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 spock1
Stranger
 
Registered: 04/14/07
Posts: 589
Last seen: 3 months, 22 days
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 Re: renters rights.... *DELETED* [Re: rugergirl79]
#8405754 - 05/15/08 03:25 PM (4 months, 27 days ago) |
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Post deleted by spock1Reason for deletion: .
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 rugergirl79
evil woman
Registered: 03/27/08
Posts: 1,673
Loc: cardboard box
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: spock1]
#8405944 - 05/15/08 04:21 PM (4 months, 27 days ago) |
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awesome!!! thanks.....don't worry...i will use gloves and shoot them with a revolver....you are truly a moron spock! 
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"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."
Hunter S. Thompson
Worked for these guys as well!
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fastfred
Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 4,326
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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I have to agree with Ojom to some extent here.
> i was expecting him to call before he came....
Why would he do that. It's not standard practice.
Why would you call somebody who's house you are standing outside of when it doesn't matter if they're home or not? If you're home they expect you to answer the door, if not they expect to fix the problem with no troubles.
> actually i am going into law enforcement.
Please tell me you are not serious! You can't even keep your cool when the maintenance man who you ordered, and should have been expecting, knocks, then enters your apartment. You didn't have the presence to ask who was entering, nor remember that you had ordered a maintenance man, nor to think that someone with a key to your place must be the maintenance man that you had ordered. Your first reaction was to grab a gun and almost shoot somebody.
No offense, I'm sure you're probably a good person, but you clearly do not have the mental disposition to be a police officer. You're not going to feel good when your hair trigger finger gets somebody killed. There are plenty of other things to do with a CJ degree.
As far as using a shotgun for home defence, there really isn't anything better. A slug is going to provide a lot more knock down power than anything else and if the shit is thick then spraying some buckshot around can do a lot of damage quickly.
-FF
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Chemy
Registered: 10/05/07
Posts: 5,727
Loc: Baltimore, MD
Last seen: 18 hours, 8 minutes
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: fastfred]
#8421164 - 05/19/08 06:19 PM (4 months, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
fastfred said:
As far as using a shotgun for home defence, there really isn't anything better. A slug is going to provide a lot more knock down power than anything else and if the shit is thick then spraying some buckshot around can do a lot of damage quickly.
-FF
FF, a shotgun is a horrible choice for home defense.
Rugergirl lives in an apartment building, different dwellings are seperated by drywall, putting your neighbors in risk of fatal injury because you can't aim a pistol or rifle is crazy, one projectile, one kill.
Shotguns are great for those that get scared shitless and shake like an earthquake in high stress situations, therefore not being able to aim an effective weapon.
A shotgun with slugs would work, but there are much better weapons that are very, very effective.
A shotgun with slugs falls under the outrageous catergory for home defense.
Might as well use a .338 winchester magnum, .450 marlin, .500 S&W, .454 casull, .50BMG the list goes on and on.
EDIT: A shotgun would be a great defense choice for those with Parkinsons disease.
Edited by Chemy (05/19/08 06:38 PM)
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johnm214
Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 6,486
Loc: Americas
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: fastfred]
#8421369 - 05/19/08 07:12 PM (4 months, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
fastfred said:
Please tell me you are not serious! You can't even keep your cool when the maintenance man who you ordered, and should have been expecting, knocks, then enters your apartment. You didn't have the presence to ask who was entering, nor remember that you had ordered a maintenance man, nor to think that someone with a key to your place must be the maintenance man that you had ordered. Your first reaction was to grab a gun and almost shoot somebody.
-FF
I agree it sounds kinda unreasonable from her description of "almost shooting him" but I think you're relying on this too much. She may have just used this as a literary fluorish rather than truthfully documenting that she was indeed almost at the point of no return.
I don't think its unreasonable to grab a gun when someone is entering your apartment after knocking first, or any other time.
As for the reasonableness of HIS actions, I think they were unreasonable. If your entering anyone's house who doesn't expect you or you don't have a friendly understanding with, I think you should announce your name and intentions (if not obvious- so if your name is "Mantis" its obvious your intention and you wouldn't need to say "I'm from the mob, I'm here to kill you"). I would expect any maintnance person to say "John from Maintenance" just as I would expect the police to announce their presence before they raid my home. If either gets shot its unfortunate, but depending on the situation may not be unreasonable, like when the cops simply batter the door down w/ one hit of the ram then run in w/ guns drawn and wearing those stupid swat uniforms w/ no obvious police insignias or signs. I think its a shame, but I almost think more police getting shot on those stupid raids would convince them to stop being cowboys and raiding small tiem dealers like they were common thugs- which they are.
Course I don't own a gun, but whatever.
Chemy, why is a shotgun bad for home defense, just the stray shot hitting someone unintended? Or can it be unpredictable how much the shot will spray, how much it will incapacitate him? Does a single stray piece of shot travel very far w/ lethal force? I don't really know how those things work.
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Chemy
Registered: 10/05/07
Posts: 5,727
Loc: Baltimore, MD
Last seen: 18 hours, 8 minutes
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: johnm214]
#8421397 - 05/19/08 07:20 PM (4 months, 23 days ago) |
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I explained why a shotgun is a bad choice in my earlier post.
I've heard of gun nuts modifying shotguns for home defense, but these same nuts would use hellfire missles and a 25mm vulcan system to defend their home from 1 unarmed burglar.
Quote:
Rugergirl lives in an apartment building, different dwellings are seperated by drywall, putting your neighbors in risk of fatal injury because you can't aim a pistol or rifle is crazy, one projectile, one kill.
Shotguns are great for those that get scared shitless and shake like an earthquake in high stress situations, therefore not being able to aim an effective weapon.
A shotgun with slugs would work, but there are much better weapons that are very, very effective.
A shotgun with slugs falls under the outrageous catergory for home defense.
Might as well use a .338 winchester magnum, .450 marlin, .500 S&W, .454 casull, .50BMG the list goes on and on.
EDIT: A shotgun would be a great defense choice for those with Parkinsons disease.
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usg543
◕‿◕
Registered: 02/11/07
Posts: 4,276
Loc: on the lot, brah
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: Chemy]
#8421493 - 05/19/08 07:40 PM (4 months, 23 days ago) |
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whatever, i'm gonna get a short barreled shotgun and i won't miss.
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Chemy
Registered: 10/05/07
Posts: 5,727
Loc: Baltimore, MD
Last seen: 18 hours, 8 minutes
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: usg543]
#8421556 - 05/19/08 07:58 PM (4 months, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
usg543 said:
whatever, i'm gonna get a short barreled shotgun and i won't miss.
Quote:
Shotguns are great for those that get scared shitless and shake like an earthquake in high stress situations, therefore not being able to aim an effective weapon.
I'll stand behind a 185 grain .45 cal. hydrashok that when it hits the body mass will drop anyone. And the 1911A1 can be equipped with trijicon night sights.
Maybe when you learn something about guns, you'll see why a shotgun is for pussies or retards.
Edited by Chemy (05/19/08 11:12 PM)
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johnm214
Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 6,486
Loc: Americas
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: Chemy]
#8421670 - 05/19/08 08:16 PM (4 months, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
Johnm214:
Chemy, why is a shotgun bad for home defense, just the stray shot hitting someone unintended?
\
Quote:
Chemy:
I explained why a shotgun is a bad choice in my earlier post.
So... the answer is yes? lol
What kinda guns do you have chemy? What do you think about concealed carry? Should you have to get a license, or should it simply be a right that's repealed after you've disqualified yourself? Should you have to take a course, or should you only have to pass as state written/performance test?
I'm curious, you seem to be passionate about guns. I used to be pretty strongly against them, but I'm much more liberal in my support of them now. The older you get, and the more crazy shit you see, the more you realize you have to be prepared for shit on your own, or your just at the whims of the police. My change of heart also has to do w/ me getting interested in the law. The second amendment is pretty clear, so I don't think policy questions about who should own a gun really matter.
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Chemy
Registered: 10/05/07
Posts: 5,727
Loc: Baltimore, MD
Last seen: 18 hours, 8 minutes
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: johnm214]
#8421760 - 05/19/08 08:34 PM (4 months, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
johnm214 said:
Quote:
Johnm214:
Chemy, why is a shotgun bad for home defense, just the stray shot hitting someone unintended?
\
A shotgun produces a pattern of projectiles, that can be 1" wide at the muzzle and the pattern becomes larger the more the projectiles travel.
The buckshot from a shotgun are nothing more than pieces of lead/antimony or bismuth, which is another reason shotguns suck, with a pistol or rifle you can use JHP's or jacketed hollow points or in revolvers you can use wadcutters with a handcarved pattern that is very effective, which are very, very effective in putting someone down.
A shotgun can not be aimed and fired accurately in the way a pistol or rifle can, ie the projectile goes where you tell it to go, not pull the trigger and pump until something falls down.
Quote:
What do you think about concealed carry? Should you have to get a license, or should it simply be a right that's repealed after you've disqualified yourself? Should you have to take a course, or should you only have to pass as state written/performance test?
I'm curious, you seem to be passionate about guns. I used to be pretty strongly against them, but I'm much more liberal in my support of them now. The older you get, and the more crazy shit you see, the more you realize you have to be prepared for shit on your own, or your just at the whims of the police. My change of heart also has to do w/ me getting interested in the law. The second amendment is pretty clear, so I don't think policy questions about who should own a gun really matter.
I grew up in a "gun house" my dad was ex-mil and a fanatic gun nut, but at the same time he made all of us shoot on the weekends until we hated guns, which actually is a great idea, I had no reason to think guns were toys when I was a kid, guns were pretty much a chore, and I never played with guns like what happens when kids get ahold of their parents gun and shoots someone accidentally.
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usg543
◕‿◕
Registered: 02/11/07
Posts: 4,276
Loc: on the lot, brah
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: Chemy]
#8422020 - 05/19/08 09:22 PM (4 months, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
Chemy said:
Maybe when you learn something about guns, you'll see why a shotgun is for pussies or retards.
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rugergirl79
evil woman
Registered: 03/27/08
Posts: 1,673
Loc: cardboard box
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: usg543]
#8422205 - 05/19/08 10:01 PM (4 months, 23 days ago) |
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actually i wouldn't have shot until i found out who and why he was in my house,.... but the gun was very handy and i do think that the click click of my shotgun would have scared any unreasonable intruder off or away from my apartment. i would never fire unless i felt threatened to the point that someone was going to take my life. don't be a dumb ass and think just because i have a shotgun and i had it ready, dose not mean that i would just aim and shoot a shot gun without knowing the implications of my actions. as far as expecting and knowing that it was maintenance entering my apartment, you must go back and review my original post and read the part where "i was asleep", and i am sure that most people are not used to being awaken by someone who has keys to their apartment and enters almost automatically. as far as the shotgun being my only weapon, it isn't....i have three ruger pistols and a glock 21/45acp. <<make great home protection weapons....i just had the shotgun beside my dresser, ready for fire. i was asleep and if i had time to think about it or if i were in a better state of mind beside REM sleep, i might have chose a better weapon. As far as my critical thinking skills, i do have a degree in criminal justice and i do think that i far a better chance than most blokes at thinking on my feet. you have only read one of my post and you don't know anything about me or how i would react. It has become a regular occurance in this area for home invasions and i want to be as prepared as much as i can for something like this to happen.
--------------------
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."
Hunter S. Thompson
Worked for these guys as well!
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four20snakeman
Background Noise
Registered: 06/11/03
Posts: 1,446
Loc: /\ /\ Right there /\ /\
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A shotgun isn't as point and click as some people think. At inside house ranges the spread isn't as much as a lot of people believe. At home defence ranges the spread is only 1.5-3 inches. I'm going with 30 ft or less range.
Saw your barrel to 18.5 inches. Leave the entire gun stock and all no less than 26.5 It will help in the tight spaces you will encounter in your home, doorways hallways down a set of stair, etc. Plus it will be slightly over the federal minimums. The actual laws is 18/26 I believe, but no reason to push your luck
Plus the sound of racking a shell is usually all it takes.
I think a Pump with the 1st round being a zytel round or rubber pellet round.
Then whatever your load choice is. If you are in a drywall type building #4-#6 is better. If you are living alone and have no collateral damage to worry about go for the #4 buckshot to the double ought buckshot.
Just keep in mind it isn't point and and shoot, Hip shooting only works and is cool in the movies
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Don't listen to me.
Come check out The Growery
Have Mario Kart Wii? My Mario Kart Friend code is 5155-3674-5607 send a PM if you add me.
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four20snakeman
Background Noise
Registered: 06/11/03
Posts: 1,446
Loc: /\ /\ Right there /\ /\
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Also be sure to Identify yourself as the owner/liver of said dwelling. Be sure to state you are packing.
"who the fuck is it"
"maintenance"
"i have a firearm (rack beanbag shell to chameber) want to duck?"
"sorry we will come back a day better for you"
The beanbag round gives them and you a 1 shot situation.
That way it isn't like you want to waste just anyone coming around.
--------------------
Don't listen to me.
Come check out The Growery
Have Mario Kart Wii? My Mario Kart Friend code is 5155-3674-5607 send a PM if you add me.
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Chemy
Registered: 10/05/07
Posts: 5,727
Loc: Baltimore, MD
Last seen: 18 hours, 8 minutes
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Quote:
four20snakeman said:
Plus the sound of racking a shell is usually all it takes.
Where are these people from that think racking a shotgun is going to get thugs to run away, Disneyland?
You forgot to add in your other post if you hear a noise from the front door that sounds like "pinging" like a basketball bouncing off concrete, and your front door caves in, you should NOT reach for or have a gun in your hand, shit will turn into 1 of the 2 worst case scenarios, instant death or death penalty.
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four20snakeman
Background Noise
Registered: 06/11/03
Posts: 1,446
Loc: /\ /\ Right there /\ /\
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: Chemy]
#8423121 - 05/20/08 03:16 AM (4 months, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
Chemy said:
Quote:
four20snakeman said:
Plus the sound of racking a shell is usually all it takes.
Where are these people from that think racking a shotgun is going to get thugs to run away, Disneyland?
You forgot to add in your other post if you hear a noise from the front door that sounds like "pinging" like a basketball bouncing off concrete, and your front door caves in, you should NOT reach for or have a gun in your hand, shit will turn into 1 of the 2 worst case scenarios, instant death or death penalty.
For 1 i have skipped out on 2 home invasions becaue of my situation.
Then again if it is the cops, When a bucnch of mofos pop your place with swat gear on, It is you own fault for not dropping your lead propellers.
Anyone with a home invasion plan worth it's salt will be dropping guns when it really matters.
BTW claymores by the entrance points will take care of most prohblems
--------------------
Don't listen to me.
Come check out The Growery
Have Mario Kart Wii? My Mario Kart Friend code is 5155-3674-5607 send a PM if you add me.
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SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis
Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 1,827
Loc: God Bless America
Last seen: 13 days, 13 hours
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Shotguns are appropriate for self defense. As are AK-47s, Glocks, and Sigs. Tactically, it is up to the user to determine what weapon is best for their dwelling.
For me, my S&W .357, under my bed would eliminate any intruder stupid enough to break into my condo, as I can reach it, take the safety off, and point at the nearest door opening in about 6 seconds, from a laying position. (I do practice this at a range)
I had a grandfather that reloaded shells for his 12 gauge. He had problems with teenagers destroying his barn (this was in the 40s). He did shoot some of them. His shells were filled with rock salt. They never came back.
--------------------
I will not fear
Fear is the mindkiller,
Fear is the little death
That brings total Oblivion
I will permit my fear to pass
Over me and through me
And where it has gone
I will turn the inner eye
Nothing will be there
Only I will remain
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johnm214
Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 6,486
Loc: Americas
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Quote:
SirTripAlot said:
For me, my S&W .357, under my bed would eliminate any intruder stupid enough to break into my condo, as I can reach it, take the safety off, and point at the nearest door opening in about 6 seconds, from a laying position. (I do practice this at a range)
You practice laying down, reaching under your bed and readying the gun/aiming at the door at the range?
How do you do this? Lay down on the floor and reach under you or something?
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SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis
Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 1,827
Loc: God Bless America
Last seen: 13 days, 13 hours
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Re: renters rights.... [Re: johnm214]
#8426034 - 05/20/08 09:09 PM (4 months, 22 days ago) |
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I wish I could, but most range regulations will not allow this.
What I do is have my gun with the safty on, laying on the prep table. I then reach for it, unlock safety, and then fire quickly from the Weaver stance.
I practice dry fires at home, from the laying down position.
--------------------
I will not fear
Fear is the mindkiller,
Fear is the little death
That brings total Oblivion
I will permit my fear to pass
Over me and through me
And where it has gone
I will turn the inner eye
Nothing will be there
Only I will remain
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fastfred
Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 4,326
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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I stick by shotguns being good home defence weapons. They're very versatile. You can load them with anything from rock salt to dove load to buckshot to slugs. Rock salt is great for scaring people. #8 dove load is great for inflicting some pain and scaring people off with a good spray at range. Close up it will destroy a huge chunk of flesh without penetrating terribly deeply and being all that lethal. Buckshot will blow shit away at a variety of ranges and has good knockdown power. And slugs are the ultimate knockdown load, there is no larger round that you can easily purchase.
This makes them a good weapon for a variety of situations. Most loads won't penetrate apartment walls except at very close range, unlike pistol rounds. It's real easy to load a blank, rock salt, or dove load round first for warning shots and then alternate buckshot and slugs. If you run out of ammo you also have a nice weapon to attack with, unlike with a pistol. They're also easier to find in the dark and easier to aim from the hip. They're also useful for hunting, more so than a pistol.
Everybody's got their own preferences, but I bird hunt and there's no way somebody is going to get past me and my shotgun. You really don't need an assault weapon to protect your home. If the warning shot doesn't scare them off they're quickly going to be blasted in the face by a hundred little pieces of lead. If they keep coming at me blinded with a shredded face they will quickly be cut in half by a hail of buckshot and slugs.
> Just keep in mind it isn't point and and shoot,
Actually that's exactly how it works. 
-FF
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It drinks the alcohol and abstains from the weed or else it gets the hose again. -Chemy
The difference between the substances doesn't matter. This is a war on consciousness, on our right to the very essence of what we are. With no control over that, we have no need to speak of freedom or a free society. -fireseed
"If we are going to have a war on marijuana, the least we can do is pull the sick and the dying off the battlefield." -Neal Levine (MPP)
I find the whole "my drug should be legal but yours should be illegal" mindset disgusting and hypocritical. It's what George Bush and company do when they drink a cocktail and debate the best way to imprison marijuana users. -Diploid
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