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 durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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 species comparison
#8352224 - 05/02/08 01:00 AM (3 months, 18 days ago) |
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well here is a thread to compare species from each other and their intermediates. there will be some recorded hybrids(not intermediates)also. these photos come from plants that had to be uprooted and decontaminated due to a nasty root mealy infection. i will have the rest of my collection that is outside photographed and compared soon. we will start with T. pachnoi. this is the "bakeberg","pc" plant that is commonly sold as san pedro.
now here is a "spiny wild form" and a close up of its spination..
in this photo which is the "bakeberg","PC" plant and which is T. bridgesii? if you guessed the one on the left as bridgesii you got it..
this is a short "spined pachnoi". this one came straight from peru from Karel knize.
this variety is called "juul's giant"....
and this is a Juul's giantXpachnoi...
there will be more san pedro varieties coming later from the ones outside. we will move on to T. scopicolus or sometimes written T. scopicola. this plant is said to be closely related to T. bridgesii. on the close up you can see its different spination then a pedro and also the skin texture difference. T. scop having a rougher skin.
this variety T. riomizquiensis also looks very similar to san pedro also but is a relative of T. scopicola.
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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ok lets move on to T. bridgesii. this is what i consider a classic bridgesii form..
here is a SS02.....
here are 2 JLHudson T. bridgesii
this is B01...
this is a T. bridgesii from sacred succulents that appears to maybe a intermedate maybe to pachnoi...
a columnar T. bridgesii monstrose..
a columnar T. bridgesii monstrose(has spines)..
a clumping T. bridgesii monstrose...
this one is a T. bridgesiiXT. pachnoi...
Edited by durban_poison (05/02/08 02:42 AM)
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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now we will go onto T. macrogonus. this one is T. macrogonus "icaros" specimen..
this one is from mesa garden seed and is a macrogonoid..
this one is a T. macrogonusXT. pachnoi..
this one is a "GF" a peruvianoid/macrogonoid. this one leans more towards macrogonus...
this one is a mesa garden specimen that leans towards macrogonus. another peruvanoid/macrogonoid..
Edited by durban_poison (05/02/08 02:49 AM)
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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ok and now on to T. peruvianus...
this is a "short spine peruvianus" not a M S Smith "short spine peruvianus". this is definetly a peruvianus.
this one is another peruvanoid/cuzconoid that looks peruvanoid....
this one is another peruvanoid/cuzconoid that leans toward the cuzco side.. a KK??
and this one is from homedepot...
ok this is a KK447 that is a peruvinoid/cuzconoid..
this is a T. peruvianus var. knuithianus aka T. knuthianus...
this is a T. peruvianus var. tarma aka. T. tarmaensis...
another "short spine peruvianus var. cristate"...
this is a "GF" thats leaning towards the peruvianoid spectrum. see other pic "GF" leaning towards macrogonoid spectrum. both are from the same stock which is a peruvanoid/macrogonoid.
the above photos are a good demonstration on seed variation when compared to other "GF" photos.
there will be many more examples of these coming as well when photos are taken.
Edited by durban_poison (05/02/08 02:48 AM)
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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Up next is what i consider T. werdermannianus. notice the black spines at the base. T. terscheckii does not have this neither does T. validus, T. taquimbalensis, T. tarmaensis or T. pasacana.
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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on to T. harissima aka. T. brevisipnulosus. im not quite sure where this falls and it could possibly be a hybrid..
this one is T. spachianus..
this one is a T. formosa...
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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here are two different T. chiloensis..
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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now some T. terscheckii..
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 cpw1971
Cactiaholic
 
Registered: 10/07/06
Posts: 3,284
Last seen: 55 minutes, 57 seconds
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sweeeeeet collection man. thanks for posting
this is my new favorite thread hehe
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preschooler
new hand
Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 1,817
Loc: wouldn't you like to know...
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Re: species comparison [Re: cpw1971]
#8353288 - 05/02/08 11:07 AM (3 months, 18 days ago) |
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nice pics
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Just want to give my thanks to the shroomery. You guys have made it possible for me to see the world in a different light so to speak. I do believe it is getting better every year that i am here and i believe what you are doing is good for the new and older members. Its also very cool to see an orginazation that gives drugs and psychotropic plants the respect they deserve. keep it up!!!!!
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 felixhigh
evil harlequin
Registered: 06/24/01
Posts: 4,096
Last seen: 57 seconds
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What a great collection you´ve got there congrats.
FH
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sturmer88
Shroomer
Registered: 09/26/07
Posts: 525
Last seen: 8 hours, 39 minutes
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Re: species comparison [Re: felixhigh]
#8353574 - 05/02/08 12:16 PM (3 months, 18 days ago) |
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Nice Pics, You must have allot of space for all those. I notice you have an ICAROS specimen. Did you grow it from seed? I have the ICAROS T. Peruvianus seeds growing and I hear they are more like Macro/Peruvianus Hybrids. Is that correct? Do you have any experience with their seed grown Peruvianus?
Edited by sturmer88 (05/02/08 12:17 PM)
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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Re: species comparison [Re: sturmer88]
#8354396 - 05/02/08 04:06 PM (3 months, 18 days ago) |
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Thanks for all the kind words everyone. yes the "icaros" is from seed. yeah they sure are macro/peruvian hybrids but they tend to stick to the macro side of things. as far as experience they definetly are intresting some moreso then others. i would rate the least intresting specimen i had equivalent to a T. pachnoi although im sure there are more boring ones out there as well as very exciting. i would consider them reliable thats for sure at least from this batch of seed. now i just need to go outside and take the rest of the photos. I think i will save that for tomorrow cause i didnt get any sleep last night.
as far as seed goes my favorite so far is the long spined scopXT. bridgesii 
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sturmer88
Shroomer
Registered: 09/26/07
Posts: 525
Last seen: 8 hours, 39 minutes
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Thanks. I have about 50-60 Icaro's starting off. They are about 2 months old now. I have heard that they look to be a Peruvianus/Macro hybrid. I'm glad I've finally seen a full specimen. I like T. Macro so I'm not disappointed at all.
Today I got a big Pie tray and put the rest of my T. Macro, Icaro Peruvianus, and Peruvianus v. Tarma seeds along with about 20 Loph Williamsii all on the same tray. So I should have a nice Ethnnogenic Pie growing in a few days.
Those cacti you have are gonna look great as soon as they are planted and get some light. Are you gonna put them in the ground or Pot them up?
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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Re: species comparison [Re: sturmer88]
#8354844 - 05/02/08 06:07 PM (3 months, 18 days ago) |
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some are going to be potted up to get larger in size and the rest have a new home in hawaii. they should get pretty large in there new environment there. we have 10 acres that are 3000 ft above sea level in a arid area. annual rainfall of 15-20 in a year.
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sturmer88
Shroomer
Registered: 09/26/07
Posts: 525
Last seen: 8 hours, 39 minutes
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Your lucky to have that much room. I'm thinking of putting some of my specimens in the ground. Since I'm in Zone 10 it should be no problem. I'm just worried about how much rainfall we get every winter. I'd love to have a few 15 foot Peruvianus growing in my yard. I'm also planting a couple kratom trees if weather permits.
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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Re: species comparison [Re: sturmer88]
#8358443 - 05/03/08 05:11 PM (3 months, 17 days ago) |
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if your worried about rain fall i would stay away from T. bridgesii. hybrids would be good. juuls and san pedro varities seem to take alot of rain. macrogonus/true peruvians and other slower growers might get rot also. the faster the cacti grows the more rain it can handle. there are always exceptions to the rule but you will have to loose some to find ones that work in your area. obviously seed is the way to go. for example: you start 50 bridgesii seeds for your area. you may loose 50-70 percent of them to rot if your rainfall is to much. the ones that survive are the winners and will get full size. those plants are very hardy and prepared for your conditions. they will also be great cultivars for others in your zone. so im only discouraging planting certain varities if you want 100% success. if your like me and prefer darwinism or evolution to take its course you will loose alot but you gain more. also the off spring of the specimens will have a much higher success ratio each generation. unfortunatly its not like our favorite herb where you can go many generations fast. with cacti it may take a lifetime to get 2-3 generations deep. its worth doing it to secure a future for our favorite cacti. everyone seems to want cacti from peruvian or equadorian sources i actually prefer seeds from plants that are of proven reliability in the US. Survivors that have mated to produce more tolerant offspring. then keep pushing the limits further north. i personally have a couple hybrids that are like this from california but they are very few and hard to find. also one of them has a undesirable dad so hes more for show. I believe T. terschekii breed into known gene pools could be a good thing considering its tolerance factor for cold and wet conditions. also it can be useful for shamanic purposes especally after being hybridized. terscheckii doesn't readily hybridize with every plant but once you break it with a plant that it takes to it is easier to hybridize again. thats why you dont see to many terschekii hybrids avalible. I have yet to work with known terscheckii hybrids but it sounds very promising. anyway its raining out so dont expect any more photos today.
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sturmer88
Shroomer
Registered: 09/26/07
Posts: 525
Last seen: 8 hours, 39 minutes
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With my seedlings I definitely wouldn't try putting them in the ground until they were at least a foot long but I'm thinking about my bigger specimens. I might just put them in the ground and uproot them next January when the rainy season starts. We only have a couple month a year that gets allot of rain. N. California Zone 10 is suppose to be one of the best places for Trichocereus.
I've heard that T. Terschekii wasn't really good for ethnobotanical use. The few trip reports I've read arn't favorible but I guess if you crossed it with P. Torch or something else that might make the difference.
Heres a funny question. What about L Williamsii. What would happen if you tried to cross a columnar species with a button cactus like L Williamsii. I'm not thinking of that it's just a interesting question that popped in my mind. I've seen Williamsii hybrids of other species on the internet. I'm just wondering what would happen. If you had a flowering Williamsii and a flowering Torch or pedro would you have to worry about cross pollination?
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durban_poison
myco contractor
Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 2,241
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Re: species comparison [Re: sturmer88]
#8358835 - 05/03/08 07:33 PM (3 months, 16 days ago) |
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the trip reports are definetly variable. this is because of the species and misclassification of the species. as you know T. validus has positive and many of the trich giants do have positive reports. now as true terscheckii having positive reports well it all depends what you have and consider terscheckii. there are such conflicting reports and distinction between species it hard to recognise what is and what isnt. however the plants that fall into active terscheckii maybe that or hybrids. these hybrids or real deal, as long as they are active are the material to use or look for. oddly enough it seems the active ones are the ones that are easier to hybridize. is that due to already being hybridized or to them being a seperate group from terscheckii remains to be unknown. these are the ones that carry terscheckii traits but can be exellent material to work with. it could also be the real terscheckii reports. its hard to say considering the 2 variations that people consider terscheckii.
Edited by durban_poison (05/03/08 07:41 PM)
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mofo
celebutante
Registered: 04/05/08
Posts: 298
Loc: SoCal
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Awesome cacti bro. So what was this disease they were getting? Is it treatable or avoidable?
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"What luck for the rulers that men do not think."
-Adolf Hitler
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