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 zZZz
friend
Registered: 12/28/07
Posts: 2,059
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 we have very little freedom   2
#15145525 - 09/28/11 02:57 AM (7 months, 28 days ago) |
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anyone else notice? jeezus we are fucking ignorant and stupid, not everyone, but most of us. what a joke of a society we live in. what a pathetic game we play.
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Jesus Is Love
 "The best quote of all time"
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 crkhd
☾☼☽
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: zZZz]
#15145561 - 09/28/11 03:43 AM (7 months, 28 days ago) |
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Disagree totally. We have total freedom. I may not, you may not but WE do.
Nothing is compelling you to go with the system.
Nothing is compelling you to follow your desires.
However you have chosen your shape and that alone limits your freedom.
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SHABOOM
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zzripz
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: crkhd]
#15145579 - 09/28/11 03:57 AM (7 months, 28 days ago) |
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I completely agree with you zZZz! We do not. And what is depressing is that others who are oppressed not only refuse to dig that, but police the dissent of other victims who bring this to the attention!
Now THAT strategy has been written about, but because I research all different subjects, and aint got a photographic memory, sometimes it is hard to remember the stuff on it--it may come to me, but off the top of my head: John Taylo Gatto (Google him) has revealed the indoctrination of the 'education' system which was imposed on millions of children in 19th century by force. It is based on inteolcking controlling philosophy since Plato and is designed to ensure a hierachy with the elite at the top and the 'peasants' at the bottom, so it is a dumbing-down strategy in other words. And Gatto goes into how this set us has been created via 'important thinkers' who influence things, that the very people oppressed are trained to police each other, and how this is for the benefit of the elite, because then they dont have to rely THAT much on spending 'their' money of coercive procedures to control dissent.
ALONG with this is of course the 'war on drugs' which very much includes the war on psychedelics, and this is obviously their control over free exploration of consciousness.
Now it of course CAN be argued that most of us can find psychedelics and/or grow our own, and thus are 'free' to do so, however IF we are caught there is a prison cell waiting for us which, I hope people will agree is NOT freedom, and that this persecution and threat affects the very culture we have to live in. I dont want to hog the conversation so will leave it there for now, but thans zZZz for bringing this to others awarenesses 
Edited by zzripz (09/28/11 04:00 AM)
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buegskee1
BLUE CHEESE
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: crkhd]
#15145580 - 09/28/11 03:58 AM (7 months, 28 days ago) |
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Disagree totally. We have total freedom. I may not, you may not but WE do.
Nothing is compelling you to go with the system.
everything we learn is.
Nothing is compelling you to follow your desires.
having no money or the right education does.
However you have chosen your shape and that alone limits your freedom
we are shown what shapes exist.
and so... agreed 
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 67,594
Loc: underbelly
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: zZZz]
#15145655 - 09/28/11 04:44 AM (7 months, 28 days ago) |
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Quote:
zZZz said:
anyone else notice? jeezus we are fucking ignorant and stupid, not everyone, but most of us. what a joke of a society we live in. what a pathetic game we play.
We are bound by the constraints of our genetics and physicality and particular animal nature. You can't think like the lion no matter how hard you try. What's interesting to reflect on is that we are a product of nature and the universe and creation at large. If we are "stupid" and do stupid things that is a reflection of creation at large. We cannot operate independently outside that system. This is why I believe humans created the myth of a conscious universe that is deliberately dumbing down as a game of remembering itself. We have to find a way to account for our stupidity and evil without condemning creation itself.
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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zzripz
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Registered: 12/23/08
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: Icelander]
#15146408 - 09/28/11 09:05 AM (7 months, 28 days ago) |
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we are not bound by genetics. neuroplasticity is finding that the old view that genetics determine you was false
we are not a 'product' of the universe and nature and creation at large. you make us sound like soap product. your terminology BINDS. words can bind, yeah? I call these toxic myths. I am not being mean to you, i know you like fun--I am just telling you how I feel it (i know ya will come back with somethin)
We rather ARE nature, ARE the universe, ARE creation. It is not this Mystery that makes us dumb it is words that bind. it is an 'education' system that tells you and nakes you believe you are a determinstic robot with no free will. In doing so that very toxic myth polices you....see? See the tricks being played?
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Posts: 67,594
Loc: underbelly
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: zzripz]
#15146610 - 09/28/11 10:08 AM (7 months, 27 days ago) |
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Baloney, people were acting like fools long before the scientific method was discovered. And you'll not grow wings and fly like a bird or climb like a squirrel.
We rather ARE nature, ARE the universe, ARE creation.
I've always said so and that's the problem as well as the solution. Any negativity you detect in the human condition is a natural product of evolution, nature, the universe and creation. If we are a mess then creation is a mess. Something I highly suspect btw.
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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dustinthewind13
Douroucoulis Aotus
Registered: 11/05/10
Posts: 2,296
Loc: Chasing the dragon
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: zzripz]
#15146615 - 09/28/11 10:10 AM (7 months, 27 days ago) |
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neuroplasticity is finding that the old view that genetics determine you was false
Neuroplasticity is determined by genetics. That means that genetics do determine you. At least with neuroplasticity. How your brain is going to change based on it's function is determined by the cooperation of nature (neuroplasticity in this case) and nurture (experience).
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"Set out running but I take my time
A friend of the devil is a friend of mine"
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zzripz
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I am not a neuroscientist but what you said does not make sense, and people I have heard who are knowledgeable about neuroplasticity dont talk like that---so, I will choose to ignore it
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Posts: 67,594
Loc: underbelly
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: zzripz]
#15146687 - 09/28/11 10:32 AM (7 months, 27 days ago) |
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bravo
but there are still the limits of genetics as I pointed out.
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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circastes
i did it for tha bliss
Registered: 01/14/10
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: Icelander]
#15146694 - 09/28/11 10:35 AM (7 months, 27 days ago) |
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See sig.
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Find me in the backyard, sailing my kettle. Playing poker with insects, wearing a cup of tea. A hat of brimstone, yellow-crimson, looking like a giant flea. Forever my friend: so my energy this day I lend, I practice faking it to pretend, and become the actor in the end. My folly hangs on the trees like leaves and drips in the falling breeze, the tock of a minute here shakes me to my knees.
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OrgoneConclusion
Pharoah & Balanced
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 29,381
Loc: Luxor
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: zZZz]
#15146701 - 09/28/11 10:36 AM (7 months, 27 days ago) |
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Let's say you are plopped down in the middle of the Amazon jungle by yourself with full gear and no oppressive regime. For breakfast you can have fish and some bitter fruit. I have 1000 times as many choices.
Then you are free to be bitten by dozens of stinging insects and are free to sweat profusely while I get to set my AC to the perfect temperature. When you get too hot you are free to swim in piranha-infested waters. I will go to my nice, clean pool.
FREEDOM!
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This is your drain on brugs.
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dustinthewind13
Douroucoulis Aotus
Registered: 11/05/10
Posts: 2,296
Loc: Chasing the dragon
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: zzripz]
#15146734 - 09/28/11 10:43 AM (7 months, 27 days ago) |
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Quote:
zzripz said:
I am not a neuroscientist but what you said does not make sense, and people I have heard who are knowledgeable about neuroplasticity dont talk like that---so, I will choose to ignore it
How does what I said not make sense? Where did your friends say neuroplasticity came from, if not from genetics?
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"Set out running but I take my time
A friend of the devil is a friend of mine"
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zzripz
Stranger
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sigggh, the whole POINT of this new tale from the usual stiff confining neuroscintific gang is that neuroPLASTICITY is that is is NOT bound by genes. who ya listening to? Are you a hip psychedelic experiencerrr orrr?
http://www.themonthly.com.au/brain-how-it-can-change-develop-and-improve-featuring-dr-norman-doidge-1385 [The reason why the ‘discovery’ of neuroplasticity is revolutionary (in 400 years) is because previously it was believed the brain was a machine like a computer, and different parts dealt with different things—like music and so on. This belief led to what I cal, neurological nihilism—that whatever state of the brain there is you are stuck with it. That once it was ‘wired’ it couldn’t ‘rewire itself’, because machines cannot do that, and this also meant that one’s nature was fixed also]
Edited by zzripz (09/28/11 10:51 AM)
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OrgoneConclusion
Pharoah & Balanced
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 29,381
Loc: Luxor
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You have to want it a lot and strain and grunt - that and it really helps to be young.
Neuro plasticity = genetics + exposure to many different types of tasks. This is one area where AI programs generally suck. Once they are fully trained it is nearly impossible to get them to respond to new data.
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This is your drain on brugs.
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zzripz
Stranger
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we have to stop THINKING of ourselves as bags-who-are-bound-by and rather see us as dynamic inter~relating forms which reach out and connect to nature, others, and universe
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dustinthewind13
Douroucoulis Aotus
Registered: 11/05/10
Posts: 2,296
Loc: Chasing the dragon
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Are you a hip psychedelic experiencerrr orrr?
Aye. 
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"Set out running but I take my time
A friend of the devil is a friend of mine"
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OrgoneConclusion
Pharoah & Balanced
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 29,381
Loc: Luxor
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More importantly are you so hip as to want to fuck dolphins?
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This is your drain on brugs.
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dustinthewind13
Douroucoulis Aotus
Registered: 11/05/10
Posts: 2,296
Loc: Chasing the dragon
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Nay. I want to fuck fairies though. 
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"Set out running but I take my time
A friend of the devil is a friend of mine"
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 67,594
Loc: underbelly
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Re: we have very little freedom [Re: zzripz]
#15147128 - 09/28/11 12:37 PM (7 months, 27 days ago) |
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Quote:
zzripz said:
we have to stop THINKING of ourselves as bags-who-are-bound-by and rather see us as dynamic inter~relating forms which reach out and connect to nature, others, and universe
One is all that.
You cannot deny the role that genetics plays. For instance one is more natural at musical ability than another. Given the same plasticity potential one will become a concert musician and the other will form a garage band and mostly be average with a lot of practice.
Actually now that I think of it, it's genetics that gives us such variety. Without it we would be truly machine like carbon copies.
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“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker
"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno."
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