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 veggie
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 Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists 
#12457641 - 04/26/10 12:14 AM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists
April 23, 2010 - AlterNet
By Tony Newman and Stephen Gutwillig
The war on drugs will be on the ballot in California this November. The nation will watch the state decide whether to tax and regulate marijuana or continue to arrest adults for possession of this plant.
The vote on the Regulate, Control and Tax Cannabis Act of 2010 will impact many of the most important issues in the country today. Californians will express how they want police resources used, if adults who consume marijuana should be criminalized, how best to deal with the tragic violence in Mexico, and what our priorities should be in tough economic times. It’s no wonder that seven months out, this issue has already generated thousands of news stories around the world.
Opposition to this reform has crystallized within the drug war establishment, and so has their spin. Here are their top five talking points and the truth beyond them:
Drug Warrior Spin #1: Why would we authorize another harmful substance in our society?
The reality is that marijuana is already widely available in our society. Like it or not, it’s a mainstream recreational drug consumed by millions, including one in ten Californians last year, according to federal data. The California ballot initiative simply acknowledges that marijuana is here and that it’s more sensible to regulate this massive market, like we do with even more harmful drugs like cigarettes and alcohol. Prohibition of highly popular substances never works and brings terrible collateral damage. Alcohol prohibition didn’t keep people from drinking, but it did give us Al Capone and gun battles in the streets. No one dies over sales of Budweiser today.
Drug Warrior Spin #2: Regulation will cause marijuana consumption to skyrocket with addiction rates to match.
The truth is rates of marijuana consumption aren’t determined by penalties against it. If they were, the U.S. – which arrests an astounding 750,000 people for marijuana possession every year – wouldn’t have double the consumption rate of The Netherlands, where marijuana sales have been tolerated for decades. That principle holds true across this country as some states that lowered penalties against marijuana possession years ago have among the lowest rates of use while some states that retained harsh marijuana laws have among the highest. As for addiction, the risk of becoming dependent on marijuana is mild compared to most other drugs including alcohol and tobacco. In fact, most people who enter treatment for marijuana addiction in this country today are referred by the criminal justice system, but 65% don’t even meet the standard criteria for dependence.
Drug Warrior Spin #3: Regulating marijuana will aid drug cartels.
It is practically Orwellian to claim that state regulation of marijuana would benefit criminal cartels. More than 20,000 Mexicans have died in the last three years thanks to prohibition. There is nothing inherent about the plant that has caused these brutal murders. Banning marijuana makes it worth more than gold, so valuable that people are willing to kill each other over the right to sell it. By regulating marijuana and beginning to bring its production and distribution under the rule of law, we would eliminate the cartels’ existing monopoly and dramatically siphon their profits. They would be the biggest losers in this reform.
Drug Warrior Spin #4: Regulating marijuana would cost society more than the taxes it generates.
Taxing marijuana like alcohol statewide would generate $1. 4 billion in California alone, according to the state Board of Equalization. Californians will also save hundreds of millions in scarce law enforcement dollars currently devoted to enforcing these futile laws. Yet opponents say that drugged driving, increased health care costs, and lost productivity will end up costing much more than taxes would generate. By that logic, alcohol, which causes nearly 100,000 American deaths annually, should be illegal and warrant life without parole. The bottom line is that marijuana is California’s largest agricultural commodity, freely consumed by millions with no regulations or protections, and with no financial benefit to the state. In this economic climate, this is a reality we literally can’t afford to ignore any longer.
Drug Warrior Spin #5: What kind of message does regulating marijuana send to kids?
The irony is that failed marijuana prohibition does nothing to protect kids. Despite 30 years of “Just Say No,” half of high-school seniors admit to trying marijuana. Students are more likely to smoke marijuana than cigarettes and say it’s easier to buy marijuana than alcohol because drug dealers don’t ask for ID. Even more chilling, of the 78,000 Californians arrested for marijuana offenses in 2008, one in five was a child under 18 and half were under 30. Out of control access and mass arrests are prohibition’s true impact on our youth. State regulation will reduce that access, separate marijuana from harder drugs, and allow us to focus on effective youth drug education programs.
We will see these arguments play out repeatedly over the next six months. In the end, California will get to choose between two very different models of dealing with marijuana in our society.
Tony Newman is communications director for the Drug Policy Alliance.
Stephen Gutwillig is the California state director of the Drug Policy Alliance.
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 Nymphaea
Smoker/Tripper/Legalizer
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: veggie]
#12457732 - 04/26/10 12:42 AM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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Very good article. Very true. 
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AntiEverything
functioning LSD addict
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: veggie]
#12458453 - 04/26/10 07:14 AM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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Why would we authorize another harmful substance in our society?
A more adequate response would be:
1.) Cannabis is only harmful when abused, or used in-correctly. It is less toxic than aspirin. If alcohol can remain legal without mass social backlash, then ending cannabis prohibition would be an even greater success. American citizens deserve a healthier alternative to alcohol, one without fear of overdose or negative health consequence.
2.) The issue isn't about protection. Prohibiting cannabis to the population does more to harm than it does to protect. Thousands of people are jailed for smoking a drug less harmful than alcohol, potentially ruining their lives behind bars. Thousands of people go without proper medical treatment because the drug is prohibited. Teens will attempt to use extremely dangerous chemicals to get high because they have no access to cannabis (ie: huffing paint). Cannabis prohibition is literally funding the Mexican Cartels who fill our streets with dirty, brick weed. Without the prohibition laws in place these cartels would never be able to prosper, the cost of cannabis would go down, it would be regulated and taxed, they would lose their market. it would no longer be profitable.
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Currently Reading: Rotting Hill - Wyndham Lewis
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winterone
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: Nymphaea]
#12458461 - 04/26/10 07:17 AM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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Alice
I wonder if I've been changed in the night? Let me think. Was I the same when I got up this morning? I almost think I can remember feeling a little different. But if I'm not the same, the next question is 'Who in the world am I?' Ah, that's the great puzzle!
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SuperD
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: veggie]
#12459100 - 04/26/10 10:09 AM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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Common sense and logic shall prevail.
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I'd like you to meet my local drug dealer 
Bruce Campbell for a day! said: Go misidentify a mushroom please.
I'm a psilovibin' psilocybeing 
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fapjack
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: veggie]
#12459691 - 04/26/10 12:10 PM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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More people would smoke if it was legal, shit I know I would. Many people cannot get marijuana, if it was sold in 711 anyone that wanted it could get it. Who cares if more people smoke weed, its their body anyway. The argument that it would cause more people to use it is a stupid fucking argument anyway.
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5-HT2A
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: veggie]
#12459793 - 04/26/10 12:28 PM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Drug Warrior Spin #5: What kind of message does regulating marijuana send to kids?
Students are more likely to smoke marijuana than cigarettes and say it’s easier to buy marijuana than alcohol because drug dealers don’t ask for ID. Even more chilling, of the 78,000 Californians arrested for marijuana offenses in 2008, one in five was a child under 18 and half were under 30. Out of control access and mass arrests are prohibition’s true impact on our youth. State regulation will reduce that access, separate marijuana from harder drugs, and allow us to focus on effective youth drug education programs.
The problem with this argument is that if enough kids want weed somebody will surface to get it to them. If you're a 16 year old stoner and one day and marijuana's legalized, are you going to say to yourself "guess I can't get it from the store so I better quit"? Of course not.
If you already have a taste for weed your demand will create the supply again in one way or another, especially since people can grow their own. Not many people make their own booze, too few bathtubs. But some kid in high school will realize he can make money with out any taxes and begin growing it behind his house and selling it to the stoners he knows plus other people.
I don't know why I think that, I just know the stoners I know and I can't image that putting weed in the liquor store would slow them down. They'd find some super ugly 22 year old girl and fuck her so she'd buy it for them or something. I guess that's another reason, because in contemporary society age barriers break down more easily.
Of course weed should still be legal. Everything should be legal. Except datura. I am afraid of datura enough that I don't even touch the plants.
Edited by 5-HT2A (04/26/10 07:31 PM)
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fapjack
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: 5-HT2A]
#12459980 - 04/26/10 12:55 PM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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If weed was legal you wouldn't get much for it. Making alcohol is easy as shit, you don't see very much moonshine around.
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RoosterCogburn
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: fapjack]
#12460010 - 04/26/10 01:00 PM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
fapjack said:
Making alcohol is easy as shit,
Easy as shit is letting Dogfish Head do it right, and then trading them money for it.
Brewing good beer is not easy as shit... brewing contaminated sludge that tastes like shit is easy.
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fapjack
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: RoosterCogburn]
#12460050 - 04/26/10 01:06 PM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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I was referring to moonshine, but you can make some shitty tasting wine even easier. All you need is sugar yeast frutit juice and water.
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RoosterCogburn
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: fapjack]
#12460081 - 04/26/10 01:12 PM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
fapjack said:
I was referring to moonshine, but you can make some shitty tasting wine even easier. All you need is sugar yeast frutit juice and water.
I'd rather pay a few dollars for stuff that won't make me ill. 
If weed goes legal, it's different from alcohol... All alcohol is the same, just different flavors and proofs.
Different weed strains have a certain character that alcohol can never duplicate... You could buy some decent 7-11 joints, or you could buy my homegrown hybrid. 
The amount of awesome weed that will be created is mindblowing.
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fapjack
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: RoosterCogburn]
#12460855 - 04/26/10 03:37 PM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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I've eaten tomatoes sold in the super market and organic tomatoes my dad grew, they taste the same. If you think that growing pot is an art that cannot be duplicated on an industrial scale you are mistaken. Outdoor pot can be grown in bulk with very little overhead, it might not look as good, but the high and the taste will be the same.
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5-HT2A
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: fapjack]
#12462012 - 04/26/10 07:35 PM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
fapjack said:
If weed was legal you wouldn't get much for it. Making alcohol is easy as shit, you don't see very much moonshine around.
Nowadays if you get an alcohol favor from somebody and you're underage they charge you extra. It could easily be the same for weed. If you don't got another hookup what else can u do?
If kids think the rules are bullshit and feel oppressed they'll always be looking to turn to some drug.
Also I personally wouldn't want to make/drink moonshine, aside from the fact that it's illegal in many places. Moonshine and weed are way different. You screw up moonshine you get sick or die. You screw up weed and you get less high.
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Annapurna1
liberal pussy
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: 5-HT2A]
#12462537 - 04/26/10 09:29 PM (2 years, 1 month ago) |
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ill C/P my response on alternet below for your convenience ..
Quote:
Annapurna1 said:
ive said this before..many times..and ill keep repeating it until you morons get it through your thick skulls ..
the authours' "talking points" are at best only subtitles...the headline anti-marijuana talking point..the one that needs to be attacked..is "marijuana poses an existential threat to america"...voters view the anti-marijuana effort as an existential war whose only outcomes are either victory or death.. they dont view it as [alcohol] prohibition...
ending the drive against marijuana requires dismantling the existential-war frame.. which may not even be possible..since any attempt to do so necessarily becomes defeatist...
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"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...
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Canberra
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: Annapurna1]
#12463435 - 04/27/10 12:58 AM (2 years, 30 days ago) |
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There exists a stigma among some kids (especially girls) attached to weed because it is a "dangerous illegal drug" so they drink almost exclusively. When/if it becomes legal that stigma will slowly disappear until it is accepted and more widely used, across all demographics. Cool.
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RoosterCogburn
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Re: Dismantling the 5 Big Talking Points of Marijuana Prohibitionists [Re: fapjack]
#12464663 - 04/27/10 09:53 AM (2 years, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
fapjack said:
If you think that growing pot is an art that cannot be duplicated on an industrial scale you are mistaken.
You are missing my point.
What I am talking about is the limitless strains than can be produced. It's not BETTER per se, but different. I'd always buy local homegrown buds over 7-11 Marlboro buds, and it's way easier for people to grow GREAT pot for the masses than it is to brew drinkable alcohol for a small group.
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