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OfflineDezzy
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Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa
    #10726125 - 07/23/09 11:54 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

How can you see the difference between these 2 species, because I bought 2 cacti at a tropical gardencentre, because they we're big (about 8cm) and cheap (6,50 euro) :smile:
But it was written with only Lophophora, so... how do I really know wich species it is?
And L. diffusa is also containing mescaline?


Edited by Dezzy (07/23/09 11:55 AM)


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OfflineDr. uarewotueat
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Dezzy]
    #10726206 - 07/23/09 12:22 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

no mescaline in L. diffusa, well a little but non worth speaking of.
pellotine is the main alkaloid present in L. diffusa.

the main morphological difference is in the rib formation.
L. williamsii has clearly defined ribs meaning that there is a depression between the ribs.
L. diffusa has diffused ribs (hence its name) meaning that there is little to no depression between the ribs, they are more rounded.

L. diffusa also tends to be more of a green colour where as L. williamsii is more greyish generally speaking, but the colour of the skin is a poor indicator really.

flower colour of L. williamsii is usually pink.
flower colour of L. diffusa is usually white.


L. diffusa:



L. williamsii:


post a pic and we will attempt to id them for you :yesnod:


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OfflineDezzy
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
    #10726217 - 07/23/09 12:25 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

I will post some in a few hours... sorry in a hurry now, hahaha :smile:


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OfflineDr. uarewotueat
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Dezzy]
    #10726234 - 07/23/09 12:29 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

take a guess :laugh:


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OfflineDezzy
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
    #10726693 - 07/23/09 02:20 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

I'v got these four... two little (about 2-3cm) ones I bought in Amsterdam (I was also told they are peyote (Lophophora williamsii), and 2 big (about 8-9cm) ones I bought at the tropical gardencentre (with also about 15seeds inside the dried fruits!!!) :laugh:
But enough talking, here are pics :smile:






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Offlinehaymaker
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Dezzy]
    #10726736 - 07/23/09 02:29 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

top one i'm unsure of, as it's a little young. the other 3 look like williamsii though


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OfflineDr. uarewotueat
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Dezzy]
    #10726888 - 07/23/09 03:10 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

first pic is L. diffusa.
second looks like L. kohreshii to me. (need a flower pic to be sure) it is on the diffusae side of the genus though.
the other two are certainly L. williamsii.

the only id that i have any doubts about is the one i said is L. kohreshii.

if you post pics when they flower we can confirm 100%.

very nice plants and very good price too :thumbup:


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OfflineDezzy
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
    #10727392 - 07/23/09 04:50 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Are you really sure of it? Well the first one...?
And I will take a picture if it's going to flower...
It kinda sucks though if it are no L. williamsii...


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OfflineCactusdan
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Dezzy]
    #10727688 - 07/23/09 05:39 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Why?

They are beautiful plants.

If you're looking for something to consume you're far better off going with a trichocereus as the Lophophora take ages to grow and the number you must consume is high.


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OfflineDr. uarewotueat
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Dezzy]
    #10727726 - 07/23/09 05:45 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Dezzy said:
Are you really sure of it? Well the first one...?
And I will take a picture if it's going to flower...
It kinda sucks though if it are no L. williamsii...



please don't murder these beautiful plants.


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Offlinefelixhigh
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Dezzy]
    #10729099 - 07/23/09 09:57 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Also, L. diffusa is green while Williamsii is gray.
L. diffusa has white flowers, Williamsii has white flowers with a pink stripe on each petal.


FH


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InvisibleMethadone
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: felixhigh]
    #10729464 - 07/23/09 10:56 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Nice plants.

How does one differentiate a koehresii and fricii from a diffusa?

Koehresii = usually diffused ribs, pink and white flower?
Fricii = usually diffused ribs, white flower?

Is a Fricii a diffusa or williamsi? Anderson states that Fricii is synonymous with both species, due to an apparent disagreement among two botanists in 1997.

-M


Edited by Methadone (07/23/09 11:26 PM)


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Offlineethnoguy
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: felixhigh]
    #10729485 - 07/23/09 10:58 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Dr. uarewotueat said:
first pic is L. diffusa.
second looks like L. kohreshii to me. (need a flower pic to be sure) it is on the diffusae side of the genus though.
the other two are certainly L. williamsii.

the only id that i have any doubts about is the one i said is L. kohreshii.

if you post pics when they flower we can confirm 100%.

very nice plants and very good price too :thumbup:



Quote:

Dr. uarewotueat said:
first pic is L. diffusa.
second looks like L. kohreshii to me. (need a flower pic to be sure) it is on the diffusae side of the genus though.
the other two are certainly L. williamsii.

the only id that i have any doubts about is the one i said is L. kohreshii.

if you post pics when they flower we can confirm 100%.

very nice plants and very good price too :thumbup:




I think your ID's are right on. I thought koehresii too. A couple of mine for comparison:



Sorry the pics are blurry. I suck with my shitty cam :lol:


Quote:

felixhigh said:
Also, L. diffusa is green while Williamsii is gray.




Not always. I will agree that diffusa is almost always a different shade of green, but williamsii color varies too much to be definitive.

EG


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InvisibleMethadone
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: ethnoguy]
    #10729497 - 07/23/09 10:59 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Not always. I will agree that diffusa is almost always a different shade of green, but williamsii color varies too much to be definitive.

EG




Especially in cultivation.

-M


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Offlineethnoguy
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Methadone]
    #10729522 - 07/23/09 11:02 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Methadone said:
Quote:

Not always. I will agree that diffusa is almost always a different shade of green, but williamsii color varies too much to be definitive.

EG




Especially in cultivation.

-M




Exactly. I think FH is exactly right regarding wild lophs. I've got lophs from all over the world, and they all are so varied, its just hard to pin things down with IDing until flowering. It isn't too hard to make an educated guess after you have a nice collection going.

EG


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OfflineCactusdan
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Methadone]
    #10729700 - 07/23/09 11:30 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Methadone said:
Nice plants.

How does one differentiate a koehresii and fricii from a diffusa?

Koehresii = usually diffused ribs, pink and white flower?
Fricii = usually diffused ribs, white flower?

Is a Fricii a diffusa or williamsi? Anderson states that Fricii is synonymous with both species, due to an apparent disagreement among two botanists in 1997.

-M




Koehresii is usually green in color with diffused enlarged tuberacles and either white with pink stripe or white with grey stripe flowers

Fricii I find is usually placed with Diffusa and has bright pink flowers (my favorite along with Jourdaniana) and diffused ribs and a grey-green body.

IME


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Offlineethnoguy
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Cactusdan]
    #10729714 - 07/23/09 11:32 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Fricii is best described as a L williamsii sub-species.

EG


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OfflineDr. uarewotueat
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: ethnoguy]
    #10731362 - 07/24/09 07:09 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

it's actually best described as its own separate species.
read that kaktusy article lol


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Offlineethnoguy
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
    #10732445 - 07/24/09 01:43 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Dr. uarewotueat said:
it's actually best described as its own separate species.
read that kaktusy article lol




Well, of course this is debatable. What article?

EG


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InvisibleMethadone
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Re: Difference between L. williamsii and L. diffusa [Re: ethnoguy]
    #10732520 - 07/24/09 01:59 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Part of a special journal from a Czech cacti and succulent society. Im sure youve seen it before, you were talking about it last year with the Doc. Search "Kaktusy Lophophora" and youll see his old thread.

Its hard to obtain, the 1 source available wants $35.00 a copy. No way im paying that for a 50 page booklet.

-M


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> The Ethnobotanical Garden

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