|
 Mr. Bojangles
Breathe In
Registered: 04/08/08
Posts: 1,534
Loc: The Dirty
Last seen: 13 days, 15 hours
|
 Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project 
#15662443 - 01/13/12 10:06 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
So my room mate is part of a research group at my alma mater, focusing on sustainable food sources in communities. There's a pretty big project that's being undertaken that's working to integrate aquaculture, horticulture, and now fungiculture. Aquaculture and horticulture are obviously getting combined via aquaponics. What we're charged with is working up a design for the mycology portion. The guy originally pushing for/planning it died this past summer and I'm the only person left with any mycology experience. I'm fairly new to the edibles and have been away from the hobby for a year or two. So I'm digging through as much stuff as I can find.
This is in Georgia and they want to grow oysters.
There is already a 20 x 40' slab of concrete laid for a foundation. And I'm seeing this along the lines RogerRabbit's awesome shipping container idea. The recently deceased drew up a similar idea and we want to keep somewhat in line with his design. Here it is: http://www.flickr.com/photos/arkfab/5575039167/in/photostream/
We're thinking two 8 x 40' concrete boxes as the base...one side for colonization, one for fruiting. The greenhouse, instead of being terraced on the side like in the illustrations, is looking to be put on top of the concrete mushroom houses. I'm thinking a good amount of earth needs to be moved to cover these up and insulate them during the summer months (this is in the middle of Atlanta)...and the Greenhouse will sit on top of that earth, not the concrete itself. The reason they want to put the greenhouse on top is to more easily pump the CO2 the mushies produce into the aquaculture greenhouse above for the plants.
What I'm looking for from the shroomery community is design flaws/engineering problems, and ideas on how to make this thing badass. We have 40 or so senior capstone engineering students and PhD's at our disposal...they just need ideas. They will figure shit out. The point is to make this as ideal as possible with the restraints being money (we have a lot, but can't really be frivolous), space (we can't go too far beyond our 20 x 40' limit), and power (thing thing is to be solely powered by photovoltaic cells). Don't worry about the power part...we'll leave that to the engineers...but if anyone has any input on making such a system as ideal as possible I'd greatly appreciate it!
Thanks for reading, if you have any other questions feel free to ask...I tried to keep this [somewhat] short.
--------------------
"It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong."
-Fracois Marie Voltaire
|
 Javadog
Continuing along
Registered: 05/03/10
Posts: 7,273
Loc: USA 
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Mr. Bojangles]
#15662715 - 01/13/12 11:05 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Wow, this is a tad beyond me, but very interesting.
Well...
Are you planning to grow warm lovers too? It looks like
you are committing to a colder Oyster world.
Have you worked out your sources for bulk substrates?
I look forward to how this evolves.
Good luck,
JD
--------------------
Boyd Rice told my brother that life is a corny pack of freesakes
Myco-tek.org
|
Mr. Bojangles
Breathe In
Registered: 04/08/08
Posts: 1,534
Loc: The Dirty
Last seen: 13 days, 15 hours
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Javadog]
#15662841 - 01/13/12 11:36 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Most likely straw logs. Horizontal colonization in one container and vertical fruiting in the other. Would that be the best way to go about growing in something this big? There's lots of cheap straw in the surrounding area. Pine straw wouldn't work, would it? Even more of that...
What are some good warm lovers? And how warm is warm? ATL gets pretty damn hot in the summer (upper 90's to 100), so we're pretty much counting on insulating this somewhat.
--------------------
"It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong."
-Fracois Marie Voltaire
|
Javadog
Continuing along
Registered: 05/03/10
Posts: 7,273
Loc: USA
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Mr. Bojangles]
#15662867 - 01/13/12 11:46 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Yes, the heat issue is what made me think of it.
Warm lovers include Paddy Straw, Blazei, SRA, Reishi
...but look up the specifics.
Others will chime in if I err.
Take care,
JD
--------------------
Boyd Rice told my brother that life is a corny pack of freesakes
Myco-tek.org
|
Greenvalley
PRS
Registered: 06/16/10
Posts: 2,005
Loc: Why not?
Last seen: 22 hours, 30 minutes
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Mr. Bojangles]
#15662892 - 01/13/12 11:54 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
This is amazing, Id love to build something like this some day, keep this updated with the end results plese.
For ideas:
If I had enough space I would have a set up similar to this so that when one myc block is spent you can easily interchange it for a new one, instead of have to deal with a whole straw log as tall as me and it might be easier to regulate temp like that too.
and why not combine some of the plants with the fungi? Paul stamets has a lot to say about that.
http://www.fungi.com/mycotech/permaculture.html
Good Luck
--------------------
  
I am looking for land. 5-20 acres for 10-20,000. Can you help? do you know of any land for sale? do you have some for sale? Would you like to help and or be part of this? I want to develop it into a permaculture food forest. Any help would be much appreciated. 
|
Mr. Bojangles
Breathe In
Registered: 04/08/08
Posts: 1,534
Loc: The Dirty
Last seen: 13 days, 15 hours
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Greenvalley]
#15663073 - 01/14/12 12:43 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
and why not combine some of the plants with the fungi? Paul stamets has a lot to say about that.
http://www.fungi.com/mycotech/permaculture.html
Ha! It's pretty sweet that he says the stuff about oysters and putting the CO2 into a greenhouse...pretty much the gist of this project 
Since it's an aquaponics setup there's not too much need for anything with the plants. No soil involved, the fish waste and CO2 provide everything. But we are planning on a hefty compost pile for vermaculture and to feed the fish with...so it's definitely good stuff there.
Is that picture basically of a bunch of straw logs, just a quarter of the size?
--------------------
"It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong."
-Fracois Marie Voltaire
|
Greenvalley
PRS
Registered: 06/16/10
Posts: 2,005
Loc: Why not?
Last seen: 22 hours, 30 minutes
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Mr. Bojangles]
#15663090 - 01/14/12 12:47 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Mr. Bojangles said:
Is that picture basically of a bunch of straw logs, just a quarter of the size?
yes
--------------------
I am looking for land. 5-20 acres for 10-20,000. Can you help? do you know of any land for sale? do you have some for sale? Would you like to help and or be part of this? I want to develop it into a permaculture food forest. Any help would be much appreciated.
|
Mr. Bojangles
Breathe In
Registered: 04/08/08
Posts: 1,534
Loc: The Dirty
Last seen: 13 days, 15 hours
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Greenvalley]
#15663096 - 01/14/12 12:50 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Sweet...I'll keep that one in mind...less time to colonize too, I presume. I'll test out both methods on some mini-grows of my own to see how it affects yield.
--------------------
"It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong."
-Fracois Marie Voltaire
|
Greenvalley
PRS
Registered: 06/16/10
Posts: 2,005
Loc: Why not?
Last seen: 22 hours, 30 minutes
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Mr. Bojangles]
#15663116 - 01/14/12 12:54 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
less time to colonize, and im not 100% sure about this but more surface area can lead to higher yields.
--------------------
I am looking for land. 5-20 acres for 10-20,000. Can you help? do you know of any land for sale? do you have some for sale? Would you like to help and or be part of this? I want to develop it into a permaculture food forest. Any help would be much appreciated.
|
Aleon
666
Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 442
Loc: WI, USA
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Greenvalley]
#15663513 - 01/14/12 02:45 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Hey, Mr Bo; i have run a small aquaponics setup, and now have a few small aquaculture systems running. IMO the best thing the fungi contribute besides CO2 for the plants which you already stated, is that the fish, at least my tilapia, eat mycelium. My fish dont really like shiitake, but they love oyster and king oyster. Also they eat the stems too, if chopped up. I have lots of ideas for integrating aquaponics with a mushroom farm, but i would like to test them for viability before suggesting anything.
ONe side note about the aquaponics part, go with the most reliable method, the UVI DWC raft style. Trust me, the other styles(ebb and flow specifically) suck in comparison, i have tried. I have pictures of my old AP setup here on the shroomery, take a look.
Fun project, keep us updated.
--------------------
"And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom."
~Anais Nin~
“Serenity is not peace outside of the storm, but peace within the storm.”
~Zoltar~
Everything we have ever been told is a lie.
Anybody who tells you something is lying, even me.
Seek the truth.
|
bangarang420
The Mellow Mushroom
Registered: 09/16/10
Posts: 213
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Greenvalley]
#15663551 - 01/14/12 02:54 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Wow this is quite an awesome project!
Some mushrooms would grow great on your compost pile and help with your closed loop system to reduce waste. Shaggy mane and SRA come to mind, but I'm sure others here can talk from their experiences.
There are warmer fruiting oysters like Pink Oysters that colonize quite fast, but go with the list Java mentioned I think they tolerate heat more so.
--------------------
If in doubt, search posts out
|
SOUTHERN
NAIL DRIVER
Registered: 03/29/09
Posts: 823
Loc: south
Last seen: 2 hours, 7 minutes
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: bangarang420]
#15664160 - 01/14/12 09:39 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
WHERE IN GEORGIA R U .. I'm in bama.. this sounds really interesting..
so
r u looking to build something that lets u use all these things in one building vessel or whatever u call it..
does there need to be a connection between all three cultures(ex use plant waste to fruit mushrooms.)
r u trying to use the fish waste as fertilizer???
I"m just trying to get the overall goal in my head so i can think about it..
southern
|
LewDoja
mad $cientist
Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 154
Loc: pnw
Last seen: 7 days, 15 hours
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: SOUTHERN]
#15664311 - 01/14/12 10:47 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
marked
very interesting
|
Mr. Bojangles
Breathe In
Registered: 04/08/08
Posts: 1,534
Loc: The Dirty
Last seen: 13 days, 15 hours
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: SOUTHERN]
#15664603 - 01/14/12 12:17 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Sweet pics Aleon! That was a nice little setup you had going there Tilapia is the fish that we will be using as well, my room mate is pushing for Jade Perch but the rest of the team is set on Tilapia. Did you just feel them chopped up stems or do they like certain spent substrates as well? We're definitely going with the floating raft style. I can't remember how many we can fit but my room mate just sketched up the rough design we're thinking about so I'll see if I can upload it.
Quote:
SOUTHERN said:
WHERE IN GEORGIA R U .. I'm in bama.. this sounds really interesting..
so
r u looking to build something that lets u use all these things in one building vessel or whatever u call it..
does there need to be a connection between all three cultures(ex use plant waste to fruit mushrooms.)
r u trying to use the fish waste as fertilizer???
I"m just trying to get the overall goal in my head so i can think about it..
Smack dab in the middle of Atlanta.
We're not necessarily looking to put everything in one vessel but we are looking to make a cluster of vessels that all feed into one another in ways that maximize certain outputs/inputs (eg - CO2, fish waste).
There does need to be a connection between all 3, with the goal of reducing waste and using everything in the best way possible. Fish waste water from the tank will be pumped out to the plants, which absorb the nutrients they need (thus cleaning the water) and we pump the clean water back into the fish tank. The plant waste, added with whatever is user generated in the kitchen, will be combined in a compost pile mainly for vermaculture so we can use worm castings in more soil gardening applications. I know spent mushroom substrate is usually pretty good for compost piles, but does anyone know if red wrigglers can/will eat through that stuff?
The CO2 generated from the mushrooms will be ventilated out of the fruiting chamber and into the greenhouse for the plants who need CO2. And we're currently looking into recirculating the cleansed air back into the fruiting chamber, but that might take some experimenting to see how fast the CO2 content drops in the greenhouse...I don't want to starve the oysters of FAE in the name of a closed system.
--------------------
"It is dangerous to be right in matters on which the established authorities are wrong."
-Fracois Marie Voltaire
|
SOUTHERN
NAIL DRIVER
Registered: 03/29/09
Posts: 823
Loc: south
Last seen: 2 hours, 7 minutes
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Mr. Bojangles]
#15666775 - 01/14/12 09:30 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
i don't know how easy corn would be to make happen in that green house, but i know that oysters love it for spawn and substrate.... and i'm sure u could feed it to a fish.. like carp or mullet.. and dead fish emulsions is a great fertlizer.. just thinking out load..
|
NSF
Eager to learn
Registered: 01/27/11
Posts: 516
Last seen: 13 minutes, 4 seconds
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Aleon]
#15667116 - 01/14/12 11:12 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Aleon said:
Hey, Mr Bo; i have run a small aquaponics setup, and now have a few small aquaculture systems running. IMO the best thing the fungi contribute besides CO2 for the plants which you already stated, is that the fish, at least my tilapia, eat mycelium. My fish dont really like shiitake, but they love oyster and king oyster. Also they eat the stems too, if chopped up. I have lots of ideas for integrating aquaponics with a mushroom farm, but i would like to test them for viability before suggesting anything.
ONe side note about the aquaponics part, go with the most reliable method, the UVI DWC raft style. Trust me, the other styles(ebb and flow specifically) suck in comparison, i have tried. I have pictures of my old AP setup here on the shroomery, take a look.
Fun project, keep us updated.
Aleon, I checked out the pics and I like what I see. Although I have no idea what I'm actually looking at. What's this setup? What's flowing where? Why? Sorry, complete hydro/aquaponics newb.
--------------------
|
Javadog
Continuing along
Registered: 05/03/10
Posts: 7,273
Loc: USA
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: NSF]
#15667405 - 01/15/12 12:33 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Yeah...and what are those little probes testing?
(hanging down into the plants)
Hygrometer?
;0)
--------------------
Boyd Rice told my brother that life is a corny pack of freesakes
Myco-tek.org
|
the_hatter
half mad
Registered: 04/18/10
Posts: 580
Last seen: 7 hours, 10 minutes
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Javadog]
#15667508 - 01/15/12 01:02 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
this is awesome! inspiring stuff  cant wait to see how this unfolds 
--------------------
"Our endless days are numbered"
|
Aleon
666
Registered: 05/26/11
Posts: 442
Loc: WI, USA
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: NSF]
#15667775 - 01/15/12 02:06 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Mr. Bojangles said:
Sweet pics Aleon! That was a nice little setup you had going there Tilapia is the fish that we will be using as well, my room mate is pushing for Jade Perch but the rest of the team is set on Tilapia. Did you just feel them chopped up stems or do they like certain spent substrates as well? We're definitely going with the floating raft style. I can't remember how many we can fit but my room mate just sketched up the rough design we're thinking about so I'll see if I can upload it.
Jade Perch lol? What, are we in Australia. Go with tilapia, they can survive unbelievably poor situations. Then you could try something else, once you feel comfortable with aquaculture. Yeah i chopped up stems and they ate spent substrate or grain spawn. The funny thing is that some peoples tilapia will eat one thing, while another persons tilapia wont eat that same thing. You'll just have to experiment.
I would think spent substrate would be great for vermicomposting, though i have not tried it. Also, the main issue you must confront with using the CO2 produced by the mushrooms, is the high humidities required for the fungi to grow. This will cause mold and poor growth for your plants. You will need to dehumidify the air before the plants get it, or frequently mist the mushrooms, but keep the RH lower. I have done this with oysters outside on sunny, windy, dry days. They still grow when its dry as hell (low humidity) if you mist the actual mushrooms often. You create a humid "micro-climate" around the mushrooms, without raising the actual airs humidity. Just some ideas for you to think about.
Quote:
NSF said:
Aleon, I checked out the pics and I like what I see. Although I have no idea what I'm actually looking at. What's this setup? What's flowing where? Why? Sorry, complete hydro/aquaponics newb.
I will try to describe it as briefly as possible. The idea was to show how much food can be grown in a 9'x10' spare bedroom. I hate when people in the city or suburbs say they cant grow their own food cause they dont have enough space. Its BS, where there is a will there is a way. This setup could provide lots of fresh fish, and way more salad greens and herbs than even my partner and i can eat (i eat 2 huge salads a day normally).
It contained: 2 100gal fish tanks with the capacity of 25 full grown fish, or more of they are smaller. This water ran to a 4'x8' ebb and flow tray. Then it went into a 120gal sump tank(lowest point in the system). The sump has a pump in it which goes to the fish tanks, which then overflows into the ebb and flow tray via gravity. Also i have 88' of NFT channels going up the walls to use the side light produced by the HID's which were on light rails. The water for the NFT came from and returned to the sump tanks. For my seedling shelf, i had 4 2'x4' ebb and flow trays which the water was also fed and recycled from/to the sump tank. This was lit by T5 fluorescent strips, 2 or 4 per tray. The imputs were: H20, electricity, and fish feed (sometimes i would foliar spray with kelp). I pay an arm and a leg for the only organic certified fish feed that you can buy in quantities of less then 1000's of pounds. But knowing my fish arent fed GMO's makes it worth every penny. Plus i supplemented the feed with mushroom, plant waste, and composting worms to stretch it.
The meters dangling into the plant canopy is a temp and RH sensor.
--------------------
"And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom."
~Anais Nin~
“Serenity is not peace outside of the storm, but peace within the storm.”
~Zoltar~
Everything we have ever been told is a lie.
Anybody who tells you something is lying, even me.
Seek the truth.
|
tai haku
Stranger
Registered: 12/14/11
Posts: 3
Last seen: 10 months, 4 days
|
Re: Serious Sustainable Mushroom Project [Re: Aleon]
#15668187 - 01/15/12 05:09 AM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Aleon said:
Quote:
Mr. Bojangles said:
Sweet pics Aleon! That was a nice little setup you had going there Tilapia is the fish that we will be using as well, my room mate is pushing for Jade Perch but the rest of the team is set on Tilapia. Did you just feel them chopped up stems or do they like certain spent substrates as well? We're definitely going with the floating raft style. I can't remember how many we can fit but my room mate just sketched up the rough design we're thinking about so I'll see if I can upload it.
Jade Perch lol? What, are we in Australia. Go with tilapia, they can survive unbelievably poor situations. Then you could try something else, once you feel comfortable with aquaculture. Yeah i chopped up stems and they ate spent substrate or grain spawn. The funny thing is that some peoples tilapia will eat one thing, while another persons tilapia wont eat that same thing. You'll just have to experiment.
I'd agree with starting with tilapia to get the syetem working well. I think there are probably a load more species with more potential for you down the line in terms of profitability but there is so much info out there on tilapia and they are pretty indestructable so they're the obvious choice. What sort of size tanks are you planning?
I hope this goes well for you and the team. I subscribed to the original ArkFab a while back and remember the first update I got was the one announcing the sad death of the chap who did the drawings and designs. Very sad.
|
|
Images only 
Threaded
Previous
Index
Next
Shop for: 
Edit 
Reply 
