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 gettinjiggywithit
jiggy
 
Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
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 The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. 
#4788224 - 10/11/05 04:20 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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These are some big changes for the catholic church. Considering many past discussions here, I thought a good handful would appreciate this news of change.
This is in the UK news,
Quote:
The Times October 05, 2005
Catholic Church no longer swears by truth of the Bible
By Ruth Gledhill, Religion Correspondent
THE hierarchy of the Roman Catholic Church has published a teaching document instructing the faithful that some parts of the Bible are not actually true.
The Catholic bishops of England, Wales and Scotland are warning their five million worshippers, as well as any others drawn to the study of scripture, that they should not expect ?total accuracy? from the Bible.
?We should not expect to find in Scripture full scientific accuracy or complete historical precision,? they say in The Gift of Scripture.
The document is timely, coming as it does amid the rise of the religious Right, in particular in the US.
Some Christians want a literal interpretation of the story of creation, as told in Genesis, taught alongside Darwin?s theory of evolution in schools, believing ?intelligent design? to be an equally plausible theory of how the world began.
But the first 11 chapters of Genesis, in which two different and at times conflicting stories of creation are told, are among those that this country?s Catholic bishops insist cannot be ?historical?. At most, they say, they may contain ?historical traces?.
The document shows how far the Catholic Church has come since the 17th century, when Galileo was condemned as a heretic for flouting a near-universal belief in the divine inspiration of the Bible by advocating the Copernican view of the solar system. Only a century ago, Pope Pius X condemned Modernist Catholic scholars who adapted historical-critical methods of analysing ancient literature to the Bible.
In the document, the bishops acknowledge their debt to biblical scholars. They say the Bible must be approached in the knowledge that it is ?God?s word expressed in human language? and that proper acknowledgement should be given both to the word of God and its human dimensions.
They say the Church must offer the gospel in ways ?appropriate to changing times, intelligible and attractive to our contemporaries?.
The Bible is true in passages relating to human salvation, they say, but continue: ?We should not expect total accuracy from the Bible in other, secular matters.?
They go on to condemn fundamentalism for its ?intransigent intolerance? and to warn of ?significant dangers? involved in a fundamentalist approach.
?Such an approach is dangerous, for example, when people of one nation or group see in the Bible a mandate for their own superiority, and even consider themselves permitted by the Bible to use violence against others.?
Of the notorious anti-Jewish curse in Matthew 27:25, ?His blood be on us and on our children?, a passage used to justify centuries of anti-Semitism, the bishops say these and other words must never be used again as a pretext to treat Jewish people with contempt. Describing this passage as an example of dramatic exaggeration, the bishops say they have had ?tragic consequences? in encouraging hatred and persecution. ?The attitudes and language of first-century quarrels between Jews and Jewish Christians should never again be emulated in relations between Jews and Christians.?
As examples of passages not to be taken literally, the bishops cite the early chapters of Genesis, comparing them with early creation legends from other cultures, especially from the ancient East. The bishops say it is clear that the primary purpose of these chapters was to provide religious teaching and that they could not be described as historical writing.
Similarly, they refute the apocalyptic prophecies of Revelation, the last book of the Christian Bible, in which the writer describes the work of the risen Jesus, the death of the Beast and the wedding feast of Christ the Lamb.
The bishops say: ?Such symbolic language must be respected for what it is, and is not to be interpreted literally. We should not expect to discover in this book details about the end of the world, about how many will be saved and about when the end will come.?
In their foreword to the teaching document, the two most senior Catholics of the land, Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O?Connor, Archbishop of Westminster, and Cardinal Keith O?Brien, Archbishop of St Andrew?s and Edinburgh, explain its context.
They say people today are searching for what is worthwhile, what has real value, what can be trusted and what is really true.
The new teaching has been issued as part of the 40th anniversary celebrations of Dei Verbum, the Second Vatican Council document explaining the place of Scripture in revelation. In the past 40 years, Catholics have learnt more than ever before to cherish the Bible. ?We have rediscovered the Bible as a precious treasure, both ancient and ever new.?
A Christian charity is sending a film about the Christmas story to every primary school in Britain after hearing of a young boy who asked his teacher why Mary and Joseph had named their baby after a swear word. The Breakout Trust raised ?200,000 to make the 30-minute animated film, It?s a Boy. Steve Legg, head of the charity, said: ?There are over 12 million children in the UK and only 756,000 of them go to church regularly.
That leaves a staggering number who are probably not receiving basic Christian teaching.?
BELIEVE IT OR NOT
UNTRUE
Genesis ii, 21-22
So the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and while he slept he took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh; and the rib which the Lord God had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man
Genesis iii, 16
God said to the woman [after she was beguiled by the serpent]: ?I will greatly multiply your pain in childbearing; in pain you shall bring forth children, yet your desire shall be for your husband, and he shall rule over you.?
Matthew xxvii, 25
The words of the crowd: ?His blood be on us and on our children.?
Revelation xix,20
And the beast was captured, and with it the false prophet who in its presence had worked the signs by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who worshipped its image. These two were thrown alive into the lake of fire that burns with brimstone.?
TRUE
Exodus iii, 14
God reveals himself to Moses as: ?I am who I am.?
Leviticus xxvi,12
?I will be your God, and you shall be my people.?
Exodus xx,1-17
The Ten Commandments
Matthew v,7
The Sermon on the Mount
Mark viii,29
Peter declares Jesus to be the Christ
Luke i
The Virgin Birth
John xx,28
Proof of bodily resurrection
JOIN THE DEBATE
www.timesonline.co.uk/debate
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Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Huehuecoyotl
Stranger
Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,158
Loc: On the Border
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
#4788246 - 10/11/05 04:26 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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Cool. It looks like they might finally grow up and be a mature religion. Why did this take 1000 years? I guess there is no hope of the religious right coming around for another 950 years if we are following the same scale.
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Maybe there is no Heaven. Maybe this is all pure gibberish — a product of the demented imagination of a lazy drunken hillbilly with a heart full of hate who has found a way to live out where the real winds blow — to sleep late, have fun, get wild, drink whiskey, and drive fast on empty streets with nothing in mind except falling in love and not getting arrested...
--HST
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gettinjiggywithit
jiggy
Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
#4788530 - 10/11/05 05:36 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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I made the post title reflective of the first sentence of the article but almost titled this, The Catholic Church Grows Up, like how you saw it. I think the scales will become exponentially shorter.
It read like good news and positive change for the globe to me.
If the catholic church can come around like this, anything can happen. Maybe this should've gone in woods miracle post.
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Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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 dr0mni
My Own Messiah
Registered: 08/21/04
Posts: 2,921
Loc: USF Tampa, Fl
Last seen: 4 years, 11 months
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
#4788818 - 10/11/05 06:44 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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 >> "We're sorry..."
 >> "I forgive you"
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gettinjiggywithit
jiggy
Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: dr0mni]
#4789063 - 10/11/05 07:21 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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 Nice one!
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Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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GeoMcCheeseburgers
one-eyed willie
Registered: 07/08/03
Posts: 39,203
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
#4791851 - 10/12/05 07:47 AM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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..
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m00nshine is currently vacationing in Maui. Rumor has it he got rolled by drunken natives and is currently prostituting himself in order to pay for airfare back to the mainland but he's having trouble juggling a hairon addiction. He won't be back for a long while.
Edited by matt (08/31/07 04:35 PM)
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Prosgeopax
Jaded, yethopeful?
Registered: 01/28/05
Posts: 1,258
Loc: Appearing at a mall near ...
Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
#4791896 - 10/12/05 08:15 AM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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This kind of thought coming from Catholics is nothing new. When I went to Catholic High School (class of 79) we were taught evolution and physics. The Old Testament was looked upon as a Jewish history book and a record of Jewish myths. We were taught that the stories in the bible were intended for an illiterate tribal people who could not fathom the intricacies of scientific explanations, they were meant to illustrate points and should not be taken literally.
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Money doesn't grow on trees, but deficits do grow under Bushes.
You can accept, reject, or examine and test any new idea that comes to you. The wise man chooses the third way.
- Tom Willhite
Disclaimer: I reserve the right to change my opinions should I become aware of additional facts, the falsification of information or different perspectives. Articles written by others which I post may not necessarily reflect my opinions in part or in whole, my opinions may be in direct opposition, the topic may be one on which I have yet to formulate an opinion or have doubts about, an article may be posted solely with the intent to stimulate discussion or contemplation.
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MJF
Human Being
Registered: 06/27/05
Posts: 1,810
Loc: Between 15 and 45 degrees...
Last seen: 3 years, 3 days
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: Prosgeopax]
#4792365 - 10/12/05 10:18 AM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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Is this receiving any media coverage in the states?
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gettinjiggywithit
jiggy
Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: GeoMcCheeseburgers]
#4792870 - 10/12/05 12:13 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
mattzdope said:
Personally I think it's pretty sad and a show of weakening beliefs that the Catholic church is changing to accommodate others.
Well, you can look at it that way, as being weak to compromise and accommodate OR you can see it as a Darwinism strength. They are also adapting to changing environments so they can ensure their survival.
Sometimes, adapting to change is a very intelligent thing to do to keep one strong and fit.
If the Old Testament and Book of Revelations of the Bible was also intended to be more metaphorical and symbolic then literal, they really are not giving into anything that wasn't already a given.
This is ultimately good, that more such comments are being made public. If it gets to the point, where the whole of the church and those who learn about it, even present hell and the devil, with the same, metaphorical and symbolic stance that can change a lot of the fear and dogmatic thinking that has been associated with the church and religion.
With more and more fear and dogmatic thinking removed from religion and societies view of it, their is bound to be more peace and acceptance where there was ignorance and conflict.
I experienced that article as being reflective of an element of positive change for the planet.
I was raised in a strict catholic environment, and had become an adult who pulled away harshly and bashed Catholicism when I could for it's fear filled dogmatic teachings. I even use to make comments in S&P that I thought all Bibles should be burned and churches crumbled to the ground.
Then, I had a change of heart after Katrina. I saw on the news, how all of these Christian churches had better organized themselves to get supplies, help and shelter for those in need better then our own government did. They had delivery stations set up for supply drop offs and rules that said all incoming had to be trucked out to areas of need every 3 hours. No red tape or bureaucracy. They moved efficiently and quick and served many.
They were all volunteering their time and resources to serve communities of people, they never met, regardless of race or religion and they had their act together with no agenda apparent other then to serve others with no monetary compensation.
Though I still have personal issues with suffering still caused by some of it's ideologies related to abortion, birth control, divorce, gay love, elitism, and fear of a God, I think we will see changes there as well in the coming times. There are many who call themselves Christians who don't agree with those judgmental or oppressive ideologies either.
I'll be happy with any positive change or good I see coming from it these days. I thought some others might be happy with seeing more of it too which is why, I thought to post that article.
What else can I say? For me to start seeing the good coming out of it where I only chose to see bad before , I think is a step in a better direction for myself anyway. It feels better.
It's like, even though I left the church at 16 when my parents really couldn't keep me to it, any negativity or resentment I had towards it allowed for it to still have a hold on me and I am 37.
It'll let go of me when I let go of the bad in it.
Is this spirituality stuff not alot about freedom and liberation of the soul and mind from its entrapments? Isn't that really the ticket out of hell and into heaven, here and now, letting go of all the hate, anger, fear and judgment in our hearts?
Until I can do that, I am in no better place or state then the things I judged the church being wrong for.
Still working at it.........day by day 
 
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Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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Billyblastoff
Psychoactivepredator
Registered: 04/20/01
Posts: 725
Loc: Down these mean city stre...
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
#4793524 - 10/12/05 02:31 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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I knew there was a good reason why I was happy I went to public school.
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"Imagination is more important than knowledge. For while knowledge defines all we currently know and understand, imagination points to all we might yet discover and create."
"There is a wealth of information built into us, tucked away in the genetic material in every one of our cells. The psychedelic drugs allow exploration of this interior world, and insights into its nature."
Tell me something good then I might agree with you....the Smithereens
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GeoMcCheeseburgers
one-eyed willie
Registered: 07/08/03
Posts: 39,203
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
#4794774 - 10/12/05 06:15 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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..
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m00nshine is currently vacationing in Maui. Rumor has it he got rolled by drunken natives and is currently prostituting himself in order to pay for airfare back to the mainland but he's having trouble juggling a hairon addiction. He won't be back for a long while.
Edited by matt (08/31/07 04:34 PM)
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MJF
Human Being
Registered: 06/27/05
Posts: 1,810
Loc: Between 15 and 45 degrees...
Last seen: 3 years, 3 days
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: GeoMcCheeseburgers]
#4794784 - 10/12/05 06:17 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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But they will die. The institution lives longer than people.
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GeoMcCheeseburgers
one-eyed willie
Registered: 07/08/03
Posts: 39,203
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: MJF]
#4794803 - 10/12/05 06:22 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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';;
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m00nshine is currently vacationing in Maui. Rumor has it he got rolled by drunken natives and is currently prostituting himself in order to pay for airfare back to the mainland but he's having trouble juggling a hairon addiction. He won't be back for a long while.
Edited by matt (08/31/07 04:35 PM)
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Moonshoe
Registered: 05/28/04
Posts: 3,783
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 6 months, 29 days
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
#4795062 - 10/12/05 07:20 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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progress.
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MJF
Human Being
Registered: 06/27/05
Posts: 1,810
Loc: Between 15 and 45 degrees...
Last seen: 3 years, 3 days
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: GeoMcCheeseburgers]
#4795304 - 10/12/05 08:02 PM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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to not tell the truth would be blasphemous....
to fix what is wrong is what God would want us to do. Plus the bible and its history is pretty shady.
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fireworks_god
SexyButt McDanger
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: GeoMcCheeseburgers]
#4797002 - 10/13/05 04:41 AM (6 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
mattzdope said:
Some people are just set in their ways and there is nothing wrong with this. It shows strength in my eyes that they would not change their belief system to accomodate others when there really is no proof about the "after life".
It shows inflexibility and stubborness in my eyes to hold such "strong" beliefs when there is nothing to base them on anyways, just as you have stated. True strength doesn't resemble being a brick. True strength is openness to change and adaptability, to not hold beliefs in something when there is no justification.
The only thing that will result from steadfastly holding such beliefs as truth when the world around you naturally changes as a result of reality is that such stubbornness serves as an effective catalyst for change away from such belief in others. The person will die and the world will continue its change unabated, if not propelled further. 
 
Peace. 
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If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
  
 
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NariusFractal
Sat Chit Ananda
Registered: 12/19/02
Posts: 786
Loc: USA
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: fireworks_god]
#5647435 - 05/18/06 06:18 PM (6 years, 10 days ago) |
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If you believe in the ideas of evolution, it is easy to see that even religions themselves evolve. Religions are a dynamic process just like anything else in the universe -- especially on a human being's time scale.
Christianity is only 2000 some years old itself! Of course, it is some sort of offspring of Judaism and who knows what. Maybe Gentiles? And in those 2000 years,
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You are the microcosm of the macrocosm.
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niteowl
GrandPaw
Registered: 07/01/03
Posts: 16,291
Loc: 
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: GeoMcCheeseburgers]
#5648815 - 05/19/06 12:30 AM (6 years, 10 days ago) |
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Quote:
mattzdope said:
However they (the Roman Catholic church) have a belief system about things that is ages old and now they are changing that because they are intimidated by science.
One of the best lectures I have seen, on cosmology and the evolution of life, came from a Catholic Priest.
All religions evolve.
The old, hard-liners die off, and new ideas and different interpretations come into play.
This has to happen or religion itself will become extinct.
Believe it or not, organized religion is nothing more than big business. And businesses have to change with the times in order to prosper and grow.
Social Evolution in action.
Quote:
If there is a god are they not being blasphemous?
Trying to fully understand the true meaning of God is blasphemous?
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Live for the moment you are in nowDon't be bogged down by your pastDon't be afraid of what lies in your future
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gettinjiggywithit
jiggy
Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
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Re: The Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of the Bible. [Re: niteowl]
#5648939 - 05/19/06 01:24 AM (6 years, 10 days ago) |
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Nite owl, mattz may not see your reply to him if he doesn't come by here anymore.
I posted this last October. It got bumped today.
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Ahuwale ka nane huna.
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