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OfflineEywa_devotee
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Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT?
    #13495155 - 11/16/10 10:27 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

I have a bit of a rant. They say society wants people who are drug users to reform and "become productive citizens", but the laws themselves force people into a life of crime, unless they know the right people or are very very lucky. The drug laws bar a person from getting any professional job  that will be reliable and pay well. Due to insurance companies that view drug offenses as worse than being a child rapist in their risk model, factory jobs, most retail jobs, and any other mundane jobs like being a mechanic or plumber is out. About the only job you can realistically expect to keep is variants of starting your own business, but this is only if you have good business sense and start up capital.

As if denying you a job wasn't bad enough, they take away your right to federal student aid. In general going to college is a waste of time and money because you could have a PH.D and still be denied a job with a drug felony. Taking classes in useful skills is another matter though, but be prepared to pay your own way though or get a lot of loans you'll need to pay back.

On top of this the time in jail/prison creates a large gap in employment history that gives employers the convenient excuse "lack of employment history/experience.

This being said, how is drug use so bad that it makes people unemployable for the rest of their life? Do the drugs cause crime or are the laws themselves creating criminals of otherwise productive citizens?


--------------------
"Love one another." "To Love is to know me." "Love is the Law, Love under Will." "In Compassion, all sorrows end." Regardless of the Master, the message is the same- Choose love and you shall live, Choose Fear and you shall die. Help bring peace to this Earth: Love one another, and serve others before yourself.


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InvisiblePrisoner#1M
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Eywa_devotee]
    #13495775 - 11/17/10 01:07 AM (3 years, 8 months ago)

financial aid is not a right, jobs are not rights, not a single employer
out there owes you a job and ultimately you're responsible for any drug
arrest on your record

maybe you should reevaluate your outlook on things, if you know something
is illegal then arent you just gambling your time until you're caught


--------------------
Winter is a murderous whore -XLCaps


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InvisibleDickheadM
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Eywa_devotee]
    #13498694 - 11/17/10 04:53 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Eywa_devotee said:
This being said, how is drug use so bad that it makes people unemployable for the rest of their life? Do the drugs cause crime or are the laws themselves creating criminals of otherwise productive citizens?




1. It isn't IMO. 
2. Both..  an addict certainly might commit property or violent crime in order to get down.  AS well a casual user may end up in jail where they learn all sorts of bad news.


--------------------
POWER


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OfflineRemix
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #13503929 - 11/18/10 03:49 PM (3 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
financial aid is not a right, jobs are not rights, not a single employer
out there owes you a job and ultimately you're responsible for any drug
arrest on your record

maybe you should reevaluate your outlook on things, if you know something
is illegal then arent you just gambling your time until you're caught




I think you're over-simplifying his complaint when you put it like this. Nobody is saying these things are rights... however there is some pretty non-sequitur logic at work when a drug conviction can bar someone from ever qualifying for such things. Especially when a fair portion of illegal drugs are safer than legal drugs and a good number of people can be "illegal drug users" and still function in mainstream society. The whole "you knew it was illegal therefore you shouldn't have done it" argument is giving such laws and "policies" a level credence they don't deserve (by example of the fact that they haven't even come close to fixing "the drug problem" and, in reality, have only made it worse). Not-to-mention, any "drug problem" imminently becomes even more of a problem when users are, for the most part, denied a whole gamut opportunities that would allow them to be a part of their respected cultures. Actually, denying someone the ability to implement themselves into a culture over any sumptuary law is only going to cause more problems than it solves. It just creates a perpetually poor and underprivileged underclass that is a constant burden on the very culture that ostracizes them.

I mean, let's face it, if you can't get a job in America just because of strict drug conviction stances the government mine as well just exile said convicts and save some taxpayer money.


--------------------


Edited by Remix (11/18/10 03:51 PM)


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InvisibleGI_Luvmoney
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Eywa_devotee]
    #13658001 - 12/19/10 09:37 PM (3 years, 7 months ago)

I don't know what its like where you live, but where I am with most first and second time drug offenses, people get a stet docket or PBJ (probation before judgement) instead of a conviction.  You can then get the arrest record expunged later on. Also, I've known a lot of people in construction that had commited serious crimes, but were able to get jobs in construction.


--------------------


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OfflineLarrythescaryrex
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #13894888 - 02/02/11 07:17 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
financial aid is not a right, jobs are not rights, not a single employer
out there owes you a job and ultimately you're responsible for any drug
arrest on your record

maybe you should reevaluate your outlook on things, if you know something
is illegal then arent you just gambling your time until you're caught




So, as a moderator on a message board that is mostly for the purpose of learning to grow illegal drugs, it is your stance that if some one is arrested on drug charges, they deserve to pay for it for the rest of their lives? Thats a steaming hunk of B.S.


--------------------
Sunset_Mission said:
"larry the scary rex
verily scary when thoroughly vexed
invoke the shadows and dust, cast a hex
mercifully massacring memories masterfully
relocate from Ur to 8th density and become a cosmic bully
mulder and scully couldn't decipher his glyphs
invoke the shadows and dust, smoke infernal spliffs"
April 24th 2011


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Invisiblemushiepussy
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Eywa_devotee]
    #13923951 - 02/07/11 11:05 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

This shit honestly makes me sick

It is a total violation of our constitutional rights

These laws help nobody to get their life back together

I got arrested for having an old roach that i didn't even

fucking know about, and I don't even smoke!!

Now i have been to court three times, have a criminal record

and have paid 500 dollars in fines. Im going to college and getting

my masters in physics, but according to the legal system, I'm a

danger to society. Shit is fucked up.


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OfflineEywa_devotee
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Registered: 10/04/10
Posts: 641
Loc: Middle of Nowhere, Wiscon...
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: mushiepussy]
    #13948523 - 02/12/11 12:10 AM (3 years, 6 months ago)

I hate to say it, but most places that hire physics majors in the US will not even let you in the door.. BUT... there is always the international option, and they aren't that picky...


--------------------
"Love one another." "To Love is to know me." "Love is the Law, Love under Will." "In Compassion, all sorrows end." Regardless of the Master, the message is the same- Choose love and you shall live, Choose Fear and you shall die. Help bring peace to this Earth: Love one another, and serve others before yourself.


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Eywa_devotee]
    #13953392 - 02/12/11 11:07 PM (3 years, 6 months ago)

Here's the facts on drug convictions and financial aid.

http://www.odos.uiuc.edu/sls/brochureAds/downloads/DrugsFinancialAid.pdf


--------------------


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OfflineDrGonz0
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #14062120 - 03/03/11 08:51 PM (3 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
financial aid is not a right, jobs are not rights, not a single employer
out there owes you a job and ultimately you're responsible for any drug
arrest on your record

maybe you should reevaluate your outlook on things, if you know something
is illegal then arent you just gambling your time until you're caught





They may not be rights, but that doesn't justify the current state of affairs. Getting arrested for drug charges shouldn't haunt us for the rest of our lives. Sure we're breaking the law, but the law is wrong, isn't it? It's a 'gamble' in an incredibly unfair game. And if we all followed the rules, the Shroomery certainly wouldn't be in existence.


--------------------
Hate never yet dispelled hate,
Only love dispels hate.
This is the law,
Ancient and inexhaustible.
-Buddha
Need Lab Equipment?
           


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Offlinemillzy
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Registered: 05/12/10
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Eywa_devotee]
    #14356267 - 04/26/11 06:56 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

the government allowing corporate america, and by corporate america i mean employers and leasing companies, to freely discriminate against drug felons, in most cases years after they've paid their due to the state, simply benefits nobody. murderers have an easier time starting their lives over than drug felons. in fact up until '06 when they changed the federal student aid rule to where it's only if you incur a drug conviction while receiving aid, you could be a murderer, or even a sex offender, and get financial aid.

the fact of the matter is that no matter how badly you want to rebuild your life and learn from your mistake, it's kind of difficult to do that if you can't find a place to live or make money. i simply don't think this is the way people should be treated. americans pride themselves on their compassion and sense of justice and the way society handles drug felons is shameful.


--------------------
"Brenda cancel the rest of my meetings today, I'm gonna take the afternoon off and get throw'd off that purp."



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Offlinejjmaker
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Eywa_devotee]
    #14410148 - 05/06/11 02:54 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Yes!  I have a Master's in statistics, was gainfully employed earning over $100k/year . . . and then I was arrested (subject to illegal search) . . . I am now on food stamps & collect unemployment.  Last year I paid $30k in taxes, this year $0. 

Someone tell me (please) what is the point?  Is there an objective here?  If they stopped "the war on drugs" not much would change.  The arrests are ineffective.  They do not stop the drug flow, they merely render individuals unemployable. 

I would like to move on, get past this event but I cannot because I cannot get a job.  It was an isolated event that is indeed a life sentence.  Any (constructive) suggestions?


--------------------
:cool:


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Offlinemillzy
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: jjmaker]
    #14410306 - 05/06/11 03:27 PM (3 years, 3 months ago)

they should pass federal laws limiting how much time can pass before denying someone employment or a lease agreement after meeting the requirements of their punishment. it's really the only way to stop the discrimination.


--------------------
"Brenda cancel the rest of my meetings today, I'm gonna take the afternoon off and get throw'd off that purp."



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Offlinetxlibertarian
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Eywa_devotee]
    #14413364 - 05/07/11 02:38 AM (3 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Eywa_devotee said:
I have a bit of a rant. They say society wants people who are drug users to reform and "become productive citizens", but the laws themselves force people into a life of crime, unless they know the right people or are very very lucky.




First off, many people who are "drug users" happen to be productive citizens.

Quote:

This being said, how is drug use so bad that it makes people unemployable for the rest of their life? Do the drugs cause crime or are the laws themselves creating criminals of otherwise productive citizens?




The CONSERVATIVE moral-police like to dictate morality. They believe that altering one's mind is immoral. Therefore, they believe that people should be put in a cage if they alter their mind.

The LIBERAL nanny-police want to protect all of the stupid people from accidentally hurting themselves. Therefore, they believe that people should be put in a cage if they might possibly endanger themselves.

Both states of self-righteousness take away from our individual free-will.


LIBERTARIANS believe that you should be able to make your own choices - and live with the consequences...

Perhaps I'm a bit biased...


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InvisibleGI_Luvmoney
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: txlibertarian]
    #14516514 - 05/26/11 07:11 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

The left have treated drug users worse than conservatives.  Look at the Soviet Union, China and North Korea.


--------------------


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Offlinemillzy
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: GI_Luvmoney]
    #14516556 - 05/26/11 07:21 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

GI_Luvmoney said:
The left have treated drug users worse than conservatives. Look at the Soviet Union, China and North Korea.




:awewtf:


--------------------
"Brenda cancel the rest of my meetings today, I'm gonna take the afternoon off and get throw'd off that purp."



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InvisiblememesS
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #14555020 - 06/03/11 01:01 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
financial aid is not a right, jobs are not rights, not a single employer
out there owes you a job and ultimately you're responsible for any drug
arrest on your record

maybe you should reevaluate your outlook on things, if you know something
is illegal then arent you just gambling your time until you're caught



Once again, Pris is the only person in a thread making any sense.



Whether or not he's a moderator of a shroom forum is irrelevant.  Companies don't hire felons for a reason - because they're felons.


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Offlinemillzy
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: memes]
    #14580157 - 06/08/11 04:43 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

As i said, nobody benefits from people with legal histories, much less non violent drug offenders, from having almost insurmountable odds against them after they meet the conditions of their punishment. Thats not justice. Its cruelty.


--------------------
"Brenda cancel the rest of my meetings today, I'm gonna take the afternoon off and get throw'd off that purp."



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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: GI_Luvmoney]
    #14585579 - 06/09/11 03:30 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

GI_Luvmoney said:
The left have treated drug users worse than conservatives.  Look at the Soviet Union, China and North Korea.





And Conservatives always have the best drugs. Hitler's meth, The Taliban's Opium, etc...


--------------------


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OfflineShroomyJohn
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Re: Drug Felony = LIFE SENTENCE of UNEMPLOYMENT? [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #14596418 - 06/11/11 04:39 PM (3 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

meams said:
Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
financial aid is not a right, jobs are not rights, not a single employer
out there owes you a job and ultimately you're responsible for any drug
arrest on your record

maybe you should reevaluate your outlook on things, if you know something
is illegal then arent you just gambling your time until you're caught



Once again, Pris is the only person in a thread making any sense.



Whether or not he's a moderator of a shroom forum is irrelevant.  Companies don't hire felons for a reason - because they're felons.





That is a fucked up stance to be taking, are you sure you're ready to defend it?  My former roommate got caught hooking up (as in, went to another friend to grab it so the kid could get a fucking bag) a "friend" with $30 worth of weed, and now he has a felony on his record for "manufacture of a schedule 1 substance".  What exactly is somebody to do at 19 years of age about something like that?

19 years old.  Felon.  Over something as petty as a DUB SACK OF MARIJUANA.  One of the most harmless, least toxic substance known. 

So is he never supposed to try and get married and have a kid?  He will most likely not be able to make enough money to allow a child to grow up in the best environment possible, so should he just say fuck it? 

Fuckd the FUCK up that either of you could be defending such a stance.  Moderator, or simple user, you're both on this site, and I'm sure both of you have held a felony amount of drugs before (one hit of acid, 2 grams of shrooms), and simply were lucky enough to not get caught. 


Edited by ShroomyJohn (06/11/11 04:50 PM)


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