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Offlinezzripz
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Registered: 12/23/08
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Icelander]
    #15180165 - 10/05/11 07:18 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Yes, but I was speaking personally too when I say 'not get it'--I try and be clear. I mean those I feel who cling to a straictly scientific materialism and will not be open to others ways of experiencing the world.

Here's one example of this attitude. Several years ago at this supposed psychedelic forums, The Lycaeum, I was talking about the magical nature of water that I can experience, and another member replied in a hostile way--as you could tell by his typing etc "WATER is H20!!!"lol

Edited by zzripz (10/05/11 07:19 AM)

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: zzripz]
    #15180191 - 10/05/11 07:26 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

The Lyceum, was maybe the first forum dedicated to the psychedelic experience.  I belonged many years ago.  Many were great guys and pioneers. 

As to the water issue it's pretty much been debunked.  That doesn't mean that I believe the material world is all there is. I stay open on that one.  It's just that I don't claim to know things that I cannot demonstrate as many do on literally thousands of different personal ideas.  I'd be a complete dupe if I did.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Invisiblefilthydee
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Icelander]
    #15180428 - 10/05/11 09:00 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

either of you guys care to share this debunked water debate with me? don't know if i've heard of this.

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: filthydee]
    #15180442 - 10/05/11 09:07 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)



--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Invisiblefilthydee
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Icelander]
    #15180457 - 10/05/11 09:11 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

thanks icelander:smile:

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Offlinezzripz
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: filthydee]
    #15181738 - 10/05/11 02:40 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

LOL no, I didn't mean that one. See how you jump to conclusions, though I can dig how you would think it to do with that.

No, I was simply talking about water in a magical way. Tyrying to tell people that there are different ways to experience reality---bnot THINKING someone psychedelic experience would come back with "Water is H20!!!"

But it wasn't just that. the whole in-house vibe there was 'NO MAGICAL THINKING ALLOWED!!' and 'WHERE'S YOUR EVIDENCE FOR THAT SENTENCE?!'

And it is that which exposes how these places like Lycauem etc are like little worlds in the main world which promotes a scientific materialism.
...Yes, I can dig that measure is important, but not when it becomes THE religion.

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: zzripz]
    #15181954 - 10/05/11 03:28 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

'NO MAGICAL THINKING ALLOWED!!'

That would make a great bumper sticker. :thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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OfflineSatyapriya
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Icelander]
    #15184201 - 10/05/11 10:48 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

ok i'm ganna try and get through this quickly since i got class in an hour..

where did i leave off?

ah right, so i had just finished going through their brainwashing material and they we're getting ready to start the ceremony.  everyone took their seats and the shaman and church leaders sat in the center around a hexagonic table.  we said a prayer and eventually Johnathan, the church leader, walked up to the front of the room and whipped out the ayahuasca he had brewed at home.  the musicians in the center had finished tuning their instruments and began playing some of the songs, as people joined in.  then people started to line up, i guess whoever was ready to go first, so i followed and watch closely as the first in line approached Johnathan.  Now what they told us in orientation was that Johnathon would look into our eyes each time we wen't up to receive and his higher self would instruct him as to how much to give us.  he did exactly that (or at least he looked intently into our eyes as IF he was reading our souls), and usually asked us how we we're doing and made chit chat every now and then.  i liked him actually, i thought he had a very positive energy about him, and thought he seemed pretty cool, which he was.  My beef wasn't with him, John, or even Chante.. it was with the asshole guardians who wouldn't just let me be.

so anyways i got up and said hello, and he asked where i was from, and if I had taken ayahuasca before.  I said it was my first time but that I was quite familiar with psychedelics, and asked him to give me whatever he thought would be best.  He looked into my eyes and positioned his thumb somewhat close to the top of the glass, and filled it to that point.  I took a deep breath, somewhat nervously, and gulped it down... gahhh!  lol actually it wasn't that bad.  NOWHERE NEAR as bad as fucking cactus juice boiled on the stove!

I then said thank you, placed the glass on the tray and sat down.  So let's skip ahead to about a half hour when i started feeling the effects..

The first thing I felt was a lightness to my body, it just felt very light, and lights in the room seemed brighter.  I remember having my eyes closed for awhile just contemplating the sensations when I decided to open them finally, and looked over at the hymn book the guy was reading next to me.  And I swear!  There was no way he could have known i started looking at the book at that moment, but he pointed out to me exactly where we were in the song, almost as if he felt my attention intuitively.  I started trying to follow along with the song, which was in Portuguese, as they all are.  It was enjoyable for what I think was about the length of 3 songs, and then I started to think, "wow, this music really sucks!"  "channeled from the higher realms my ass!"  i looked ahead at the music and made an interesting note, at least i thought it was interesting.. the reason every song is so boring and sounds exactly the same is because every fucking song is in the key of C! or rarely, Am, which has all the same chords and notes as C.  Ughh, C, the most overused key in pop music history! basically because it is all the white keys on the piano, and also very easy to play on guitar.

it is at this time that my memory is a bit hazy, but i remember having a lot of back pain, as i have a former back injury, and riding 11 hours on the moto over the course of a 24 hour period didn't help.  Really my body just felt very weak, and my stomach was aching.  I didn't yet feel like throwing up, but it was getting there.  The ayahuasca high that i felt i could definitely compare to the higher awareness and insight I receive under the influence of magic mushrooms.  plus i read that DMT is only one oxygen molecule more than the chemical structure of psilocybin, so I guess that makes sense.  Although i felt much more groggy than on mushrooms (on which i feel hardly groggy at all), more like somewhat intoxicated.  i sensed however that the plant definitely had healing qualities to it, and started to understand its medicinal value to the people of the rainforest.  But still, only partly through this experience, as i don't feel like i was comfortable enough to go deeper into it.

So the initial come up was good, and was feeling the effects pretty strongly at this point.. but the rest of the night was a complete disaster..

I started to get deeply, DEEPLY sick of hearing this godforsaken music, and decided to ask a guardian if i could go to the back area and lie down.  they allowed me to do so.  they said it is best to lie on your back and so that's what i did.  I'm not sure what was going through my head at this point but I'm pretty sure it wasn't all that great.  I have a more than average amount of social anxiety around people when sober and definitely started to feel it more intensely as time went on.  And so my awareness of the presence of others was spiking, as were negative thought processes, which we're flooding my mind quite rapidly.  The music was really starting to become a problem for me now as I couldn't focus, and couldn't relax.  I decided then to ask to go outside.

...

Fuck, well now I'm done with class, but have to go to sleep for work in the morning :sad: will finish this later.


--------------------
www.collectivelyconscious.net - Hive mind for the awakened. ॐ Collectively Conscious ॐ is a community-powered, community-verified, alternative news/multimedia aggregation service for global citizens.

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OfflineRewindicus
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Satyapriya]
    #15184239 - 10/05/11 11:00 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

D-Y-I-N-G........did yo usee anything? fractals? colors? :popcorn:


--------------------
“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.”- Dr. Seuss

"Too much of a good thing, can be wonderful!" - Mae West

"If you have nothing nice to say about anyone, come sit next to me."
- Alice Roosevelt Longworth




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Invisiblec0sm0nautt
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Rewindicus]
    #15187582 - 10/06/11 04:52 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Thanks for sharing your account - I'd like to hear more.

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Invisiblefilthydee
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: c0sm0nautt]
    #15208600 - 10/11/11 07:36 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

anyone? jeez man talk about a cliff hanger.

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Offlinezzripz
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: filthydee] * 2
    #15210173 - 10/11/11 02:41 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

they've got him. last i saw he was all in white and smiling and singing in Portugese

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OfflineKickleM
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: zzripz]
    #15210276 - 10/11/11 03:06 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

:lol:


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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OfflineCouperj
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Kickle]
    #15213257 - 10/12/11 10:44 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

W Aaaaaahhhh wtf man!?! You're killing me here! So far it sounds like a horrible experience, but still I want to hear the rest of the story. This past summer I had an amazing spiritual awakening and I thought maybe the Santo Daime would be a place for me, but after reading this account I am starting to think that I was mistaken. I'm down with j man, but I believe there is so much more to it than what organized religion would have you believe. Zzripz- I'm pretty sure iknow what you mean about getting "it." It's unforutnate that psychs don't necessarily help one to get it, but I have found that you can get "it" without the aid of psychs, it just takes a whole hell of a lot longer.


--------------------
(¯`'·.¸(♥)¸.·'´¯) But suddenly you're ripped into being alive. And life is pain, and life is suffering, and life is horror, but my god you are alive and it is spectacular!

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Couperj] * 1
    #15214064 - 10/12/11 01:43 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

He probably offed himself. :shrug:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Invisiblec0sm0nautt
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: zzripz]
    #15214481 - 10/12/11 03:06 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

zzripz said:
they've got him. last i saw he was all in white and smiling and singing in Portugese




:rofldrunk:

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InvisibleCups
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Icelander] * 1
    #15214916 - 10/12/11 04:32 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
He probably offed himself. :shrug:




That seems to be your default response whenever someone stops posting for a while.

Then you seem disappointed when they come back.

:strokebeard:


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What's up everybody?!

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OfflineSatyapriya
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Icelander]
    #15214920 - 10/12/11 04:33 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
He probably offed himself. :shrug:




How nice lol

i have just been non-stop busy since i got back.  but the rest of the story is coming.. patience plz.


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www.collectivelyconscious.net - Hive mind for the awakened. ॐ Collectively Conscious ॐ is a community-powered, community-verified, alternative news/multimedia aggregation service for global citizens.

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InvisibleCups
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Satyapriya]
    #15214928 - 10/12/11 04:33 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Guess Ice is sad now.

:lol:


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What's up everybody?!

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OfflineSatyapriya
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Re: So I contacted the Santo Daime church in Ashland, Oregon [Re: Satyapriya] * 1
    #15215540 - 10/12/11 06:27 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

alright here we go, I'll do my best to remember the rest of the evening..

so i was feeling overwhelmed and asked one of the guardians if i could go outside.  he said sure and escorted me to the garden area around back.  i sat on the concrete, not really feeling sick or anything, just more like a little bit freaked out with the whole ceremony.  I chatted with the guy for a little while, who seemed pretty cool.  If he had taken the ayahuasca, then he had pretty good control over himself, bc he seemed totally normal to me.  i think one of the first things i said to him was something like, "man.. this is really weird." ... to which he replied, "oh without a doubt, VERY weird," lol.  i then asked him some questions about the ayahuasca, which i can't remember really, but remember him getting into all this stuff about the higher realms and the like.  whatever he said really must not have made any sense to me because i can't remember any of it.. so then i asked him about the church and what he thought about it, and i remember him saying something like, he just thought it was really cool that there is a community that gets together and takes psychedelics for the purpose of discovery and self-discovery...etc.  i think it was about that time that a raccoon ran across the patio right behind us lol.  and then a deer off in the distance, which was pretty awesome.  i was then feeling a little bit better and more grounded after talking to him and decided to go back inside.

They we're just starting to give out the second serving when I walked in, and so I contemplated whether or not I should drink once more..  I figured so long as I can go outside and get away from all this crazy energy, i would be fine.  so i took off my sweater, down to the white shirt again (since i had to wear that to receive), looked down at it and thought "whatever" lol, and entered the line.  when i got up to Johnathan again, he asked how i was feeling and how much i thought i would want to drink.. I shrugged and said "whatever you think," and he filled the glass to the top.  I gulped it down and then returned to my seat and rejoined the singing, for which i figured i would withstand for another 5-10 minutes and then go outside, to explore the effects of the ayahuasca in my own space.

but after about 5 minutes my stomach started to seriously ache, and i became anxious.  i felt like my body was telling me "no! too much! get it out!" but decided to stick it out for a little while longer.  i lasted about another 5 minutes when i decided i just couldn't hold it anymore, and asked a guardian if i could vomit somewhere.  he led me to the back and gave me a vomit bucket coated with some sort of tissue.  i dropped onto all fours in the back corner and just stared into the vomit bowl, waiting for it to come out.  eventually, i had to gag myself to get myself to be able to throw up, and then just let er rip!  AND OMG, IT FELT SO FUCKING GOOD TO VOMIT! :grin:

i remember that the gag reflex was so intense in this state that my entire field of vision brightened, almost to the point that everything i saw was bright white.  and good sensations rolled throughout my body.. "LA PURGA!" i thought lol.

i then sat there for another 5 minutes and then got up and decided to walk around a bit, feeling a bit more light and less groggy than before.  I walked over to the entrance where the bulletin board was and read some of the flyers, when i noticed something, the first like ACTUAL hallucination.. the walls we're quivering.  I've never seen this before..  I've seen the walls breathe and wave, but never quiver like this before.  And it was definitely in my periferals bc when i looked straight at the part that quivered, it remained still.  i was fascinated by this and thought how it looked almost like i could see the sound waves of the music bouncing off the walls just as they hit it.  it was quite beautiful.

at that point i was still pretty high on the ayahuasca and decided it would be a good time to go and meditate outside, so i grabbed my stuff and asked a guardian if it was alright.  i walked out back to the garden again and noticed that there we're many more people out there now, more like 10 or so.  Half of them vomiting in the bushes lol.  I pulled out my meditation cushion and sat down, and then wrapped myself in my shawl and just shut my eyes.  It was like a beautiful symphony of vomit noises and gagging all around me.

After about 5 minutes of sitting outside and trying to center myself, the guardian who led me outside this time, a different guy, said something like "okay are you good, ready to go back inside?"  i replied with "actually, do you mind if i stay out here for a little while? i'm not feeling well and need to center myself."  Then he started to go off on how i can't do that, how i signed up for this ceremony and how i HAVE to be a part of it... blah blah blah.  I then decided to be honest with him and said, "you know, this just isn't really vibing with me, i feel very uncomfortable in there.." we argued back and forth like this for about 10 minutes...

now i had already made the decision in my mind that there was no way i was going back in there lol, so i was basically just trying to relate my pain and discomfort to this guy this whole time, which i was very much so feeling at this point as well.  i had been up since 8am and had ridden 6 hours that day on the bike, and 6 hours the day before, so my back was killing me and i was just plain low on energy.  plus the lights around where they were singing were super bright and were straining my eyes as well.  but this did not work.  he eventually told one of the higher ups, a guy named cliff, who i will hopefully some day be able to forget.. i'm not kidding, this guy came out and aggravated me to my core like no one else has been able to do in years.

the first fucking thing he did was kneel down and look me right in the eyes as wide as his eyes could go and said "okay, look at me. what you are doing is not good. you're stuck in your lower body.." BLAH BLAH BLAH!  he wen't on like this for about 2 minutes.  I so badly wanted to say "get the fuck away from me you asshole!" but said instead, "man, put yourself in my shoes, i'm in a lot of pain right now, my back is killing me, my eyes are strained, i'm tired.." then he just cut me off!  and continued with his control freak rant talking metaphorically, in the most creepy way, about how he cannot have a part of his body not be where he can see it, or WHATEVER.  i was getting seriously frustrated with this guy, but still did not move from my cushion.  i started talking and again he cut me off.  and said, quite intensely, and crazily, "i don't have time for this, i have wasted enough time already." and stormed back inside.  i just sat outside, baffled by the complete insanity of this person, and just tried to let myself breathe and calm down.  But then another guardian came out and talked to me....

this was the black guy who gave me the vomit bucket.. and one of the first things he said to me was, and i'll never forget it:

"we miss your energy."

and in the most awkward and creepy way lol.  i couldn't help but laugh out loud after he said that.  i told him the same thing i told the others, and he said okay and left to go back inside.

over the next 5 or 10 minutes, as i sat there, like a dozen of participants wandered outside one by one to vomit in the bushes lol.  and then i noticed that crazy asshole cliff in the parking like, doing the weirdest thing i've ever seen... he had his hands together as if in prayer but up on his chest, with his head down a bit, walking SUPER rapidly in little circles on the pavement.  i was like, "oh dear God.."

it was then that i decided that this was not my kind of party, and decided to just leave and head back to my campsite...

now this is the epic moment of the night that i will never forget.. as i walked back inside from the back door, the first thing i saw, and heard, was about 10 people puking in the back area, and a few walking around in a haze.. then in the next area up, a man was lying on the couch having convulsions or something, and a guardian had his hand on his chest, as if he was exorcising a demon from his soul or something! and as if that wasn't enough, the final most creepy feeling i got was when i looked at he rest of the group, still singing in the circle beneath the lights, and at a very fast pace..

now its probably just my paranoia, but at that exact moment i got the distinct feeling that they we're channeling some sort of dark energy.. either that, or stealing people's energy and diverting it into the shaman.  I wanted to get away from it so badly, but had to interrupt the guy who i carpooled with to get my stuff from his truck.. ughh.

so i sneaked up behind him and tapped him on the shoulder and told him i had to leave, that some of the guardians were being very negative to me and that i just wanted to sleep.  i asked if i could get a ride, and he said he didn't think he could drive.  which was understandable.  we walked outside and as i was collecting my things that motherfucker cliff came up to me again!  all jittery like he had just snorted some cocaine he said "where are you going?!"  i said "i have to leave, this whole thing isn't vibing with me, and i need to get to sleep."  he said "you know, you signed a contract that you would stay for the entire session.." blah blah blah.. and i said "yes, well i'm going to have to break that contract. what are you going to do about it?"  he said, "okay, well i just need to know if you are leaving, you just have to let me know then.." :confused:  i then said "yes i'm leaving, bye." and walked away.  and he stormed inside again.

like i said, some people just should not be taking psychedelics :facepalm: plain and simple.

so i gathered my things and tried to consolodate again, enjoying this sweet sensation of freedom that was starting to rush over my body :smile:  but then the realization hit:  my campsite was 5 fucking miles away..

and i didn't have enough money for a taxi either, no joke.  and was still too high and freaked out to just walk up to someone late at night and try and ask for a ride.  i'm not really the type of person to do that anyways.  so i walked, for 5 miles down the main road, tripping on ayahuasca, until i FINALLY got to the camp site.  my legs we're completely worn out, arms too from carrying my things, and then i realized.. oh fuck! i forgot my headlamp at the church! :sad:

this basically means that i wouldn't have enough light to be able to set up my tent, and everyone else in the area was already sleeping.

it was at this point that i just accepted my defeat.. and collapsed under a tree, falling asleep on the grass.

THE END!


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