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 veggie
Registered: 07/25/04
Posts: 13,985
Loc: 
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 Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT]
#6608156 - 02/25/07 08:53 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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February 25, 2007 - timesargus.com
Mayor wants death penalty for drug dealers
BARRE – Mayor Thomas Lauzon on Saturday said he hoped the Legislature would consider imposing the death penalty on convicted crack and heroin dealers, and to legalize marijuana.
Failing that, the mayor said, he would call for a public forum in Barre to kick off a statewide discussion about the growing drug problem in Vermont and steps – including the death penalty and legalization — to control the situation.
"I'm sure everyone will distance themselves from me," Lauzon said Saturday night of his death-penalty call. "But if anyone tells you we're winning the war on drugs, they're lying."
Lauzon was quoted in The Times Argus' Saturday edition saying, "People who are dealing crack and dealing heroin have zero social value and should be put to death."
Saturday night he reiterated that belief.
"What social value do they have? They are dealing crack and heroin to young people, knowing full well what the effects will be," the mayor said. "What purpose do they serve in society other than to destroy lives, to destroy families?"
He went on to say that by legalizing marijuana, fees on the production and sale could be used for drug prevention and treatment efforts to get at the core problem – drug usage in Vermont.
Lauzon acknowledged that his views would be controversial, but he said the state needs to confront the fact that Vermont is losing the war on drugs.
Sen. Richard Sears, D-Bennington, chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, said he understood Lauzon's frustration with the growing drug problem. But Sears stopped short of supporting the mayor's call for the death penalty or the legalization of marijuana.
"I think the man is very frustrated, and I understand his frustration," Sears said. "The problem in my view is we've ignored this problem until it's out of hand."
Sears said legalizing a drug would put Vermont at odds with federal law, creating more problems than it solved.
"Secondly, if we were to have a discussion about the death penalty — and that's a big if — I think it would be about a different population," the senator added.
Jason Gibbs, spokesman for Gov. James Douglas, said he had not discussed the issue of imposing the death penalty on crack and heroin dealers with the governor. But, he added, Douglas would oppose legalization of marijuana. "He's not unalterably opposed to the death penalty, but he doesn't have any plans to introduce it. There are some circumstances he would support a death penalty, but I'm not sure this is among them," Gibbs said. "Marijuana is a gateway drug for some folks, so he would not support legalization." Gibbs was referring to the view of some that marijuana is a "gateway drug" because it is the first step toward more serious drug usage and addictions.
"The governor certainly has no appreciation or respect for anyone who seeks to poison another individual for profit," Gibbs added.
He said Douglas does support a registry for those convicted of dealing hard-core drugs, such as crack and heroin. "That's a measure he would certainly support."
Lauzon said he had spoken with some lawmakers about the possibility of introducing legislation to legalize marijuana and impose the death penalty on serious dealers.
Their response was somewhat cool, he said. "They listen politely. I would like to have a statewide conversation. The conversation I'd like to start with is 'How are we doing?' Are we happy with our progress in the war on drugs? What are we doing in Vermont with regard to the war on drugs?" Lauzon said. "Maybe we start in Barre."
Although the call for a drug-related death penalty is unusual, this is not the first time during this legislative session that a call for legalization of marijuana has been publicly discussed.
Windsor County State's Attorney Robert Sand put forward the idea in a recent opinion piece in The Times Argus and Rutland Herald, calling for the decriminalization and regulation of marijuana use. Sand's proposal drew criticism from Vermont Public Safety Commissioner Kerry Sleeper. The focus on Vermont's rising drug problem has intensified in recent weeks, however, with federal, state and local law enforcement on Tuesday joining forces to crack down on a rash of armed robberies, home invasions and personal assaults they believe are linked to illegal drug activity in the state.
Lauzon said he would call for a public forum on the subject in late April.
He acknowledged that his call for the death penalty sounded harsh, but said he had attended the funeral of a young person who died as a result of a drug overdose.
"When you go to a service and look at the parents of a young man … who just lost a son … it's not good. It's not good," he said. These dealers are murderers, he added. "If you put a gun to someone's head, it's murder. How is this so different?"
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 TurricaN
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: veggie]
#6608220 - 02/25/07 09:19 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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"If you put a gun to someone's head, it's murder. How is this so different?"
It's quite different. Taking a drug is an entirely voluntary act.
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JackthaTripper
MSME!
Registered: 01/29/07
Posts: 2,454
Loc: Mind Exploration
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 Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: veggie]
#6608525 - 02/25/07 11:24 AM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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I defiantly agree with the legalization of marijuana part, however it seems very severe to impose the death penalty for any drug offense. With that said I see a clear distinction between different types of drugs due to the varying degree of detrimental effects they have on people. For the most part I see ganja as a relatively benign and harmless HERB that is virtually non-addictive. I believe it also can be a very useful tool if not abused, with the potential to heal this sick world in which we currently reside. The same can be said for shrooms.
I cannot say the same for other drugs like crack and heroin. They may have some benefits at first but most people cannot maintain a productive life when they are used in excess, and society as a whole is negatively affected.
It does seem like a promising concept; to give the people an alternative to addicting pharmaceuticals, alcohol and tobacco to have a release in this stressful life. Imagine everyone (even the poor and homeless) having access to growing their own marijuana. I bet the number of people using these other legal but more harmful substances would drop. I bet crime would drop, especially drug related crimes, along with crimes associated with alcohol abuse.
Of course there would be those that would still want to use crack, heroin, meth... ect, but we could put out ACCURATE information to society and use the tax money generated from the pot/shrooms to fund rehab centers and hospital programs for registered attics. The death penalty idea way is to far out there for me though.
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Come on breakthrough with me...such wonders terrify the soul...it's real no need to question...knowledge infiltrates the host
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TrancedShroom
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: JackthaTripper]
#6608715 - 02/25/07 12:32 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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Heres an exception to that death penalty. I believe they should be put to death if and only if they commit a drug related murder. No waiting in line, just kill them.
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Sheepish
Registered: 04/02/02
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Loc: Exile
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 Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: TrancedShroom]
#6608885 - 02/25/07 01:30 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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There's not much diference between normal murder and drug related murder.
The mayor seems to miss the point. Yes, the drug war isn't working. So he's going to impose a Catch 22 situation which would make matters worst. Legal drugs have controls and age limits. That way you eliminate scum who will deal to young children with no thought but for their profit.
Besides, the death penalty has done sweet fuck all to get rid of murder in the US. It's not a deterrant for people who are absolutely determined to do this.
EDIT: "The governor certainly has no appreciation or respect for anyone who seeks to poison another individual for profit," Gibbs added.
Oh, so he hates tobacco shops and liquor store owners?
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Going away for a while.
Edited by Sheepish (02/25/07 01:32 PM)
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Hix
Animal Mother
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: Sheepish]
#6610017 - 02/25/07 06:39 PM (5 years, 3 months ago) |
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The death penalty for hard drug dealers is going way too far. He's got a bit of thinking to do before saying shit like that... Go ahead and legalize pot though!!! Good luck vermont!
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kake
The answer to1984 is 1776.
Registered: 05/06/99
Posts: 2,778
Loc: The 66th harmonic
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: Hix]
#6611101 - 02/25/07 10:45 PM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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Well, think about how many people WOULDNT sell heroin/crack anymore if they were faced with the death penalty.
I'm not saying its fair, but it would work. But I think the problem is this: most people selling heroin/crack probably have no idea how long they'd go to jail for, and therefore, they have cloudy judgement. "Death penalty" is so harsh, so defined, and so absolute, it would be easy to dissuade.
Drug dealers are not violent offenders necessarily. I don't think they ought to be put in jail at all... but if they must be thrown into the "Correctional" system, why not have them do community service, etc.? Throwing them in jail is a waste of your and my tax money.
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The answer to 1984 is 1776.
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Koala Koolio
TTAGGGTTAGGGTTAGGGTTAGGG
Registered: 01/07/04
Posts: 7,752
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: kake]
#6611178 - 02/25/07 11:22 PM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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You're absolutely right. But...
Think about how many people wouldn't steal batteries if they enforced the death penalty.
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You're not like the others. You like the same things I do. Wax paper, boiled football leather... dog breath. We're not hitch-hiking anymore, we're riding!
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EntheogenicPeace
Scholar
Registered: 10/04/05
Posts: 3,448
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: veggie]
#6612246 - 02/26/07 10:47 AM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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[These dealers are murderers, he added. "If you put a gun to someone's head, it's murder. How is this so different?"]
I wonder if he feels the same way about tobacco companies & their dealers?
["People who are dealing crack and dealing heroin have zero social value and should be put to death."]
I fully agree with this enlightened man's logic. This is a great staring point, but let's not forget...
Mentally handicapped people have zero social value and should be put to death.
Homeless people have zero social value and should be put to death.
{insert whoever you're prejudiced against} have zero social value and should be put to death.
Too bad this guy wasn't a mayor in Nazi Germany. But considering where the U.$. is headed, he may get his chance after all to send "undesirables" to concentration camps.
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Every part of this country is sacred to my people. Every hillside, every valley, every plain and grove has been hallowed by some fond memory or some sad experience of my tribe.
Even the rocks... as they swelter in the sun along the silent seashore in solemn grandeur thrill with memories of past events... and the very dust under your feet responds more lovingly to our footsteps than to yours, because it is the ashes of our ancestors, and our bare feet are conscious of the sympathetic touch, for the soil is rich with the life of our kindred.
And when the last red man shall have perished from the earth and his memory among white men shall have become a myth, these shores shall swarm with the invisible dead of my tribe.
- Chief Seattle
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fastfred
Old Hand
Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,242
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
#6613671 - 02/26/07 05:32 PM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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Installing the death penalty would put a quick end to the drug war at least....
With every drug dealer going out in a hail of bullets, rather than face the death penalty, we'd soon be out of cops!
-FF
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: veggie]
#6615667 - 02/27/07 04:17 AM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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> he hoped the Legislature would consider imposing the death penalty on convicted crack and heroin dealers, and to legalize marijuana.
Another case of "my drug is better than you drug"... *sigh*
When will they realize that prohibition doesn't work... it is my body and you have no more right to tell me what I can put in to my body than I have telling you what you can put in to yours...
> With every drug dealer going out in a hail of bullets, rather than face the death penalty, we'd soon be out of cops!
Exactly. I would much rather have cops arresting violent criminals such as rapist, murderers, robbers, etc, than wasting their life because some career politician needs a few more votes for the upcoming election.
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Just another spore in the wind.
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chemiKalz
u r tripp0r?
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: veggie]
#6615960 - 02/27/07 07:28 AM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think they should legalize crack and heroin, and put the pot smokers to death. 
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Disco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR
Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,590
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: veggie]
#6615976 - 02/27/07 07:36 AM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
veggie said:
Lauzon was quoted in The Times Argus' Saturday edition saying, "People who are dealing crack and dealing heroin have zero social value and should be put to death."
People who poison an already poisoned society with such remarks have far less value than a crack dealer and should, according to their own words, be put to death. I am better than this man tho, and I pity him because he is a wretch, and so I would not put him to death. If I was like him tho, a murderer (yes, someone who puts people to death is a murderer, and someone who desires to do so is a murderer at heart), he would be someone needing to be put to death.
Quote:
"What social value do they have? They are dealing crack and heroin to young people, knowing full well what the effects will be," the mayor said. "What purpose do they serve in society other than to destroy lives, to destroy families?"
They provide a valuable and valid service, unfortunately they don't control what those they sell their goods to will do with it.
Quote:
"When you go to a service and look at the parents of a young man … who just lost a son … it's not good. It's not good," he said. These dealers are murderers, he added. "If you put a gun to someone's head, it's murder. How is this so different?"
In the same sense that any company who manufactures a car that a driver has crashed and died in are murderers.
This person is stupid in the same sense that he is not smart.
Edited by Disco Cat (02/27/07 08:37 AM)
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WhiskeyClone
Not here
Registered: 06/25/01
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Loc: Longitudinal Center of Ca...
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: veggie]
#6616027 - 02/27/07 08:09 AM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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Mayors are usually idiots.
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Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man. For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire. Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.
~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"
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white_noise
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: WhiskeyClone]
#6616874 - 02/27/07 01:05 PM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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I like this mayor!
He's not scared to speak out like most officials are. Granted, he didn't think through the death penalty and its implications, also his views on drug dealers is sterotypcal, but at least people listen to him because of his position, and he has created a point of interest when it could have never been brought to light.
Edited by white_noise (02/27/07 01:07 PM)
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mattymonkey
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: veggie]
#6617297 - 02/27/07 03:17 PM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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I really wish he would have stated these two things in separate announcements. While legalization is awesome, the death-penalty thing just makes him sound really un-credible.
Heres to vermont and at least getting the idea of legalizing maryjane out there! Thanks VT!
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"listening for the secret.. searching for the sound.."
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oppression
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: mattymonkey]
#6617452 - 02/27/07 04:07 PM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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I dont like meth opiates crack or cocaine, but the fact that I dont like those things and will not do them doesnt mean that other ppl should be imprisoned or put to death for doing them or selling them. I guess what Im sayin in short is I dont care what other ppl do in there houses just as long as they stay the FUCK outta mine. On a side note do we really want to be giving the government more power to put ppl to death I mean these are the same ppl that pay 400 bucks for a hammer, should we really be entrusting them with that kind of responsibility?
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‘Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or ill, it teaches the whole people by its example.’"
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero
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Loc: Caribbean
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: white_noise]
#6619430 - 02/28/07 02:20 AM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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> He's not scared to speak out like most officials are.
It has less to do with fear and more to do with intelligence. Most people are smart enought to keep their inbred-like ignorance out of the public light...
> should we really be entrusting them with that kind of responsibility?
Why not. We already let them decide when we can't die and we already let them decide what we cannot put into our bodies... is it that far of a step to let them decide when we should die? (sarcasm)
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Just another spore in the wind.
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Disco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR
Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,590
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Re: Mayor calls for marijuana legalization, death penalty for hard drug dealers [VT] [Re: Seuss]
#6620438 - 02/28/07 12:31 PM (5 years, 2 months ago) |
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