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 MokshaIs
everywhereeverpresent
Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 393
Last seen: 16 hours, 35 minutes
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 spirituality is bull shit
#8402174 - 05/14/08 07:16 PM (6 months, 5 days ago) |
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............Reality Revealed is what the journey is about!
eh?
no?
tis a journey for Joy? for comfort? for nothing?
certainly Reality Revealed is rather joyous and comforting...
well, for those "on the path", spiritual materialism best be watched out for eh? I don't meditate...
wait...some say...who is there meditating...wait...
spirituality is bull shit
... as is that
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in all of Infinite
there is but One
and it is nOne
ever and always
in every and all ways
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Lion
I Am That I Am
 
Registered: 09/20/05
Posts: 3,665
Loc: The Becoming Tree
Last seen: 53 minutes, 10 seconds
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 Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: MokshaIs]
#8402203 - 05/14/08 07:27 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Reality Revealed sounds like a book from the New Age section at Barnes & Noble. Be careful, you just might end up making some $ with your message. 
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One day Ananda, who had been thinking deeply about things for a while, turned to the Buddha and exclaimed, "Lord, I've been thinking - spiritual friendship is at least half of the spiritual life!"
The Buddha replied: "Say not so, Ananda, say not so. Spiritual friendship is the whole of the spiritual life!"
Oh the good old days in merry old England and Europe. It was especially tasty to be a women then. Yes it certainly was better in the past.-Icelander
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backfromthedead
Activated
Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 3,590
Last seen: 3 months, 23 days
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: Lion]
#8402218 - 05/14/08 07:30 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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'Reality Revealed is what the journey is about!'
Can you speed the unveiling for Timmy?? He is having some trouble distinguishing who exactly is fucking with him at this point in time.
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 Oweyervishice
Overshoes
Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 1,245
Last seen: 9 seconds
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: MokshaIs]
#8402358 - 05/14/08 08:06 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Spirituality is just a word for describing certain aspects of life. It is nothing supernatural.
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MokshaIs
everywhereeverpresent
Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 393
Last seen: 16 hours, 35 minutes
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but of course. what is not natural? only the perspective decides... eh?
--------------------
in all of Infinite
there is but One
and it is nOne
ever and always
in every and all ways
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Oweyervishice
Overshoes
Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 1,245
Last seen: 9 seconds
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: MokshaIs]
#8402451 - 05/14/08 08:30 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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I agree.
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Cervantes
Devil's Advocate
Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 9,238
Loc: Dark Side of the Windmill
Last seen: 8 hours, 31 minutes
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: MokshaIs]
#8402531 - 05/14/08 08:50 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Spirituality has nothing to do with natural and supernatural.
Man, how many times do we have to have this discussion?
Spirituality is real... but most people mis-use the word.
Here's my favorite quote from an earlier discussion about this very topic.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/8257155/an/0/page/0
Cervantes said:
I wanted to do a better job defining "Spirituality" than I previously have.
So I got access to the full Oxford English Dictionary website... and I figured I should post the "Spiritual" information I was able to dig up.
The online website costs $$$... and the actual dictionary set is as large as a complete set of Encyclopedia volumes... so I hope you don't mind that I can't post the links... however, these ARE the entries... if you don't believe me, go to a library...
AND, these definitions ARE the definitions which all English dictionaries use as their primary source.
I find this stuff fascinating.
The OED is a BRITTISH dictionary, so you may notice slight differences in spelling of some words... especially if you are from North America.
I think this covers MUCH of what has already been discussed in this thread.
So, without further ado...
From Oxford English Dictionary:
spiritual /spírichl/ adj.
adj.
1. of or concerning the spirit as opposed to matter.
2. concerned with sacred or religious things (spiritual songs).
3. (of the mind, etc.) refined; sensitive.
4. concerned with the spirit, etc., not with external reality (his spiritual home).
And from the same book, the definition of Spirit:
spirit
→ noun
1. the non-physical part of a person which is the seat of emotions and character; the soul: we seek a harmony between body and spirit.
• such a part regarded as a person's true self and as capable of surviving physical death or separation: a year after he left, his spirit is still present. • such a part manifested as an apparition after a person's death; a ghost. • a supernatural being: shrines to nature spirits. • ( Spirit ) short for Holy Spirit.
2. [in sing.] the prevailing or typical quality, mood, or attitude of a person, group, or period of time: I hope the team will build on this spirit of confidence | the university is a symbol of the nation's egalitarian spirit.
• [with adj.] a person identified with their most prominent quality or with their role in a group or movement: he was a leading spirit in the conference. • (often spirits) a person's mood or attitude: the warm weather lifted everyone's spirits | he confessed in a spirit of self-respect. • [mass noun] the quality of courage, energy, and determination: his visitors admired his spirit and good temper.
3. the real meaning or the intention behind something as opposed to its strict verbal interpretation: the rule had been broken in spirit if not in letter.
4. (usu. spirits) (chiefly Brit.) strong distilled liquor such as brandy, whiskey, gin, or rum.
• [mass noun] [with modifier] a volatile liquid, especially a fuel, prepared by distillation: aviation spirit. • (archaic) a solution of volatile components extracted from something, typically by distillation or by solution in alcohol: spirits of turpentine.
5. (archaic) a highly refined substance or fluid thought to govern vital phenomena.
→ verb (spirits, spiriting, spirited)
1. [with obj. and adverbial of direction] convey rapidly and secretly: stolen cows were spirited away some distance to prevent detection.
2. [with obj.] (spirit someone up) (archaic) stimulate, animate, or cheer up someone.
enter into the spirit join wholeheartedly in an event, especially one of celebration and festivity: he entered into the spirit of the occasion by dressing as a pierrot.
in ( or in the ) spirit in thought or intention though not physically: he couldn't be here in person, but he is with us in spirit.
the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak (proverb) someone has good intentions but fails to live up to them. [ORIGIN with biblical allusion to Matt. 26:41.]
when the spirit moves someone when someone feels inclined to do something: he can be quite candid when the spirit moves him. [ORIGIN a phrase originally in Quaker use, with reference to the Holy Spirit.]
the spirit world (in animistic and occult belief) the non-physical realm in which disembodied spirits have their existence.
- ORIGIN Middle English: from Anglo-Norman French, from Latin spiritus ‘breath, spirit’, from spirare ‘breathe’.
From the Oxford English Dictionary of Philosophy:
spirit (Latin, spiritus: breath, life, soul, mind) When we describe things in terms of spirited responses, mean-spirited behaviour, a spirited waltz, and so on, we are characterizing them purely as lively or animated. It is a short, but perhaps philosophically fatal, step to thinking of the spirit as that which animates them: the principle or immaterial source from which the animation flows. One's own spirit becomes a soul or mind or Ego; while the principle from which all natural events emanate becomes the animating principle of the cosmos, or world-spirit. The notion of a Geist is that of a spirit that breathes through things, and in Hegel the highest level of spirit, distinguished from the individual spirit and the social or political spirit, is the absolute spirit to whose realization world history is directed. See also absolute idealism.
From the Oxford Companion to Philosophy:
spirit. Spirits hover between minds, souls, and vapours. The original idea of a spirit is of a disembodied agent, as an immaterial soul or a non-material intelligent power. In the seventeenth century and earlier there was a belief in spirits as gaslike substances intermediate between matter and mind. For all his dualism Descartes in Les Passions de l'âme uses the idea. When we talk now of the spiritual we refer to neither of these but typically to the kind of emotion one might have towards God or some other factor beyond one's material life. An image common to all three of these seems to be one of distillation, of a more refined product of a crude original.
Prof. Adam Morton
See also pneuma.
From The Consice Oxford English Dictionary of Etymology:
spirit A. breath of life;
B. vital principle;
C. incorporeal being XIII; immaterial element of a human being;
D. vital power XIV;
E. †any of four substances so named of the alchemists XIV; liquid of the nature of an essence XVII. — AN., aphetic of espirit, OF. esperit, (also mod.) esprit — L. spritus breathing, breath, air, life, soul, pride, courage, (in Chr. use) incorporeal being, f. sprre breathe. Hence spirit vb. (arch.) enliven, inspirit XVI; carry away mysteriously XVII. spirited ( -ED2) XVI. spiritism XIX. So spiritual pert. to the spirit XIV; ecclesiastical XIV. ME. spirituel (later latinized) — (O)F. spirituel — L. spritulis; see -AL1. spirituality XV. — (O)F. or late L. spiritualism XIX. spirituous †spirited XVI; ardent, alcoholic XVII. — F. spiritueux or f. L. spritus
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You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. -Inigo Montoya
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Oweyervishice
Overshoes
Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 1,245
Last seen: 9 seconds
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: Cervantes]
#8402622 - 05/14/08 09:07 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Cervantes said:
Spirituality has nothing to do with natural and supernatural.
Your definitions basically say that spirit is something non-physical (supernatural) or it is a way of describing the qualities of a person or situation (natural). 
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Chemy
Registered: 10/05/07
Posts: 5,758
Loc: Baltimore, MD
Last seen: 5 hours, 29 minutes
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Why does the spirit need the body to die in order to activate and seperate from the physical vessel?
No living human being can answer this question, and "near death experience" doesn't count, 2nd place doesn't win the race.
I'm not saying there is or isn't, just that I have no clue whatsoever.
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sudo apt-get install Barack-Obama
pu *.Bush
Deleted: B: /Bush/Patriot Act
Deleted: B: /Bush/NSA/AT&T/Warrantless Spying
Deleted: B: /Bush/Economy
Deleted: B: /Bush/Nukalur Weapons
Deleted: C: /Cheney/Control
Deleted: R: /Rice/Tool
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Oweyervishice
Overshoes
Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 1,245
Last seen: 9 seconds
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: Chemy]
#8402703 - 05/14/08 09:25 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Chemy said:
Why does the spirit need the body to die in order to activate and seperate from the physical vessel?
No living human being can answer this question, and "near death experience" doesn't count, 2nd place doesn't win the race.
I'm not saying there is or isn't, just that I have no clue whatsoever.
I'd say if we really DO have a soul, or whatever you choose to call it, it is obviously tied in some way to our living bodies. Some claim it is possible to leave your body before you die...I don't think so.
It's like time-release capsules. The plastic casing is our body, the medicine inside is the spirit. The spirit can't get out until the capsule dissolves. 
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Cervantes
Devil's Advocate
Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 9,238
Loc: Dark Side of the Windmill
Last seen: 8 hours, 31 minutes
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Quote:
Oweyervishice said:
Quote:
Cervantes said:
Spirituality has nothing to do with natural and supernatural.
Your definitions basically say that spirit is something non-physical (supernatural) or it is a way of describing the qualities of a person or situation (natural).
Many things are not physical... like thoughts. You believe in thoughts... right? Are thoughts supernatural? No. Are they spiritual? By definition... yes.
This isn't hard.
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You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. -Inigo Montoya
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WhiskeyClone
Not here
Registered: 06/25/01
Posts: 13,660
Loc: Longitudinal Center of Ca...
Last seen: 1 hour, 37 minutes
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: MokshaIs]
#8402786 - 05/14/08 09:39 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
MokshaIs said:
tis a journey for Joy? for comfort? for nothing?
certainly Reality Revealed is rather joyous and comforting...
well, for those "on the path", spiritual materialism best be watched out for eh? I don't meditate...
No, not certainly.
There should be no materialism in meditation. A lot of spiritual teachings warn against attachment to any gratifying or beneficial effects that result from meditation.
Sorry, your post doesn't quite invalidate thousands of years of human spirituality. Maybe a you have to elaborate to Reveal Reality for us.
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-oOo-
A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines. With consistency a great soul has simply nothing to do. He may as well concern himself with his shadow on the wall. Speak what you think now in hard words, and to-morrow speak what to-morrow thinks in hard words again, though it contradict every thing you said to-day. -- `Ah, so you shall be sure to be misunderstood.' -- Is it so bad, then, to be misunderstood? Pythagoras was misunderstood, and Socrates, and Jesus, and Luther, and Copernicus, and Galileo, and Newton, and every pure and wise spirit that ever took flesh. To be great is to be misunderstood.
~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"
-oOo-
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Oweyervishice
Overshoes
Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 1,245
Last seen: 9 seconds
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: Cervantes]
#8402792 - 05/14/08 09:40 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Cervantes said:
Quote:
Oweyervishice said:
Quote:
Cervantes said:
Spirituality has nothing to do with natural and supernatural.
Your definitions basically say that spirit is something non-physical (supernatural) or it is a way of describing the qualities of a person or situation (natural).
Many things are not physical... like thoughts. You believe in thoughts... right? Are thoughts supernatural? No. Are they spiritual? By definition... yes.
This isn't hard.
Well, everything that is non-physical depends on the mind to exist, as far as I know. Whether or not the mind is actually physical or not is still up in the air.
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Cervantes
Devil's Advocate
Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 9,238
Loc: Dark Side of the Windmill
Last seen: 8 hours, 31 minutes
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You're getting it...
But, the mind is physical. It is grey matter. You can hold a person's mind in your hands.
Thoughts are NOT physical... so don't confuse the two. Can you hold a thought in your hands? Do you see thoughts flying around? Do thoughts make noise?
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You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. -Inigo Montoya
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Chemy
Registered: 10/05/07
Posts: 5,758
Loc: Baltimore, MD
Last seen: 5 hours, 29 minutes
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: Cervantes]
#8402867 - 05/14/08 09:54 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Cervantes said:
You're getting it...
But, the mind is physical. It is grey matter. You can hold a person's mind in your hands.
Thoughts are NOT physical... so don't confuse the two. Can you hold a thought in your hands? Do you see thoughts flying around? Do thoughts make noise?
Will a persons thoughts exist after death?
I'm really stuck in this fractal, not very pleasant.
--------------------
sudo apt-get install Barack-Obama
pu *.Bush
Deleted: B: /Bush/Patriot Act
Deleted: B: /Bush/NSA/AT&T/Warrantless Spying
Deleted: B: /Bush/Economy
Deleted: B: /Bush/Nukalur Weapons
Deleted: C: /Cheney/Control
Deleted: R: /Rice/Tool
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Cervantes
Devil's Advocate
Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 9,238
Loc: Dark Side of the Windmill
Last seen: 8 hours, 31 minutes
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: Chemy]
#8402887 - 05/14/08 09:58 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Chemy said:
Will a persons thoughts exist after death?
I'm really stuck in this fractal, not very pleasant.
No they will not...
... unless the thoughts are expressed... and remembered by others.
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You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. -Inigo Montoya
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Chemy
Registered: 10/05/07
Posts: 5,758
Loc: Baltimore, MD
Last seen: 5 hours, 29 minutes
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: Cervantes]
#8402917 - 05/14/08 10:04 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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This thread is basically the pattern of thoughts I've been having that causes a lot of fear for me.
You said thoughts cease after a person dies, so basically when we pass on thats it, we didn't exist before birth, and will cease to exist after death?
That scares the hell out of me, when I was younger I believed in life after death, but now, I just think what's here is here and there is no behind the scenes magic.
--------------------
sudo apt-get install Barack-Obama
pu *.Bush
Deleted: B: /Bush/Patriot Act
Deleted: B: /Bush/NSA/AT&T/Warrantless Spying
Deleted: B: /Bush/Economy
Deleted: B: /Bush/Nukalur Weapons
Deleted: C: /Cheney/Control
Deleted: R: /Rice/Tool
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 OrgoneConclusion
Oh, bee hive!
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 7,945
Loc: In the woods
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: Cervantes]
#8402945 - 05/14/08 10:10 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Swami is long gone, yet his witty and incisive posts shall live forever.
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Tim: Hey Aimee, did you hear the one about the two bears who went to The Vatican?
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WhiskeyClone
Not here
Registered: 06/25/01
Posts: 13,660
Loc: Longitudinal Center of Ca...
Last seen: 1 hour, 37 minutes
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: Chemy]
#8402951 - 05/14/08 10:11 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Chemy said:
That scares the hell out of me, when I was younger I believed in life after death, but now, I just think what's here is here and there is no behind the scenes magic.
Are you sure you want to assume you see the whole 'stage'?
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-oOo-
A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines. With consistency a great soul has simply nothing to do. He may as well concern himself with his shadow on the wall. Speak what you think now in hard words, and to-morrow speak what to-morrow thinks in hard words again, though it contradict every thing you said to-day. -- `Ah, so you shall be sure to be misunderstood.' -- Is it so bad, then, to be misunderstood? Pythagoras was misunderstood, and Socrates, and Jesus, and Luther, and Copernicus, and Galileo, and Newton, and every pure and wise spirit that ever took flesh. To be great is to be misunderstood.
~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"
-oOo-
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klimt
Stranger
Registered: 03/07/08
Posts: 166
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Re: spirituality is bull shit [Re: WhiskeyClone]
#8403142 - 05/14/08 10:42 PM (6 months, 4 days ago) |
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Spirituality has so many different meanings you can adapt the term to mean whatever you want it to mean all the way from the mundane to the metaphysical.
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