|
 whattheheck
Chief Love Lover
Registered: 06/01/07
Posts: 7,380
Loc: Denver Colorado
|
 I'm convinced 
#10072039 - 03/30/09 05:21 AM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
The American economy, and most likely government will fail within the next 2 years. Most likely sooner.
That is all.
--------------------
A society whose whole idea is to eliminate suffering and bring it's members the greatest amount of comfort and pleasure is doomed to be destroyed -Thomas Merton
|
 chobumms
Pokemon Master
Registered: 08/01/07
Posts: 1,698
Last seen: 12 days, 11 hours
|
|
I'm convinced the government already failed and the economy is so fucked...
--------------------
  
My "Faster Germination For Popcorn Substrate" TEK
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/8428361#8428361
|
NoAgenda
THEY'RE BABIES!
Registered: 03/12/09
Posts: 348
Loc: NYC
Last seen: 3 years, 6 months
|
|
You think everything will start to go chaotic or just be in general "shittier"?
I'm under the suspicion that The Dark Knight and Watchmen is laced with Illuminati propaganda. I warned everyone that when Ledger died that it was a hit and that burning the money was something like insulting me through film. So now I'm wondering if they are going to kill The Dark Knight/The Bat(black)man.
|
HeavyToilet
The Heaviest OfThem All
Registered: 08/06/03
Posts: 9,405
Loc: British Columbia
|
Re: I'm convinced [Re: NoAgenda]
#10073013 - 03/30/09 12:10 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
NoAgenda said:
You think everything will start to go chaotic or just be in general "shittier"?
I'm under the suspicion that The Dark Knight and Watchmen is laced with Illuminati propaganda. I warned everyone that when Ledger died that it was a hit and that burning the money was something like insulting me through film. So now I'm wondering if they are going to kill The Dark Knight/The Bat(black)man.
LOL.
|
Silversoul
Rhizome
Registered: 01/01/05
Posts: 22,569
Loc: The Barricades
|
|
The economy is already showing signs of improvement, and the people have more confidence in the government than they've had in a long time. I say we're out of this mess within 5 years at most.
--------------------
|
whattheheck
Chief Love Lover
Registered: 06/01/07
Posts: 7,380
Loc: Denver Colorado
|
|
What signs of improvement are you speaking of? The toxic waste plan is being gamed by the major banks, the GDP to debt ratio (Which is a HUGE component as to why we're in this mess to begin with) is increasing at the most rapid rate in history, and Bernanke buying up bonds is a clear move of desperation and most likely indicates that China is no longer buying up our debt, which is going to lead, one way or another, to dislocation of the bond market and default on the Government's part.
Even the optimist George Soros is calling for at least a 30% drop in commercial real estate, many leading experts even more, and THAT situation will make the sub-prime issue look like a bump in the road. China and Russia are pushing for a move to a multiple based, or altogether new, world reserve note, the list goes on.
The "good" news of a dead cat bounce, and a strong dollar, has more to do with the fact that out of all the nations that are screwed, we are the least, and the world reserve note is the dollar. But if Russia and China, and whoever else they can ally with them, can change that,  The world is pissed at America, we're the epicenter of this whole collapse. Of course, everyone else was in when the party was raging, so I don't feel sympathy for them, but after the past 8 years, America has few friends left. And we need them.
--------------------
A society whose whole idea is to eliminate suffering and bring it's members the greatest amount of comfort and pleasure is doomed to be destroyed -Thomas Merton
|
LayYouIn
Taurus
Registered: 09/28/06
Posts: 4,402
Loc: Organ
|
Re: I'm convinced [Re: NoAgenda]
#10076692 - 03/30/09 10:43 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
NoAgenda said:
You think everything will start to go chaotic or just be in general "shittier"?
probley just get shittier slowly. i highly doubt things will break out within a few months, it'll probley take years. then we'll all look back and thing about how good we had it when we lived off the rest of the world. :sigh:
i hope things get better though. but there's just so much bad news about the economy.
|
whattheheck
Chief Love Lover
Registered: 06/01/07
Posts: 7,380
Loc: Denver Colorado
|
Re: I'm convinced [Re: LayYouIn]
#10077219 - 03/30/09 11:54 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
We're going to see rioting in major overseas cities by July. America is SO much better off than the rest of the world (for the most part) that it's not even funny. Not because we are "better" off, but our standing in the world (which is slipping by the hour) puts us in an enviable position. If China really has quit buying up our debt, look for Bernanke to buy up even more bonds, which without recovery in a MAJOR way (which is NOT coming) will lead to a dislocation.
It all comes down to math. And we're near the end of this equation, and it's not adding up well.
--------------------
A society whose whole idea is to eliminate suffering and bring it's members the greatest amount of comfort and pleasure is doomed to be destroyed -Thomas Merton
|
Prof. Astro
acirebma
Registered: 04/15/08
Posts: 4,083
Last seen: 2 months, 16 days
|
Re: I'm convinced [Re: LayYouIn]
#10094780 - 04/02/09 04:35 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Well exactly, the economy is a figurative roller coaster. There are contractions, recessions, expansions, peaks and depressions. Considering we are past the 6th month limit for contraction we have entered a recession, if the economy does not pick up we will fall to a depression, hopefully we already hit the trough and are on the road to expansion though.
Don't worry in a few more years we will hit the peak and fall down again.
--------------------
|
whattheheck
Chief Love Lover
Registered: 06/01/07
Posts: 7,380
Loc: Denver Colorado
|
|
No.
--------------------
A society whose whole idea is to eliminate suffering and bring it's members the greatest amount of comfort and pleasure is doomed to be destroyed -Thomas Merton
|
Redstorm
Prince of Bugs
Registered: 10/08/02
Posts: 44,173
Last seen: 8 hours, 47 minutes
|
|
Quote:
whattheheck said:
No.
Awesome rebuttal.
|
cuddlebear
Free hugs
Registered: 03/31/09
Posts: 182
|
Re: I'm convinced [Re: Redstorm]
#10099605 - 04/03/09 12:28 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
I don't see how anyone can say the status-quo is sustainable (or who would want it to be for that matter with all the ecological destruction, war, and the sick state of US society). All empires end eventually, it's just a matter of how long it takes and how it happens.
In the short term, the US government keeps ballooning debt to unfathomable levels and seems to be acting like it can just sell US treasuries forever to raise capital. The thing saving it now is the fact the USD is the de facto international currency. Nearly all commodities are traded with it. That means if you want to have oil, you have to first get USD, so you have to do trade with the US or a US trade partner.
However, there are few critical problems with this. One is the reason the USD was made the international currency after WWII (industrial powerhouse, top oil producer, backed by gold, etc.) are no longer true. Secondly, large holders of US treasuries around the world are facing budget deficits, many oil producers for the first time in history. So they will be offloading their US assets soon, rather than buying them. More about the problems with the USD at http://www.marketskeptics.com/2009/01/ten-major-threats-facing-dollar.html and for a very good treatment of the unsustainability of US debt see the film IOUSA.
Then there's the issue of oil production peaking. Basically new well discovery peaked in 1981 and after that they've just been drawing down what they already found. It's a simple matter of finite resources and production not being able to keep up with demand. What we saw last year with the price spikes is just an appetizer of what is to come. The debate is just over when oil production will exactly peak (some say it has already but prices were driven down by the recent financial meltdown). This is a huge change for the American way of life, which is so reliant on cheap fossil fuels for even just basic things like transportation and food production. There is a good FAQ about this at http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net
These two things alone are enormous challenges to the US government's ability to provide for mass consumerism (called "economic security" for middle class people) and may even be the end of industrialization, which was powered by cheap fossil fuels and debt. With these two things on the decline, I think the US government will have a much harder time justifying its existence. I mean, I know very few people who genuinely like the bureaucracy even now. Most just seem to tolerate it as a "necessary evil" because they are not self-reliant and it provides for them (through propping up private industry) and/or they are afraid of backlash for actively opposing it.
Who knows when it's going to fall. I think this is a very unique point in history and there's not much to go off on to forecast. Personally, I see this as a positive thing opening up more healthier and sustainable options. The sooner the better.
Edited by cuddlebear (04/03/09 12:42 PM)
|
Yrat
Hello
Registered: 11/08/07
Posts: 2,030
Last seen: 20 hours, 51 minutes
|
|
--------------------
"There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil
to one who is striking at the root."
-Henry David Thoreau
Strike The Root
|
Mr.Al
Alphabet soup
Registered: 05/27/07
Posts: 5,233
Loc: N.S.A. D.C.
Last seen: 3 days, 5 hours
|
|
Have you ever wondered what causes the "boom and bust cycle" in the economy?
Goods and services produced in the market have value. In the U.S., the unconstitutional federal reserve makes a fiat currency that they hand over to the Treasury. This currency, because it is backed by nothing has no intrinsic value. The unchecked printing of this unconstitutional toilet paper money waters down the value of the goods and services that utilize the fiat for exchange. Initially the government and corporate world use the newly created money first. They get the most for their money because inflation hasn't hit yet. The inflated money supply, for a time, will still have value UNTIL THE MARKET ADJUSTS. That is the boom part of the cycle. After the market adjusts to the inflation of the money supply the economy tanks (bust part of cycle). This is an unnatural and certainly NOT a free market. These economic cycles hurt the average joe the most. This widens the gap between the working class man and the ultra wealthy. It is for that reason that a FIAT monetary policy is IMMORAL and was made illegal by the men who founded this country.
Thus, we have a strange situation in which the government has grown out of control in size and spending through the utilization of the fiat currency. The federal government is much like a parasite upon the economy. When the economy loses strength due to this bizarre and illegal siphoning off of value from everything it produces the government blames the "free market" (we don't have a free market right now) and proposes "more regulation" and "more government"...
The government does not create value! Only the market can do that!
This madness has to stop....
|
Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 80,498
Loc: underbelly
|
|
Quote:
whattheheck said:
The American economy, and most likely government will fail within the next 2 years. Most likely sooner.
That is all.
I hope this isn't just a lot of wishful thinking. I've had this survival gear for years.
--------------------
"People convince themselves of their own lies, becoming victims of their own inventions as they begin to direct their lives by standards of behavior, ideas, feelings, or instincts which do not correspond to their inner reality. What is truly serious in this matter is that the individual loses all points of reference regarding what comprises truth, and what comprises lies. He becomes used to considering as true only that which is convenient for his personal interests; everything that is in opposition to his self-esteem or in conflict with already established prejudices, he considers false."
- John Baines
|
Noetical
Flip Horrorshow
Registered: 11/28/04
Posts: 9,192
|
|
FIAT CURRENCIES!!!1!!
*** I'm sauced and shouldn't act like a jerk outside the OTD's
apologies
Edited by Noetical (04/03/09 07:19 PM)
|
Redstorm
Prince of Bugs
Registered: 10/08/02
Posts: 44,173
Last seen: 8 hours, 47 minutes
|
Re: I'm convinced [Re: Noetical]
#10101486 - 04/03/09 07:13 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
/raises hand
|
Noetical
Flip Horrorshow
Registered: 11/28/04
Posts: 9,192
|
Re: I'm convinced [Re: Redstorm]
#10101503 - 04/03/09 07:16 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
*says the one guy with two licks of sense
|
whattheheck
Chief Love Lover
Registered: 06/01/07
Posts: 7,380
Loc: Denver Colorado
|
Re: I'm convinced [Re: Redstorm]
#10101794 - 04/03/09 08:09 PM (4 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Redstorm said:
Quote:
whattheheck said:
No.
Awesome rebuttal.
Stayed up all night working on it.  
--------------------
A society whose whole idea is to eliminate suffering and bring it's members the greatest amount of comfort and pleasure is doomed to be destroyed -Thomas Merton
|
whattheheck
Chief Love Lover
Registered: 06/01/07
Posts: 7,380
Loc: Denver Colorado
|
|
Quote:
Icelander said:
Quote:
whattheheck said:
The American economy, and most likely government will fail within the next 2 years. Most likely sooner.
That is all.
I hope this isn't just a lot of wishful thinking. I've had this survival gear for years.
No, and some UNREAL (well not that unreal if your view is that pretty much all bankers and politicos are corrupt) broke yesterday, but all you hear about is how great the "market" is doing. 
--------------------
A society whose whole idea is to eliminate suffering and bring it's members the greatest amount of comfort and pleasure is doomed to be destroyed -Thomas Merton
|
|
Images only 
Threaded
Previous
Index
Next
Edit 
Reply 
