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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery

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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: r72rock]
    #13687856 - 12/26/10 06:01 PM (1 year, 5 months ago)

We may know a lot but we will likely never know what we know.

We are not the creator if ourselves as far as we know. Life created us and in a form that has limitations. For instance we really cannot grasp infinity. So we don't know how we work in all of our amazing complexity and detail. And because of that all we can do is make a guess and hope we get close. Life is far bigger than a single species of primate that cannot even figure out how to stay alive much more than 100 tiny years. And we don't know if our brains and our dreams and our intuitions are telling us the whole truth.


--------------------
     

“What is the ideal for mental health, then? A lived, compelling illusion that does not lie about life, death, and reality; one honest enough to follow its own commandments: I mean, not to kill, not to take the lives of others to justify itself.”
― Ernest Becker


"Beneath the civilized veneer, man remains the supreme predator. Cursed with what he believes is understanding, his true soul blossoms godlike in the heart of the nuclear inferno." 


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Offlinefoliocb
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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: Icelander]
    #13689193 - 12/26/10 11:49 PM (1 year, 5 months ago)

Subjectively, we know alot. Objectively, we know nothing. :cheers:


--------------------


Everything posted by me on this forum is purely fictional and should not be taken seriously.


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Offlineleery11
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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: foliocb]
    #13689226 - 12/27/10 12:02 AM (1 year, 5 months ago)

someone says all roads lead to rome

is the abode of truth rome  perhaps all roads lead to a single road , which leads to rome, and is the only way in ?


--------------------
Om bhur bhuvaha swaha tat savitur varenyam bhargo devasya dhimahi, dhiyo yonah prachodyat.
We meditate upon that supreme light , the source of all creation, may it illumine our intellects and bring us eternal life.


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Offlineleery11
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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: zZZz]
    #13689236 - 12/27/10 12:07 AM (1 year, 5 months ago)

Christianity is originating from the premise of Jesus Christ being a cool wonderful being that can do something great for us

there are many demon-in-nations of christianity , of course ,

some say you are original sin, guilt,
most say you have to die to know the truth, if so then we wouldn't be here now ,

some say well jesus is love, so call him
that is what iw ould look at ,
jesus , are you real , are you light, are you good and not evil , god , is that so  protect me fro jesus if he is evil or false but if he is real , let me know the light, and give me the right understanding

because frankly without doing that you are not going to know anything, abook will give you ideas which will sculpt you in a manner, resembling the book itself, cloning almost , and in that sense you can learn from the teachings in the book that are GOOD,

the other thing to inquire about is simply if that dude is a being of golden lightcome to heal you , a demon in an energy field created by dark conspirators and the catcholic church ,

i mean you gotta be able to figure that out , if you want to know the truth anyway , 

believing the bible will only either wake you up or confirm in you how you were TAUGHT to think, ex

( yes this is a controversial read so i can see you are paying attention )

bliptty blee, Jesus is , the dude man, and like, i mean dude, so you read it , and then you are like, dude he is the dude, yeah !

you read into it church programming and the general thing they want you to read into it ,

without eyes to see

with eyes to see you see , which is nice .  then if you see, and Jesus is real, is HE THE REAL

the real is HEAVNELY FAHTER if you ask jesus he worshipped not himself and his reflection but the father, and it was to him he taught us to pray ,

SO IS THE RIGHT WORD FOR GOD HEAVENLY FATHER, is god ?

ask and receive.

post does and does not make sense depending upon your comprehension :laugh: easy to ignore or deep to explore,
one thing we should learn is to be perfectly ourselves we are all genius at something, and Jesus came not to condemn ...

IF THE CHURCH WAS WRONG, BUT JESUS IS REAL WOULD YOU SEEK HIM ?

AND IF HE IS REAL DOES THAT LIMIT US , TO JUST HIM, OR ARE THERE MANY SONS OF GOD ? ARE WE SONS OF GOD ? WHAT DOES JESUS SAY ? WHAT DO ALL THE RELIGIONS SAY ,

DOES IT EMPOWER YOU , questions(christians) worthy of asking .

would we tear apart what we believe in 1 second flat if we see the truth just over yonder mount, ?


--------------------
Om bhur bhuvaha swaha tat savitur varenyam bhargo devasya dhimahi, dhiyo yonah prachodyat.
We meditate upon that supreme light , the source of all creation, may it illumine our intellects and bring us eternal life.


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Offlinefoliocb
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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: leery11]
    #13689254 - 12/27/10 12:16 AM (1 year, 5 months ago)

Jesus is nothing more then a personified thought construct. We human beings tend to personify things a lot, don't ask me why.

Christianity implies that the objective creator 'god' or 'all that is' judges his own creations, which doesn't make any sense because it would simply be judging itself.

Christianity is just another flawed religion that gives hope to recovering drug addicts, or people that have been through some rough shit in their life. However, I wasn't faced with anything like that, and when you honestly suspend all your beliefs and take a look at religions such as Christianity, you notice that something isn't right... infact it's full of bullshit everywhere you look. There is so much fear ridden in its texts its amazing how afraid most human beings are of death.


--------------------


Everything posted by me on this forum is purely fictional and should not be taken seriously.


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Offlinesoldatheero
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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: foliocb]
    #13689346 - 12/27/10 01:04 AM (1 year, 5 months ago)

If you agree that you are generally ignorant to the true nature of reality and know very little. Then how can you make claims that things such as what happens after physical death, are impossible to know? Being ignorant how can you be able to say what can or cannot be known by others?

Quote:

Jesus is nothing more then a personified thought construct.




Thats a bold claim and a conclusion that IMO is way too simple and really doesn't even make much sense. Can you elaborate??  During the first century thousands of Christains died for Jesus as matrys.

In an interview Albert Einstein was asked about this issue, he made some good points IMO.

Quote:

"To what extent are you influenced by Christianity?"

"As a child, I received instruction both in the Bible and in the Talmud. I am a Jew, but I am enthralled by the luminous figure of the Nazarene."

"Have you read Emil Ludwig's book on Jesus?

"Emil Ludwig's Jesus," replied Einstein, "is shallow. Jesus is too colossal for the pen of phrasemongers, however artful. No man can dispose of Christianity with a bon mot."

"You accept the historical existence of Jesus?"

"Unquestionably. No one can read the Gospels without feeling the actual presence of Jesus. His personality pulsates in every word. No myth is filled with such life. How different, for instance, is the impression which we receive from an account of legendary heroes of antiquity like Theseus. Theseus and other heroes of his type lack the authentic vitality of Jesus."

"Ludwig Lewisohn, in one of his recent books, claims that many of the sayings of Jesus paraphrase the sayings of other prophets."

"No man," Einstein replied, "can deny the fact that Jesus existed, nor that his sayings are beautiful. Even if some them have been said before, no one has expressed them so divinely as he."





Quote:

The scholarly mainstream not only rejects the myth thesis,[59] but identifies serious methodological deficiencies in the approach.[60][Need quotation to verify] As such, New Testament scholar James Dunn describes the mythical Jesus theory as a "thoroughly dead thesis".[61]





wiki

It seems you think you know alot for someone who claims to take a position of ignorance.


--------------------
..and may the zelda theme song be with you at all times, amen.


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Offlineleery11
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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: soldatheero]
    #13689372 - 12/27/10 01:21 AM (1 year, 5 months ago)

i would not use the you to refer to one person in that way because everyone who reads it at all , gets this impression that it is about us ,

, albeit i will have to check myself to also not do so , i would use you only to mean very generally speaking "me" in reference to the "you" that i am writing ( all of you ) , in making points, if you know what i mean.

i myself personally never made claims about the things, and that confuses me personally when i look deeply at words, and looking deeply at words shows us whether they are valid for our experience , as i have found generally speaking to be put off by the energy waves , or what have you , feelings, of the bible , and other texts, and innately fascinated by the tao te ching, personally .

but i love random bible verses here and there, i cannot find linear sensibility in the thing, random verses are usually useful at times.


--------------------
Om bhur bhuvaha swaha tat savitur varenyam bhargo devasya dhimahi, dhiyo yonah prachodyat.
We meditate upon that supreme light , the source of all creation, may it illumine our intellects and bring us eternal life.


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Offlinefoliocb
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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: soldatheero]
    #13690557 - 12/27/10 10:38 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Quote:

soldatheero said:

"You accept the historical existence of Jesus?"

"Unquestionably. No one can read the Gospels without feeling the actual presence of Jesus. His personality pulsates in every word. No myth is filled with such life.






Really? When I read the gospels I didn't feel any presence, sounds like more subjective bullshit to me.

Oh, and if you want a brief lesson on other myths(I find it funny how the guy you quoted refers to jesus as a myth) then might I suggest a very simple youtube video?



You may also be interested in mother goose and the three little pigs if you enjoy the jesus story.  :ass:

Quote:

soldatheero said:

During the first century thousands of Christains died for Jesus as matrys.






Haha, whats your point? Just because people die for a 'cause' justifies it? Oh and by the way, how do you know that people died for him during this 'first century'? Oh... you read it in a book? Hmm.... sounds like another circle of ignorance to me. I've heard it all before "Oh I can prove jesus' existence.... just go read the bible!" Yeah.... death anxiety... :boot:


--------------------


Everything posted by me on this forum is purely fictional and should not be taken seriously.


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Offlinesoldatheero
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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: foliocb]
    #13691599 - 12/27/10 02:37 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Haha, whats your point? Just because people die for a 'cause' justifies it?




Well my point is that is more likely they were willing to die for a real person not a story on par with mother goose or the three little pigs, that is ridiculous.

Yeah I've seen the Zeitgeist take on Jesus, I don't buy it.

" very simple youtube video?" Oh it's simple all right.

Christian holidays were placed on Pagan holidays because the majority of religions at the time were Pagan, it was likely done to make the transition to Christianity easier.

Zeitgeist fails to acknowledge the fact that Christianity began with the poor and low class and was initially surpressed by Rome.. making it more unlikely to be a plot of the ruling elite.


The main arguements in Zeitgeist are just straight-up false.

Quote:

Examining some of specific claims made by the film, Forbes points out that while there are parallels between the story of Jesus and many other ancient mythological figures, many of the ones mentioned in the film are false, as are other aspects of the film's description of these myths. Forbes states that there is no evidence in Egyptian sources that Horus' mother Isis was a virgin, and claims that Ra was the Egyptian god of the sun, not Horus. Similarly, neither Krishna nor Dionysus nor Attis were ever said to be born of virgins, as Krishna was the eighth child of his parents, Devaki and Vasudeva, and Dionysus' mother, Semele, had slept with Zeus. Forbes asserts that Horus was not adored by three kings, and that neither he nor Attis were crucified nor resurrected. Forbes and interviewer John Dickson, founder of the Centre for Public Christianity, took issue with what they perceived as an argument centered on the homophony between the words "Sun" and "Son" in regards to Jesus, with Forbes dismissing this point as a pun, and pointing out that those words are not homophonic in ancient Egyptian, Latin or Greek. Forbes also points out that neither Horus, Attis nor Jesus were born on December 25, as the ancient Egyptian calendar did not include the month of December found in the Latin calendar, and that the date of Christmas is a celebratory tradition historically derived from Sol Invictus and Saturnalia, rather than the Bible.[25]

Forbes also criticizes the movie's use of Roman sources to suggest that Jesus did not exist, noting that the list of supposed contemporaneous historians alleged by the film to have not mentioned Jesus is actually a list of geographers, literature professors, poets, philosophers and writers on farming or gardening, who would not be expected to mention him, and that the modern sources cited in the film are either experts in fields other than ancient history, such as German literature, or uncredentialed amateur Egyptologists. Forbes challenges the film's allegation that Josephus' mention of Jesus was doctored by pointing out that Josephus actually mentions Jesus twice, and that only one of these mentions is believed by scholars to have been doctored in the Middle Ages, in order to change an already existing mention of him. Forbes also argues that while Emperor Constantine I legalized Christianity, it was Theodosius I who made it compulsory later in the 4th century, and that contrary to the film's thesis, Constantine did not invent the historical Jesus, as early records show that his historicity was already a key element of early Christianity prior to Constantine's conversion to it.[25]





wiki
Quote:

] S. G. F. Brandon and others argue that the very idea that early Christians would consciously incorporate pagan myths into their religion is "intrinsically most improbable,"[109] as evidenced by the strenuous opposition that Paul encountered from other Christians for even his minor concessions to Gentile believers.





wiki



"Oh and by the way, how do you know that people died for him during this 'first century'? Oh... you read it in a book? "

For the most part Roman Historians, including secular ones

"Oh I can prove jesus' existence.... just go read the bible" There is secular evidence that Jesus existed.

Sure you can argue both ways but I personally think it is more probable that Jesus did indeed exist. It has nothing to do with death anxiety.. lmao

This this is a topic of its own, if you want make another thread.
I would like to hear Mark The Gnostic's take on this!


--------------------
..and may the zelda theme song be with you at all times, amen.


Edited by soldatheero (12/27/10 02:52 PM)


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Offlinefoliocb
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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: soldatheero]
    #13692606 - 12/27/10 05:47 PM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Just because people die for a cause doesn't justify it at all, actually. People died for all sorts of weird shit back then, and even now people die for weird shit. Extremists in the middle east suicide themselves in the name of allah. Does that justify/prove it? Nope. You're just being ethnocentric to your own ignorance to claim that Christianity is likely true since people died for the 'cause'.

And for the most part, whether you believe zeitgeist or not, it's pretty easy to see that Christianity stole many of its aspects from pre-existing religions, especially Egyptian ones. Catholosism was made to convert Paganism and Christianity without bloodshed... sorta. Even though we ended up killing many of them during the Inquisition and such...

I don't know what else to say on this. Jesus may or may have not existed. We don't know. Any assumption on that is purely out of ignorance and subjective opinion. If you honestly put your belief systems in ideologies that instill fear into you, and actually make you believe that the objective creator of everything is actually willing to judge its own creations, and that you either need to get with the program or burn in hell for eternity... then I think you failed the first basic test on transcending your own ignorance.

While I can understand that our culture, society, family, media, and even our own language has implied a lot of the things we are led to believe, you have every tool required to step outside of your ignorance for just a single moment and realize how archaic all of this crap really is.

If Jesus did exist, he was probably a man who did a bunch of psychedelics and was tripped the fuck out, I woulda had a blast meeting him. :mushroom2:


--------------------


Everything posted by me on this forum is purely fictional and should not be taken seriously.


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Offlinesoldatheero
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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: foliocb]
    #13694535 - 12/28/10 02:02 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Quote:

And for the most part, whether you believe zeitgeist or not, it's pretty easy to see that Christianity stole many of its aspects from pre-existing religions, especially Egyptian ones.




Haha did you not read my post? My post goes to show all the opposite of what you state.

Quote:

If you honestly put your belief systems in ideologies that instill fear into you, and actually make you believe that the objective creator of everything is actually willing to judge its own creations





Jesus taught and preached nothing but love. If you take the modern religions as a representation of Jesus' words then you are a fool. Jesus showed nothing but love for all, particularly the lepers and the prostitutes, the perceived lowest of low. Modern Christianity does not equate to Jesus. Jesus judged no one but the money changers and the clergy.

The words of Jesus give me great inspiration to love.. the exact opposite of "death anxiety" and fear which you make your mantra.


--------------------
..and may the zelda theme song be with you at all times, amen.


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Offlinefoliocb
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Re: "God In A Pill?" [Re: soldatheero]
    #13695616 - 12/28/10 10:38 AM (1 year, 4 months ago)

Every Christian I meet says jesus hates fags.... yeah sounds like love to me.

Every human being has death anxiety. Christianity is just another desperate attempt by the ego to try and transcend the ego after death- which is a load of crap. Death is the true killing of the ego... whether there is something beyond this realm- we don't know. Any attempt at claiming to know is just another belief system in a circle of ignorance you have created around yourself.

Just the idea of being judged after this life is pretty funny actually. It's another fear mechanic in Christianity that makes people conform and live 'sin free'. How many millions of people were killed because they did not repent or convert to Christianity? Yeah... sounds like this 'love' you describe to me!


--------------------


Everything posted by me on this forum is purely fictional and should not be taken seriously.


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