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 deCypher
 
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 6,183
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 How can we find a purpose in life?
#9049251 - 10/08/08 05:48 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Objectively speaking, there is no meaning to our existence.
So what then should we make our subjective meaning into? Somehow, saying that any subjective meaning I give to life is just as valid as any other seems a bit naive. What if my meaning to life is eating Cheerios? This hardly seems very satisfying.
In my opinion, it seems that to garner the least amount of suffering through our short existence, it would do us best to choose our actions to fit our purpose the most closely. Since there is no God, there is no strict purpose in the original sense of the word, but there is a purpose in that we are beings that have evolved to fit our environment and to optimally fit into a particular survival niche. By doing those actions that we evolved to do naturally, we are in a sense doing what we were meant to do.
So the question is; what were we as humans meant to do? Civilization seems a bit too modern to match our still-Neolithic brains and bodies--as evidenced by the countless wars, slaughter of innocents, harmful technology, seductive traps of addictive drugs, the creation of a hierarchical power structure that only serves to oppress the downtrodden in favor of the guys at the top, and even money itself: a drug more addictive than heroin.
So looking back before the advent of civilization; what niche do humans fit in the most adequately? Before the advent of civilization in Sumeria, obviously. Should we look before agriculture and the domestication of animals? Before the hunter-gatherer mode of existence? What was even before this? Successes using this paradigm are ample; the Neolithic "Stone Age" diet has been shown to be one of the healthiest diets out there; and small tribes and groups are incredibly more successful at social cohesion, stability, and promoting the individual not at the expense of the tribe than our modern-day, bloated world of warring nation-states comprised of billions of people with no sense of global community.
Is the solution really to go back to the roots of modern Man and start anew?
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the truth will set you free...
...and everything I say is true.
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Veritas
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 10,305
Loc: PNW
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: deCypher]
#9049264 - 10/08/08 05:50 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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We cannot possibly be doing anything that we have not evolved to do, so this argument doesn't work. We are at this point in human history because we've adapted and changed in order to survive. The fact that we are capable of making ourselves utterly miserable is just a quirky side-effect.
If Cheerios do it for you, then that is exactly as valid and important as joining the Peace Corps or becoming President or living in a cave.
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No man is free who is not master of himself.
~Epictetus.
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 Lion
I Am That I Am
Registered: 09/20/05
Posts: 3,680
Loc: The Becoming Tree
Last seen: 4 hours, 47 minutes
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: deCypher]
#9049267 - 10/08/08 05:51 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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The solution is to be present, in my opinion.
Of course, as I write this, I'm thinking of Jesus when he said,
"You hypocrite! First remove the beam from your own eye, and then you will see clearly enough to remove the speck from your brother's eye."
...because I have not removed that beam...Nevertheless, that's my honest opinion...Fully feeling your embodiment in this human form, here and now, is the purpose of life and the solution to its maladies.
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One day Ananda, who had been thinking deeply about things for a while, turned to the Buddha and exclaimed, "Lord, I've been thinking - spiritual friendship is at least half of the spiritual life!"
The Buddha replied: "Say not so, Ananda, say not so. Spiritual friendship is the whole of the spiritual life!"
Oh the good old days in merry old England and Europe. It was especially tasty to be a women then. Yes it certainly was better in the past.-Icelander
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deCypher
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 6,183
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: Veritas]
#9049274 - 10/08/08 05:52 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
Veritas said:
We cannot possibly be doing anything that we have not evolved to do, so this argument doesn't work. We are at this point in human history because we've adapted and changed in order to survive. The fact that we are capable of making ourselves utterly miserable is just a quirky side-effect.
If Cheerios do it for you, then that is exactly as valid and important as joining the Peace Corps or becoming President or living in a cave.
Evolution, in the sense of changes to the physical brain and body, stopped after the Neolithic period. We haven't evolved to read, or to use the Internet. These are all side-effects, and the injurious effects of such technology are clear.
The human ability to make tools and develop technology has effectively halted evolution as we know it.
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the truth will set you free...
...and everything I say is true.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 23,398
Loc: underbelly
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: deCypher]
#9049284 - 10/08/08 05:54 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Whatever makes you relaxed and happy and energized and interested. 
This seems to be different for different people. At least in form.
Don't you just hate these simple answers to you complex questions.
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What the thinker thinks, the prover proves. R.A.W.
I don't believe anything, but I have many suspicions. R.A.W.
embrace death in all the ways it comes no matter how soft or hard. cruel ,tragic,weak,light, gentle, ect how ever. thats life
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awesomebastard
Registered: 12/16/07
Posts: 1,911
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: deCypher]
#9049301 - 10/08/08 05:57 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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To do this we need to depopulate and quick.
I agree with that thought that we are meant for small groups.
I believe the reason we are in this predicament now is due to population size.
There is no turning back with this many humans alive today.
BTW hunter gatherer society probably predates any humans.
Chimps our closest living relatives are hunter gatherers I believe.
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Veritas
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 10,305
Loc: PNW
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: deCypher]
#9049313 - 10/08/08 05:59 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Yes, we've evolved to be capable of doing everything that we are doing right now. If we had not, we would not be doing it. All of our tech is just an expanded version of primitive stone tools, and all of our laws and governments just expanded versions of tribal rules and leaders. I think you've misunderstood the concept of evolution.
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No man is free who is not master of himself.
~Epictetus.
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deCypher
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 6,183
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: Veritas]
#9049332 - 10/08/08 06:01 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
Veritas said:
Yes, we've evolved to be capable of doing everything that we are doing right now. If we had not, we would not be doing it. All of our tech is just an expanded version of primitive stone tools, and all of our laws and governments just expanded versions of tribal rules and leaders. I think you've misunderstood the concept of evolution.
Just because we've evolved to be capable of doing something doesn't mean that doing anything within our capabilities is necessarily good. We've evolved to be capable of truly horrible things; and it is this capability that is encapsulated in our use of technology and tools.
I'm arguing for abolishing technology, civilization, and over-population in favor of a better existence. How have I misunderstood the concept of evolution?
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the truth will set you free...
...and everything I say is true.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 23,398
Loc: underbelly
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: deCypher]
#9049350 - 10/08/08 06:05 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Just because we've evolved to be capable of doing something doesn't mean that doing anything within our capabilities is necessarily good.
The point is to survive, not to be good. That is according to evolution.
Now as far as your subjective wishes it would be unusual if they matched up to reality if you could have them.
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What the thinker thinks, the prover proves. R.A.W.
I don't believe anything, but I have many suspicions. R.A.W.
embrace death in all the ways it comes no matter how soft or hard. cruel ,tragic,weak,light, gentle, ect how ever. thats life
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deCypher
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 6,183
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: Icelander]
#9049373 - 10/08/08 06:08 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
The point is to survive, not to be good.
I'd go a step further and say that the point is to survive just long enough so that you can reproduce and nurture your offspring to full maturity.
Anything after is mere wankery.
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the truth will set you free...
...and everything I say is true.
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Huehuecoyotl
Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 9,142
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: deCypher]
#9049416 - 10/08/08 06:17 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Why is a niche or purpose necessary? Why can't we just be.
Quote:
A gypsy of a strange and distant time
Travelling in panic all direction blind
Aching for the warmth of a burning sun
Freezing in the emptiness of where he'd come from -- The Moody Blues
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"A man of knowledge lives by acting, not by thinking about acting." - Carlos Castaneda
www.warriorfusion.org
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Lion
I Am That I Am
Registered: 09/20/05
Posts: 3,680
Loc: The Becoming Tree
Last seen: 4 hours, 47 minutes
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
#9049421 - 10/08/08 06:19 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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--------------------
One day Ananda, who had been thinking deeply about things for a while, turned to the Buddha and exclaimed, "Lord, I've been thinking - spiritual friendship is at least half of the spiritual life!"
The Buddha replied: "Say not so, Ananda, say not so. Spiritual friendship is the whole of the spiritual life!"
Oh the good old days in merry old England and Europe. It was especially tasty to be a women then. Yes it certainly was better in the past.-Icelander
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Arden
Explorer
Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 294
Loc: Among the Lemurs
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: Lion]
#9049727 - 10/08/08 07:13 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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The irony is that the modern inventions, rampant technology, and elaborate social systems has inspired this whole "where do I belong?" dilemma. Since the dawn of consciousness, elaborating some hidden purpose in human life has consistently been an important issue, but never before has it been such an important problem.
When people move towards defining themselves by what is available in their environment, then it becomes a problem, especially given most of the circumstances today. Success, purpose, and happiness, if paralleled to how a lot of people view it, quickly becomes egotistical in terms of money, power, and wealth. Whether it is a job, a church, a fancy home, or a endless list of professional titles, so many people unfortunately fall into the trap of defining themselves with unreal concepts and silly fabrications. They absorb instead of observe, and in the process they remove the essence of their unique individuality.
Like the original post suggests, any notion of purpose is subjective. But this becomes a problem when such subjectivity begins to reflect emptiness and uniformity.
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This world is an eternal playground.
There is nothing to lose but boundaries.
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OrgoneConclusion
Oh, bee hive!
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 7,988
Loc: In the woods
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: Lion]
#9049814 - 10/08/08 07:29 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
The solution is to be present, in my opinion.
OK
Quote:
as I write this, I'm thinking of Jesus when he said,
So to be present we must go back 2000 years. 
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What is the sound of one jaw snapping?
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Lion
I Am That I Am
Registered: 09/20/05
Posts: 3,680
Loc: The Becoming Tree
Last seen: 4 hours, 47 minutes
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Good point; no, I just think he was wise to point out that we can't enlighten others without helping ourselves first.
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One day Ananda, who had been thinking deeply about things for a while, turned to the Buddha and exclaimed, "Lord, I've been thinking - spiritual friendship is at least half of the spiritual life!"
The Buddha replied: "Say not so, Ananda, say not so. Spiritual friendship is the whole of the spiritual life!"
Oh the good old days in merry old England and Europe. It was especially tasty to be a women then. Yes it certainly was better in the past.-Icelander
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OrgoneConclusion
Oh, bee hive!
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 7,988
Loc: In the woods
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: deCypher]
#9049834 - 10/08/08 07:32 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
Anything after is mere wankery.
Start your website (The Wankery) and I am down.
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What is the sound of one jaw snapping?
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DieCommie
Ally
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 7,382
Loc: The Union
Last seen: 2 hours, 8 minutes
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
#9049854 - 10/08/08 07:35 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
Huehuecoyotl said:
Why is a niche or purpose necessary? Why can't we just be.
I agree. There is no inherent purpose in life, just as there is no inherent purpose that water falls from the sky or that a dice lands on a particular number.
Purpose is a man made concept that doesnt exist anywhere but in the mind.
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Behold yon miserable creature. That Point is a Being like ourselves, but confined to the non-dimensional Gulf. He is himself his own World, his own Universe; of any other than himself he can form no conception; he knows not Length, nor Breadth, nor Height, for he has had no experience of them; he has no cognizance even of the number Two; nor has he a thought of Plurality; for he is himself his One and All, being really Nothing. Yet mark his perfect self-contentment, and hence learn his lesson, that to be self-contented is to be vile and ignorant, and that to aspire is better than to be blindly and impotently happy.
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deCypher
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 6,183
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: DieCommie]
#9050020 - 10/08/08 07:55 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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Quote:
DieCommie said:
Purpose is a man made concept that doesnt exist anywhere but in the mind.
So what motivation drives you?
--------------------
the truth will set you free...
...and everything I say is true.
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DieCommie
Ally
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 7,382
Loc: The Union
Last seen: 2 hours, 8 minutes
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: deCypher]
#9050052 - 10/08/08 07:58 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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I have no idea. Is that relevant though?
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Behold yon miserable creature. That Point is a Being like ourselves, but confined to the non-dimensional Gulf. He is himself his own World, his own Universe; of any other than himself he can form no conception; he knows not Length, nor Breadth, nor Height, for he has had no experience of them; he has no cognizance even of the number Two; nor has he a thought of Plurality; for he is himself his One and All, being really Nothing. Yet mark his perfect self-contentment, and hence learn his lesson, that to be self-contented is to be vile and ignorant, and that to aspire is better than to be blindly and impotently happy.
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deCypher
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 6,183
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Re: How can we find a purpose in life? [Re: DieCommie]
#9050057 - 10/08/08 07:59 PM (1 month, 14 days ago) |
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One's motivation for doing things and even living could be considered a self-decreed purpose of sorts.
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the truth will set you free...
...and everything I say is true.
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