days later, Apperson slipped behind the wheel of the Ryder truck, and Pickard took the Buick. It was time to move out, to a new lab site, prosecutors allege, somewhere near Aspen, Colorado. Pickard claims he was merely carting the lab away to destroy it and prevent further legal trouble for his friend Skinner.
They didn't get far before a unit of the Kansas State Highway Patrol clicked on its red lights and pulled them over. Though Apperson was quickly captured, Pickard scampered off into the night, sprinting across snowy ground into the woods, two highway patrolmen half his age in hot pursuit, a chase that was eventually joined by DEA agents, helicopters with infrared scanners and tracking dogs. Pickard eluded them for nearly eighteen hours before deputies from the Pottawatomie County sheriff's office brought him in. His wallet, later found at a convenience store in Wamego, contained a Mastercard in one of Pickard's several aliases,James Maxwell, three false identification cards under that name, a business card from UCLA in his real name and eleven telephone calling cards.
That night, Sheriff Anthony Metcalf dropped by Pickard's cell in the local lockup. Pickard's manners impressed him: "He looked like a distinguished old gentleman. If somebody said to me, `Hey, there's a bigtime doper over there,' Pickard would be the last guy you'd ever think of."
Metcalf visited the missile base during a cleanup that lasted several days and employed a squadron of technicians wearing bright-blue hazardous-materials suits. " `How big is this, and who is this guy?' he asked one of the DEA chemists on the scene. "There's probably seven people in the world that could run an operation this large, and Pickard was one of them."
PICKARD ON ICE
WHILE PICKARD ADJUSTED TO LIFE AT THE SHAWNEE COUNTY JAIL IN Topeka, I tried to track down some more information about him in California. It was a frustrating and often fruitless task. An address for Pickard in Mill Valley, just over the Golden Gate Bridge from San Francisco, turned out to be a MailBoxes, Etc. in a mall. Another address, in Berkeley, was also a mail drop, the Berkeley Mailroom. LSD distributors, BNE agents told me, traditionally use businesses like these to ship their product. Until Pickard's wife, Natasha, mailed me some of his research papers, I could not find the address of the apartment in San Francisco that Pickard shared with her and her father - but neither, at least early in their investigation, could agents of the DEA.
The same was true for Todd Skinner. He moved out of the Wamego missile base, which is now on the market for a reported $1.5 million. A visit to his last known address, in Berkeley, turned up no traces of the elusive informant. A member of Pickard's defense team says that Skinner has been seen around Mendocino, the picturesque village north of San Francisco, in between trips to Topeka to huddle with federal prosecutors.
Pickard's friends - some feeling betrayed, others worried about repercussions for their own drug research - are not rushing to his defense. After Talitha Stills read about Pickard's arrest in the Santa Cruz Sentinel, she told me, quite frankly, "You just can't hold a bad boy down." But when I called Sasha Shulgin to inquire about the learned chemist's relationship with Pickard, Shulgin began, "He was a student of mine ioo years ago, but he's been in his own little world, which I really don't know that much about." Ann Shulgin interrupted our conversation. "We'd rather not comment at all on this entire matter," she said. "It's very sad, and I don't think we have any information that could possibly help you." The Shulgins are not the only friends of Pickard's distancing themselves from him. Agents who searched Pickard's apartment in San Francisco on November i5th turned up a supportive letter written by the city's district attorney, Terence Hallinan. "When I was in private practice, I represented Leonard Pickard on some legal matters," it read. "I always found him to be an honorable person who kept his word." Hallinan won't comment further. Mark Kleiman, Pickard's mentor at Harvard and his boss at UCLA, also declined a request to discuss his friend.
"Either caught red-handed or very carefully set up," said Blanche Hartman, the Abbess of the San Francisco Zen Center. "It sure doesn't look good. I was surprised and dismayed, and extremely sad. His girlfriend gave birth just days after he was arrested. She was just totally distraught."
Leonard Pickard maintains he is guilty only of being in the wrong place at the wrong time. "I am not a psychedelic chemist," he told me resolutely. Then, he adds, "Remember, I just left Boston in '97. I can't obviously be making kilos of LSD and doing my work at Harvard in the meantime." Besides, he said, LSD is more than a bit passe in the world of social-- drugs research he now inhabits: "I'm concerned with the need for new regulatory structures for new drugs of abuse. I'm more concerned with what's coming than with what's present."
After the bust, Todd Skinner called his old friend Moise Seligman. Says Seligman, "He said, 'I want to send you some articles on Leonard Pickard. I am mentioned in there. I am in no way involved with him. You know me and drugs: He was not a drinker and not a drug man of any kind." A few weeks later, Skinner called again, to invite Seligman and his wife to join him in Washington or New York, where Skinner would purportedly receive an award for his work on the Pickard prosecution. "Todd said, `If they are successful in loGating the cash that Pickard may have stashed, I would come in for a portion of that money, up to a third.'" Skinner promised to call back with more details, but never did. "I don't know where he is. I don't know if he got an award or got shot," says Seligman.
More than anything, in the course of several meetings in the Topeka jail, Pickard sounded embarrassed by the current federal case against him, frustrated that the whole business couldn't be sorted out in a gentlemanly fashion by rational men. At a detention hearing in January, Pickard stood before a federal judge and offered, in essence, to trade his freedom for somebody else's: "If released, even in the most severe constraints,I would immediately proceed to report to the federal building [and] cooperate even aggressively with DEA in any matters that they wish." The judge, however, refused to grant Pickard bail.
Almost every week, Pickard wrote letters from jail. Sometimes two or three arrived on the same day, with carefully worded answers to my questions, interspersed with Van Morrison lyrics and quotes by a wide variety of luminaries from Berkeley fixture Wavy Gravy and poet WH. Auden to Carlos Lehder, the assassinated Colombian cocaine baron ("Cocaine is an A-bomb pointed at the heart of America"). The letters gave the impression of a man in complete control, confident that the breadth of his intelect and experience would enable him to surmount all obstacles. More than once, he hinted at a wilder tale to be told only after his trial ends: "A post-disposition retrospective would be a more thrilling and soulful read."
Rick Doblin won't want to hear it. "He's been caught multiple times in the past and has felt it convenient to supply the police with information on people who have been involved in other drugs that he doesn't think are so useful. That's a difficult game to play," he says.
"Once you start cooperating, it's easy to lose sight of what your own values are.
"The drug-dealer code of honor is that you don't turn anybody else in," Doblin continues. "That's lost from the public consciousness. And that's more true from the old days, from the pot dealers. That sort of shifted when the pot dealers got into coke. But that's always been the case with the LSD dealers. That's why the DEAs been very rarely busting labs and major distributors for LSD."
The DEA's investigation of Leonard Pickard continues. Does Pickard have anything to offer the feds? Agent Nichols believes Pickard employs a worldwide distribution network. So far, Pickard hasn't shown any inclination to discuss such a network. This time, it would seem, the pressure Pickard feels is somewhat greater than it was in 1988, when he was a single guy cooking drugs in Mountain View. He missed the December 2000 birth of his daughter, also named Natasha, and held the child for the first time, for a minute, inside a Kansas courtroom surrounded by armed federal marshals. Thinking about this tearful moment later, Pickard wrote, "It was a glimpse of limitless joy. Surrounded by the sacred, I whispered what love and comfort I could, and vowed to return to them. I could have held them, and hold them even now, forever."
Says Pickard, "If this ever went away, I'd probably go straight back to Cambridge and finish my Ph.D.
"I regard myself as marginal, or as they say in Zen, `nothing special.' My regret is not giving more to society in the form of substantive research, but perhaps some time is left to do that, God willing." In March, after local jailers grew frustrated handling Pickard's many telephone calls, federal authorities transferred him from the relatively calm Shawnee County Jail to the maximumsecurity federal pen in Leavenworth, Kansas, a prison notorious for its violence and gang activity.
Even now, Leonard Pickard is surprised that Todd Skinner has done nothing to help him. "I thought he would at least provide some legal support. But I guess not. He must feel really lousy, assuming he has feelings at all."
"I forgive him his confusion," he wrote in a letter. "He is, after all, somewhat like the Wizard of Oz. Seemingly very impressive, but behind the (stolen) amplifier, quite small and afraid."
Skinner faces new problems of his own. On May 16th, state authorities in Kansas arrested him on a charge of involuntary manslaughter in the drug-- overdose death of the computer-company employee, Paul Hulebak. The dead man's sister, Kirstin Reynolds, a ballet teacher in Tulsa, says, "Todd Skinner is evil. He considers himself very smart, but I can tell from speaking with him numerous times that he's used to dealing with stupid people." Skinner's sidekick, Gunnar Guinan, she says, "spilled the beans."
Looking back on his life, Pickard wrote, "All in all, a complex story. Suffice it to say that everything was done with dedication and focus, and I have prepared for this day for many years."
In another letter, Pickard enclosed a prayer, "one favored in times of trouble, among psychedelic people in the Sixties."
May the long-time sun shine upon you
And all love surround you
And the clear light within you
Guide your way home.
"If you see fit," Pickard wrote, "you might include that, for the young people."
Edited by shLong (01/31/12 11:58 AM)
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shLong
:feelsgoodman:
Registered: 03/04/10
Posts: 6,651
Loc:
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: shLong]
#15742679 - 01/31/12 12:02 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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To be fair though, it wasn't his 1st bust
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underfliptown
Just another person.
Registered: 03/07/11
Posts: 4,387
Last seen: 1 hour, 25 minutes
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: shLong]
#15742684 - 01/31/12 12:05 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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We all know it was neurosoup who was the most instrumental in the LSD manufacturing!
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shLong
:feelsgoodman:
Registered: 03/04/10
Posts: 6,651
Loc:
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: underfliptown]
#15742692 - 01/31/12 12:07 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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oldgringo51
oldgringo51
Registered: 01/28/12
Posts: 2
Loc: Sacramento, California
Last seen: 2 months, 26 days
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Learyfan]
#15742759 - 01/31/12 12:24 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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That was a fairly well done program. The best one I've seen, and is available on DVD, is The History Channel's "Peyote to LSD : A Psychedelic Odyssey". It has Wade Davis reflecting on the career of Dr. Richard Evans Shultes as Davis revisits many of the places of Shultes' studies. Very entertaing and packed with info and ceremonial experiences. "The Peyote Road" is another excellent documentary but only available on VHS...you can transfer it to DVD. Anything else worthwhile out there ?
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psychotropical
Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 235
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: oldgringo51]
#15742913 - 01/31/12 01:08 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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Quote:
oldgringo51 said:
That was a fairly well done program. The best one I've seen, and is available on DVD, is The History Channel's "Peyote to LSD : A Psychedelic Odyssey". It has Wade Davis reflecting on the career of Dr. Richard Evans Shultes as Davis revisits many of the places of Shultes' studies. Very entertaing and packed with info and ceremonial experiences. "The Peyote Road" is another excellent documentary but only available on VHS...you can transfer it to DVD. Anything else worthwhile out there ?
Thanks for that! It's on youtube, gonna watch it later tonight:
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psychotropical
Registered: 10/15/11
Posts: 235
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: oldgringo51]
#15742940 - 01/31/12 01:15 PM (3 months, 27 days ago) |
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Quote:
oldgringo51 said:
Anything else worthwhile out there ?
"The Brotherhood of Eternal Love" is a pretty good read, you can find some free downloads of it out there. Traces the history of the west coast acid movements, chem labs, busts, etc..
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Ghostwriter
(I'm my own planet)
Registered: 06/18/10
Posts: 2,935
Loc: USA
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: psychotropical]
#15799097 - 02/12/12 04:45 PM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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New Drugs Inc. on NATIONAL GEOGRAPHIC Tonight at 9pm
New episode is on "Designer Drugs" will cover spice, bath salts etc..
Get tuned motha fuckers
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STARVE THE EGO, FEED THE SOUL
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
Registered: 06/11/11
Posts: 4,784
Last seen: 29 days, 21 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Ghostwriter]
#15799112 - 02/12/12 04:48 PM (3 months, 14 days ago) |
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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shLong
:feelsgoodman:
Registered: 03/04/10
Posts: 6,651
Loc:
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL] 2
#15803556 - 02/13/12 02:22 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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That was the worst, least informative episode of Drugs inc. EVER!
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love2shpongleIRL
Opiophile
Registered: 06/11/11
Posts: 4,784
Last seen: 29 days, 21 hours
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: shLong]
#15803767 - 02/13/12 03:05 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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Bummer, I got that feeling from flipping through it but I have yet to watch.
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Only those who will risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go.
T. S. Eliot
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shLong
:feelsgoodman:
Registered: 03/04/10
Posts: 6,651
Loc:
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: love2shpongleIRL]
#15803800 - 02/13/12 03:13 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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In a nutshell....
All rc's are "bath salts"...bath salts kill and cause insanity. No mention or breakdown of the different varieties. They mention mephedrone briefly though.
Was hoping they'd talk about methylone, e1, b1, 6apb, etc etc
Synthetic weed also is extremely dangerous and is a growing problem.
All the other episodes are at least informative and interesting. This one was mainly one big "CAUTION!!"
Still check it out though, I munched 1.5mg of xanax, so my memory may not be the most reliable
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wildchild68
lion in a coma
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Posts: 5,112
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: shLong]
#15803989 - 02/13/12 03:50 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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Quote:
shLong said:
That was the worst, least informative episode of Drugs inc. EVER!
agreed, kinda knew it was coming though.
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FractalDust
Inspired by the mystery
Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 11,296
Loc: Blue Mu
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: wildchild68]
#15804619 - 02/13/12 05:38 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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So the new episode of Drugs Inc. is about stealing cars? 
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shLong
:feelsgoodman:
Registered: 03/04/10
Posts: 6,651
Loc:
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: FractalDust]
#15804907 - 02/13/12 06:23 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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?Huh?
Its about designer drugs
Mpdv etc
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FractalDust
Inspired by the mystery
Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 11,296
Loc: Blue Mu
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: shLong]
#15804946 - 02/13/12 06:28 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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Quote:
shLong said:
?Huh?
Its about designer drugs
Mpdv etc
That's episode 7, I'm streaming the new one episode 8 and it's about stealing cars.
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FractalDust
Inspired by the mystery
Registered: 03/20/05
Posts: 11,296
Loc: Blue Mu
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: FractalDust]
#15805023 - 02/13/12 06:40 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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By capping their season with an episode on grand theft auto it seems to me Drugs Inc. is trying to portray drug users and dealers as being in the same class of people as thieves. 
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Freyja
Stranger
Registered: 09/03/11
Posts: 196
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: FractalDust]
#15805040 - 02/13/12 06:42 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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Yep, worst episode ever. All they really covered was bath salts and spice.
Though I'm kind of glad they didn't cover MXE, 25xNBOMe or 4-meo-pcp /3-meo-pcp, I'd really like to get my hands on those before they get banned.
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The future did not look good for Schrodingers cat.
one shroom, two shroom, green shroom ... wait how did that get there?
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Beefy1
GONE
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Posts: 1,869
Loc: around
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Freyja]
#15805130 - 02/13/12 06:57 PM (3 months, 13 days ago) |
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It was an intersting series to watch but they'vev run out of drugs to focus on.
bath salt /spice one could have been a lot better. It sucked.
THey're out of material. Can't keep the series going without really stretching things.
The one before that on hash I had to turn off when it went to the lady in the treatment center for teenage dutch potheads.
The show is entertaining sometimes. All these drug shows need to go away. There's some new one out to replace the one from harborside that's not on anymore
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dwpineal
Psychedelic Artist
Registered: 07/20/06
Posts: 3,703
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Freyja]
#15812390 - 02/15/12 06:54 AM (3 months, 12 days ago) |
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Quote:
shLong said:
That was the worst, least informative episode of Drugs inc. EVER!
Quote:
Freyja said:
Yep, worst episode ever. All they really covered was bath salts and spice.
Though I'm kind of glad they didn't cover MXE, 25xNBOMe or 4-meo-pcp /3-meo-pcp, I'd really like to get my hands on those before they get banned.
Man I had such high hopes for the research chemical episode. As someone who discovered RC's in about 1995 JUST as the internet was coming online - I was actually able to correspond with Sasha Shulgin and discovered things like AMT and DPT before anyone really knew what the f*%k they were...I watched it with my wife, who does not know anything about the whole RC thing, and was hoping she would learn something valuable. Instead - no - just a big Warning Sign.
And I actually laughed out loud when the "Dealer" said he was making $1000 a week, A WEEK! You can do that in a normal job! She's known me for a long time and was like, how much were those boxes you used to sell at shows? (we'd move 25 lbs of mushrooms in a day or two at shows pre-2005 (so money was worth more than it is now) so $20K in 2 days. The "wholesaler" is selling 5 capsules.
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psiloscribe
Stranger thanmost
Registered: 10/28/04
Posts: 2
Last seen: 1 month, 27 days
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Re: Hallucinogens episode of Drugs Inc. on Nat Geo [Re: Nature Boy]
#16030539 - 04/01/12 05:29 PM (1 month, 27 days ago) |
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Quote:
Nature Boy said:
The asshole with the cluster headaches is going about "self-medicating" with mushrooms all wrong.
N.B.
Until YOU put your face and family on TV, cultivating, consuming and treating a medical condition with psychedelics (without your disclaimers), putting his life and liberty on the line, only to help others.......I'll just consider YOU the asshole.
B~
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