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 Chronic777
Awareness of "I Am"
 
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 2,902
Loc: Emptiness
Last seen: 1 day, 2 hours
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 Do-er ship is a myth!!!
#8399765 - 05/14/08 05:43 AM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Ego is the sense that there is a do-er.
"I have so much control over my life" Only ego says this.
When seen from spaciousness, we as ego's have no more sense of truth or any more control over our lives over that of an ant or a dog.
If you wish to be free, you must give up all ego, this includes the sense of a do-er, essentially of free will!
Many teachers teach the path of surrender & devotion (Bhakti) as all that is needed, Ramana Maharshi also told us of the importance of self-enquiry to fully destroy the ego.
The only 2 techniques any human being needs to awaken is Jnana & Bhakti, knowledge & devotion, which are both extremly simple, all you need to do is totally surrender to life & when you are unable to, find out who is unable, who resists?
This finding all you can find is ego, which does not exist, except as a thought.
Then you are unattached as all is in the hands of the universe, not some mythical ego that believes itself to have control, this do-er who desires so much power.
If you feel violated "who are you telling me to surrender my free will!?"
Who says this? Whos offended? Who says "my" free will??? Ego Ego Ego!!!
Freedom is SO simple, the do-er makes it difficult.
"Come on now, who do you, who do you, who do you, who do you think you are?
Ha ha ha bless your soul
You really think you're in control!?"
--------------------
 
"Now I have become totally empty"
Bodhidharma slapped him immediately and said
"Now go and throw this emptiness also!"
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Oweyervishice
You're Vicious
Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 313
Last seen: 20 hours, 31 minutes
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 Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Chronic777]
#8399789 - 05/14/08 05:57 AM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Isn't making the choice to live free of the ego, do-ing something?
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I was taught a month ago
To bide my time and take it slow
But then I learned just yesterday
To rush and never waste the day
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Chronic777
Awareness of "I Am"
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 2,902
Loc: Emptiness
Last seen: 1 day, 2 hours
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No as it is realising choicelessness as bliss.
That in reality the ego has no choice, it just believes it so, so is merley a practiced belief. Nothing more, nothing real or substantial.
You could say its doing, yet doing nothing.
Like Buddhas teaching of "walk, as if no-one is walkiing"
Or Lao Tzu "in doing nothing all is acheived"
Let me explain how i directly experienced this truth of do-er ship being a myth.
While in the throws of deep deep ecstatic bliss after satsang with Mooji, i thought...
"Damn if i really totally let go right now im going to go krazy with bliss, ill be like Krishna dancing through the streets, blissed out on a park bench for the rest of my life with a long beard smelling of funk!!!"
Then i enquired...
"Who lets go & goes krazy!?"
Surely the ego can not let go of the true being, as it is false, it must be the true being who lets go of the belief in being an ego!
Thus relising we have absolutely no free will whatsoever, any belief otherwise is a belief in the power of the ego, which is illusionary.
How can the ego say "yes i let go of this false ego"???
Surely that is ego saying it!!!
It is not real, just a false belief, it is the beingness that lets go of the false belief in being an ego, you have no control, no choice over it.
Know this & be free, right now you can be free of this ego.
When you look back on your past does it not seem as if everything happened at the right time for you to be HERE, NOW? Then why isit you believe you have some contorl over where you go next? All these feelings doubt thoughts truths untruths are simply thoughts occuring in the space, the space that you are!
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"Now I have become totally empty"
Bodhidharma slapped him immediately and said
"Now go and throw this emptiness also!"
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Oweyervishice
You're Vicious
Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 313
Last seen: 20 hours, 31 minutes
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Chronic777]
#8399869 - 05/14/08 06:58 AM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
Chronic777 said:
When you look back on your past does it not seem as if everything happened at the right time for you to be HERE, NOW? Then why isit you believe you have some contorl over where you go next? All these feelings doubt thoughts truths untruths are simply thoughts occuring in the space, the space that you are!
Sure, everything happened just right to make the present moment as it is. That doesn't mean there weren't other *possible* present moments.
 I'm not ready to discount free will just yet.
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I was taught a month ago
To bide my time and take it slow
But then I learned just yesterday
To rush and never waste the day
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Chronic777
Awareness of "I Am"
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 2,902
Loc: Emptiness
Last seen: 1 day, 2 hours
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Who is not ready?
Dont answer, just let the question point you inside, who is not ready?
ps im not syaing everyone should give up theyre free will & do nothing, all im saying is totally throw this ego away, its false, starve it by finding out & watching who it is that does, says, decides, walks & talks...be empty and simply let this body/mind fullfill its destiny in deep joy & peace, instead of misery confusion & suffering.
--------------------
"Now I have become totally empty"
Bodhidharma slapped him immediately and said
"Now go and throw this emptiness also!"
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Oweyervishice
You're Vicious
Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 313
Last seen: 20 hours, 31 minutes
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Chronic777]
#8400005 - 05/14/08 08:15 AM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
Chronic777 said:
Who is not ready?
Dont answer, just let the question point you inside, who is not ready?
ps im not syaing everyone should give up theyre free will & do nothing, all im saying is totally throw this ego away, its false, starve it by finding out & watching who it is that does, says, decides, walks & talks...be empty and simply let this body/mind fullfill its destiny in deep joy & peace, instead of misery confusion & suffering.
Rolling in the mud of illusion is messy, but it can also be very exciting.
--------------------
I was taught a month ago
To bide my time and take it slow
But then I learned just yesterday
To rush and never waste the day
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 Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 20,731
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Chronic777]
#8400798 - 05/14/08 01:09 PM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
Chronic777 said:
Ego is the sense that there is a do-er.
"I have so much control over my life" Only ego says this.
When seen from spaciousness, we as ego's have no more sense of truth or any more control over our lives over that of an ant or a dog.
If you wish to be free, you must give up all ego, this includes the sense of a do-er, essentially of free will!
Many teachers teach the path of surrender & devotion (Bhakti) as all that is needed, Ramana Maharshi also told us of the importance of self-enquiry to fully destroy the ego.
The only 2 techniques any human being needs to awaken is Jnana & Bhakti, knowledge & devotion, which are both extremly simple, all you need to do is totally surrender to life & when you are unable to, find out who is unable, who resists?
This finding all you can find is ego, which does not exist, except as a thought.
Then you are unattached as all is in the hands of the universe, not some mythical ego that believes itself to have control, this do-er who desires so much power.
If you feel violated "who are you telling me to surrender my free will!?"
Who says this? Whos offended? Who says "my" free will??? Ego Ego Ego!!!
Freedom is SO simple, the do-er makes it difficult.
"Come on now, who do you, who do you, who do you, who do you think you are?
Ha ha ha bless your soul
You really think you're in control!?"
Cut the preacher crap. Please go to the mystery forum and deposit your 
--------------------
What the thinker thinks, the prover proves. R.A.W.
I don't believe anything, but I have many suspicions. R.A.W.
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Chronic777
Awareness of "I Am"
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 2,902
Loc: Emptiness
Last seen: 1 day, 2 hours
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Icelander]
#8400847 - 05/14/08 01:19 PM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
Cut the preacher crap. Please go to the mystery forum and deposit your
Just posting what works for me, shit all over it, please, it is like fertilizer for it
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"Now I have become totally empty"
Bodhidharma slapped him immediately and said
"Now go and throw this emptiness also!"
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OrgoneConclusion
Thinker
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 6,617
Loc: Not gardening
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Chronic777]
#8400895 - 05/14/08 01:31 PM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Just posting what works for me,
Quote:
If you wish to be free,
But you are not merely stating what works for you.
There is a HUGE difference in your two statements.
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I am not an actor, I merely play one on TV.
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Chronic777
Awareness of "I Am"
Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 2,902
Loc: Emptiness
Last seen: 1 day, 2 hours
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It does work for me, and has done for thousands of people for thousands of years.
So i am saying what has worked wonders for me, and suggesting it for others as it has worked for many others. Just look up the words Bhakti & Jnana and see...
If some don't like it then thats fine & dandy, there are a few who do, unfortunately i now have to leave
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"Now I have become totally empty"
Bodhidharma slapped him immediately and said
"Now go and throw this emptiness also!"
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OrgoneConclusion
Thinker
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 6,617
Loc: Not gardening
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Chronic777]
#8401045 - 05/14/08 02:01 PM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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So because racquetball is my sport of choice it is most helpful to tell everyone that the only way to perfect physical health is to play racquetball?
That is how you come across.
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I am not an actor, I merely play one on TV.
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Veritas
Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 8,896
Loc: PNW
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Chronic777]
#8401166 - 05/14/08 02:28 PM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Yes, it is true that the personality does not have a tangible existence. However, to extend this to say that we, as individuals, have no independent existence is absurd. There IS a "do-er," and no amount of meditation will change this fact.
The question "who does this" is asked by...no-one? And who pursues a spiritual path...no-one? Who idolizes their master/teacher/sage and is certain that they have found THE truth? Who posts on the Shroomery? Who reads posts in response to theirs?
We do have individual bodies, individual experiences of life, individual minds and individual decision-making ability. No matter how much you "look within," there is still someone looking at their own constructs. This someone is unique, and their experience of looking within is unique.
To hoist oneself unto the high horse of "enlightenment" and claim that all other methods and perspectives are false is to sit in judgment. This perspective is part of the personality, aka ego, and not a sign of so-called egolessness and blissful oneness with the Universe.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 20,731
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Chronic777]
#8401421 - 05/14/08 03:49 PM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
Chronic777 said:
Quote:
Icelander said:
Cut the preacher crap. Please go to the mystery forum and deposit your
Just posting what works for me, shit all over it, please, it is like fertilizer for it
This is a lie. You are telling us what we must do, go back and read your stupid post.
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What the thinker thinks, the prover proves. R.A.W.
I don't believe anything, but I have many suspicions. R.A.W.
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Gomp
¡(Bound to·(o))be free!
Registered: 09/11/04
Posts: 9,095
Loc: I re·side [primarily] in ...
Last seen: 3 days, 6 hours
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Chronic777]
#8401555 - 05/14/08 04:24 PM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Ego is the senser..
Ego is a lot! 
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Grapefruit
Stranger
Registered: 05/09/08
Posts: 88
Last seen: 4 days, 23 hours
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Icelander]
#8401565 - 05/14/08 04:27 PM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
This is a lie. You are telling us what we must do, go back and read your stupid post.
Quote:
If you wish to be free, you must give up all ego, this includes the sense of a do-er, essentially of free will!
If being the key word here.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 20,731
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Grapefruit]
#8401621 - 05/14/08 04:41 PM (3 months, 6 days ago) |
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What an arrogant post. If we wish to be free then do like you say. I think I want to puke.
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What the thinker thinks, the prover proves. R.A.W.
I don't believe anything, but I have many suspicions. R.A.W.
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C.M. Mann
Stranger
Registered: 05/01/08
Posts: 88
Last seen: 2 months, 10 days
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Chronic777]
#8409314 - 05/16/08 12:32 PM (3 months, 4 days ago) |
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Just my opinion mind you, but the ego is the act that you are displaying to the world. It is a facade that hides the your truth from everyone you meet. Everyone is responsable for their actions no matter how you define who is in control. ..........................You do not want to lose your ego, you should want to control it and use very little. It should not be one way or the other, it should be a healthy balance. I have never heard of one budhist who actualy achieved anything they were talking about. There are many beautiful words, but it is obvious meditation will not get you there. You may experience altered states, but you will not access the subconscious mind. Much of what you say rings true to me, but there are many ways to do what you are describing. Some of what you say sounds like nonsense, maybe I just can not conceptualize your words.
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 Rahz
Spore Viewer
Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 1,815
Last seen: 1 minute, 3 seconds
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: C.M. Mann]
#8409592 - 05/16/08 01:48 PM (3 months, 4 days ago) |
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It seems that both ego and soul "do", though there is no real effort when the expression is free of ego.
Having said that, it's really a matter of who/what is on TOP. I'm not trying to kill, or do away with part of myself any more. We can roll around for a while, but he got tired of getting pinned down all the time. We're gonna be friends and teach each other a thing or two.
Being peaceful and calm is nice, but doing is "nice" too. Somewhere in the middle lies something neither can create on their own, and I find that to be the nicest of all.
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rahz
comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace
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backfromthedead
Activated
Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 3,590
Last seen: 24 days, 10 hours
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Re: Do-er ship is a myth!!! [Re: Rahz]
#8409637 - 05/16/08 02:00 PM (3 months, 4 days ago) |
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'We're gonna be friends and teach each other a thing or two.'
LIKE BROTHERS/SISTERS SHOULD
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learningtofly
Stranger
Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 2,267
Last seen: 2 hours, 16 minutes
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Quote:
Chronic777 said:
No as it is realising choicelessness as bliss.
That in reality the ego has no choice, it just believes it so, so is merley a practiced belief. Nothing more, nothing real or substantial.
You could say its doing, yet doing nothing.
Like Buddhas teaching of "walk, as if no-one is walkiing"
Or Lao Tzu "in doing nothing all is acheived"
Lao Tzu meant to do it effortlessly. Not by letting go. An example being a good athlete can enter a state of body-awareness in which the right movements happen by themselves without effort of conscious will. He is not saying to be passive which is what I think you're implying.
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GnuBobo said:
You're a stupid hippie. That's my point.
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