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 A Myco Journey
Mr. Myco
Registered: 05/01/10
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 Sclerotia producing mycelium types 
#15485533 - 12/08/11 02:15 PM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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Hi y'all.
Thought I would start a thread on sclerotia producing mycelium types.
What are your experiences on sclerotia producing strains and what type of mycelium works best via agar, as in rhizomorphic works best for production of fruit bodies. Has anybody observed better sclerotium production with other mycelial patterns?
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Workman
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Hmmm, well it seems like dark pigmented sectors on agar form sclerotia more often than purely white sectors. Sclerotia formation directly on agar is a good sign and you can grab the stone itself to transfer to a new plate. None of the sclerotia forming species have what I would consider rhizomorphic mycelium.
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 devilstone
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Registered: 08/15/11
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Re: Sclerotia producing mycelium types [Re: Workman]
#15513087 - 12/14/11 12:12 AM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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My experiences with sclerotia is limited to P. Galindoi.
I brought out 30+ sub-strains on PDA agar 4% from 3 separate MS syringes.
None of the dishes were very rhizomorphic, rather they were whispy and dense, with a leading edge of fine nearly invisible hairs. As each dish rounded the first 7 days of growth the yellow banding layer began to show. The first stone formations on the aggressive substrains began appearing around the 8th day. These stones were selected and plated as an attempt to achieve the closest thing to an isolate my skills and tools will provide me.
3 plates contaminated with trich, they were double wrapped and isolated for observation. They all pinned aggressively and attempted to fruit, the pins all occurred on the furthest edges of mycelium growth, near the point that the trich and mycelium decided to draw the line against each other. Fruiting ceased, and the trich and mycelium are still locked in stasis.. (4 months later)
I've found my most aggressive stone producers were from plates where the yellow banding layer was the widest. The substrain produces the same banding when plated onto other plates, so I know it has to be a genetic trait, or I would assume so anyways. When harvesting a growbag, the bulk of all the stones grow in this banding layer relative to the bag. The center of the bag of grain tends to be loose knit mycelium with mostly dried out grain, while all the stones are embedded in the banded layer from the surface touching the bag to an inward depth of about 3 to 4 inches..
Here's a link with some photos of the innards of a growbag harvest I did: Sclerotia Harvest
My most aggressive stone producer (400-600grams fresh/5lb wheat prepped) has a banding layer than if allowed to, takes up nearly 3/4 of the petri dish.
I will go back to my plates and awaken them.. take a few photos.. I need to start of few master jars anyways..
I'd like to see what others have seen with their sclerotia strains.. I have tried tamps and mexA, but for some reason I can't seem to get them going without yeast contams..
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devilstone
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blackout
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Re: Sclerotia producing mycelium types [Re: Workman]
#15515566 - 12/14/11 03:12 PM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Workman said:
None of the sclerotia forming species have what I would consider rhizomorphic mycelium.
Have you ever had sclerotia with cubensis?
I was reading this thread, but the original pictures are now deleted
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/3929845
it had this post at the end
Quote:
Joshua said:
Gartz recognizes P. cubensis sclerotia...how very interestink.
Joshua
which would infer Jochen Gartz has seen it.
devilstone- I read your thread, have you considered growing out other myc, like azures. Have you seen the thread on growing on soft agar. The azure myc seems to be about as potent as dry cubensis fruits, and takes just 3 weeks. It can be sterilized with just H2O2 so your setup could be filled with 2L PET bottles stacked very closely together, no boiling necessary at all. And easier to harvest
Another suggested technique is purposely introducing barriers in your bags, like bits of plastic, for the sclerotia to form against.
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devilstone
Dave's not here...
Registered: 08/15/11
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Re: Sclerotia producing mycelium types [Re: blackout]
#15515797 - 12/14/11 04:15 PM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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On the adding barriers to the bag, I tried this with cut down sheets of throw away cutting board plastic..
They were a pain in the arse.. inhibited shaking, added puncture potential to the bags, as well as added a new element in trying to get all that crap in the pressure cookers with the bags.. I don't like giving up grain space in my cookers. The results were mixed, I did get better formed stones... the only added benefit(from my experiences) is the better formed stones.. they look prettier when allowed to form against a surface.
I scrapped the plastic ideas after I did a batch of 50 bags, but instead of adding plastic I squeezed them together..
Kinda like making a row of books... I would place 20 bags in a row, touching each other.. smashing each bag against the next so that the grain inside forms a narrow tall column.. this placed more grain against the surfaces of the bag and left less grain in the center(non-stone growing areas).. I still maintained the same weights at harvest, but my stones were all sexy instead of a mix of the conglomerated grain/sclerotia.. harvesting was easier because the stones tended to form better leaving less grain pieces to pick off in the end. Stones definitely love a hardy surface to pit themselves against, but there is a ratio of quality based on the amount of surface area to grain used.
On the azures and mycelial mats.. sounds interesting but it'll be awhile before it makes it onto my experimentation table..
I'm getting ready to embark on a bulk substrate for sclerotia with the only intent of growing out more stones once the initial bag harvest is over.. I will be running bins of straw, straw/manure, coir/verm, and straight manure.. as well as an expected to fail bin of pasteurized whole oats spawned at a 1:1 rate.. I'll be posting follow ups of those on the cultivation board as I collect enough photos and data..
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devilstone
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blackout
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Re: Sclerotia producing mycelium types [Re: devilstone]
#15516417 - 12/14/11 06:26 PM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
devilstone said:
On the adding barriers to the bag, I tried this with cut down sheets of throw away cutting board plastic..
I was thinking of thinner plastic so it would not really take up any more space. I see you were using GLCs, I have used excess LC on partially dry grains before with great success.
these jars were injected with 30ml LC each and shaken just the moment after that injection, 3 days later they looked like this (it is cubensis)
Some said those jars look nasty, and I expect some think I was lying or that it was infected, but they went on to fruit just fine
I would guess never having disturbed/shaken the mycelium should make for better stones.
I tried this with atlantis before but it did not turn out too well, it might have got infected. But colonisation was rapid with no need for shaking. I think the quick colonisation might have helped fend off complete contamination
that jar had 1.25kg of dry wheat which was cooked up, below is the jar after 4 days, no shaking (apart from after the LC injection of course, all 195ml of it).
the log is here http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/4586804
I mention it might have not have had enough air, the shaking might give it more breathing room, so it might well benefit from it.
-am I reading you correctly that you plan on growing stones on manure? and plan on eating these? you will pretty much always have substrate in the sclerotia...
Edited by blackout (12/14/11 06:38 PM)
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Workman
Psilocybe Microscopist
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Re: Sclerotia producing mycelium types [Re: blackout]
#15519891 - 12/15/11 11:35 AM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Have you ever had sclerotia with cubensis?
I was reading this thread, but the original pictures are now deleted
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/3929845
it had this post at the end
Quote:
Joshua said:
Gartz recognizes P. cubensis sclerotia...how very interestink.
Joshua
which would infer Jochen Gartz has seen it.
I've never seen anything resembling true sclerotia in cubensis. The closest I've seen is malform mushroom blobs that look somewhat like sclerotia. But they aren't as dense and form on the surface of a casing like mushrooms and they occasionally have structures that hint at their origin (occasional gill or bit of stem or cap color). I have seen tiny sclerotia in some Panaeolus species and some strains of Psilocybe semilanceata (Liberty caps).
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Beefy1
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Re: Sclerotia producing mycelium types [Re: Workman]
#15521670 - 12/15/11 06:15 PM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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Has anyone ever seen sclerotia from Ps weillii or Caerulescens?
Saw an article somewhere -wiki? that claims they are sclerotia producers (and may be closely related)
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RogerRabbit
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Re: Sclerotia producing mycelium types [Re: Workman]
#15522288 - 12/15/11 08:11 PM (1 year, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Workman said:
I've never seen anything resembling true sclerotia in cubensis.
Agreed. Nor have I.
RR
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A Myco Journey
Mr. Myco
Registered: 05/01/10
Posts: 115
Loc: Land Of The Faerie Throne
Last seen: 10 months, 22 days
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Re: Sclerotia producing mycelium types [Re: devilstone]
#15546500 - 12/20/11 07:20 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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A High5 Shrooms for you sir lovely work!
Quote:
devilstone said:
Here's a link with some photos of the innards of a growbag harvest I did: Sclerotia Harvest
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jimmyjame1
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Re: Sclerotia producing mycelium types [Re: Beefy1]
#15549850 - 12/21/11 12:16 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Beefy1 said:
Has anyone ever seen sclerotia from Ps weillii
i was wondering the same
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Workman
Psilocybe Microscopist
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Re: Sclerotia producing mycelium types [Re: jimmyjame1]
#15551256 - 12/21/11 04:52 PM (1 year, 4 months ago) |
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Not me but there is a Guzman report of sclerotia in P. caerulescens. I've never seen any independent confirmation.
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